The Three CommentEARS Episode 13: Beauty and the Beast

[Super Aurora]

I wish I could hear all your commentaries but they're hard for me hear or understand since i'm hearing impaired. Too bad you don't have close captions or such for your commentaries.

Just earlier I watched the audio commentaries(with the subtitles) of BatB and HoND by Don Hahn, Kirk Wise, and Gary Trousadale. God, I love those three. Those three are really such great pair and are absolutely funny and come up with some of the funniest stuff. Most of you guys here love John Muskers and Ron Clements so much But I love these two the best +Don Hahn. I find them more interesting and humorous and their commentaries shows it much better than the others commentaries i've watch.

When watch BatB commentaries,I found really interesting about the initial plan scene to have Gaston visit the insane asylum. Holy shit that would of been so creepy and badass. Understandable why they took it out and it probably creep children out but just the visual imagery and imagination of thinking about it made me love to see that sequence. Wish a deleted scene in the future of that part shows up some point.

[Escapay]

I wish I could hear all your commentaries but they're hard for me hear or understand since i'm hearing impaired. Too bad you don't have close captions or such for your commentaries.

If you'd like, I can transcribe them for you (and anyone else who's interested). I still have most of my notes from the recording sessions, and can easily consult pap and Kelvin if I can't understand a phrase they say. Plus, the transcription would have the added benefit of including addendums that may correct misinformation that's been brought to our attention (a few examples are in this thread, i believe - and I already know of misinformation on my part in a future commentary that needs correcting), as well as me removing several of my own verbal stammerings where I ended up at a loss for words.

Just be forewarned that they may take awhile. I've just started a new job, and I'm still writing my weekly column, while also working in theme park visits and doing my own private research for other projects. But I've been intending on having an archive of textual transcripts (broken down by the chapter listings of the LD/DVD/BD) available for anyone who would probably just rather read through than listen.

Albert

[Super Aurora]

I wish I could hear all your commentaries but they're hard for me hear or understand since i'm hearing impaired. Too bad you don't have close captions or such for your commentaries.

If you'd like, I can transcribe them for you (and anyone else who's interested). I still have most of my notes from the recording sessions, and can easily consult pap and Kelvin if I can't understand a phrase they say. Plus, the transcription would have the added benefit of including addendums that may correct misinformation that's been brought to our attention (a few examples are in this thread, i believe - and I already know of misinformation on my part in a future commentary that needs correcting), as well as me removing several of my own verbal stammerings where I ended up at a loss for words.

Just be forewarned that they may take awhile. I've just started a new job, and I'm still writing my weekly column, while also working in theme park visits and doing my own private research for other projects. But I've been intending on having an archive of textual transcripts (broken down by the chapter listings of the LD/DVD/BD) available for anyone who would probably just rather read through than listen.

Albert

That would be great! And take your time as much as possible. I'm in no rush. The official commentaries on blu rays and dvd as well as my own drawings i'm working on are more than enough to keep me occupied and patience.

[Escapay]

August's commentary has just been posted. We tackle 1973's Robin Hood, which will likely be more insight into the film than anything from Disney themselves.

You can listen to the streaming version here:
http://fromscreentotheme.com/screen/Thu ... sures.aspx

Or download the MP3 here:
http://www.fromscreentotheme.com/The%20 ... 20Hood.mp3

Enjoy!

(Also, Super Aurora, I'm halfway through transcribing our Cinderella commentary. Once I finish it, I'll get started on the others.)

Albert

[Super Aurora]

August's commentary has just been posted. We tackle 1973's Robin Hood, which will likely be more insight into the film than anything from Disney themselves.

You can listen to the streaming version here:
http://fromscreentotheme.com/screen/Thu ... sures.aspx

Or download the MP3 here:
http://www.fromscreentotheme.com/The%20 ... 20Hood.mp3

Enjoy!

(Also, Super Aurora, I'm halfway through transcribing our Cinderella commentary. Once I finish it, I'll get started on the others.)

Albert

Thank you! I really appreciate it!

[DisneyFan09]

Hey guys, I recently listened to your commentary of "Hunchback" and I really liked it. It was good, informative and nuanced, although I'm surprised that you didn't mention the scene where Frollo grabs Esmeralda and sniffs her hair.

However, in case you didn't knew, here are some info; According to Mouse Under Glass by David Koenig, Kirk Wise and Gary Trousdale were chosen as the directors for "Hunchback", in order to not remake "Beauty and the Beast".

I'm looking forward to hearing your other commentaries.

[Escapay]

Thanks for the feedback, DisneyFan09! Sometimes, quick moments and/or scenes pass by without us allowing to dwell on it as we may still be talking about another topic at hand, or we simply didn't feel enough relevant information/analysis could be discussed within the time at hand.

Our newest commentary was posted last week, but is more relevant this week as the film's been released and remains fresh on viewers' minds: 1989's The Little Mermaid.

You can listen to the streaming version here:
http://fromscreentotheme.com/ThreeComme ... rmaid.aspx

Or download the MP3 here:
http://www.fromscreentotheme.com/The%20 ... ermaid.mp3

Since the syncing for this commentary is not reliant upon the "Walt Disney Presents" title card, make sure to begin the commentary when Prince Eric's ship breaks through the mist. On the VHS and DVD, it occurs about 43 seconds into the film, but on the Blu-Ray (with the newfangled HD Disney logo), it'll occur even later.



Enjoy!

Albert (and for any longtime UDers, I make a confession towards the end that changes my stance on the film when compared to seven years ago)

[ajmrowland]

How did I not know about this?

I have got to get back on FSTT

[ajmrowland]

I wish I could hear all your commentaries but they're hard for me hear or understand since i'm hearing impaired. Too bad you don't have close captions or such for your commentaries.

Just earlier I watched the audio commentaries(with the subtitles) of BatB and HoND by Don Hahn, Kirk Wise, and Gary Trousadale. God, I love those three. Those three are really such great pair and are absolutely funny and come up with some of the funniest stuff. Most of you guys here love John Muskers and Ron Clements so much But I love these two the best +Don Hahn. I find them more interesting and humorous and their commentaries shows it much better than the others commentaries i've watch.

When watch BatB commentaries,I found really interesting about the initial plan scene to have Gaston visit the insane asylum. Holy shit that would of been so creepy and badass. Understandable why they took it out and it probably creep children out but just the visual imagery and imagination of thinking about it made me love to see that sequence. Wish a deleted scene in the future of that part shows up some point.

Agreed on all fronts. Honestly, they may have been able to get away with the asylum now in some form. But it sounds so fascinating.

[pap64]

And on that note, you guys might be surprised to hear what I think of the overall movie, despite my own analysis of it.

[DisneyFan09]

Thanks for the feedback, DisneyFan09! Sometimes, quick moments and/or scenes pass by without us allowing to dwell on it as we may still be talking about another topic at hand, or we simply didn't feel enough relevant information/analysis could be discussed within the time at hand.

You're welcome. My comment wasn't meant as a criticism, but just to add a "fun fact". However, I'm looking forward to hearing more of your commentaries.

[Flanger-Hanger]

I was crowed Temporary Ruler of the Realm! It was great. The show did end in 2006 to be replaced by the very short lived Let’s Have a Ball with Aurora and Phillip. That show only lasted a few months and now the sword just sits there.

In Paris there’s Lancelot’s Carousel with scene’s telling his story and the same sword in the stone prop, along with a shop named after Merlin in the castle. The Carousel in California does at least have the shields of the Knights of the Round Table.

Also interesting that SitS clips were used for both Halloween and Christmas specials.

[pap64]

I was crowed Temporary Ruler of the Realm! It was great. The show did end in 2006 to be replaced by the very short lived Let’s Have a Ball with Aurora and Phillip. That show only lasted a few months and now the sword just sits there.

In Paris there’s Lancelot’s Carousel with scene’s telling his story and the same sword in the stone prop, along with a shop named after Merlin in the castle. The Carousel in California does at least have the shields of the Knights of the Round Table.

Also interesting that SitS clips were used for both Halloween and Christmas specials.

Is the Sleeping Beauty show you are talking about this one?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6SSSwp7eHOI

That's great that you were crowned ruler! I always wish to see the show live and meet Merlin, so it broke my heart when they ended the show. My heart broke even more when they brought Merlin back for Long Lost Friends week two weeks AFTER I had visited Disneyland.

Oh yes, something I've been meaning to talk about here, if anyone has listened to some of our later commentaries, you might have noticed that we use the terms "torn dress moment" and "It moment" a lot. For those that have no idea what we are talking about, here is a brief explanation:

It moment: It is a moment that defines the whole story, character and film. The scene is so effective that it becomes an iconic representation of the film, and thus Disney will heavily market that scene to audiences. Examples include "A Whole New World" from Aladdin, both "Part of your world" and "Under the Sea" in The Little Mermaid and the flying lanterns scene in Tangled. A movie can have more than two It moments.

Torn dress moment: A scene in which the character, or characters, experience a soul crushing blow, and are at their lowest emotiona point because of it. Named so after the scene in Cinderella in which Cinderella has her pink dress torn by the stepsisters after her mice friends had worked hard on it. Examples of these include the destruction of Vanellope's kart in Wreck-It Ralph, Quasimodo's humiliation in The Hunchback of Notre Dame and Sulley scaring Boo in Monsters Inc.

[disneyboy20022]

I was crowed Temporary Ruler of the Realm! It was great. The show did end in 2006 to be replaced by the very short lived Let’s Have a Ball with Aurora and Phillip.

Are you talking about The Sword in The Stone in Disneyland? I was also crowned Temporary Ruler of the Realm and got a nice medallion for it in 2003. you can find more info about that in my signature.

I still haven't gotten around to listening to these audio commentaries but I plan to get around to it hopefully soon.

[Flanger-Hanger]

This is the show I was talking about Pap:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_kC_p-hJryg

You also got a certificate along with the medal when you pulled the sword from the stone.

disneyboy, the show was at both Disneyland and Magic Kingdom (where I did it). I'm guessing it was in Paris too, but can't confirm at the moment.

[Disney's Divinity]

I liked the point about how the Triton-destroys-the-grotto scene makes a point of focusing on the dancing statue--the one scene with the “wanna see ‘em dancing” line--being destroyed. Which is why I do see Ariel’s actions following that scene as logical (in an emotional way, definitely, but even in a cold, matter-of-fact way), because Triton has so completely and fully rejected who she is as a person. And that even plays in the scene where Sebastian decides to help her; the fact that she will never be happy or fulfilled in a place where everything she is has been fundamentally rejected. I know I’ve read some readings about how the transformation scene revolves around this--Triton is determined to keep her in mermaid form or, in other words, undeveloped (not just physically), prepubescent, without sexuality, and without the ability “to stand.”

About pap’s point that the song/Ariel’s story in some ways could be seen very heavily from a gay perspective, it made me focus on the Mary Magdalene picture (since the commentary had put that on my mind after the fire/soul discussion), and how it’s definitely a significant choice, even if unintentional (since I believe you said Glen Keane chose that painting?). Mary Magdalene was also someone who had been rejected/ostracized by society for her sexuality. Then onto Ursula, the person Ariel turns to who is also very sexual--and much more of a gay-coded character than even Ariel--and also rejected by her society (like Ariel has been at this point)? The themes of sexuality and gender are definitely all over this film.

I also agree with--I think it’s Disneykid?--about the climax being a very good choice (even if it did come from the “infamous” Katzenberg ). I’m not sure how else they could’ve ended the film without being this climactic, tbh--even the alternate ending, with all the action/death/etc. is too calm to really give the peak the film needs. And, honestly, the giant Ursula ending has always been my favorite scene (*I have at least 5 favorite scenes that are difficult to rank, so take this with grain of salt… ). I think this film has so many iconic scenes, actually. I know there was a clip on the TLM: Diamond of Musker and Clements talking about how some people had commented to them how the film was more “cinematic” than previous Disney films, and I actually think that’s true about the Renaissance films--which is a pro in some cases and a con in others, as far as the quality of those films in comparison to previous Disney films goes.

Btw, I didn’t know Eric had been on The Golden Girls before this; I knew about the nurse character/Carlotta connection though.

[pap64]

I liked the point about how the Triton-destroys-the-grotto scene makes a point of focusing on the dancing statue--the one scene with the “wanna see ‘em dancing” line--being destroyed. Which is why I do see Ariel’s actions following that scene as logical (in an emotional way, definitely, but even in a cold, matter-of-fact way), because Triton has so completely and fully rejected who she is as a person. And that even plays in the scene where Sebastian decides to help her; the fact that she will never be happy or fulfilled in a place where everything she is has been fundamentally rejected. I know I’ve read some readings about how the transformation scene revolves around this--Triton is determined to keep her in mermaid form or, in other words, undeveloped (not just physically), prepubescent, without sexuality, and without the ability “to stand.”

About pap’s point that the song/Ariel’s story in some ways could be seen very heavily from a gay perspective, it made me focus on the Mary Magdalene picture (since the commentary had put that on my mind after the fire/soul discussion), and how it’s definitely a significant choice, even if unintentional (since I believe you said Glen Keane chose that painting?). Mary Magdalene was also someone who had been rejected/ostracized by society for her sexuality. Then onto Ursula, the person Ariel turns to who is also very sexual--and much more of a gay-coded character than even Ariel--and also rejected by her society (like Ariel has been at this point)? The themes of sexuality and gender are definitely all over this film.

I also agree with--I think it’s Disneykid?--about the climax being a very good choice (even if it did come from the “infamous” Katzenberg ). I’m not sure how else they could’ve ended the film without being this climactic, tbh--even the alternate ending, with all the action/death/etc. is too calm to really give the peak the film needs. And, honestly, the giant Ursula ending has always been my favorite scene (*I have at least 5 favorite scenes that are difficult to rank, so take this with grain of salt… ). I think this film has so many iconic scenes, actually. I know there was a clip on the TLM: Diamond of Musker and Clements talking about how some people had commented to them how the film was more “cinematic” than previous Disney films, and I actually think that’s true about the Renaissance films--which is a pro in some cases and a con in others, as far as the quality of those films in comparison to previous Disney films goes.

Btw, I didn’t know Eric had been on The Golden Girls before this; I knew about the nurse character/Carlotta connection though.

First of all, thanks for the feedback! We really appreciate it!

I was the one that made the point about the objects being destroyed in the grotto, and funny enough, it was something I noticed while working for this commentary, and it made the destruction that much more devastating because she had just sung about her wishes and desires using these objects as metaphors.

The Mary Magdalene point was made by Kelvin (which is Disneykid here on UD), and I agree that the themes of sexuality are all over this movie. But I think it also talks about ANYONE that has decided to lead a life that is considered "taboo" or against the norms of society, whether it be a lifestyle, a religious concept and more. The movie talks about how we should be free to pursue what we want in life, rather that restrain ourselves and be miserable. That is why I think the movie has become so iconic for so many people, and it is no surprise that it came out in the 80s, a decade which was very defining and changing in terms of how society evolved from previous eras.

[pap64]

BUMP!

Sorry for the delay, but just updated the first page of the thread with our two latest episodes; Hocus Pocus (for October) and Tangled (for Frozen).

Here is the info for our Tangled commentary:
http://www.fromscreentotheme.com/ThursdayTreasures.aspx
"For this episode, we take a look at 2010's Tangled, revisiting the film just as another Disney fairy tale hits theatres: Frozen. Unlike past commentaries, this one spends more time analyzing the story and characters of Tangled, as each of us offers different interpretations, discourse, and criticism. In addition, we continue to delve into the production of the film, as well as the influence found in non-Disney sources, along with the film's impact on viewers since its release."

[Jay]

I have to say I love all of your commentaries. They're so much fun to listen to. Keep up the great work!

I love pap64's comment in the Tangled review about the shard of glass Flynn uses to cut the hair. I think that Gothel has the most beautifully done death scene of any Disney villain. All of the karma hitting her at once. The shard of glass from the mirror she used earlier as a weapon against Rapunzel with her passive aggressive comments now being used as a weapon to cut the hair and free her. Then she looks into the mirror which earlier she did to enjoy her youth and satisfy her vanity. But now she is horrified at her haggard appearance and shields her face with her hood. And the fact that her face is amplified by the shattered glass is awesome. Then she trips over the hair which is what she truly loved and cared about and now it is being used against her by Pascal who is getting his revenge for her kicking him. Then she falls out of the tower which she kept Rapunzel trapped in for 18 years. And I love how the three shots of her falling mirror the 3 shots of her being pulled up to the tower at the beginning of the film. The final shot of her cloak hitting the ground with nothing but dust left is a fabulous way to end her story.

Sorry for ze rambling but I find her death scene so well done and beautiful haha. I love that you mentioned that about the glass shard

Coming back to earth as I said awesome job on all your commentaries guys! Can't wait for more!

[Musical Master]

I have to say I love all of your commentaries. They're so much fun to listen to. Keep up the great work!

I love pap64's comment in the Tangled review about the shard of glass Flynn uses to cut the hair. I think that Gothel has the most beautifully done death scene of any Disney villain. All of the karma hitting her at once. The shard of glass from the mirror she used earlier as a weapon against Rapunzel with her passive aggressive comments now being used as a weapon to cut the hair and free her. Then she looks into the mirror which earlier she did to enjoy her youth and satisfy her vanity. But now she is horrified at her haggard appearance and shields her face with her hood. And the fact that her face is amplified by the shattered glass is awesome. Then she trips over the hair which is what she truly loved and cared about and now it is being used against her by Pascal who is getting his revenge for her kicking him. Then she falls out of the tower which she kept Rapunzel trapped in for 18 years. And I love how the three shots of her falling mirror the 3 shots of her being pulled up to the tower at the beginning of the film. The final shot of her cloak hitting the ground with nothing but dust left is a fabulous way to end her story.

Sorry for ze rambling but I find her death scene so well done and beautiful haha. I love that you mentioned that about the glass shard

Coming back to earth as I said awesome job on all your commentaries guys! Can't wait for more!

That moment was the shining moment for Gothel and her demise, plus it was the most thrilling part of such a dull and a meh climax.