Frozen: Part III

[SWillie!]

It may sound harsh, but I don't think it really is. It makes complete sense. I've talked about this a lot in the Paperman thread - the exciting things that happening to the 2d/CG universe right now are too much for the "traditional" artist to ignore. Even the most loyal, hardcore hand-drawn guys wanted to give animating on Paperman a shot. I'm sure eventually many will want to create a new film that is totally traditionally animated - but right now those artists are caught up in what the future of animation looks like. And thank goodness, as the guy with the original comment said! Without their astounding talent, the future of the medium wouldn't be nearly as exciting. I think it's a good thing.

[Sotiris]

Even the most loyal, hardcore hand-drawn guys wanted to give animating on Paperman a shot.

It's not as if they have anything else to do at Disney.

I'm sure eventually many will want to create a new film that is totally traditionally animated.

Many of them want to do that now. But it's not up to them.

Right now those artists are caught up in what the future of animation looks like.

It's too early to predict what the future of animation will be. No one knows whether this hybrid will be embraced by the industry, let alone become the new standard.

Also, why does it always have to be the one or the other? There are plenty of films in development at WDAS. Some could be in CG, some in this hybrid form, and some in 2D. It's obvious that the reasons behind medium choices are strictly financial. If the first full-length film that debuts this new hybrid does not perform as well as expected at the box office, it will probably be the end of it at the studio just like hand-drawn animation was.

As much as I like this new hybrid medium and truly wish for its success, it cannot and should not replace hand-drawn animation. Traditional animation should have a place in the industry and especially at Disney that has such a rich legacy and long history with the medium.

[REINIER]

I fully agree Sotiris! It goes without saying that the name Disney, was/is/forever will be associated to 2D. It's a shame there are forces at work who think otherwise, at least during this 2D drought that we are now in. What I do hope is that Disney,when the time does come for 2D to shine like days of old , will create a proper marketing strategy to rightfully cater to their audience. That, to me, is a problem that should be handled carefully so as to learn from current mistakes.

[SWillie!]

As much as I like this new hybrid medium and truly wish for its success, it cannot and should not replace hand-drawn animation. Traditional animation should have a place in the industry and especially at Disney that has such a rich legacy and long history with the medium.

I think you and I have discussed this before, but I really think my point still holds. Of course I wouldn't want to see traditional animation replaced by a hybrid. There is a legacy, and it should continue. But I don't think that means there needs to ALWAYS be films of all different mediums at all times. Like I said, that would take talent away from other projects which could use it.

I'm sure, like you said, there are artists that would love to work on a traditional feature right now. But those same artists are really drawn to the prospect of hybrid right now. I've said it before, and I know you don't agree, but I think if given the choice to work on either a traditional film or a hybrid film at this point, most artists (even the most loyal traditional artists) would choose the hybrid, because it is just too exciting as an artist to pass up. I know every 2d animator at the studio I've talked to (mind you, that's only a handful), say that everyone is really excited about. They talk about how it's a natural evolution of traditional animation, and it allows them to so things regular traditional never could.

Again, will these artists go back and create a traditionally animated film a few years down the road once the excitement of something new has worn off? I hope so, and I think they will. There's a legacy there a I hope it's continued. But right now I think most of the artists at the studio are excited about this , regardless of whether the money makes the decisions.

[Disney's Divinity]

But I don't think that means there needs to ALWAYS be films of all different mediums at all times. Like I said, that would take talent away from other projects which could use it.

Um...don't most studios have multiple projects at once?

I have friends needed-for-my-point who would prefer to stop everything and work on a 2D film... *wink wink*

(Btw, are we sure Disney is doing anything with the hybrid Paperman technique right now? I mean something that would involve a lot of people--at most there's a short, but most of the "talent" is on the 3D films.)

[Sotiris]

Again, will these artists go back and create a traditionally animated film a few years down the road once the excitement of something new has worn off? I hope so, and I think they will.

Again, it's not up to the artists. It never was and it never will be. It's always been up to management.

[DisneyEra]

Looks like Frozen will get some competion this November after all:

http://www.cinemablend.com/new/Amy-Poeh ... 35953.html

[jazzflower92]

Looks like Frozen will get some competion this November after all:

http://www.cinemablend.com/new/Amy-Poeh ... 35953.html

Why do I have a sneaking suspician that Dreamworks did this on purpose.This also means that they are releasing the Croods and Turbo this year.Which means that Dreamworks is releasing three movies this year.

[Sotiris]

Why do I have a sneaking suspicion that Dreamworks did this on purpose.

Turkeys is not a DreamWorks film. It's not even distributed by Fox.

[Disney's Divinity]

Turkeys!? What a title. If Rise of the Guardians had trouble for being too seasonal, I'm not sure what to expect from this. With all the celebrity voices, it sounds like a mess. But it could be something the public eats up, considering how ridiculous it sounds. It's like those Eat Mor Chikin commercials.

[jazzflower92]

I am defiantly seeing Frozen over that.This defiantly in my opinion really screams Shrek like comedy.

[estefan]

Like Sotiris said, Turkeys is not a DreamWorks film. It's made by Reel FX (the same studio that made the recent CG Looney Tunes shorts).

[Sotiris]

It looks like Reel FX will also be getting into the theatrical animation game. Besides Turkeys, they have announced The Book of Life and Beasts of Burden and who knows what other projects they already have in development.

[jazzflower92]

Maybe Turkeys can be good or maybe it will win razzies.We just need to wait for the critics to review it or at when the trailer hits.

[SWillie!]

Um...don't most studios have multiple projects at once?

Of course - not saying Disney shouldn't have more than a single project at any time, I'm saying tht just because there is a traditional legacy, that shouldn't mean that they have to have a traditional film in production at all times (or a film of any particular medium). My point is, the best talent at the studio ought to be working on the innovative exciting stuff. They shouldn't be forced to do a 2d film just because of the legacy, if that isn't what they're interested in.

I have friends needed-for-my-point who would prefer to stop everything and work on a 2D film... *wink wink*

Haha come on now, that's not fair. You know I'm not making that up. Like I said, while I certainly can't pretend to know what the majority of the artists are thinking, the ones I've talked to at events like CTN and Inspire Days are focused on the potential of doing something new.

Btw, are we sure Disney is doing anything with the hybrid Paperman technique right now? I mean something that would involve a lot of people--at most there's a short, but most of the "talent" is on the 3D films.

The only thing that's been confirmed is that John Kahrs is working on a test o bring the hybrid technique into the organic, colorful world. From what I understand most of the strictly 2d artists are working on this or a 2d short that is supposed to show with Frozen.

Again, it's not up to the artists. It never was and it never will be. It's always been up to management.

Okay yes, but I don't get what this has to do with my point that the 2d artists are excited about hybrid stuff. Just because they aren't the ones deciding what they're working on doesn't mean they can't be excited about it.


Anyways, I can't even believe that Turkeys is being pushed up to this year. Thats a crazy production schedule. Reel FX came to my school to recruit a few weeks ago, and there was no mention of it. For what's its worth, what I saw of Turkeys looks visually fantastic. I don't have any idea if the story will be good or not, but the animation sure looks nice.

[WonderNeverOz]

"Wreck-It Ralph" director Rich Moore told the crowd at the motion picture academy's Beverly Hills headquarters that he never envisioned the video game adventure from Disney as a musical, but "Book of Mormon" co-writer Robert Lopez and his wife Kristen Anderson-Lopez did create an original song for the film.

It didn't work, so it's not in the movie," said Moore. "That's our process. We try lots of stuff. We throw it against the wall, and the stuff that sticks stays in the movie. It's a very organic process making films like this."

omg, wow, seems like disney is replacing Alan Menken with Robert Lopez...

Source: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/2 ... ertainment

[RodryCroft]

It's OK if they hire different people to do the soundtracks, and we still have to hear Frozen's soundtrack to give an oppinion, but I'm so sorry... Alan Menken is Alan Menken, I want him for much more Disney soundtracks!!! =(

[Sotiris]

But I don't think that means there needs to ALWAYS be films of all different mediums at all times. Like I said, that would take talent away from other projects which could use it.

I don't see how having films of various mediums in development could be a problem. You're basically arguing that if there was a hand-drawn film in development in addition to a hybrid film there would be a shortage of 2D artists. First of all, we're talking about development here, not production so that's not really an issue. Second, it's a rarity for Disney nowadays to have two films in production at the same time, let alone two films which require 2D animators. The odds of that happening are very slim. Even in the extremely unlikely case of that happening, it can be easily resolved by simply hiring more 2D animators. Therefore, I find this argument nothing but a very flimsy excuse for not having a 2D feature in the works.

My point is, the best talent at the studio ought to be working on the innovative exciting stuff. They shouldn't be forced to do a 2D film just because of the legacy, if that isn't what they're interested in.

Who says they are not interested in a 2D project? You're being very presumptions as to what the artists at Disney want or don't want to work on. Just because they are excited to work on a hybrid film like Paperman that does not mean they wouldn't be excited to work on a traditional 2D film as well. I'm certain that if there was a hand-drawn project in development, a lot of artists at Disney would love to work on it. This is besides the point, anyway. Employees at any studio are "forced" to work on whatever the project at hand is. It's their job. I'm sure there are artists at Disney which were "forced" to work on CG films or projects they didn't care for in general.

Okay yes, but I don't get what this has to do with my point that the 2D artists are excited about hybrid stuff. Just because they aren't the ones deciding what they're working on doesn't mean they can't be excited about it.

I didn't argue the contrary. You're missing my point. You argue that one day the artists there will want to work on a 2D film. Overlooking the issues of what the artists want and when, even if they did want to work on a hand-drawn feature one day, it wouldn't be up to them to do so.

Anyways, I can't even believe that Turkeys is being pushed up to this year. That's a crazy production schedule.

Really? But it's been reported that the project has been in production since January 2011.

[SWillie!]

I didn't argue the contrary. You're missing my point. You argue that one day the artists there will want to work on a 2D film. Overlooking the issues of what the artists want and when, even if they did want to work on a hand-drawn feature one day, it wouldn't be up to them to do so.

Well, we're just circling here... but I'm not missing you're point. I totally get that it's not up to the artists to do decide what films they want to work on. But that's just not what I'm talking about here. The bigger point I'm trying to make here is that the artists at the studio are excited about what direction the studio is heading right now, and I feel like we ought to support that instead of bashing it simply because there isn't a completely traditional film in the works right now.

I know I'm being presumptuous to an extent, but that's why I pointed out that while I obviously can't pretend to know what the majority of the artists are thinking, I can at least make an educated guess at it based on the positive reaction to the technique, the public excitement of the artists that worked on it, and the conversations I've had with a few of those artists.

Anyways, I can't even believe that Turkeys is being pushed up to this year. That's a crazy production schedule.

Really? But it's been reported that the project has been in production since January 2011.

Well that would certainly make more sense, I wasn't aware of that. Thanks. When they came to our school they made it sound as if things were kind of just getting started, so maybe they were just referring to the major ramp-up of production.

It is kind of irritating that they're bringing it out right when Frozen is released as well. With it being their first feature you'd think they would play it safer with a release date, not try and compete with a major player.

[PatrickvD]

Sotiris, if you can find the Big Hero 6 thread, then this could be reported there:

http://www.bleedingcool.com/2013/02/23/ ... ease-date/