Alice in Wonderland Discussion

AwallaceUNC · Post by **AwallaceUNC** » Wed Aug 04, 2004 6:38 pm

Kelvin's gonna love this one.

I just watched this the other day. Alice in Wonderland is one of the grossly underrated films in Disney's canon. I absolutely love it.

The animation: At times, it can get a little cartoony, but remains rich even then. For the most part, it's really beautiful animation, and unique. It's a very colorful film, which is very appropriate for a story that explores the imagination. It looks doubly fantastic on the wonderful ME DVD, which is a must-have for a Disney DVD collection, imo.

The tone: Alice in Wonderland, the book and the movie, delicately straddles the fine line between a dream and a nightmare. That balance results in the quizzacle, pondrous feeling of wonder and oddity that defines the story. In the film, this comes through with as much as humor as it does in the book. Alice is possibly Disney's funniest animated classic, I laugh the whole way through. That's partly due to the witty wordplay and the challenges of logic, but it's also largely due to...

The characters: Alice really is the quintessential curious child. That makes her the perfect victim, so to speak, for Wonderland. I think my favorite thing about Wonderland's residents is just how rude they are. It's so funny. It's as if they resent the fact that Alice just doesn't get it, when in fact, getting it is impossible. The Queen of Hearts makes a great villain- mean for the heck of it. The Cheshire Cat is perhaps my second favorite, behind only the Mad Hatter, who is a hoot!

The music: "A World Of My Own" follows the Disney tradition of framing an entire story with a film's first song. I really like it. A Very Merry Unbirthday is very catchy, too, and depicts a lot of the madness. Other than those, though, the rest of the songs are sadly forgettable. I really liked the deleted "I'm Odd" song on the DVD, though. If there were so many songs written for Alice, I wish they would have picked some better ones.

The book: I absolutely love Lewis Carrol's Alice In Wonderland and Through The Looking Glass. The movie borrows elements from both, and abandons a lot from both as well. But while it does stray slightly from the story, it manages to not only remain fairly faithful to the text, but to perfectly capture the spirit. So much was left out, though, that AiW (I JUST got what Kelvin's MSN addy means, btw, now that I typed that) is deserving- dare I even say in need of- a sequel, if any of the Walt-era classics are. I wish it could've been done then. But, alas...

The reception: As I said earlier, it is grossly underrated. It was also a relative flop, from what I understand. To be fair, Cinderella is a very tough act to follow for any contendor. Walt said that Alice had no heart, or something to that effect. I can see where he's coming from. There's a lot of potential to really tug on emotions by the end of the film (innocent girl lost and can't find her way home in a very strange place). It tries to capitalize on that with the "I very seldom take my advice" song, but in my opinion, it fails to really make you feel for her. That's onlya minor complaint, though.

The story: It's really an adventure, though it does seem to get a bit episodic at times. I don't want to summarize, as I think most people here know at least the basics, but to me, it's really a very entertaining story. I love the way in which everything comes crashing together in the end.

Other adaptations: All in all, I think Disney's may be my favorite. However, there are more literal adaptations that I really enjoy as well (the recent NBC adapatation w/ Whoopi and lots of other celebs, and the 1985 2-parter). Hopefully Disney will produce an apt follow-up to this endearing classic!

-Aaron

Disneykid · Post by **Disneykid** » Wed Aug 04, 2004 7:12 pm

Yay, a thread basically tailored exclusively for me!

Where can I start...

The story: Both Alice books are among my favorite books ever. I love how whimsical and fantastical they both are, and even though the Disney film isn't true to the books literally, I believe it's true to them thematically. Since the book uses verbal puns, the movie decides to use visual puns to suit the film medium and the results are spectacular. Sure, the film is very episodic, but in some ways the film benefits from this because then it doesn't drag on and on like other films but skips nimbly from scene to scene.

The characters: Alice has some of the most colorful characters ever in the studio. They may all be mad, but they're all unique enough to give the film some variety. They're all very memorable and offer some of the most quotable lines from any Disney movie.

The animation: This is possibly my favorite aspect of the film next to the story. Alice probably has the most colorful pallette of any Disney movie. Every color of the rainbow is here and used vibrantly. The style of animation is very surreal and twisted; you'll be hard pressed to find a straight line in this film. But this style suits the film perfectly and offers a great backdrop for the characters to run in.

The music: What makes the soundtrack of Alice so unique is how songs aren't just clearly there like with other Disney films. Instead, the songs are literally blended into the dialogue so that characters randomly burst into them, even if they're only like 3 lines long. It adds to unconventional feel of the film and offer some clever Carrollesque verbal puns.

Alice in Wonderland is to me an outstanding movie on all levels. People accuse of Disney of following a pattern or mold, but this movie follows anything but, yet for that it gets bashed. It's true that the film lacks a certain level of warmth (which is why this is actually my 2nd favorite Alice film, my favorite being the 1985 CBS miniseries which not only followed the books well, but offered a lot of heart and warmth), but it makes up for this in all other aspects. Besides, whenever people say the title Alice in Wonderland, people usually think of the Disney movie, so that's gotta count for something, right?

rb_canadian181 · Post by **rb_canadian181** » Wed Aug 04, 2004 8:32 pm

Agreed, Alice In Wonderland is one of my very favourite Disney classics. It's one that I bought off ebay about 2 years ago. I managed to get my hands on a still shrink wrapped copy of the original classic!

I don't see why Disney let it go under-rated. It's almsot an embarassment to them-or so it seems. I love it! The characters are so colourful in so many ways. I used to remeber back when I was very young watching "Adventures in Wonderland" on the family channel in Canada. For a while i tried to see if there were any mirrors I could walk through and get to Wonderland

The imagination of a child.....
anyway. this is a great topic. Alice in Wonderland is great!

DreamerQ18 · Post by **DreamerQ18** » Wed Aug 04, 2004 11:55 pm

I will never forget the first time I discovered Alice in Wonderland. I was 7 years old and I was really sick I had the stomach virus so there was no other choice but to stay home and I got it on the weekend. Friday night I was in my moms room and it came on TV what is now the WB. And I was totaly captured and fell in love with the story.

My favorite sequence was the Unbirthday segment. The Mad hatter and hair just cracked me up. How they were so crazy about thier tea and how they took the white Rabbits watch and were doing all this crazy stuff to it. And of course the song a very Un- Birthday Lol.

I also really enjoyed the segement in which Alice sings with the Flowers and how they made fun of her since she really wasnt one.

Its one oof the few Disney movies that dosnet have a magical touch to it or the best songs that totaly captured me. That year I got Alice In Wonderland for my birthday on VHS loved it so much wore it out got it again this year for my 18th birthday on DVD.

My only complaint like Aaron says is that they didnt use more of the songs that I had for the movie. I love the I am odd song.

AwallaceUNC · Post by **AwallaceUNC** » Thu Aug 05, 2004 10:00 am

DreamerQ18 wrote:How they were so crazy about thier tea and how they took the white Rabbits watch and were doing all this crazy stuff to it.

I LOVE that scene, I'm always rollin' in laughter there. hahahha, I wanna watch it again now.

Also, in my characters section, I forgot to mention the Caterpillar. "WhO R U?" I love it! My favorite part is the 3" tall line, though.

-Aaron

deathie mouse · Post by **deathie mouse** » Fri Aug 06, 2004 11:22 am

Alice in Wonderland: more Disney animated psicodelia. I love it!

Wonderlicious · Post by **Wonderlicious** » Fri Aug 06, 2004 11:39 am

Alice in Wonderland is one of my favourite Disney films. It was my first movie ever and even if I watched it tommorow and hated it for some reason or another, I would still put it in my Disney Top 10 for its sentimental value.

MickeyMousePal · Post by **MickeyMousePal** » Fri Aug 06, 2004 1:56 pm

Well let's began with Alice in Wonderland wasn't one of my favorite Disney film until the Masterpiece Edition came out then I really fell in love with the film. I don't wait it all the time but watch it one time a month because I love Cheshire cat!!!
I'm glad Disney re-releases Alice in Wonderland with a Masterpiece Edition because this is my family least favorite film.

Kram Nebuer · Post by **Kram Nebuer** » Fri Aug 06, 2004 4:43 pm

I love Alice in Wonderland! I don't remember when I first saw it but I saw it after a long time of not seeing it at my cousin's house in CA. We were on vacation and I got bronchitis. One day everyone went shopping, but I had to stay home b/c I was sick. I was looking at their VHS collection and popped in Alice. It became one of my favorites since then! A fun adventure with a lost character in a world of oddities. It's like a metaphor for life! I love the music, the colors, the animation, the characters, it's always been a major part of the magic of Disney. I read an abridged version of the first book and found all that they cut out, but that is in one way a good thing, otherwise the movie would be WAAAAAAAAAAYY too long. Overall a great Disney classic!

Fun Quotes:

"Forward, backward, inward, outward, bottom to the top...something something something never never stop!" - the Caucus race

(After putting in two spoons, jam, butter, tea, etc. into the White Rabbit's pocketwatch to fix it...)
March Hare: Mustard?
Mad Hatter: Yes, mustar- Well! Let's not be silly!

ETA:
(The Dormouse is going bananas...)
Dormouse: CAT! CAT! etc.
Mad Hatter and March Hare: The jam! The jam! Put it on his nose!
Dormouse: *calms down*
Mad Hatter: Those are the things that upset me!

DreamerQ18 · Post by **DreamerQ18** » Fri Aug 06, 2004 6:13 pm

(After putting in two spoons, jam, butter, tea, etc. into the White Rabbit's pocketwatch to fix it...)
March Hare: Mustard?
Mad Hatter: Yes, mustar- Well! Let's not be silly!

Thats one of my absloute favorite parts.

AwallaceUNC · Post by **AwallaceUNC** » Fri Aug 06, 2004 6:19 pm

Mine too. The dialogue of the tea party scene is pure comedic genius!

-Aaron

Disneykid · Post by **Disneykid** » Fri Aug 06, 2004 7:30 pm

Psst...actually it's "Don't let's be silly!"

Loomis · Post by **Loomis** » Fri Aug 06, 2004 7:33 pm

http://www.ultimatedisney.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=246

(From 2099net's DISCussion)

To quote myself:

"I've always been a fan of the Alice story. Just always thought it was cool. One of the chief complaints that was leveled at 'Alice' was "In both of the book, the bulk of the story is nothing more than a series of events that Alice finds herself wondering in and out of." (Reader, para 3) This, however, is what I find most fascinating about it. The dreamlike quality of the whole production. What has often been called 'trippy' by some is a magnificent animated recreation of the disjointed images one might experience in a dream. In real life, you wouldn't follow a rabbit down a hole. In a dream, it might seem like a perfectly logical thing to do. For me, this quality adds to the sense of 'wonder'.
[...]
Ok, this is one of my faves and I am somewhat biased. Yeah, there are weak links to the film (Alice's voice is a little too twee on occasions), and there are legitimate arguments for it being worse/better than other films. However, to dismiss this as poor because of the narrative structure of the piece (at the same time the narrative structure of the books!) is simply unfair. I think this has rightfully earned a place in the Disney masterpiece collection. "

Alan · Post by **Alan** » Sat Jun 25, 2005 7:44 am

I thought Alice in wonderland was a strange film indeed. I didn't think there was like any plot, and was kind of boring. I think its overrated, I didn't like it. The animation was all right, but the dialogue wasn't. It was very episodic, the episodes didn't connect with each other.

2099net · Post by **2099net** » Sat Jun 25, 2005 8:42 am

Thank you for that insightful post Alan.

Please take the time to read and digest The UltimateDisney Posting Guidelines, which are also available as a 'sticky' at the top of the General Discussion forum.

Once you have done so, we would appreciate it if you could edit your above post in give us more reasoning and critisism rather than your simple 'fluff' post.

It should be an easy task for somebody who appreciates the cinimatic artform enough to recognise the greatness of Kurosawa san.

Thank you for updating your post Alan

Timon/Pumbaa fan · Post by **Timon/Pumbaa fan** » Sat Jun 25, 2005 10:42 am

I actually have to agree with Alan with this one! It was just so weird and I have to agree with Walt Disney that I think Alice "derserved" the poor box office scores because Alice really didn't have much of a heart in it. Please forgive me Kevin, I didn't hate the movie. I loved Mad Hatter and Marche Hare! They were hilarious! I also like the Dodo and the Cheser Cat! But the story just sometimes bored me! Like when Alice was singing that song when she was lost or when Alice meet all those flowers! Those were points I just felt like turning off the t.v. Sorry if I insulted any fans like Kevin, but it just was never one of my favorites.

Nala · Post by **Nala** » Sat Jun 25, 2005 11:23 am

There's more than just the movie on the ME of Alice in Wonderland. The bonus features are excellent especially An Hour In Wonderland. I like the movie Alice In Wonderland.

Just curious, Alan. Is there any animated classic pre-walt that you like?

Disneykid · Post by **Disneykid** » Sat Jun 25, 2005 11:27 am

Timon/Pumba fan wrote:I actually have to agree with Alan with this one! It was just so weird and I have to agree with Walt Disney that I think Alice "derserved" the poor box office scores because Alice really didn't have much of a heart in it. Please forgive me Kelvin, I didn't hate the movie. I loved Mad Hatter and Marche Hare! They were hilarious! I also like the Dodo and the Cheser Cat! But the story just sometimes bored me! Like when Alice was singing that song when she was lost or when Alice meet all those flowers! Those were points I just felt like turning off the t.v. Sorry if I insulted any fans like Kelvin, but it just was never one of my favorites.

You didn't insult me and I don't hate you; just don't expect me to talk to you ever again.

Hey, at least you liked the Cheshire Cat and mad tea party segments, which counts for something considering they're the best aspects of the film.

SuicideSeaside · Post by **SuicideSeaside** » Sat Jun 25, 2005 11:42 am

I love Alice in Wonderland. I was surprised that the script matched the text of the books. I wish there were more characters included but that would make the movie long and cluttered. A live action movie with Dakota Fanning is in the making. Another movie called "Flying though Neon Lights."...or something like that has Marilyn Manson as the Red Queen.

I love American McGee's Alice.

Disneykid · Post by **Disneykid** » Sat Jun 25, 2005 11:50 am

I'm really looking forward to the Dakota Fanning film from Dreamworks, but at the rate she's growing, she may end up being too old by the time production starts (though even then, she'll still be younger than most Alices). The American McGee Alice game is being made into a movie by Universal starring Sarah Michelle Gellar. I'm mildly interested in that one, but I think it would be more effective for if they cast someone younger. McGee's Alice is only 17 (10 years after her adventures in Wonderland as a seven-year-old took place). Someone on AICN's boards suggested Emily Browning from Lemony Snicket, who I think would be absolutely perfect for this.

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