I'd like everyone to read this (Rant on Enchanted Christmas)

[Escapay]

Would that rat be Mickey or Minnie?

More than likely, it can be you, or the one in Lady and the Tramp (are you gonna attack that now for the obvious subtext behind the title?)

Escapay

[Wonderlicious]

Skullfarmer, I accept your opinion. Personally, I feel saying that every copy of The Enchanted Christmas should be destroyed is a bit extreme, but hey. I do, however, find this thread pointless. Why?

1. You keep on shouting at everyone which is turning this thread into a hate one.

2. You keep on advertising your essay, such as in this example:

Would you just read the paper already?

If this is the point in your post, why don't you place a link to the topic in a signature (click on the Profile button)? Honestly, if you want people to read something you wrote, why don't you stop wasting bandwith by starting whole threads and placing "read it" posts throughout? People have done this before and it's annoying. Use siggies to their advantage!

[Escapay]

Good idea, Wonderlicious.

Gave me an idea too...check the siggy

Escapay

[Escapay]

I was bored, and decided to check any other messages by Skullfarmer. Found only two that were not in this thread:

http://www.ultimatedisney.com/forum/vie ... ght=#72424

Well, well...more direct-to-video garbage. I just want you guys to know
that "Mrs. Potts' Party" has been discredited, as well as the rest of
BELLE'S MAGICAL WORLD and THE ENCHANTED CHRISTMAS, due to
a paper I wrote on the films which can be read at the Internet Movie
Database...

http://www.ultimatedisney.com/forum/vie ... ght=#82535

Allow me to open your eyes:

http://imdb.com/title/tt0118692/board/nest/4335312

Seems the only thing Skullfarmer finds worth his/her time here at UD is to pimp out his/her essay.

Escapay

[goofy108]

this is the stupidest thing i think i have ever heard of! dude get a life. this forum is for serious stuff not this crap. so what? its a cheap movie that you dont like. i mean everyone is entitled to their own opinion but dude let it go. there are plenty of disney movies i didnt care for but that doesnt mean im going to go on and on about it just asking for attention.

[Skullfarmer]

Man...tough room. I apologize if I've offended anyone, but not for my paper.

[Just Myself]

Man...tough room. I apologize if I've offended anyone, but not for my paper.

Tough room? It's a message board not a chat room. And we're being tough because you're agravating the furk out of us. And you really can't apologize to us 'but not for your paper', because that's all you talk about- that assinine paper. Dude- It's a CHEAPQUEL! Let it go! Most cheapquels are expected to be mediocre at best. It probably didn't cost anything more than a million dollars to make anyway! So please, leave the boards or stop shilling your dumb paper.

[Skullfarmer]

1. It's not JUST a cheapquel, it's an attempt to cash in on a work of art.
2. The fact that it exists is reason enough to hate it.
3. It has nothing to do with Christmas, at its core.
4. Indisputable canonical facts were altered to suit the "story."
5. So were the characters.
6. The result = a lie

I'm outta here.

[Escapay]

1. It's not JUST a cheapquel, it's an attempt to cash in on a work of art.

Disney can cash in on whatever they want, and how they do it is their own business. If you hate it that much, don't subject yourself to it and just pretend it doesn't exist so as to not damage your memories of the work of art.

2. The fact that it exists is reason enough to hate it.

So..does the fact that anythign exists give you reason enough to hate it? Even your precious Beauty and the Beast?

3. It has nothing to do with Christmas, at its core.

From your twisted point of view.

4. Indisputable canonical facts were altered to suit the "story."

Then don't count it as canon in your head. Let others who enjoy the film not have to worry about the canon like nitpickers like you.

5. So were the characters.

Ditto. It's just a movie. It's not like someone's life was ruined by this film, unless it was yours.

6. The result = a lie

You waste your time trying to discredit a good Christmas movie. Why not just sit down, have a cup of decaf coffee, and take a nap.

I'm outta here.

Thank god and amen.

[StitchExp626]

Nice eloquent response, Kevin! Let's see if Skullfarmer treats you with a customized put-down the way he has everyone else.

Thanks Luke, though I don't think that there will be any response to that post. As a famous Aussie once said "That's life" !!

[Skullfarmer]

1. It's not JUST a cheapquel, it's an attempt to cash in on a work of art.

Disney can cash in on whatever they want, and how they do it is their own business. If you hate it that much, don't subject yourself to it and just pretend it doesn't exist so as to not damage your memories of the work of art.

Pretending doesn't do any good.

2. The fact that it exists is reason enough to hate it.

So..does the fact that anythign exists give you reason enough to hate it? Even your precious Beauty and the Beast?

Not sure what you mean...

3. It has nothing to do with Christmas, at its core.

From your twisted point of view.

Not just from mine.

4. Indisputable canonical facts were altered to suit the "story."

Then don't count it as canon in your head. Let others who enjoy the film not have to worry about the canon like nitpickers like you.

Not counting it as canon in my head would be pointless, wouldn't it.

5. So were the characters.

I erased what you wrote, sorry...

6. The result = a lie

You waste your time trying to discredit a good Christmas movie. Why not just sit down, have a cup of decaf coffee, and take a nap.

It's NOT A GOOD MOVIE. I don't understand how you people can
defend it as if it were real cinema.

Now which post is the one you guys don't think I'll respond to? I'm going
to respond to it and then somebody please tell me how to unsubscribe,
or whatever I have to do to not post here...

I'm outta here.

Thank god and amen.

You took the words right out of my mouth...

[toonaspie]

1. It's not JUST a cheapquel, it's an attempt to cash in on a work of art.
2. The fact that it exists is reason enough to hate it.
3. It has nothing to do with Christmas, at its core.
4. Indisputable canonical facts were altered to suit the "story."
5. So were the characters.
6. The result = a lie

I say with the slight exception of #3 that this pretty much refers to pratically ALL of the Disney DTV sequels.

[Just Myself]

Skullfarmer, do what you said you would and get 'outta here'.

[Wonderlicious]

1. It's not JUST a cheapquel, it's an attempt to cash in on a work of art.

So would a print of the Mona Lisa be a travesty and worth a 25 page rant, then?

[TreasurePlanetRules]

Now which post is the one you guys don't think I'll respond to? I'm going
to respond to it and then somebody please tell me how to unsubscribe,
or whatever I have to do to not post here...

I think the post is the long one on the second page of this very long thread!! Man you should read your entire thread as you started it!!!!!! It is quite a funny one though, you have a wicked sense of humor!!!

[ichabod]

So would a print of the Mona Lisa be a travesty and worth a 25 page rant, then?

No, but a sequel of the Mona Lisa in a Santa hat would be!

*update*



As you can see the image in the picture clearly depicts homosexual paedophile... blah...blah...blah...rant....rant...rant

Full essay coming soon to an IMDB near you!

[Angela]

1. It's not JUST a cheapquel, it's an attempt to cash in on a work of art.
2. The fact that it exists is reason enough to hate it.
3. It has nothing to do with Christmas, at its core.
4. Indisputable canonical facts were altered to suit the "story."
5. So were the characters.
6. The result = a lie

I'm outta here.

It's this simple, if you don't like it DON'T WATCH IT Geez, it's like the people who complain about tv shows they hate, if you hate it, turn the channel, ie. if you hate the movie, then don't watch it as I said above.

I can respect that you don't like it, but geez all that hate over one movie? You must have ALOT of free time

[Skullfarmer]

All right, here's an answer. (And whoever put a Santa hat on the Mona Lisa... I looked at it and can't stop laughing.)

I agree with some of the points raised in your very long discussion on the Enchanted Christmas DTV release.

Thank you.

Like you Skullfarmer I have watched the original video and now the DVD release of Beauty and the Beast many times; at least fifty times and I have always found it very moving.

I'm closing in on my eight hundreth.

So I can appreciate how important the movie is to you and to many of us.

Again, thank you.

I think that many also have been less than thrilled with the overall quality of the sequels, eg new characters, less than strong storylines and often below par songs.

"Outraged" would be a better word. This is CINEMA, this is ART we're talking about.

You provide an insight into the subliminal sexual subtext of some of the characters in the sequel, such insights are frequently used in discussing various types of literature, eg the works of Charles Dickens, with a young character called Master Bates!!!!! However as Escapay points out this analysis could be applied to many of the Disney films, eg look at various theories that have been expounded about the relation between Aladdin and the Genie for instance.

I didn't see or feel any sexual tension between Aladdin and the Genie.

We can overly analyze these cartoons, many do and that is why they want them banned. There are many interest groups that do not want movies that advocate a world view that is even slightly different from theirs and these are the are the ones that are very vocal in wanting a number of Disney productions banned.

I'm not a member of any of those groups.

Again The Lion King, a big outrage over suggested cloud formations spelling out an undesirable word!!!! I think that you would agree that these reactions are over-reactions.

Yeah, they are.

You and I both do not think highly of The Enchanted Christmas. However to suggest that all copies should be destroyed is also an over reaction

Then we must agree to disagree...

We do have the power of choice in what we see, like buy etc. We may not like a sequel, but we can not base a dislike on the subtext, otherwise the argument would have to apply to most movies and not just DTV sequels

Oh, I hate the sequel more than I hate the subtext.

We can not dislike a sequel because of continuity problems

-continuity = canon.

we know that it is simply impossible to correlate the passing of time between Maurice going in search of Belle until the time that Belle finds him cold and lost in the woods. But we allow some licence with this problem, although this was the reason why the song Human Again was dropped, as it would show even greater amounts of time passing, and poor old Maurice lost in the wood for months!!!!

The film is meant to be a fairy tale. Fairy tales don't always make perfect sense.

Also most sequels have this problem, no mention of Ursula having a sister in the original, no mention of Scar selecting his heir in the original and no mention of Aladdin's preoccupation with his Father in the original etc etc. Yet we allow these continuity issues to be forgotten in order to enjoy (or not) the new narrative that is being presented.

I can't just ignore the fact that the people at the beginning are singing a song from the late 1800s, or that the Enchantress was wearing a green gown in BEAUTY AND THE BEAST and red in CHRISTMAS. Or... or... or... I could go on all day with this...

Ultimately it comes down to our own likes and dislikes. There is nothing wrong with simply saying that the Enchanted Christmas is in your opinion terrible and not worth watching. There is no need to have to back it up with some psychological analysis of the animated characters.

But the characters are psychologically complex.

Just as we don't like it, there are others, especially the younger age group who do enjoy it.

They need to know how awful it is.

So, Skull, keep enjoying the original and don't worry if Disney makes hundreds of inferior sequels. It does not matter, it in no way diminishes the integrity of the original characters that you love

That's right, but those sequels would still exist.

The important lesson, that the original movie tells us, is that we need to have a level of goodness inside, this is why the beautiful enchantress turned the young man into the Beast. It is only when he finds this love inside does he become fully human.

Exactly.

Instead of being overly angry, I think that you should focus more on the positive qualities that you have inside. Interesting thread and hopefully you will have also broadened your vision and thoughts through having this dialogue with everyone who has posted.

I think my position on this movie is the same as Roger Ebert's stance on the movie NORTH. I don't have the exact quote in front of me. ("I hated hated hated hated hated hated this movie...")

Somebody show me how to delete my account.

[ichabod]

You wrote a reply to yourself?

[Tom in North Carolina]

Somebody show me how to delete my account.

PLEASE!!!

Tom