The Ultimate Matrix Collection

[Edge]

Well, a bridge was needed, and I thought the action supplements in the second one were awesome. Sure, they could've squeezed it into two movies... but why not make three. If the two options are spacious or dense, I'm fine with spacious. It's not as if they were at any time boring, in my opinion. The $7 didn't break me, either, and it was my choice to spend it.

Well thats the whole point about making three. They said why not, and they made a ton of movie for it. Because the average person says "why not" even if it weakens the process.

Nobody claims the 7 bucks put anyone in poor house, but it essentially doubled their profit for little effort.

The first movie was more than just an action movie. The second was a popcorn flick, simple as that.

It actually had such a negative feedback that they actually went back and altered the third movie after it was just about wrapped up. So someone, somewhere in that think tank realized it was "off center".

Of course, whether or not they are simply bad films is only a matter of opinion, one that I disagree with. Speaking as a fan of the Matrix and Star Wars follow-ups, though, I can assure you that I don't base my opinion on "shiny things" and video games I never played. I thought the plot in all the Matrix films was solid and the philosophy was consistent.

Your 100% right. And no one is saying you or any other fan is wrong or stupid. But there is another side of opinion out there and a reasoning behind it. You're right the philosophy was consistent, it was also circular and it didn't really progress beyond the first movie. All you needed to know from a philosophical standpoint was hammered home in the first movie.

As someone else said, it really looked like the bros. ran out of steam when they ran with the ball. Kind of a "Where do we go from here" routine followed with a "Let's just throw a 30 minute fight scene in to eat up time" response. If it were a Bruce Lee that would be cool, but the matrix has the potential to be something REALLY special. In the end the result was rather average.

And I hardly think it's fair to reduce the Star Wars story to a lie.

Though that's blasphemy in some circles, there is a good reasoning behind it. No one EVER saw these stories before recently and the writing styles are almost toally different. The normal lucas style of character introductions and arcs is lost in the process. In many ways its like comparing hand writing samples. It might change over time, but if these stories were all supposedly written at once, it just doesn't add up. At all.

No one is saying Star Wars is a lie but at this point Lucas has double talked himself so far into a corner that you don't really no what to believe anymore. No dvd's, then dvd's. They know first edition, it's how he see's it now, blah blah blah, etc.

The guy is a businessman and very good businessman. He's milked his creation for every penny it is worth, knowing the fans who love the series will by anything he puts out there. If he added a new scene where Luke Skywalker moon walks across the death star, people would go out and but it and he'd make a fortune.

The ONLY way to see the original versions at this point is to go on ebay and find the old school VHS tapes.

I mean he even has gone as far as to paste the young Anakin's face on the older body at the end of Return of the Jedi.

It's entirely his choice, it's his "baby". But the luster of Lucas is starting to wear off and even his biggest supporters are gonna be watching closely when Episode 3 comes out.

There's nothing wrong with your POV. It's no more valid than mine. I'm just presenting a different one.

[Jake Lipson]

This box is MINE.

I saw the original movie per the reccomendation of a teacher shortly before the sequels came out and came on the bandwagon a little while before time that the marketing machine started up for Reloaded. I loved The Matrix and consider it one of the best films ever made, a rare action epic with the bravery to be different and the daring to ask questions without answers. The price of admission to see it is to think and not have things dumbed down for you, which is something that I applaud and respect.

When I saw Reloaded a couple weeks after its release with said teacher, I was equally astounded. Maybe it's because I didn't have time to build up unrealistic expectations and had already been "conditioned" to the previews of the sequels before seeing Matrix, but I loved it too and thought it was a solid, entertaining, convincing continuation of the original that took the story deeper and continued the themes and questions raised previously. The scene with The Architect is nothing less than pure sci-fdi brilliance. Action scenes here were great, too and the cliffhanger was so well done that it was simply maddening. It was also done perfectly to allow for six months of endless debate between Reloaded and Revolutions, and after they were over came...Revolutions.

Unlike most people, I loved this too and think that it was a great ending, bringing the plot threads together in a logical, if open to debate, conclusion to the trilogy which just so happened to be full of AMAZING action. The final battle between Neo and Smith had me breathless. Actulally, I think that while Reloaded and Revolutions are best viewed as one film, if you have to split them, Revolutions is the better half. The original still regins supreme in the end, but I love 'em all, though.

So I can't wait for this box. I will gladly buy the trilogy, and The Animatrix, again, especially considering the improved quality of the original's transfer, and all of the new content that will be there. Revisited too will be new to me as I never managed to pick that up on its own, so I'll just wait for it now. And all ten discs for just $60? Awesome! I'll pass on the mini-bust gift set, though.

[deathie mouse]

Actually I think the first transfer very accurately reflects the 35mm print I saw, grain and all. Just smaller. And I'll pass the minibust edition, cus i have

a Trinity bust

[yoda_four]

It was obvious that the Brothers couldn't sustain the new story over two films, unless of course they added wanky dance parties and 30 minute fight scenes that went nowhere.

Funny cause it's true!

As for my opinion: I enjoyed the original like any other good film, but didn't join with my friends as viewing it as awesome and mind-blowing, back when it was released. I would certainly add it to my collection if it weren't for the snapper. The second I found quite boring, and usless; while Revolutions was somwhat better but still a load of junk. I think the Wachoskis (never spelt it before) just should've left it as The Matrix was and allow the fans to interpret and expand the universe as the wished (same reason they don't do commentaries). But, sadly, Warner had to be money-grabby and destroy another franchise.

I agree with the notion of comapring the sequels to the SW prequels. Not because fans created their own ideas and expectations were too high, it's because the filmmakers gained or lost something during those years aay that changed how they write and create a movie. That's why Spielberg is such a great filmmaker: he's constantly reinventing himself though still sticking to his main principals (ever heard to always watches those three David Lean films before he starts his next project).

Like with the Alien Quadrilogy, soon to be Five-ologoy (i dont know the word!), it sunk in quality after the main story was expanded way too much. I agree totally with Loomis how a story arc of one film gets worse overtime if that one story was never meant to be expanded. Alien was a perfect wrap, just like with Star Wars, Raiders of the Lost Ark, The Godfather, Jurassic Park, American Graffiti, or Back to the Future. There were all crafter to be one movie, and you can't just take that away and pretend there's more to it. Why do you think most sequels are worse than their predecessors. I think sequels only really work for somebody like a comic-book hero or James Bond figure, where they have a job and constantly run into a new antagonist

As for buying these... It sounds great, it certainly does. And the price is smashing! But, I'll be passing. I want to buy the collector' set with minibust but I hate how its in that crap plastic CD cases. It it were the digipak with the Neobust along side it I'd grab it if I had the money. And, if Warner does ever release them separately, I'll prolly grab just the original jsut like I did with Alien.

[deathie mouse]

I think that would be Alien Pentalogy.

mmm and the Matrix box the Decalogue?

[2099net]

I saw the original movie per the reccomendation of a teacher shortly before the sequels came out and came on the bandwagon a little while before time that the marketing machine started up for Reloaded. I loved The Matrix and consider it one of the best films ever made, a rare action epic with the bravery to be different and the daring to ask questions without answers. The price of admission to see it is to think and not have things dumbed down for you, which is something that I applaud and respect.

Well, it's not different. That's the whole point I'm making. And as Loomis says it's certainly not a new idea if you read your hard sci-fi literature. That's what rubs me up about the Matrix the most (I'll tell you what else rubs me up about the film later). It's success is all based on the incorrect hype that is was a totally original concept.

I'm not really sure what questions were asked in the first film that weren't answered. Like I say there may be a few, but the Matrix is hardly an enigma of Lynchian proportions. As far as I can see there are very few unanswered questions and ambiguities by the time the movie ends. There's a whole sequence in the film where one of the main characters sits down and explains the whole 'concept' of the film to the hero. And as far as I can remember it's quite a lengthy piece of exposition too.. The exposition may not equate to dumbing down, but it certainly gives enough information to answer most of the questions. Other issues, such as the constant Alice in Wonderland references are hardly that startling or mystifying either.

But I do think the film dumbed itself down, and took itself in totally the wrong direction with the famous "lobby shoot out" scene. It pains me that when a film like The Matrix is presenting a new potentially mind-blowing concept to most of it's audience, the most remembered bit about the whole film is when Neo and Trinity simply shoot everyone in sight for a few minutes (and not even in an exciting way really, it all seems rather flat).

Firstly, it highlights everything that is wrong with the public as a whole that is what they decided to pick up on, but it's also wrong in the flow of the story for two reasons.

1: The people who are being shot are not agents. They are ordinary people inside the Matrix simply doing their job (Security Guards). The whole massacre is of 'innocent' people, and the so-called 'heroes' of the movie commit it. Now I'm not a prude when it comes to violence in movies, but I do strongly believe that the heroes must never lower themselves to the level of who they oppose.

2: The whole sequence doesn't really fit with the rest of the film, and it sort of spoils the 'resourceful outmatched and under equipped freedom fighters who know the truth fighting against the system'. It is literally a deux-ex-machina of epic proportions. It's as if it was written into the film because the filmmakers were worried that all the talky bits and weak-philosophy would bore the audience so they dumbed the film down to include a bit shooty bit. Now be honest, wouldn't it have not only fit in with the film more, but also have been more interesting and potentially suspenseful if the 'resistance' used their skills and expertise to sneak into the building to rescue Morpheus (good name by the way, another example of symbolism as subtle as a brick in the face).

The Matrix and its sequels do not present new concepts. Their philosophical musings are weak to say the least, the symbolism in some of the names and items in the films ultimately amounts to nothing, and once Neo became 'Superman' at the end of the first film, it was clear sequels were going to be a problem (which makes me think no sequels were intended – if they were, I'm sure they would have given the first film a different ending).

Yes, I guess if my life was only a little different I'd be one of the professional critics who hate the films doing a commentary.[*]

If you really want to see a film that doesn't dumb down, presents lots of unanswered questions and is 'different' then I recommend a film like David Lynch's 'Lost Highway'.

It's odd, but to me, even films like The Blair Witch Project have more unanswered questions than the Matrix. Even the critically mauled Blair Witch sequel raises more worthwhile philosophical points than the Matrix films do.

[*] Talking of critics and commentaries, don't forget to check out Ebert's commentary on Dark City. The man cannot praise the film enough.

[Disneykid]

I find it rather interesting that although you're obviously not a fan of The Matrix, you're buying the box set, anyway. Are you doing so to the give the film(s?) another chance or are you just an impulse buyer?

[deathie mouse]

I can't speak for him of course, but for me, like I said: Best Demo Reels. And the lure of those critics commenting, that should be interesting.

[Loomis]

But I do think the film dumbed itself down, and took itself in totally the wrong direction with the famous "lobby shoot out" scene. It pains me that when a film like The Matrix is presenting a new potentially mind-blowing concept to most of it's audience, the most remembered bit about the whole film is when Neo and Trinity simply shoot everyone in sight for a few minutes (and not even in an exciting way really, it all seems rather flat).

Just for everyone who is hanging out to hear what I have to say (you can relax now, cletus):

Yes, I have to say that is the one point that I turn on the film as well. Most modern sci fi, even the good ones, have to have the "dumb action scene" to justify their existence as a blockbuster. Look how dumbed-down Asimov was in I, Robot for example.

And still on that scene, I found it amusing that year that two other movies were widely criticized for their "violence" (Fight Club and Three Kings), but both movies carefully showed the after effects of mindless violence, as well as making a comment on violence and US culture in general. However, The Matrix - a film widely praised for its philosophical musings - seems to celebrate and show the "coolness" of violence without consequence (as 2099net points out, those guards were more than likely other "unfree" humans, rather than Machines, that they were senselessly killing).

And I think this is related to why the sequels failed (as films, if not commercially). The celebrated the same violence, but at the same time forgot what was impressive about the first film. The fight scene with the 60 Agent Smiths might have looked cool, but it wasn't needed (especially if Neo could fly away at any time). And after a brief period of time, one stopped caring as it looked as though you were watching a movie sequence from a computer game. This is equally true of the poor "final battle".

I'd go so far as to say this is a problem with modern filmmaking, and it is a trap that George Lucas also fell into. "Cool" and "new" is not necessarily better. The box set seems to be falling into the same trap the sequels did too. By adding LOTS of stuff, it will seem like a worthwhile set. But you can't polish a turd, really. Yes, a 10 Disc set for under $60 is awesome, but not when two of those films completely negate the first one and you have several docos that preseumably focus on how the "coolness" was achieved.

[2099net]

I find it rather interesting that although you're obviously not a fan of The Matrix, you're buying the box set, anyway. Are you doing so to the give the film(s?) another chance or are you just an impulse buyer?

Well, I bought Alice in Wonderland ME too didn't I?

I've reread my above post again, and I can see how it could give the wrong impression. Contary to how that post looks, I do actually think the first Matrix film is a decent movie. It's just easier for me to say something negative than good. I do however have a problem with the Matrix hype, just like I have a problem with most hype these days.

I also love, and I mean LOVE, the DVD medium, and it looks like this set will use the medium to it's advantage. Will I watch all the supplements? I doubt it, I've still not seen all of the Alien Quadrilogy supplements yet! But I'm sure I can pick and choose somehting that will interest me out of such a large set (even if it's only comic book artist Steve Skroce's design and storyboard sketches - the "Art of the Matrix" book is selling for $50 itself - and used to be around $100 when it first came out I believe).

Likewise I'm in high-anticipitation of the Warner Bros Freaks disc. While I do like the film a lot, I've seen it about 6 or 7 times by now, so the actual film has little appeal for me as such - But I am really looking forward to the commentary and one hour documentary. Sometimes the documentarties can be more entertaining than the films. I've done some research on Browning, so I'm looking forward to hearing more.