Tangled (aka Rapunzel) Discussion - Part III

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Wonderlicious
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Re: Tangled

Post by Wonderlicious »

The Kingdom of Corona? A land overflowing with Mexican beers (or Spanish crowns)? :o I'm there with bells on! :D

:party: :party: :pink: Image :pink: :party: :party:
Marianne81 wrote:Does no one care about my blog posting :(
I know it's long, but I'd love for people to read
I did read your blog post (or at least the Tangled parts), and I enjoyed it. I'm glad you had fun and sorry that people have been flipping out about stuff such as the name of the kingdom itself and what Rapunzel's shoes will look like. I think that Zak Levi probably influenced Flynn's look to at least a small extent, as it would be his voice they were animating anyway (they normally always also film the actors in the voice studio for the animators to watch and catch nuances).
Disney Duster wrote:Wonderlicious, right, the origins of Cinderella's name were not mentioned, which is different from completely changing how it was (the book could have just not known how she got her name).
Well, it was implied that she had that name from her parents. The narrator reads "there lived a widowed gentleman and his little daughter Cinderella", before they mention that the father ultimately remarries later on down the line. The stepsisters had yet to appear before that, so it can be said that the origins were changed quite a bit in Disney's version; it's by no means a nasty nickname derived from sleeping by the fire.
Disney Duster wrote:Nobody thinks it's amazing I came up with an idea that Disney turned out to also come up with and use? !
This isn't a criticism, but I think there are some who don't really want to read stuff like that as they don't want any speculation/spoilers (it is in white). Personally, I want to get caught up in the news and project tracking, but I don't want potential spoilers leaving me knowing what to expect when I go in the screening room. Cars, The Princess and the Frog and several others all got spoilt to some extent for me when I clicked on a thread on here and someone went and posted (not in white, I should add) things like "Ray's death is the saddest since Bambi's mom!", or "coz Lightning McQueen didn't win in the end, does that mean there could be a Cars 2?" (with the latter, maybe it has ;)).

I did actually read your thoughts on the whole lettuce vs flower thing (mainly as they weren't in white :p), and I think that the flower is from the "Rapunzel" plant (which itself is a bit of an ambiguous term, as I'll explain). All the versions of the Rapunzel story use some sort of plant as the name for the heroine (for an interesting article on the origins of the tale, lookie here: http://www.endicott-studio.com/rdrm/rrRapunzel.html ). The term "Rapunzel" from the Grimms' version, however, is pretty much always lost in translation (not just in English it seems), since it would need some explanation of sorts in English and result in a clunky text. Depending on where one is in Germany, Rapunzel can either mean lamb's lettuce, which is where the use of "lettuce" as a substitute in English translations of Grimm comes in (by the way, "Rapunzel" as "lamb's lettuce" is a regional term, and probably no longer used that much in modern Germany). It can also mean a very specific type of rampion (a type of plant whose leaves are used in salads) grown in Germany and whose full name is "Rapunzel-Glockenblume" in German (and I believe this is a Germany-wide term). The "Glockenblume" indeed translates as "bellflower" and agreeably looks very similar to the plant on display. Here's the German Wikipedia page (only to prove that I'm coming out with accurate stuff), as well as another picture of the plant.

German Wikipedia page:
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rapunzel-Glockenblume
Actual plant:
Image

Thus, I think that the use of this specific flower could be intended as being faithful enough to the story. If they do use the flower as a plot point and not the leaves, then they'll at least be using the same overall plant; the film makers would have done some research on what "Rapunzel" means, after all. Of course, the flower is different in colour, but then one may as well condemn Snow White for having chipmunks and raccoons in a European forest or Alice in Wonderland for having a pink and purple cat. It's a fantasy, where everything is not as it seems.
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Marianne81
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Post by Marianne81 »

Thanks all for kind comments on my blog posting. I'm glad some people were finally able to read it. :D
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Disney Duster
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Re: Tangled

Post by Disney Duster »

Thanks Amy, now I really want that Faerie Tale Theatre DVD set...

CiciRose, yes, you are right, it is more marketable, but that's not a good or artistic excuse for the film I mean. The could keep the lettuce but just have girls play with the flowers that come on the lettuce, if you know what I mean.

Wonderlicious, wow, thank you, that made me feel a lot better, answering me about all that.

I didn't understand only one thing, and that's when you said:
Wonderlicious wrote:(with the latter, maybe it has ;))
What? Anyway, I agree about Zak and Flynn, and was thinking, all the voice actors influence their character's look at least a little. It only makes sense to. As for Cinderella, indeed you are right the book implies that her parents named her that, but it did occur to me that the story could have been lost to time, and was just recorded wrong in the book being passed down, even though the movie, when the book comes to life, is "what really happened". Or the scribes of the book didn't know her name's origins, so they just called her Cinderella even at the beginning. Anyway, she never changes her name back in the original story, she kept the name, so it's like it is her name, and so if it is her name in the Disney version, not a nickname, I like that more. I like to think it had to do with her burnt orange/ash blonde hair.

As for the plant info, thanks. Let me get this straight, the flower's leaves are edible? Or it's lettuce...with flowers growing on it?

Because if it's the flower's leaves that are edible, that makes sense for how the movie can keep it the Rapunzel plant, since you can make tea with leaves (she could just eat them like the original story but whatever). If it's that the lettuce grows the flowers, they still could have kept that too and she just eats the lettuce.

This isn't spoiling anything by the way, it's in the beginning of the movie.

I just realized I still have a big problem with Rapunzel not having been born a peasant. That, and a bandit instead of a prince, is the biggest change Disney's made to any fairy tale so far, changing the character's backgrounds and, well, who they are (other than the Princess and Frog's changes which I kind of forgive because they needed a black heroine).

But I only said that because it was on topic, I'll shut up about it now.

Oh, and I think the flower is gold instead of purple because it is magical, it came from the sun's rays, and it makes Rapunzel's hair gold.
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Post by CiciRose »

DisneyDuster, I totally get what you mean. It sucks that business moves are more important than keeping the story close to the original, it's the nature of the beast, sadly. But, in the end, I'm sure the movie will be great :]

Marianne81, I read your blog :] I was actually shocked at the panel when they said Flynn was this Frakenstein creation of different "hot" actors because I've always thought he looked like Zac :lol: Granted, a more "classically handsome" version of him, but the resemblance has always been there for me. I knew it was a giant coincidence since he wasn't part of the cast until recently (recently, meaning compared to how long this thing has been in production @_@) but, yeah, I was surprised with how much Flynn ended up looking like Zac in the end. It's bound to happen, as you guys have said, because he provided the voice. Also, I read your TV Guide and Chuck posts, I might have seen you there ;]
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Re: Tangled

Post by Wonderlicious »

Disney Duster wrote:
Wonderlicious wrote:(with the latter, maybe it has ;))
What?
Cars 2 is indeed becoming a reality! :p
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Post by DisneyFan09 »

Love the way Flynn moves... His expressions. Seems like one of Disney's most charismatic heros.
Yup and also one of the most sexiest Disney heroes as well. I can't get enough of him.
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Atlantica
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Post by Atlantica »

As they have potentially created a very strong new 'Disney Hero' in this movie, do you think Disney will try to revive / relaunch the short lived Disney Heroes range ? This could be the perfect oppportunity to connect the more 'fairy tale' of Disney films with the male audience.

I only remembered this due to seeing an old 'Disney Heroes Music Collection' CD in HMV yesterday .... this could have had so much potential, to balence the Princess franchise. Now would be the perfect time to have another go ?
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Post by CiciRose »

atlanticaunderthesea wrote:As they have potentially created a very strong new 'Disney Hero' in this movie, do you think Disney will try to revive / relaunch the short lived Disney Heroes range ? This could be the perfect oppportunity to connect the more 'fairy tale' of Disney films with the male audience.

I only remembered this due to seeing an old 'Disney Heroes Music Collection' CD in HMV yesterday .... this could have had so much potential, to balence the Princess franchise. Now would be the perfect time to have another go ?
I would love that! Some of my favorite Disney characters are the "heroes" :D If Disney were smart, they would definitely be planning something like that.
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Post by DisneyDude2010 »

CiciRose wrote:
atlanticaunderthesea wrote:As they have potentially created a very strong new 'Disney Hero' in this movie, do you think Disney will try to revive / relaunch the short lived Disney Heroes range ? This could be the perfect oppportunity to connect the more 'fairy tale' of Disney films with the male audience.

I only remembered this due to seeing an old 'Disney Heroes Music Collection' CD in HMV yesterday .... this could have had so much potential, to balence the Princess franchise. Now would be the perfect time to have another go ?
I was just thinking about that last night Flynn would be a great addition HE WOULD be one of my favoourites like Prince Phillip. :D Disney Should do this i totally agree !!


Oh found this ....
Image .... Cute XD

Its also shown in concept art on that certificate thingy :L sorry forgot wat its called . !
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Post by ajmrowland »

yet another christmas gift I want.
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Post by DisneyFan09 »

DisneyDude2010 wrote:
CiciRose wrote: I was just thinking about that last night Flynn would be a great addition HE WOULD be one of my favoourites like Prince Phillip. :D Disney Should do this i totally agree !!


Oh found this ....
Image .... Cute XD

Its also shown in concept art on that certificate thingy :L sorry forgot wat its called . !
Thanks for sharing! :) It looks gorgeous :) Where did you found it?
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Post by Sotiris »

DisneyFan09 wrote:Thanks for sharing! :) It looks gorgeous :) Where did you found it?
On amazon.com most likely. I just checked there and I found it too. Actually I find the cover awful. There is some really amazing artwork produced for this film and they chose this one for the cover of the "Art of" book? Inexcusable!
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Post by robster16 »

From the Disney facebook pages:

Image

Early color concept art shows one of the many action sequences during Flynn and Rapunzel’s journey in “Tangled.”
Image
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Post by DisneyJedi »

robster16 wrote:From the Disney facebook pages:

Image

Early color concept art shows one of the many action sequences during Flynn and Rapunzel’s journey in “Tangled.”
I have no idea why whatsoever, but that scene reminds me of the avalanche scene in Mulan. :?
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Post by Edthehyena »

Beautiful and epic picture indeed !

Changing subject...

To all the Menken and Disney Music addicts like me who can't wait to HEAR some notes ;.. Did u notice that the famous article posted here from i dont' remember wich magazine gave us an essential clue and key to the forthcoming music !????... So, Below, you'll find the inspiration source for Alan composing and for Mandy singing... It's called "Chelsea Morning" They wrote it in that article. So you can picture what that famous new next WISH SONG (WHEN WILL MY LIFE BEGIN ?) will sound like, yeah, sixties, ectic, joyful, bouncy, country, sunny, fresh, original... less moving than "Out There" or "Part of your World" but i am sure the real song will have a more haunting menken style twist...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c5DYLYHlKvk

ENJOY and let your ears and imagination float... waiting for the real listening time
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Post by CiciRose »

robster16 wrote:From the Disney facebook pages:

Image

Early color concept art shows one of the many action sequences during Flynn and Rapunzel’s journey in “Tangled.”
Love the concept art, thanks very much for sharing! I just can't wait to see something that's actually from the movie >_< But, this scene looks like it'll be good. Judging by the arrows, I'm guessing it's the guards coming after Flynn? I wonder how early after he and Rapunzel meet this scene takes place. Assuming it's still in the movie, that is :P
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Post by Animalia »

DisneyJedi wrote:
robster16 wrote:From the Disney facebook pages:

Image

Early color concept art shows one of the many action sequences during Flynn and Rapunzel’s journey in “Tangled.”
I have no idea why whatsoever, but that scene reminds me of the avalanche scene in Mulan. :?
You're right, it's almost exactly like that. 8) When I first saw the picture I thought of the scene in Spirit Stallion of the Cimarron.
Edthehyena wrote:Beautiful and epic picture indeed !

Changing subject...

To all the Menken and Disney Music addicts like me who can't wait to HEAR some notes ;.. Did u notice that the famous article posted here from i dont' remember wich magazine gave us an essential clue and key to the forthcoming music !????... So, Below, you'll find the inspiration source for Alan composing and for Mandy singing... It's called "Chelsea Morning" They wrote it in that article. So you can picture what that famous new next WISH SONG (WHEN WILL MY LIFE BEGIN ?) will sound like, yeah, sixties, ectic, joyful, bouncy, country, sunny, fresh, original... less moving than "Out There" or "Part of your World" but i am sure the real song will have a more haunting menken style twist...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c5DYLYHlKvk

ENJOY and let your ears and imagination float... waiting for the real listening time
It sounds very nice, I think this will be the first time Menkan has ever actually mentioned a song that inspired him. Please correct me if I'm wrong. :wink: The only thing I'm worried about is that the song might only have guitar in it, I just hope the song will have a complex tune, not just one instrument.

I'm also warming up more to Mandy Moore as Rapunzel. When I first heard she was going to play her, I listened to one of her songs and wasn't very impressed. Just recently though, somewhere they were playing a song and I was wondered who the talented artist was, well it turned out to be Mandy Moore! This was the song they were playing

<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/R_HHSjgpLDU?fs ... ram><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/R_HHSjgpLDU?fs=1&hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>

And since everyone is talking of beer, my theory is the reason Disney hasn't had any boy merchandise is because they are going to produce Corona beer! :) It makes sense now that Rapunzel will be the first Disney Princess to enter a tavern and if the concept art is true have ale. Disney is so sneaky! :lol:
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Post by Polizzi »

http://search.barnesandnoble.com/Tangle ... ey+Tangled
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Found this on Barnes and Noble website.
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Post by SWillie! »

sotiris2006 wrote:
DisneyFan09 wrote:Thanks for sharing! :) It looks gorgeous :) Where did you found it?
On amazon.com most likely. I just checked there and I found it too. Actually I find the cover awful. There is some really amazing artwork produced for this film and they chose this one for the cover of the "Art of" book? Inexcusable!
Couldn't agree more. I was kind of assuming they would use the concept piece of them in the boat in front of the kingdom with all the lanterns, or the painting of the tower. This cover's horrible. It's a shame cuz the cover of The Art of Princess and the Frog was gorgeous.
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Post by Snow White »

The cover of "The art of" will show that Tangled will be only a parody à la Shrek... What I watched about the movie (trailer, etc) sounds like a Shrek ripoff... "The Art of" will confirm the movie will be a Shrek ripoff.

I'm very very disappointed...

Concept art are beautiful but the final movie isn't like this... I think it will be only a parody like Enchanted or Shrek or Happily N'Ever After or Hoodwinked... the title is like them, the trailer is like them, the book "The Art of" confirm that.

So, Disney made a great mistake to remove Keane and Wellins and shelved their beautiful dark version of the fairy tale... I don't like work of Byron Howard and Nathan Greno... it's too stupid what I watch and know about their version of Rapunzel...

Mawnck, you watched the movie in storyboards, so is it a parody? is it only a humor movie? I think Tangled have a lot of gross and vulgar comedy (like Shrek) and not heart or great moments...
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