Female Disney characters- Role models or bad examples?

[jessiaaaa1991]

Hellooo =]
I'm an A-level student studying media and have chosen to carry out a critical research study on 'Women in film'.

My question is:
How are the female characters in disney films represented?

As you can tell its quite an open question so I'm looking for as many ideas and answers as possible.


Do you think that females are represented positively or negatively in Disney films?

Do you think that characters costumes are acceptable or in some cases too revealing?

Do you think that women are represented as equal to men?

Do you think that young girls will think that they will always "live happily ever after" because of the influence of Disney films?

Do you think that as time has passed, Disney films have adapted to fit into their era?



I would really appreciate any opinions on the topic both positive and negative.

Or even if you have another point that I havent mentioned I'd be happy to hear it =]

Thank youuuu =D

[Marky_198]

"How are the female characters in disney films represented?"

Females are presented beautifully in Disney films.
They represent hope, dreams, beauty, determination, believing.
It's all very positive, and about learning and growing up.

(I'm talking about the princess characters here, and they are great rolemodels for people in the world. Of course the world is full of Cruella's and Ursula's too, but people like that are represented in the Disney films very well too. Not everyone is a good person. In fact, everyone I know can be matched to a certain Disney character, so I could say the way characters are presented in Disney films is quite realistic).

"Do you think that women are represented as equal to men?"

In some cases women are presented to be better than men, but that's all part of the image.

"Do you think that characters costumes are acceptable or in some cases too revealing?"

Costumes are fine, no discussion about that. If anyone disagrees, they're not from this world.

"Do you think that young girls will think that they will always "live happily ever after" because of the influence of Disney films?"

Yes, at least they will dream about it. And it's a wonderful thing.

[WonderlandFever]

Do you think that females are represented positively or negatively in Disney films?

Positive

Do you think that characters costumes are acceptable or in some cases too revealing?

Never too revealing.

Do you think that women are represented as equal to men?

Not in the early days but they are now.

Do you think that young girls will think that they will always "live happily ever after" because of the influence of Disney films?

No, kids know it's a fairy tale and not real life but they can fantasize about it.

Do you think that as time has passed, Disney films have adapted to fit into their era?

Yes

[Rudy Matt]

I'm an A-level student studying media and have chosen to carry out a critical research study on 'Women in film'.

I'm going to challenge you hard here, and it's not personal, but get ready for serious questions. To begin with, what does your "A-level" have to do with your premises?If you want to study Women in Film, what percentage of yur study is devoted American animated films veruses all films? What other films are you studying?

My question is:
How are the female characters in disney films represented?

How many have you seen? "Disney films" covers everything from Pollyanna to The Journey of Natty Gann, from The Sword and the Rose to Cinderella to the early Alice comedies. Obivously, women characters are presented according to the dictates of the story. You have strong women, weak women, evil women, women of virtue -- your question is too broad, and furthermore, it implies a single-handed approach to women by Disney, when there is no such formalism.

As you can tell its quite an open question so I'm looking for as many ideas and answers as possible.

Your question is so broad, you might as well ask what shape the clouds in the sky are.

Do you think that females are represented positively or negatively in Disney films?

Seeing as how I can't recall a Disney film that tries to portray a gender in a postivie or negative light, your very premise is faulty. I know Disney films with female characters, and some of these are "good" and some are "bad", but none make a judgement call based on gender.

Do you think that characters costumes are acceptable or in some cases too revealing?

You're fishing in the wrong pond. You want people to condemn how a couple of Disney heroines are dressed so you can print some easy ink in your paper. You won't get such sophistry from me.

Do you think that women are represented as equal to men?
Have you seen Bsmbi?how about Tha Parent Trap or Pollyanna? Or "The Firebird" in Fantasia 2000?

Do you think that young girls will think that they will always "live happily ever after" because of the influence of Disney films?

Doesn't every Christian, Muslim, Buddhist, and Jewish soul believe in a "happily ever after" when this life is done? You are fishing for a response that states Disney somehow lies to children and leads them to disillusionment.

Do you think that as time has passed, Disney films have adapted to fit into their era?

It's not a "think" -- every Disney film is a product of its time.

[Rumpelstiltskin]

Well, you have to remember the time these movies were made in. Snow White, for instance, was released in 1937. In the movie, she starts cleaning and washing once she arrives to the dwarfs' home, and even Grumpy is willing to let her stay when it turns she knows how to make good food.

If you have intentions to look at female Disney characters through the years, you are probably already aware of that. If you are more interested in writing about how they are portrayed in modern times, maybe you should just focus on the newest movies.

And what do you mean with "role models or bad examples". Do they have to be good OR bad? Maybe not all female characters in movies (Disney or not) are good role models, but it doesn't mean they are bad role models either. Or vice versa.

[Disney's Divinity]

Most of what I could say could fit in nearly any question, so:

Do you think that females are represented positively or negatively in Disney films?
I think females have been represented more positively in recent films that in their earlier ones. Not that I think the older films go all out in stereotyping women, but, with their female characters, they tend to have a Madonna-whore complex. Either a character is saintly or she is abhorrent and evil. Snow White vs. The Evil Queen, Cinderella and her Fairy Godmother vs. Tremaine and her daughters, the Gossiping Elephants vs. Mrs. Jumbo, Lady vs. Peg. Compare this to the modern films, with the flawed-but-redeemable Ariel, Lilo and Megara (Hercules), as well as the commendable women you find with Jane from Tarzan (an artist and a researcher), Esmeralda from the Hunchback of Notre Dame, Captain Amelia from Treasure Planet, Pocahontas, Mulan, Audrey Ramirez from Atlantis , and Nani and the Grand Councilwoman from Lilo & Stitch. Amelia and the Councilwoman, in particular, are the first females who've been given a position of power/authority in a Disney film that has not abused it (and this isn't counting Fairy Godmothers).

But there are also some stand-outs from the older films, such as with Wendy (Peter Pan), Alice and even the characters in Robin Hood (Lady Cluck, for instance). And the animal films do, typically, have better representation for the female characters.

Do you think that characters costumes are acceptable or in some cases too revealing?

I don't think they're too revealing really. The only characters I can think of are Ariel, Mowgli, Jasmine and Tarzan who might be questionable. However, they all live in places where they would have to look that way, and both Mowgli and Ariel conform to civilized standards at some point in the film (Tarzan does as well, though in the end he decides to stay in the jungle). Only Jasmine would leave any real doubt, because she is sexualized heavily. The only other female background characters who look like her, in the same film, are also sex symbols.

[ajmrowland]

My question is:
How are the female characters in disney films represented?

As everyone above says, quite differently. There are female villains, but I'll assume you're talking about the heroins of Disney films. Snow white was portrayed as soft, weak, and a housewife That's two out of three for being dated. Bambi's mother was stronger, but that's for survival. Cinderella was stronger, because she chased her prince instead of waiting for him. The '90s women are good, because they do not let men tell them what to do. Mulan is the best example of this, as she joins the army and fights disguised as a boy, defying all law and tradition in her country to make her family proud.

Do you think that females are represented positively or negatively in Disney films?

above answer
No, not really. In fact, I find that more revealing clothing could only mean a better self-image for girls who are currently under pressure to look stylish and perfect.
The more recent Disney films would see it that way. But as for the rest of society, that's a big "hell, no".
For a time. Kids know too much, these days, because parents know too much, these days.

Yes. As the views of our time change, so does the entertainment


Anyway, sorry for forcing my propaganda on you.

[Rudy Matt]

The more recent Disney films would see it that way. But as for the rest of society, that's a big "hell, no".

Yeah, those male Dwarfs really bossed Snow White around and made her clean up the house....it's not like she came in and ordered THEM to wash before they could eat the food she cooked. In fact, one could say SHE took over the house, but gosh, that doesn't fit the Disney=sexist template, does it?

And the Blue Fairy -- a woman as a God-like figure.

And Bambi's mother and Faline - wow, they were so burdened by their inequities to men.

and on and on and on it goes. I'm sick of this garbage that argues Walt Disney's films are sexist. You can't win that argument, not with me, not with history. I'll blow apart any argument you present that even attempts to suggest the Disney films are sexist. Take that to some website like Moveon.org, you bring that within 100 feet of me, get ready to rumble.

And what's with you guys focusing only on the fairy tale films? Walt made hundereds of movies, you guys act like he made three and the new company made four. Come on!

[ajmrowland]

The more recent Disney films would see it that way. But as for the rest of society, that's a big "hell, no".

Yeah, those male Dwarfs really bossed Snow White around and made her clean up the house....it's not like she came in and ordered THEM to wash before they could eat the food she cooked. In fact, one could say SHE took over the house, but gosh, that doesn't fit the Disney=sexist template, does it?

And the Blue Fairy -- a woman as a God-like figure.

And Bambi's mother and Faline - wow, they were so burdened by their inequities to men.

and on and on and on it goes. I'm sick of this garbage that argues Walt Disney's films are sexist. You can't win that argument, not with me, not with history. I'll blow apart any argument you present that even attempts to suggest the Disney films are sexist. Take that to some website like Moveon.org, you bring that within 100 feet of me, get ready to rumble.

And what's with you guys focusing only on the fairy tale films? Walt made hundereds of movies, you guys act like he made three and the new company made four. Come on!

I never said Walt's films were sexist. Snow White was that way because of society at the time. And yes, I should've mentioned her taking control of the household, but it was done in ways that women were expected to. It's not like she actually defied anyone's expectations of her.

[Goliath]

As a film student, I would strongly advise you to narrow your research question down. Pick one film to analyse. Or just two, so you do a comparison, e.g. between an old (Walt-era) and a new (1990's) film. But analysing all Disney films with female (lead) characters will be an immense amount of work, and the scope of it will only force you to make superficial statements.

Now, to answer your questions:

Do you think that females are represented positively or negatively in Disney films?

That depends on which film you consider, and which character. In Walt's days, a female heroine was basically always a damsel in distress who needed to be saved by her handsome and fearless prince. But that was true of almost every movie from that period. In the 1990's, Disney heroines were much more in control of themselves, like Ariel, Jasmine and Belle. However, that only depends on your interpretation.

I've read accounts from a feminist perspective that heavily criticized Disney's 1990's heroines: The Little Mermaid taught young women that they were the only ones who had to make sacrifices to be in a relationship, while the man would have to make none; Beauty and the Beast taught girls it was okay to stay in an abusive, violent relationship, because after all the abusive husband doesn't mean it that bad after all.

Then there's the villains. Those can be female too. Cruella de Vill, Madam Medusa, Malificent: they are no less dangerous than their male counterparts.

Do you think that characters costumes are acceptable or in some cases too revealing?

They all look fine to me, but I'm a man, of course!

But seriously, they are all Disney films, so how bad can it be? I know of only two instances that are questionable. One is in The Little Mermaid. When Ursula transforms Ariel into a human and Flounder and Sebastian take her to the surface, at one point you can see her naked body, including her... you know. They placed a dark shadow over it, but it always annoyed me. If they had not chosen to take a close-up of it, they wouldn't have need any shadow, now would they? The second instance is in The Great Mouse Detective, in the saloon scene. Basil and Dawson are watching three female mice performing a striptease. The lyrics are very sexually suggestive, they literally tae off their clothes, and one male mouse has to be stopped by two others from climbing onto the stage:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2IctxaCPqw

Do you think that women are represented as equal to men?

No, in most films they're not. (But to be fair, this is true of almost all movies, not just Disney's.) There are exceptions, most notably in the 1990's, but even in that era, there are exceptions. Take Megara rom Hercules. At first sight, she seems to be totally different than all other Disney heroines up to that point. She sassy and sarcastic and she initially rejects Hercules' offer to rescuer her from the minotaur. She is convinced she "doesn't need a man to make it happen". But then we see her fall in love, and eventually she too has to be rescued by her knight in shining armor.

There are also some earlier examples of women in control. One good example of this is Bianca in 1977's The Rescuers. She is even a stronger character than Bernard.

Do you think that young girls will think that they will always "live happily ever after" because of the influence of Disney films?

No, I don't think so. I've always been very wary of making a causal cause-effect link between media and recipients. People like to do it all the time, to blame all media (comics, film, tv, videogames, rock music) for all of society's ills. I don't believe in that, but it also depends on the environment girls grow up in. They need parents to teach them the difference between fiction and reality.

Do you think that as time has passed, Disney films have adapted to fit into their era?
Yes, I do think so. However, sometimes they have a setback, like Megara, or Jane.

[slave2moonlight]

I didn't want to get drawn into this (it's a question that's been posted before), because I consider it one of those discussions ripe with B.S. and with too much potential to lead to webboard arguments that are tedious, neverending, and pointless (as the people who get stirred up are naturally the ones very set in their opinion). Still, I'll state my piece and try not to revisit the subject...

My question is:
How are the female characters in disney films represented?

I'll agree with what has been said that this is something that could not be addressed in detail without being more specific about which character(s) you are asking about. Generalizing is hardly fair, though I will say that overall I don't feel they have been portrayed negatively at all. They are thankfully different enough that they are not going to please everyone as a group and people have their favorites and complaints about others. The problem is hardly with the portrayal of the Disney females and more with the fact that some people only want to see women portrayed one way. Such people are not really calling for "realistic" female portrayals, as they may personally believe, but rather an ideal they have developed. If they are lucky (or if Disney is lucky?) they will find one Disney girl who matches that ideal, but then they seem to want all the others to be that way.

Of course, with Disney the popular complaint is that Disney girls are all damsels in distress, and because this prevalence in earlier Disney films has formed a grudge for more feminist minded women, they start trying to find the flaws in the less "damsel in distress" type Disney girls. Here comes the b.s. Belle is submissive, Ariel expects nothing from her man, etc... These major character assumptions are derived from only an hour and a half of getting to know the characters and without any really strong evidence. After all, Belle refused Gaston in part due to his obvious desire for a submissive wife and apparently saw something more in the Beast. The idea from the film is that some people could change with proper guidance and love, though not all. Belle apparently was smart enough to tell the difference (something that is unusual in real life, but not completely impossible; consider how some gang members can become VERY reformed, but of course only SOME). One can argue about depicting women who go for guys who need reforming over nice guys who don't, but the fact is that it reflects real life very well, sadly. Feminists seem to want all female characters to be depicted as flawless, especially since most folks unfairly see Disney films as only for kids, but flawless characters are less believable, and hopefully at least everyone here knows Disney animated features are not intended solely for small children.

But to get to something that really gripes me... the point often made in defending Disney films that depict the female as the damsel in distress is that this is mostly seen in the older films and that is how most movies/stories of the time were. This is a good argument, but I'd like to add to that. These are also Fairytales, not to mention period stories. One thing I, personally, find very annoying is when period films (especially live-action, by the way) depict women who act more like they are from modern day Los Angeles than ye olden days. I don't remember which period film I saw recently where the girls giggled and laughed about one man because he had a beard, meanwhile, most guys of the time did. They are also always trying to push the modern distaste for age-differences in relationships in newly-made period flicks, or showing teenage mothers hundreds of years ago to be as helpless and tragic as teenage mothers are viewed today. It's just not realistic. It's the same thing with the damsel in distress issue. It would hardly be realistic to never show women in period films, particularly fairytales, as the damsels in distress. Imagine if every female in every period film acted like Xena: Warrior Princess? It's just b.s. Not every character should have to be Mulan, and that approach would get so old so fast. Anyway, calling all Disney princesses helpless damsels is b.s. too. What you have in something like Snow White, for example, is NOT an always helpless damsel in distress. Here is a young woman who, when cast out by a woman in high power, found a place to stay and paid her way (through working) completely on her own before she fell victim to the Queen's plot. Yes, a prince kisses her, but it is not he who revives her but a kiss of true love (the same with Sleeping Beauty). And anyway, what is Disney supposed to do, change the ending to a well-known, classic fairytale?

You also have this whole problem that if the female is always saving the day, as some people would like, then the male never is. Reversing things doesn't make them any better than they were before. On the topic of Megara, the movie is called Hercules, not Megara, so you really have to have him save the day and the girl. Even in modern films, this should be okay sometimes. The fact that Meg decided that she didn't need a man shouldn't make it a bad thing that she fell in love with one. After all, that was why she was in the story. The love interest.

Do you think that females are represented positively or negatively in Disney films?

See above...

Do you think that characters costumes are acceptable or in some cases too revealing?

Can't see why this would be an issue. Only one that I'd think comes close to revealing is Ariel's seashell costume, but she IS a mermaid. Sex appeal was a big part of that movie though (just read Disney's Encyclopedia of Animated Characters, I believe that's where I read it), just further proving that filmmakers don't make animated features for the kid audience exclusively. And I've been in love with Ariel ever since (her and Tink, also not a damsel in distress).

Do you think that women are represented as equal to men?

This depends on what you view as equal. I think this is often misviewed. Equal does not have to mean "The Same". Men and women are different, and that's a reality. You can be equal and different, though again, to answer this question would have to be thought out on a case by case basis. It's easy to say Mulan and Kim Possible are, but to make every single story about a female warrior or secret agent would be a little ridiculous. And, again, you have periods to consider, both the period the film is set in and the period it was made in. You have the caste system, etc... Take Cinderella. She is not royalty, so in that way she's not equal to her prince, but there really is nothing to indicate that she isn't equal to him in other ways. He was assertive, yes, in insisting to marry who he wanted, but she too was assertive in defying her stepmother and going to the ball. There is a film that makes me roll my eyes when anyone says Cinderella is another weak female character.

Do you think that young girls will think that they will always "live happily ever after" because of the influence of Disney films?

I think Disney films push the idea that we CAN live happily ever after, that it's a possibility. They push optimism, that's all. You can push optimism or you can push pecimism. I might be willing to fault them on pushing the idea of true love at first sight, but that whole subject is a very individual and personal one for everyone who contemplates it, it is directed at both males and females in films, and Disney isn't the only one at fault there. Again, they are producing fairytales and fairytale-type stories mostly, so...

Do you think that as time has passed, Disney films have adapted to fit into their era?

Yes. I wouldn't say that is always a good thing, but they definitely have.

[jessiaaaa1991]

I didnt make it quite clear in my first post and some people seem to have taken offence to my questions, but the questions I asked were based on opinions that I have heard or read, they are not my own opinions.

The question had to be open and I am studying around 3-6 disney films.
So in particular I am focusing on; Snow white, The little mermaid, Aladdin, Beauty and the beast, Mulan and Enchanted. I am not just focusing on the heroines, I am focusing on all of the female characters in the film.

I love Disney and dont agree with the negatve view that some have, but I must look at both sides of the argument.

Thanks for your time.

[Flower's Friend]

I didnt make it quite clear in my first post and some people seem to have taken offence to my questions, but the questions I asked were based on opinions that I have heard or read, they are not my own opinions.

The question had to be open and I am studying around 3-6 disney films.
So in particular I am focusing on; Snow white, The little mermaid, Aladdin, Beauty and the beast, Mulan and Enchanted. I am not just focusing on the heroines, I am focusing on all of the female characters in the film.

I love Disney and dont agree with the negatve view that some have, but I must look at both sides of the argument.

Thanks for your time.

I did not take offense to anything that you posted. I did not even know how you felt about all this.

[Flower's Friend]

I want to take about Cinderella. When I see Cinderella I see a woman who has a very strong mind.

[CampbellzSoup]

Meg was pretty much my favorite Disney chick she's tough, strong, and has a great dry humor to her.

[halfbreed3614]

looks like everyone is doing your homework for you...

[Super Aurora]

looks like everyone is doing your homework for you...

Like that's new?

And LOL at Rudy Matt for taking this too seriously up the ass

[candydog]

Ah yes, these threads have a habit of popping up every now and then on disney forums all over the internet. I must say I'm with Rudy Matt and rather admire his anwers.

First of all I find the costume question quite funny, I mean if the issue you want to deal with is sexual objectification then Disney really isn't the best way to start. As for the cotumes: Ariel wears a bra. Yup, it's revealing, but guess what? The mermen were shirtless. We just assume that because a woman's body is on display at some point it makes her a sex object, when quite frankly merfolk just aren't likely to wear much more than they do in the movie. If they do exist that is
And erm.... let's face it, there are no complaints regarding Tarzan running around the jungle in a loincloth.

Anyway, the overall question?

In my opinion women are portrayed in a positive light. They were not necessarily shown as equal to men because in the case of fairytales, the setting did not allow for it. I mean in medieval times and earlier when the fairytales were set, women quite simply weren't treated as equal to men, and it would be false to portray them as equal in a movie set at that time. They can be equal in other ways and in their personalities of course but at the end of the day if a woman wanted to progress in life she had to marry to do so.
Does this make her a bad role model for girls? In a way yes, but I don't think it should be taken too seriously. I know plenty of girls who, when they were very young would have idolized the princesses, but I can assure you that they did not grow up to expect a life of cooking, cleaning and waiting around for men to save them, because women in today's society know that they don't have to, they know they can have their own lives and careers and that becomes clearer to them as they get older.
We live in quite a "girl power" society where girls are told they can do pretty much anything they want to and that their gender shouldn't stop them, which is actually more than boys have to be honest.
As girls get older they're able to look at these films, enjoy them for what they are and ultimately say "that was then, this is now".

But even so, that's just the fairytales. As a whole I don't think Disney portray female characters in any way worse than they portray male characters. Men in fairytale films are usually simple plot devices and in modern classics they tend to be rather flawed individuals compared with their perfect female counterparts.

[ajmrowland]

Women still aren't treated equally. I mean not always, but int he case of Disney films, they generally are.

[Escapay]

Every so often someone comes in saying they're writing a paper about Disney and women, so these threads may come in handy:

Positive or Negative Portrayal of Women in Animated Films?

women representation in disney animated films

Representation of women in Disney films......please help!

Women: Disney vs. Anime

Are the Disney Princesses Bad for our Children?

Disney, it is time for a black Princess!

A2 Media Investigation-Women in Disney-Responses Needed!!!

And I agree with Rudy Matt. There's so much more to Disney than a few animated films. For once I wouldn't mind one of these "Help, I'm doing a paper on Disney, I wouldn't mind your opinions!" threads to be about something like a comparison of Walt Disney's "Disneyland" series to fellow "studio" shows like "MGM Parade" or "Warner Bros. Presents", and analysing why Walt's was successful while the others were just...blatantly promotional (though "Warner Bros. Presents" did include original programming). Or perhaps a comparison of Walt's live-action The Story of Robin Hood and His Merrie Men to the animated Robin Hood and how much or how little both change what (allegedly) happened historically in order to adhere to the Robin Hood mythos.

albert