More Turbulence At Disney

All topics relating to Disney-branded content.
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Margos
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Post by Margos »

Yeah, "The Iron Giant" actually was pretty good, I have to admit. I didn't say all non-Disney films are crap, just usually not as good. And while I did really enjoy "The Iron Giant," as well as some other animated films, even DreamWorks ones, I usually don't find them enjoyable enough to actually feel any need to see them again. "Corpse Bride" is the exception, but there are some others that were pretty good. As I said, "The Prince of Egypt" is definitely DreamWorks' best, and it is quite good. Most of their stuff isn't horrible, it's just not up to Disney's level.

(And note that, in Disney, I am including Pixar. In my mind, Pixar has that same spirit, mostly due to John Lasseter. I've always seen them as more or less one entity, even when they were thinking of splitting up. They were destined to merge, because they've both got that little spark of magic, you know what I mean?)

To me, though, no matter how "not-terrible" DreamWorks' products are, that studio is not where the magic is. It's where a former employee (one who, by the way, gave Ron and John a hard time about some of their projects and often made odd moves, like almost cutting "A Part of Your World") was bitter over being fired, and decided to start a new studio with his friends to leach money off of his "enemy." That's it. It's why they made "Antz," especially, being the most glaring example of DreamWorks' desire to diminish Disney's success. "The Prince of Egypt" was their greatest triumph, because it actually was a good movie made for its own sake.

And pvdfan, I agree that childhood memories are a big part of my love for Disney. But not really, because when I was little, animation was animation, and I'd put DreamWorks' and Disney's films on a shelf beside each other. Then I grew up. And Disney allowed me to recapture my childhood through it's classic stories and beloved characters. DreamWorks never made me feel like a kid again. It never made me feel like I was recapturing something I lost. I loved them both as a young child, but now I can feel the magic coming from one, and feel nothing from the other.

More than 70 years later, we all sit and wait for "Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs" to come out on Blu-Ray and DVD. Will you be able to say the same thing for anything to come out of DreamWorks? Only if they can find that intangible spark of magic that a man named Walt stumbled across so many decades ago. When they do, I'll be there in the cinema to watch their improved efforts.

And Goliath, personally, I find "Home on the Range," "Brother Bear," and "Treasure Planet" all better, both story-wise and aesthetically, than the Shrek films. The three of them all warm my heart, and feel like classics, despite only being around for a couple of years. "Shrek" was a great idea, and could have been excellent... But it was too busy mocking itself and everything else (especially Disney) to even be a serious film in its own right. It was like "Ha Ha Ha, stupid childish fairy tales! This is how a grown up does it! Watch this instead!" And so I just can't take them seriously.

Jeez, that was a long post. I just felt the need to seriously explain what I said. I wrote it when I was rather tired, and I feel like I sparked an awful lot of controversy. Sorry for all the fuss I caused, but there's a reason why I feel the way I do. (Plus, as an Aspie I tend to obsess over things that are precious to me, and I've rather latched on to Disney animation :P )
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Post by disneyboy20022 »

The_Iceflash wrote:Why does this discussion feel like it turned anti-Disney? :roll:
anti-disney Discussion on a Disney Forum......isn't that sac religious? :P
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Post by Goliath »

Margos,

You are right that DreamWorks hasn't and probably never will put out films as great as Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs. And they will never capture the genius of Walt Disney, that's also true. But the same can be said of the Disney Company of recent years. I have a very, very, very hard time believing Home on the Range *really* "warms your hearth" and "feels like a Classic". I still think you're blinded by the Disney-brand, automatically praising anything that comes out of the company, just out of habit. Nobody who truly loves Snow White would think Home on the Range has *any* redeeming qualities.
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Post by pap64 »

I already posted this on the Princess and the Frog thread, but I thought this needed to be posted here as well...

According to Box Office Mojo, The Princess and the Frog went back to the top 5 after dropping to number 7 at the box office during Christmas weekend. The film now sits at number 5, going up two places after the big drop.

This isn't much and doesn't mean that it will come up to the top three. But it does say that the movie might be strong enough to end up on the 80 to 100 million range, meaning that the movie did have some lasting appeal.

Again, this doesn't change the overall outlook of the movie.
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Post by akhenaten »

i like home on the range...:( i even got an award on this forum for defending it. :) the movie may not have any warmth or be a classic but its sincere in being a fun ( not funny!) little movie with beautiful visual style and serviceable songs.yes some jokes are lame but it is better than the hollow of a movie called sword in the stone.had it been released in the 60s or 70s it might have a better reputation. nowadays audience only go for movie that rocks the theaters with fast pace cuts and loud audio.for a movie about cows, it seemed suited for tv or home video instead.

:)
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Post by PatrickvD »

pap64 wrote:I already posted this on the Princess and the Frog thread, but I thought this needed to be posted here as well...

According to Box Office Mojo, The Princess and the Frog went back to the top 5 after dropping to number 7 at the box office during Christmas weekend. The film now sits at number 5, going up two places after the big drop.

This isn't much and doesn't mean that it will come up to the top three. But it does say that the movie might be strong enough to end up on the 80 to 100 million range, meaning that the movie did have some lasting appeal.

Again, this doesn't change the overall outlook of the movie.
$90 million is locked right now. And if you take away the 3D money from Bolt, both films will have sold a similar amount of tickets. Except that Bolt cost $45 million more to make.

And TPATF sold more merchandise.
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Post by pap64 »

Once more, I am being cautious with these numbers, because they may or may not mean anything. But, its very rare to see a film go back up after experiencing such a huge drop. It looks as if who wanted to see the hyped films were satisfied and are going back to see what they missed.

As for Home on the Range, I agree that it isn't a masterpiece. But its not horrible. I used to think it was pretty bad the first time I saw it. But after watching it last year for the second time I thought it was a fun little film with some great animation, color and music.

The story is very light, and that works in its favor and against it. If you see it as an innocent, fun film then it becomes very enjoyable. But if you try to see it as a deep, Disney classic, you will be disappointed.

I put it up there with the Disney package films. They have similar themes and styles, especially Pecos Bill.
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Margos
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Post by Margos »

pap64 wrote: The story is very light, and that works in its favor and against it. If you see it as an innocent, fun film then it becomes very enjoyable. But if you try to see it as a deep, Disney classic, you will be disappointed.

I put it up there with the Disney package films. They have similar themes and styles, especially Pecos Bill.
That's pretty much why I like it. I don't know, some days I'm in the mood for heavy classics, like pretty much all of the princess films and other golden age, silver age, and renaissance fare. But some days I just was a nice, simple, feel-good story (or stories). Then I pop in HotR or something like that. It's got some sad moments, but in the end, it's definitely a "feel-good" movie, IMO. (Not usually Melody Time, though, if I need a pick-me-up, since Pecos Bill was a depressing way to end a movie. :( ) I'm not saying it's like, one of the all-time-greatest movies ever. No, it is one of Disney's weaker ones, in my opinion. But I still love it, and it still affects me. I enjoy it, and that's enough for me. It's not perfect, but it's not bad.
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Post by disneyboy20022 »

Honestly in my opinion..I've had some thought on this....and.I don't think it was going to get sales as good as fast or at all like ALaddin...because Aladdin was in theaters for 8, 9 months...and then took a year to come to VHS....now it's due out on DVD and Blu Ray and On Demand and Itunes etc after 4 months of being in theaters.....I think this plays a role with a lot of films....use to it took forever for a theatrical film that was recent to come out....and I know it didn't happen 4 months later after it was released......so some people just rent movies.....because they don't have to wait a year for its release on the exception of A Christmas Carol release and other Christmas Themed movies.....on occassion...

Edit also when VHS came out...they were $25 a piece in Aladdin's Day in age......and when VHS first hit the scene in the 80s I know my dad always had blank vhs tapes instead of buying the films and he used that and hbo a lot.....now instead of buying stuff or using blank tapes some peole dvr it over using a vcr to tape it....
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Post by pvdfan »

^I agree with that 100%. The numbers may be huge for movies now, but take away the gimmicks (3-D and IMAX) and you would see those numbers drop some. Also, compare the movies to movies of any other generation and adjust their numbers to inflation and we have a different story.
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Post by pap64 »

According to the recent numbers, looks like the film WILL hit 80 million by the time the weekend ends, and will likely hit 100 million by the time it ends its run in theaters.

So things ain't as bad as they looked at first...
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Post by DisneyJedi »

pap64 wrote:According to the recent numbers, looks like the film WILL hit 80 million by the time the weekend ends, and will likely hit 100 million by the time it ends its run in theaters.

So things ain't as bad as they looked at first...
Well, not to sound negative, but I wouldn't be so sure about hitting $100 million, since Winter Break will have to end sooner or later. :|

But then I could be wrong. So here's to hoping it does break even, at least domestically! :)
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Post by pap64 »

DisneyJedi wrote:
pap64 wrote:According to the recent numbers, looks like the film WILL hit 80 million by the time the weekend ends, and will likely hit 100 million by the time it ends its run in theaters.

So things ain't as bad as they looked at first...
Well, not to sound negative, but I wouldn't be so sure about hitting $100 million, since Winter Break will have to end sooner or later. :|

But then I could be wrong. So here's to hoping it does break even, at least domestically! :)
Here's how I see it. The movie will likely be out on DVD and Blu-Ray in March. That means that the film will be playing for many more weeks. So whatever money it makes will go towards the overall tally. So by the time its on Blu and DVD, it might have earned 90 to 100 million, which is pretty good.

My concern, however, is that Disney is focused on how it performed on its first days rather than overall lifetime and overseas performances.
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Post by disneyboy20022 »

pap64 wrote:
DisneyJedi wrote: Well, not to sound negative, but I wouldn't be so sure about hitting $100 million, since Winter Break will have to end sooner or later. :|

But then I could be wrong. So here's to hoping it does break even, at least domestically! :)
Here's how I see it. The movie will likely be out on DVD and Blu-Ray in March. That means that the film will be playing for many more weeks. So whatever money it makes will go towards the overall tally. So by the time its on Blu and DVD, it might have earned 90 to 100 million, which is pretty good.

My concern, however, is that Disney is focused on how it performed on its first days rather than overall lifetime and overseas performances.
But I thought Disney could have its cake and eat it too even when its not their Happy Unbirthday :P
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Post by Just.A.Friend »

Just wanted to tell you guys that I went to a matinee showing of PatF today and it was absolutely packed, there were no seats available. None. When we got out we saw just how long the line was for more people to go in. It is doing very well this weekend at my theatre at least. We heard so many people ordering princess and the frog tickets when we were leaving. I guess it's maintaining a steady income.

And by the way, the movie has broken 100 million with worldwide releases, which is pretty good since the important releases arent even till around February.
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Post by DisneyJedi »

Just.A.Friend wrote:Just wanted to tell you guys that I went to a matinee showing of PatF today and it was absolutely packed, there were no seats available. None. When we got out we saw just how long the line was for more people to go in. It is doing very well this weekend at my theatre at least. We heard so many people ordering princess and the frog tickets when we were leaving. I guess it's maintaining a steady income.

And by the way, the movie has broken 100 million with worldwide releases, which is pretty good since the important releases arent even till around February.
DANG! :o

Is that domestically, or does it include international grosses?
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Post by pap64 »

Just.A.Friend wrote:Just wanted to tell you guys that I went to a matinee showing of PatF today and it was absolutely packed, there were no seats available. None. When we got out we saw just how long the line was for more people to go in. It is doing very well this weekend at my theatre at least. We heard so many people ordering princess and the frog tickets when we were leaving. I guess it's maintaining a steady income.

And by the way, the movie has broken 100 million with worldwide releases, which is pretty good since the important releases arent even till around February.
That's something I noticed. Even though the movie may be a slow earner it has gained a lot of fans and acceptance from the movie audience. Proof of this is Tiana's Showboat Jubilee. It was originally going to end in January, but its been so successful that they might extend it till March (which is when the movie will likely be released on DVD and blu-Ray).

And the numbers have been very steady, with little to no drops in earnings.

Again, maybe we cried Chicken Little a little too soon with this...
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Post by The_Iceflash »

Just.A.Friend wrote:Just wanted to tell you guys that I went to a matinee showing of PatF today and it was absolutely packed, there were no seats available. None. When we got out we saw just how long the line was for more people to go in. It is doing very well this weekend at my theatre at least. We heard so many people ordering princess and the frog tickets when we were leaving. I guess it's maintaining a steady income.

And by the way, the movie has broken 100 million with worldwide releases, which is pretty good since the important releases arent even till around February.
That's great! :)


Unfortunately all I've been hearing about is Avatar and its success with the box office :roll:
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Post by Rudy Matt »

Princess and the Frog is absolutely wonderful. If you haven't seen it, go now. You'll never be able to see it again on the big screen. What are you waiting for? Why are you still reading this? You should be out the door on your way to the cinema by now. I'm serious. Go. Go now.
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Post by Rudy Matt »

Goliath wrote:
Rudy Matt wrote:The polarization of the country regarding the health care bill isn't helping this movie at all. Terrible timing. Not the fault of poor Musker and Clements.

Anyhoo, they took a gamble, and they crapped out. The mood of the country was against them - same thing happened to Dumbo and Bambi.
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pap64 wrote:And what does this have to do with anything?
:lol:
OBVIOUSLY, Rudy Matt was being sarcastic in mocking all the various reasons people are giving for the supposed 'failure' of PatF. I must say, I had to laugh out loud when I read that! He's satirizing other people's excuses for the poor box office returns --blaming everything except the film.
Thanks Goliath - I'm glad someone understood (as if a vote on a health care bill would depress turnout to an animated musical...come on, people...)
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