Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney

[Sotiris]

Wow, that was truly good animation!

Mickey and Daisy were off-model in some shots, but I did like Donald's animation. What I found really odd though was Clarabelle being the only character in her '30s design. She stuck out like a sore thumb. I wonder why they did that.

[D23ExpoVisitor25]

Wow, that was truly good animation! It was far superior to the likes of Once Upon a Studio and Disenchanted!

The animation for Mickey and Friends was fine in Once Upon a Studio, the human characters were the ones that looked off.

Not all human characters looked off. The ones they got right, IMO, were Aladdin, Jasmine, Merlin, Stromboli, Milo Thatch, Christopher Robin, Mowgli, Prince Arthur, Lilo, Mulan, Belle, Quasimodo, Jafar, Madame Medusa, Morgana, the Red Queen, the Mad Hatter, Cody from The Rescuers Down Under, Peter Pan, Wendy, John, Michael, Jim Hawkins, and Tiana.

[Farerb]

I listened to half of the Bancroft Brothers podcast with Mark Henn and he said that he finally decided to leave Disney because he didn't find the work fulfilling and that there isn't any hand drawn work in the pipeline. He also said that only two trainees remained from the hand drawn program and that Eric Goldberg might retire soon as well.

He also said that he submitted ideas for features during the pandemic but none were approved. Apparently he wanted to direct a feature for a long time but they never let him do that. Two of his ideas were eventually made by someone else (Valiant and Planes).

He also explained that the reason Disney didn't continue with hand drawn features is because that meant to create another studio within a studio and it was too expensive and they couldn't justify that.

https://bancroftbros.libsyn.com/mark-henn

[Kyle]

Well that's depressing.

And I dont get the whole "too expensive to have a studio within a studio" thing. Disney is like, the biggest company in the world, I dont buy that they cant afford it. Also, couldn't the majority of the pipeline just be done by their 3d team anyway? so really you just need to add animation desks for those who still use paper, and the rest probably already use cintiqs.

[reee9948]

I'm really sad that Disney won't be returning to 2d animation anytime soon or ever. I really hope that Light of the World succeeds in box office so it would pressure them to go back to making 2d movies again, but I doubt that its going to happen. At the very least, I hope that the movie succeeds so that studio making the movie can continue to make more 2d animated movies.

[Farerb]

In its 100 year, I think it's time to acknowledge that the Disney Company is dead and is never coming back.

Like I said a while ago, this was really a eulogy for Disney Animation:
https://youtu.be/gB90me0aqSY?si=GSPhmwmxr0RTLsfi

[Farerb]

Coincidentally, an article came out today:

Disney Legend Mark Henn Says He May Have Not Retired “If The Work Had Been More Meaningful”
https://www.cartoonbrew.com/studios/ret ... 36985.html

[D23ExpoVisitor25]

I listened to half of the Bancroft Brothers podcast with Mark Henn and he said that he finally decided to leave Disney because he didn't find the work fulfilling and that there isn't any hand drawn work in the pipeline. He also said that only two trainees remained from the hand drawn program and that Eric Goldberg might retire soon as well.

He also said that he submitted ideas for features during the pandemic but none were approved. Apparently he wanted to direct a feature for a long time but they never let him do that. Two of his ideas were eventually made by someone else (Valiant and Planes).

He also explained that the reason Disney didn't continue with hand drawn features is because that meant to create another studio within a studio and it was too expensive and they couldn't justify that.

https://bancroftbros.libsyn.com/mark-henn

I don't believe him when he says that there's no hand-drawn work in the pipeline when we have that Tiana series, which has been reported many, many times to be hand-drawn animated, for Disney+ in the works over at Walt Disney Animation Studios in Vancouver along with it being worked on in its alredy-established lot in Burbank, which Henn was rumored to be educating the people over there to work on to get the hand-drawn style right before he retired. He can't call that story "not meaningful" when many people think that series is meaningful for many reasons. I think what he means to say is no hand-drawn movies in the works in the pipeline.

In its 100 year, I think it's time to acknowledge that the Disney Company is dead and is never coming back.

Like I said a while ago, this was really a eulogy for Disney Animation:
https://youtu.be/gB90me0aqSY?si=GSPhmwmxr0RTLsfi

You're wrong. The company is not dead, that's a sentiment only those online grifters say and I think we should be the opposite of them and not repeat their vitriolic rhetoric. It's not a eulogy, it's a celebration. And if this short film gets nominated and wins the Oscar for Best Animated Short, it'll force Disney to not shut it down.

Coincidentally, an article came out today:

Disney Legend Mark Henn Says He May Have Not Retired “If The Work Had Been More Meaningful”
https://www.cartoonbrew.com/studios/ret ... 36985.html

So, the Tiana series wasn't meaningful to him, even when he allegedly spent time helping educate the animators in WDAS Vancouver on getting the show's hand-drawn animated style right?

No.

I'm sorry I have to draw a line and say that might not be true.

[MoonMarc21]

He also said that he submitted ideas for features during the pandemic but none were approved. Apparently he wanted to direct a feature for a long time but they never let him do that. Two of his ideas were eventually made by someone else (Valiant and Planes).

He also explained that the reason Disney didn't continue with hand drawn features is because that meant to create another studio within a studio and it was too expensive and they couldn't justify that.

Dang, now I feel bad for Mark Henn. I think he would make a fine feature film given his experience with mostly John Musker and Ron Clements and I wonder what his ideas were You'd think that Jennifer Lee would be excited for an animated movie directed by a veteran animator in the studio, even if they compromise it to become a CGI film instead. Oh well, at least he'll direct a short film before he leaves...

Also, I agree with Kyle here that Disney is that big of a company to have a "studio within a studio", they literally bought a whole other company 5 years ago! And if it's not for full hand-drawn movies, then use it for hybrid animated movies in order to elevate what Wish's animation style could've been.

[DisneyJedi]

Not to be all doom and gloom, but were they just lying about bringing back (or interest in bringing back) hand-drawn as more full-scale or whatever and training new animators on the medium?

[D23ExpoVisitor25]

Not to be all doom and gloom, but were they just lying about bringing back (or interest in bringing back) hand-drawn as more full-scale or whatever and training new animators on the medium?

Considering Tiana has been allegedly and reportedly said to be hand-drawn animated over and over and over again, I don't think they were lying. Maybe they just don't know what is the best idea for a succesful big mainstream hand-drawn animated film.

[Sotiris]

Tiana supposedly being 2D is just rumor and speculation (and honestly, wishful thinking at this point) and it hasn't been confirmed by Disney or a credible source like a trade publication.

[D23ExpoVisitor25]

Tiana supposedly being 2D is just rumor and speculation (and honestly, wishful thinking at this point) and it hasn't been confirmed by Disney or a credible source like a trade publication.

It's not wishful thinking if PEOPLE I TALKED TO WHO CLAIMS TO HAVE FRIENDS WORKING ON THE SHOW say Tiana is hand-drawn.

Even Jennifer Lee in a French interview that was translated into English said something along the lines of "Tiana will be traditionally animated."

Maybe at D23 in August, they'll finally confirm that, especially since people on Twitter claimed to have read things saying the team at WDAS Vancouver who worked on Once Upon A Studio is behind the animation for the Tiana series.

THAT is why I think Tiana being hand-drawn animated is more than just so-called "wishful thinking," it might actually be the truth.

But you probably are just too afraid to admit it might be true because you don't want it to be CGI animated if you end up jinxing it.

[Sotiris]

Even Jennifer Lee in a French interview that was translated into English said something along the lines of "Tiana will be traditionally animated."

No she didn't. You see what you want to see. It was in a Spanish, not French, interview actually, and she said "[Disney+] is a really good platform to start playing with things that have meant a lot to a lot of us." You can't get any more vague and non-committal than that.

[D23ExpoVisitor25]

Even Jennifer Lee in a French interview that was translated into English said something along the lines of "Tiana will be traditionally animated."

No she didn't. You see what you want to see. It was in a Spanish, not French, interview actually, and she said "[Disney+] is a really good platform to start playing with things that have meant a lot to a lot of us." You can't get any more vague and non-committal than that.

Then why did she also say this when talking about Tiana?

"How technology has allowed us to maintain the importance of traditional animation through artists is what excites me the most."

Sounds to me like they ARE committing to Tiana being hand-drawn.

I didn't just see what I want to see. I saw what she said.

And what she said is her own way of saying "Tiana will be traditional 2-D hand-drawn animated."

May not be how YOU see it, but that's what I imagine she is saying.

[Sotiris]

Then why did she also say this when talking about Tiana?

"How technology has allowed us to maintain the importance of traditional animation through artists is what excites me the most."

She wasn't saying that about Tiana. She was speaking in general. But even if she were talking about Tiana in that instance, what she said was very ambiguous. She could have easily be referring to the animation style of Wish, not real 2D animation.

[D23ExpoVisitor25]

Then why did she also say this when talking about Tiana?

"How technology has allowed us to maintain the importance of traditional animation through artists is what excites me the most."

She wasn't saying that about Tiana. She was speaking in general. But even if she were talking about Tiana in that instance, what she said was very ambiguous. She could have easily be referring to the animation style of Wish, not real 2D animation.

Sorry but I don't believe that. I don't at all. I just don't. Because people like Grace Randolph, iCritic, Skyler Shuler, etc, they've all heard, from friends they know, that Tiana IS HAND-DRAWN ANIMATED, even Grace when she said she heard 2025 for Tiana's release because they want more time on getting its hand-drawn animated style right.

So, it doesn't sound that ambiguous to me, when someone like me has looked more into this than you have.

[Farerb]

Disney has made 16 CGI films so far. How will you feel when they make their 47th CGI film?

[D23ExpoVisitor25]

Disney has made 16 CGI films so far. How will you feel when they make their 47th CGI film?

We're not talking about films, we're talking about Tiana. Stop trying to move goalposts.

[Farerb]

Disney has made 16 CGI films so far. How will you feel when they make their 47th CGI film?

We're not talking about films, we're talking about Tiana. Stop trying to move goalposts.

I asked a general question in the "Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney" thread. If you want to talk about Tiana, you can do it in its own thread.