Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney

[DisneyJedi]

But wasn't Frozen's success supposed to boost Disney's confidence in creativity (specifically in the animation department, to encourage more than one animation medium creativity)?

[TsWade2]

But wasn't Frozen's success supposed to boost Disney's confidence in creativity (specifically in the animation department, to encourage more than one animation medium creativity)?

I hope so.

[Nandor]

When are you going to stop shooting the Messenger? Sotiris has done nothing but inform us about the current state of affairs. He/she is Always careful to include the source and makes it clear when something is speculation or fact.
By your logic (Sotiris shouldn't post anything negative), we should all stop watching the news, reading the paper or living as a whole. There are negative things happening everywhere, but shutting it all out and pretending it's not happening won't work.

Basically, I'm just really tired of seeing you call out Sotiris everytime he/she posts. The world does not revolve around you and people don't have to adhere to your censorship.

I realise I may come across as hypocritical by telling you what to do. I'm not, I'm just asking you to stop. If you don't, that's your choice. It's been bugging me for ages and I had to say something this time.

[DancingCrab]

Well, how about if you just…..put a sock in it!

Or…How about YOU look in a mirror and say that again? Your behavior and bad form is nothing short of ridiculous.

[Super Aurora]

Do we have to go there again? Look Soitiris, I don't know how many times you keep posting bad news about hand drawn, but where's the good news? I mean, I know we won't see any new hand drawn animated features for a while, but there still doing hand drawn shorts so that will prove that hand drawn is not dead. And Disney hand drawn animation will return. You'll see.

God, you sound like a complete immature child who can't have things his way.

I just hope the new CEO of Disney will let John Lasseter to do hand drawn animation and maybe fire those greedy satanic executives. And hopefully Sotiris will give us good news about hand drawn.

Since when can CEO fire stock holder sharers? Those are the executives, the ones even a CEO has to respond too. You have no concept of how business is run, do you.

Oh, all right. Also, to assure you, I don't hate or against CGI movies. Frozen is possibly the best CGI movie ever. I just miss 2D traditional animation. And I don't think it's fair to people treating it as a lost art.

Thank you.

You know going to go back to his usual routine all over again when the next "bad" news pop-up.

Well, okay. Maybe Spongebob Squarepants sequel will save traditional animation even though I don't like him.

A few thoughts:

1) As 2D is still alive and kicking on TV and foreign markets, I don't really miss it.

2) Personally, I am glad that Disney appears to prefer working on and perfecting some sort of paperman/CGI hybrid, before making another film that looks like TPATF, where the CGI was jarring and unpleasant.

3) Perhaps if the Phineas and Ferb theatrical movie is successful things might look bright for another WDAS 2d film?

4) Big Hero 6 would've been a great opportunity for 2D. An anime style/comic book adaptation lends itself perfectly to the story.

Someone here has common sense.

Painterly CG... They tried doing that with Tangled, but then they decided to make it a basic CG film.

And do you know why? read on to my response below....

^Lasseter is just reiterating his narrow-minded view that an audience can't engage with a film that's stylized. Apparently, he finds anything that's not generic "too distracting" for mainstream audiences. That's why he changed the painterly style of Tangled and the CG/2D colored hybrid of Moana to generic CG blandness.

No, he probably most likely change the painterly style of Tangled because of the budget, as well as time. Tangled was already had a fucking huge budget they must try to regain from BO. Do you realize how huge the money and cost for it had it gone the the painterly route? So huge that most likely the project would of gotten shut down. Possibly for good. CGI cost shit ton of money (even more so than hand drawn ever is) and to then start going a unique different stylization right off the start on a feature length film would be dumb and suicidal. It's even a miracle Tangled was able make the money back and we're lucky they even went to do Tangled given it's long and drawn production.

If Disney want to test on the new ways and innovated ideas to animation, the smart choice is to do it with shorts first. That way, not only does it cost less than feature film(as well as time) but it's also a good way of using as a testing ground to the general audience. Paperman shown it to be a complete success and the mickey one has shown that. The most likely best option for them would start it off on a short first.

But wasn't Frozen's success supposed to boost Disney's confidence in creativity (specifically in the animation department, to encourage more than one animation medium creativity)?

I hope so. Also, don't listen to Sotiris. He or she is just a hope spoiler.

Yes, let's blame it on the guy who just only reporting the news for us. You'll lucky Sotris even has the time and patience to do all that for all you whiners.

Well, how about if you just…..put a sock in it!

Or…How about YOU look in a mirror and say that again? Your behavior and bad form is nothing short of ridiculous.

Ignore him. He's starting to get to Chris-chan level by this point.

[unprincess]

I think you should go easy on Tswade a bit. I dont know him personally but am familar with his posts since Ive been lurking here almost 2 years ago, & I think its possible his resistence to change & repetitive behavior may be due to something he has no control over...

just saying....

[MovieMan995]

I think we certainly could use more traditional animation and I'd be happy to see Disney doing more hand-drawn movies, especially as Disney largely leads the industry here in the US, but they should use whatever they feel the film calls for artistically and in terms of its story. I think the CG in Tangled works fantastically towards the emotional undertones to the film. They shouldn't go for whatever's easiest just because it's the easiest but they shouldn't pick one for no reason more than 'to be different'.

[FigmentJedi]

So it was John all along and we all bought it.

[Musical Master]

For now, CG is the best way to go for the Disney films, atleast for now. We all just need to wait for 2-D animation to find a way to get an audience again, even if it takes decades.

[DancingCrab]

I agree. It's just not commercially the right time for hand drawn animation to make it's comeback. Anything can and will happen within a few years.

If Disney was still making things with the quality of Chicken Little, then yes, I'd be first in line to mob the studio with pitch forks and torches, but with Tangled, Ralph and Frozen making CGI that IMO surpasses PIXAR and Dreamworks combined in the character animation department, I don't think it benifts anyone, ourselves or Disney to be acting like…well, the sky is falling.

Stop torturing yourself (and us) with your nonsensical rants, tswade2. There is a lot to enjoy in the world till the next hand drawn film comes along, be it 4 years from now or 40. Be patient and enjoy this short thing you have called Life

"If we'd stop trying to be happy we could have a pretty good time." ~ Edith Wharton

[estefan]

Not to mention, while I would love for Disney to make another hand-drawn film in the future (and I think they eventually will. It's merely a case of time, leadership, finances and story), it's not like the medium has vanished from the planet. There are TWO hand-drawn animated features nominated for an Oscar this year and along with an additional one in the Annie line-up. I saw Ernest & Celestine a couple of weeks ago and it was very touching and well-made. The Wind Rises is opening wide in North America next month (distributed by Disney, no less). The first movie Paramount has chosen to start their newly opened animation division with is a hand-drawn project. Hand-drawn films are not that hard to find.

I wonder if stop-motion animation fans were upset at the lack of features in that medium many years ago. Well, a couple of years ago, THREE stop-motion features were widely released in North America with Aardman and Laika having plenty more in the pipeline. And The LEGO Movie is a combination of stop-motion and computer animation, believe it or not. If stop-motion can successfully hit multiplexes after years relegated to shorts, television and film festival, hand-drawn absolutely can.

[TsWade2]

Okay, I'm sorry if I've been a bit hasty on Sotiris. I'm sure he's well meaning and rooting for Disney and hand drawn, it's just that, he's always burst our bubbles of hope, if you know what I mean.

I think you should go easy on Tswade a bit. I dont know him personally but am familar with his posts since Ive been lurking here almost 2 years ago, & I think its possible his resistence to change & repetitive behavior may be due to something he has no control over...

just saying....

Thank you for your patience. i appreciated. And I'm working on it.

[milojthatch]

I read Lassiter's comments on hand drawn animation today and think he's nuts. I used to trust his creative vision. I fear that somewhere between Toy Story 2 and becoming a big wig in the Disney Company, he sold us all out.

[TsWade2]

I read Lassiter's comments on hand drawn animation today and think he's nuts. I used to trust his creative vision. I fear that somewhere between Toy Story 2 and becoming a big wig in the Disney Company, he sold us all out.

I know. Not only he's a coward, he's also a....poor unfortunate soul.

[thedisneyspirit]

Oh Wade, when will you ever stop-

[MeerkatKombat]

I agree. It's just not commercially the right time for hand drawn animation to make it's comeback. Anything can and will happen within a few years.

If Disney was still making things with the quality of Chicken Little, then yes, I'd be first in line to mob the studio with pitch forks and torches, but with Tangled, Ralph and Frozen making CGI that IMO surpasses PIXAR and Dreamworks combined in the character animation department, I don't think it benifts anyone, ourselves or Disney to be acting like…well, the sky is falling.

Absolutely. Tangled, WiR and Frozen have been great. For now 2D shorts has to be the way for Disney to continue - build up some interest in 2D animation and rebuild some confidence in it. At least we are getting 2D shorts.

I haven't seen Chicken Little and quite frankly refuse to own it for the sake of it. What I have heard is

Tangled, Wreck it Ralph and Frozen won't ever feel like Beauty and the Beast, but then Beauty and the Beast doesn't have the same feel as Bambi or Snow White. It is just things moving on. It happens and different styles emerge.

[unprincess]

I dont understand why Lassiter is interested in exploring CGI programs that incorporate a handrawn organic look, but at the same time he doesnt like when traditional styles look too arty or distracting. Nothing is more distracting that the hyperrealistic effects & textures of most cgi films anyway. If audiences can get used to that Im sure they'll have no problem accepting something with a painterly look.

I still think the biggest problem is the glass ceiling that is the suits, who just arent interested in something that doesnt look like traditional CGI. It doesnt matter how much Lassiter loves the 2d style, he cant overide the suits desicions. At the same time he cant just put the blame on the suits in interviews(IOW, use the blunt truth) for why Disney isnt doing 2d(not if he wants to keep his job). So he's forced to come up with excuses, or do this runaround where he's like "yeah we still do 2d! but not really... but we're experimenting with new hybrid stuff! but it may be too distracting, but yes, but no, but maybe... blah blah blah...."

[Warm Regards]

I haven't seen Chicken Little and quite frankly refuse to own it for the sake of it. What I have heard is

It's entertaining enough, but if your film includes baseball, aliens, and ends with an Elton John song, your plot probably isn't a strong one. Oh, and the father is a jerk who values popularity over his sons feelings for most of the story.

[estefan]

I still think the biggest problem is the glass ceiling that is the suits, who just arent interested in something that doesnt look like traditional CGI. It doesnt matter how much Lassiter loves the 2d style, he cant overide the suits desicions. At the same time he cant just put the blame on the suits in interviews(IOW, use the blunt truth) for why Disney isnt doing 2d(not if he wants to keep his job). So he's forced to come up with excuses, or do this runaround where he's like "yeah we still do 2d! but not really... but we're experimenting with new hybrid stuff! but it may be too distracting, but yes, but no, but maybe... blah blah blah...."

You pretty much hit the nail on the head. I probably sound like a broken record at this point, but Lasseter has only so much power. There's still people like Bob Iger and Alan Horn above him, not to mention the shareholders. It's a shame that business people have more control in the film industry over creative types, but that's the way it is. Steven Spielberg, the biggest name in movies and one of the founders of DreamWorks Pictures, had to fight hard to get Disney to let him make Lincoln to the point where he almost made it as a mini-series for HBO. He had to bring in an Indian media mogul and 20th Century Fox before Iger finally agreed to greenlight the project. And it amazingly only cost $65 million. Michael Eisner forced Harvey Weinstein to sell movies he had produced to other studios and if you know anything about Weinstein, he is not a man to be trifled with.

[MeerkatKombat]

I dont understand why Lassiter is interested in exploring CGI programs that incorporate a handrawn organic look, but at the same time he doesnt like when traditional styles look too arty or distracting. Nothing is more distracting that the hyperrealistic effects & textures of most cgi films anyway. If audiences can get used to that Im sure they'll have no probam accepting something with a painterly look.

Sofia the First uses cel shading which gives a 2D/3D mutant feel. I wonder if this technology could be improved? Sofia the First can look stiff.
Even if they do create such a computer that does incorporate a handrawn look, I doubt any film would ever see the benefit as it would probably be deemed a 'risk'.
I personally like arty stylized 2D. Do people honestly find this distracting?
I admit it is becoming harder to retain warm feelings for Lasseter since joining this site).

I still think the biggest problem is the glass ceiling that is the suits, who just arent interested in something that doesnt look like traditional CGI. It doesnt matter how much Lassiter loves the 2d style, he cant overide the suits desicions.

I think this is a problem I have with CGI - it mostly looks the same. And well, it gets boring to look at.
The oil painting style they were going to go for when Tangled was Rapunzel would have at least felt like an innovation of sorts.