Has Pixar Lost Their Way ?

[thedisneyspirit]

Is "Brave" really that horrible? I've only seen it once but I thought it was okay.

I'd rather prefer Pixar doing original stuff than filling themselves up with sequels.

Has Pixar lost their way?

I thought the finest Pixar time was around 2007-2009, the Ratatouille-Up era was pretty good. Original ideas and characters and they were pretty good films. Then came the slowness and the sequel fever, and I don't understand why so many people hate Brave? Is it because of its similarities with Brother Bear?

[DisneyFan09]

Is "Brave" really that horrible? I've only seen it once but I thought it was okay.

I didn't thought "Brave" was horrible, but it had a stronger first act, with heart and emotion. Thereafter, the film lost it's spark and spunk. At least so do I think.

I don't understand why so many people hate Brave? Is it because of its similarities with Brother Bear?

There are many reasons for the hatred. First of all, the hardcore Pixar fans complains about it being too Disney than Pixar and it was a "result of Disney destroying Pixar". Others hate it because of it's weak, think and quite derivative story, which could have been better executed. And some of it hates it because of the feminist aspects of the film.

[frankf3]

Also Brave winning the Oscar over Wreck It Ralph didn't do the movie any favors.

[Atlantica]

Also Brave winning the Oscar over Wreck It Ralph didn't do the movie any favors.

I have to admit, that was absolutely shameful; it is kind of tiresome to have whatever Pixar does either win or at least gets nominated at the Oscars, all the time.

I'm not bashing Brave, but in a comparison between the two, Ralph wins hands down. It was original, had a great script, kind of a gamble, humour, heart and soul. Something that I personally felt Brave was lacking, maybe due to the fact (as someone mentioned here) it feels like a movie split in two. Whether that is to do with the director switch over we don't know, but it couldn't have helped.

[thedisneyspirit]

So Brave sucked.

And the feminists call it "Pixar's best film". Pfft, they don't really know how to review a movie properly in the first place.

[HarryCanyon]

Brave was ok but we seen this story before.

[Mooky]

It's actually more of a 'meh' movie, because there are parts of it that really work: namely the mother-daughter relationship/conflict/banter, and the second act which is quite strong and surprisingly original. Usually in tales of transformation, one of characters is turned into an animal and returned to their previous state without any sort of hazards and stakes along the way. I think Brave outdid itself with the concept of Merida being faced with the possibility of having her mother lose her mind and memories by giving in to her animalistic side. However, the unlikable heroine with questionable motives and her horrible actions that had no real repercussions, as well as misplaced (and juvenile) humor and pointless supporting characters, killed any potential the movie had to be great.

I also felt the movie (needlessly) went out of its way to show it wasn't 'your regular' fairytale from redundantly putting down Disney's fairytale films ("You haven't seen a princess film like this", "Merida is not a typical Disney princess" -- damn right, none of the other 10 princesses were imbeciles) to taking some thematic distances from usual fairytale tropes (like substituting the "magical number three" for two, as in "three days" vs "two days"), all of which was -- I guess -- done in an effort made to make it look and feel more mature and less girly. Unfortunately, these days the meaning of the word "mature" is lost on all Disney and Pixar executives.

[Atlantica]

I also felt the movie (needlessly) went out of its way to show it wasn't 'your regular' fairytale from redundantly putting down Disney's fairytale films ("You haven't seen a princess film like this", "Merida is not a typical Disney princess" -- damn right, none of the other 10 princesses were imbeciles) to taking some thematic distances from usual fairytale tropes (like substituting the "magical number three" for two, as in "three days" vs "two days"), all of which was -- I guess -- done in an effort made to make it look and feel more mature and less girly. Unfortunately, these days the meaning of the word "mature" is lost on all Disney and Pixar executives.

Sums up my thoughts exactly. Feels almost like Pixar were saying, "We can do what Disney does. But better. When in fact, actually, no they couldn't. If maybe they hadn't crowned Merida it would be less annoying. But that still wouldn't have improved Meridas' character, which wasn't as well written as previous Pixar leads.

[Mooky]

But that still wouldn't have improved Meridas' character, which wasn't as well written as previous Pixar leads.

Indeed. Nothing in the movie as it is now shows me that Elinor was wrong in her treatment of Merida. By the way she was written for the first two acts, I hoped the movie would end with Merida coming to her senses and showing regret for her actions, by realizing, you know, "I almost poisoned and killed my mother, maybe she is right by saying I don't know what's right for me". But no, she suddenly gains wisdom she's been lacking and teaches the (dominantly male) crowd -- and her mother -- the error of their ways. Congratulations Brenda Chapman, you did indeed succeed in giving "young girls and women a better, stronger role model" by making all male characters in the movie idiots. It probably wasn't an easy feat.

I'm guessing some people may bring up Ariel and Triton as a counterpoint, so I'm just going to write this in advance: the difference between Ariel and Merida is that Ariel didn't deliberately put her father in danger; yes, she was naïve and foolish, but for all she knew Ursula didn't have ulterior motives regarding Triton and taking over Atlantica. Merida, on the other hand, intentionally involved her mother in the spell and, well, got away with it.

[estefan]

Congratulations Brenda Chapman, you did indeed succeed in giving "young girls and women a better, stronger role model" by making all male characters in the movie idiots. It probably wasn't an easy feat.

The odd thing is I think the way Merida's father and the other suitors were written was all Mark Andrews' doing. Every attempt at humour on those characters (e.g. "Feast your eyes!", the bare-bottoms, the triplets' breast and snot jokes) has been credited to Andrews, while the core mother-daughter relationship was Chapman's main contribution. From what I've gathered, Chapman's version was a lot more serious and dark and then Andrews was brought in to lighten things up.

[Semaj]

I wish we could get one cartoon where men wearing kilts DOESN'T involve them mooning/flashing someone.

[Sotiris]

The odd thing is I think the way Merida's father and the other suitors were written was all Mark Andrews' doing.

Indeed. She said so in an interview. She didn't want the male characters to be portrayed as buffoons who couldn't be taken seriously.

[Mooky]

The odd thing is I think the way Merida's father and the other suitors were written was all Mark Andrews' doing.

Indeed. She said so in an interview. She didn't want the male characters to be portrayed as buffoons who couldn't be taken seriously.

In that case, I stand corrected. That still doesn't excuse the fact she thought there was something wrong with the way Disney's previous heroines were presented and set out to create Merida as a response.

[Sotiris]

That still doesn't excuse the fact she thought there was something wrong with the way Disney's previous heroines were presented and set out to create Merida as a response.

Well, I think she just wanted a princess who didn't have a love interest. Even Mulan ended up with one. Not that there's anything wrong with romance, but variety is always a positive thing.

[Lady Cluck]

Also Brave winning the Oscar over Wreck It Ralph didn't do the movie any favors.

I have to admit, that was absolutely shameful; it is kind of tiresome to have whatever Pixar does either win or at least gets nominated at the Oscars, all the time.

I'm not bashing Brave, but in a comparison between the two, Ralph wins hands down. It was original, had a great script, kind of a gamble, humour, heart and soul. Something that I personally felt Brave was lacking, maybe due to the fact (as someone mentioned here) it feels like a movie split in two. Whether that is to do with the director switch over we don't know, but it couldn't have helped.

Cars 2 wasn't nominated.

But yes reputation matters, and unfortunately for Disney that works both ways. In the years Pixar was building its reputation, Disney was destroying its own. Sure they had a couple decent movies in the late 90s/early 2000s but it was mostly a drastic drop in quality and Disney lost its status as the premier animation company with the rise of others. I'm glad they're back on track, but it may take more than a couple hits to regain the respect Pixar has. Tangled wasn't even nominated and there were only 3 nominees that year.

I think Brave's visual style compared to Wreck-It Ralph's helped it a lot too. WIR is very bright and cartoony and looks very much like a kids' movie, while Brave has darker/earthier tones and has a more "mature" feel to it. I am glad that Frozen appears to have a more cohesive and thought out color palette than the "EVERY COLOR IN THE RAINBOW" scheme Tangled and Wreck-It Ralph seemed to go with, though it made sense artistically with WIR.

Brave also had more subtle emotion and WIR kind of hit you over the head with it. I still liked WIR more, but not THAT much more, and I wasn't surprised Brave won for more reasons than just "it's Pixar ugh!"

[Atlantica]

I don't understand all the Tangled hate on UD; it 100% deserved at least a nomination. I was so disappointed that year when it was missed out.

For me as an animation fan, I kind of surprised myself in the fact that I have been happy to miss the last few Pixar releases in the cinema. I have watched them all on home release, but haven't been willing / intrigued enough to pay the £8 to go to see it in the cinema. I think that says a lot.

[DisneyEra]

I don't understand all the Tangled hate on UD; it 100% deserved at least a nomination. I was so disappointed that year when it was missed out.

For me as an animation fan, I kind of surprised myself in the fact that I have been happy to miss the last few Pixar releases in the cinema. I have watched them all on home release, but haven't been willing / intrigued enough to pay the £8 to go to see it in the cinema. I think that says a lot.

What I couldn't stand was how Tangled lost Best Song to Toy Story 3's We Belong Together by Randy Newman. But a year earlier, he was nominated twice for Best Song for The Princess & the Frog, but lost. But a year later he wins for Toy Story 3? Something just seemed fishy about that.

[Atlantica]

Goodness yes, I couldn't agree with you more! Had forgotten about that. There is no way that should have won at all, even taking away my enjoyment of 'See The Light'. 'We Belong Together' just wasn't a very good song.

The Academy does have a habit of that though; they make someone miss out one year, then give it when it isn't as deserving. (Nicole Kidman missing out on Moulin Rouge! then winning the year later for The Hours, case in point).

[Lady Cluck]

Oh I don't hate Tangled and it at least deserved a nomination. I was also kind of annoyed by the only 3 nominees that year, but I will say I was sorely disappointed with its music. It's grown on me a lot, but with the exception of Mother Knows Best, it's still sub par and forgettable compared to most other Disney musicals. Never will understand why people almost universally prefer it to TPATF's soundtrack. I enjoy TPATF much much more.

[Musical Master]

Oh I don't hate Tangled and it at least deserved a nomination. I was also kind of annoyed by the only 3 nominees that year, but I will say I was sorely disappointed with its music. It's grown on me a lot, but with the exception of Mother Knows Best, it's still sub par and forgettable compared to most other Disney musicals. Never will understand why people almost universally prefer it to TPATF's soundtrack. I enjoy TPATF much much more.

I think the reason why people perfer Tangled's soundtrack over TPATF is because some of them were dissapointed with Newman's work on TPATF for being "bland" and "not as memorable as the past Disney films". Or something like that.

But I love "Almost There" and "Dig a Little Deeper" for their catchy tunes and the performances are really good. It's only Randy's lyrics that (to me), is really REALLY dull.

Which is why I'm excited for Robert Lopez and Kristen Anderson-Lopez's work on Frozen.