Disney Channel Criticism/State of the Disney Channel

[The_Iceflash]

First we have the two poster children for Disney Channel Shows/Movies criticisms, Hannah Montana and High School Musical which were followed by shows/movies such as Wizards of Waverly Place and Camp Rock (and Camp Rock 2) but looking back at them and re-watching episodes (and seeing Wizards of Waverly Place come to a close) I can't help but think that they were unfairly criticized. The music from High School Musical (and its sequels) actually aren't as bad as they were made out to be. I like those songs more than the electro-pop/dance-pop of today. Compared to some other comedies currently out there right now (both Disney Channel and non-Disney Channel shows), I would actually rank Hannah Montana and Wizards of Waverly Place above them. No lie. The shows didn't need to be more realistic either. There are shows that showcase nothing but the bad in schools and life but that isn't any more realistic.

Why they received the level of hate that they did is beyond me. I know it is fashionable to hate on them but they aren't as bad as everyone makes them out to be. There's much worse out there.


Also, if anyone would like to make mock up retro blocks or ways to change their programing, go right ahead!

[DisneyDude2010]

The stuff you mentioned above actually gained more positive criticism than negative. The Wizards Movie and HSM's are Disney Channel's have the highest ratings with audiences of 11m to 17m

[Mickeyfan1990]

If I may rant a bit, I don't like the current live action Disney Channel shows at all. Why? Cuz they use a laugh track and I hate that! I mean, have the show filmed with a live studio audience and maybe then it would have more appeal. I mean, why don't the executives use the time to make something WE want like a new Mickey Mouse show in the style of Mickey Mouse Works? The only good shows on Disney are Phineas and Ferb and Fish Hooks.

[AliceinWonderland]

If I may rant a bit, I don't like the current live action Disney Channel shows at all. Why? Cuz they use a laugh track and I hate that! I mean, have the show filmed with a live studio audience and maybe then it would have more appeal. I mean, why don't the executives use the time to make something WE want like a new Mickey Mouse show in the style of Mickey Mouse Works? The only good shows on Disney are Phineas and Ferb and Fish Hooks.

the shows are filmed in front of an audience. you can get free tickets here
http://www.tvtickets.com/fmi/xsl/core/recordlist.xsl?

[Mickeyfan1990]

Well, ain;t that a kick in teeth. I'd assume those shows used laugh tracks. My mistake. Incidentally about Disney Channel Movies, my favorites are the Halloweentown movies (who doesn't like 'em? ).

[MouseHouse55]

You two are both correct. They film in front of an audience, but the audience's reactions are not recorded; the laughter etc. in the episodes is from a track.

[Goliath]

The only good shows on Disney are Phineas and Ferb and Fish Hooks.

But the animation is god-awful, especially the last show. My eyes hurt after watching it for more than 30 seconds. Everytime I see FH and I realize it gets aired under the Disney-label, I think I can hear Walt crying.

[...] The music from High School Musical (and its sequels) actually aren't as bad as they were made out to be. I like those songs more than the electro-pop/dance-pop of today. Compared to some other comedies currently out there right now (both Disney Channel and non-Disney Channel shows), I would actually rank Hannah Montana and Wizards of Waverly Place above them. [...]

but they aren't as bad as everyone makes them out to be. There's much worse out there.

And there it is. If you lower your standards enough, everything passes. Like I said to you in another thread: the only reason why these shows look slightly better to you in retrospect, is because everything else sucks even harder. That's not my guess, that's what you give as a reason; just look at what I quoted above. You don't even say that you like the music in HSM, just that it's not as bad as other music. You don't say you like those songs, just that you like them *more* than crappy music. Doesn't sound like a person who's enthusiastic about these shows/movies to me.

I don't hate those DC shows because it's fashionable to hate them. I hate them because they lack quality. And anybody who reacts to that by saying "they're just kids shows" doesn't take children very seriously, which is a shame. Children and teenagers don't have to be treated as dolts. But these shows do exactly that. They aim at the lowest common denominator. The DC shows have nothing to do with real children's lives. They present a shallow reflection of it, in which every hollow, 2-dimensional character is incredibly handsome and popular and they all wear designer clothes and shoes. These shows lack integrity and authenticity. They don't stimulate any thinking on the part of the audience (which isn't a punishment, by the way, and I'm not saying they should be educational programs, because I realize they're sitcoms). In short, they insult our intelligence.

And why can't anybody in these shows act? I mean, I'm not asking for anything like Natalie Portman in Leon, but at least take actors who can pull of real human emotions. This overacting would even fill Nicholas Cage with embarassment.

Children/teen shows can be done without dumbing down its audience. They even can be so good that they're still entertaining to adults. You can make a show about (pre-)highschool girls and all the 'problems' they go through. Just pick two leads who don't look like mini-models with perfect hair, perfect smile and $500 jeans; but instead look like the girls you know from next-door. Have them act and behave like girls that age would; instead of making them scream their lines and do facial expressions that would make Jim Carrey go: "is that possible?" And write storylines in which the target demographic can recognize itself. Then you have a good show for children/teenagers:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sBsIHawwUEw


But good shows don't always have to be that realistic. Sometimes you just want to watch a good fiction series, in which anything can and will happen, a show that's not bound to the limits of reality. That's perfectly fine, but it doesn't have to be as dumbed down as the DC shows, which almost all deal with fantastic/unrealistic elements. You can also have a show which isn't realistic in its topic, but which still has a smart, solid script behind it. One that uses various kinds of fantastic elements but treats them intelligently and asks the audience to do the same. A show with believable characters, brought to life by convincing actors. One that pulls of drama in a sincere way, but mixes it with humor and action, all the while keeping the viewer guessing what will come next:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EHlm7dQJ-9Q


Or else just have a fun little sitcom with a little over-acting, some cartoony moments, some goofy characters but still have the sense of including clever jokes, decent storylines, good character-relationships to make the show worth the watch and give you enough to laugh and care about:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QiEiG_Tok5Q


See? It CAN be done!

[Tae]

I'm going to go with the unpopular opinion and say that I genuinely like Wizards of Waverly Place. The acting is fine, there is only one episode where the main character sings and it's never brought up again (unlike nearly all of the post-Hannah Montana shows), there's a lot of darker elements to it (in the movie, the main character accidentally says a spell that changes history and she and her brother have to go on a dangerous journey or else they will disappear forever), and up until the fourth season, it avoids a lot of Disney Channel cliches. The main character only dates three guys, one of whom disappears and we never find out why, the second disappears for 20 episodes before we find out why, and the third gets turned into a wolf and we don't see him again for around 20 episodes. And unlike most post-Hannah Montana Disney shows, where the leads are either a girl and her best friend, a girl and her boyfriend, or a girl and her best friend and her boyfriend, the leads in Wizards are a girl and her brother, and in the first three seasons they get more screentime together then any other characters on the show.

I've tried to watch some older Disney Channel shows that people claim are much better then shows such as Wizards, and I found them to be very boring, so at this point I just ignore the criticism and enjoy the shows I like, whether or not others agree.

[estefan]

I gotta agree with the above poster that Wizards of Waverly Place is quite an enjoyable show. It pretty much does the opposite of the other tween-coms and avoids a lot of the things I hate about them. The acting is actually quite natural from the young actors, there's are ongoing story-arcs that are quite involving and the jokes actually succeed in being funny. The main character, despite being a bit of a troublemaker, does actually learn her lessons and is a solid role-model. Oh and I think Phineas and Ferb is fantastic.

Not a fan of the other Disney Channel programming, though. Oh and on DisneyXD, I highly recommend Kid vs Kat. Definitely one of the best Flash-animated shows I've watched.

[milojthatch]

The last original series on Disney Channel that I actually liked was Even Stevens. My dis-like of more modern shows and films on that thing Disney is trying to pass off as the Disney Chanel actually is not at all based on opinions or feelings from anyone else. I personally truly don't like them on my own.

I just don't find any of the modern titles (example: Wizards of Waverly Place, Hannah Montana, High School Musical, Fish Hooks) that entertaining. I get bored, find noting worth investing in. I find the jokes not funny, the music cringe worthy, the acting bland and the stories uninteresting. And then they put the "Disney" label on that? I hate to admit it, but I fully agree with Goliath, Walt would cry.

The only modern title I feel is half decent is Phineas and Ferb. That show I find somewhat entertaining. However, even it I feel Disney is starting to run into the ground, and it will never be as good as things like DuckTales or TaleSpin. Disney doesn't make quality shows like that anymore.

So, short answer to the original question: no, the harsh criticized Disney Channel shows lately get is VERY much earned and not unfair. In fact, I don't feel the praise they might get is fair. I think they are bad shows that are at the heart and soul of Bob Iger and his team's plans to re-brand the "Disney" brand name into something that has next to nothing to do with the company Walt Disney set up.

[Rose Dome]

No offence, but I think the DC shows deserve the criticism they get.

The live action ones are shallow and poorly acted kid coms, which teach nothing of any value and are about churning out celebs rather than telling stories that viewers will remember.

I would much rather see Disney do some live action sci-fi and fantasy shows such as this one (Disclaimer:I am not the user who posted this video):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hum69IH5 ... re=related

The cartoons are also in a bad state. Like Goliath, I could hear Walt's ghost sobbing when I checked out Phineas & Ferb and Fish Hooks. I don't need animation to be rich in detail, but I do need it to be neat. The ugly and overstylised animation of the two aforementioned shows made my eyes water. This isn't even going into the brainless writing. Kim Possible was the last strong cartoon originally aired on The Disney Channel. No! Scratch That - It was the last strong show originally aired on The Disney Channel.

I'm not lowering my standards when Disney can do so much better.

[RIPJoeRanft]

They deserve the criticism they get. But so does current Nickelodeon. Really, the best network right now in terms of quality children/young adult content is Cartoon Network (Adventure Time, Regular Show, the new Looney Tunes series, The Clone Wars, etc.)

Disney Channel peaked in the mid-90s, and had some excellent animated series. There was so much quality in animated television back then, even on other channels like Nickelodeon and WB and FOX. Now, most of the DC shows are mindless live action entertainment, complete with the outdated laugh track and inoffensive, bland humor.

[slave2moonlight]

I'm not sure on what basis Disney peaked in the 90's, since it was at its best as far back as you go (early 80's), and it was probably at its most popular during the height of the Hanna Montana/HSM stuff... Anyways, I am coming in on this a bit late. Basically, Goliath said everything I wanted to say. I would only throw in that Wizards of Waverly Place is an exception (to some degree). Yeah, it could be even better, but as it was, especially since it was meant to be a comedy, it was really good. I think what really upsets Disney fans about current Disney Channel, on top of all the stuff Goliath said, is that its programming used to be very good. Even its earlier teen programming, the further back you go, is just better and better. The only exception in my opinion is the 90's Mickey Mouse Club. As much as I wanted to like it, it was pretty bad, if I remember correctly. But then, sketch comedy never seems to be good on kids' shows. And, please don't bother mentioning "All That". It was terrible too.

I also agree that Nickelodeon is just as bad, and it probably sucked FIRST. Yes, Cartoon Network is definitely the best channel for kid/family programming right now, though who knows how long that will last. They're putting more and more crappy live-action stuff on there. What's with that Destroy Build Destroy and junk like that?! They're NOT cartoons, guys.

[The_Iceflash]

[...] The music from High School Musical (and its sequels) actually aren't as bad as they were made out to be. I like those songs more than the electro-pop/dance-pop of today. Compared to some other comedies currently out there right now (both Disney Channel and non-Disney Channel shows), I would actually rank Hannah Montana and Wizards of Waverly Place above them. [...]

but they aren't as bad as everyone makes them out to be. There's much worse out there.

And there it is. If you lower your standards enough, everything passes. Like I said to you in another thread: the only reason why these shows look slightly better to you in retrospect, is because everything else sucks even harder. That's not my guess, that's what you give as a reason; just look at what I quoted above. You don't even say that you like the music in HSM, just that it's not as bad as other music. You don't say you like those songs, just that you like them *more* than crappy music. Doesn't sound like a person who's enthusiastic about these shows/movies to me.!

You make a lot of good points. The only thing I should clear up is that I do like the music from HSM, I have the CDs and the Blu-rays of them. About the shows though you make an interesting point. I'm looking at the shows compared to others now vs their own merit. They don't stand well against shows of the past like your example. What I was doing was comparing shows like A.N.T Farm to Wizards of Waverly Place, Hannah Montana, The Suite Life of Zach and Cody, etc and those shows look even better now when compared to the current ones gracing the Disney Channel like A.N.T Farm. Even with the musical shows, "Shake It Up", and "Austin and Ally", the music has even been reduced to standards below the music of Hannah Montana and High School Musical. I at least enjoy the music from both of those. I like the theme song from Shake It Up (sung by Selena Gomez) and that's about it. Disney Channel been in need of a tune up for a while but there was something about that Hannah Montana, HSM era, and Camp Rock-era that I loved now that I'm looking back on it. Maybe it's nostalgia? Disney Channel was at an all time high with popularity then and maybe there was something to it. Now, with the shows from that era over, its time to revamp it instead of trying to recapture that era. Disney needs to expand their demographic. Maybe to what TeenNick is doing and do a similar thing to the "90s are All That". It's a good way to expand their demographic by bringing back previous viewers. (If anyone would like to make up a mock Disney Channel block similar to that, go right ahead. I know some of you are thinking Vault Disney but I was thinking of stuff that encompassed more eras or maybe making each weeknight themed, (i.e 50s, 60s, 70s, 80s, 90s with 00s being Saturday night ).

On the flip side, some of Disney's better shows have been on Disney XD, IMO. I find Kickin' It to be a very good show that surpasses everything currently on the Disney Channel.

[Lazario]

Case by case basis. I don't have the time to watch any of Disney's newer shows and even when I thought That's So Raven wasn't so bad 5 or so years ago, I don't remember meeting many UD'ers who agreed with me. Maybe they were right.

Historically, however, the cartoons from the late 80's / early 90's have proven they have passion fanbases and I've seen quite a few made-for-TV movies I liked. Or enjoyed watching, regardless of how bad they were. Of course, I've never encountered that movie where Tyra Banks was some kind of Barbie doll come to life again. I think if there is any place a studio like this can make bad entertainment fit - it's on television.

[Goliath]

@ The_Iceflash: less quote, please.

Of course I never followed these shows for more than a few episodes I came across during channel-flipping, but I believe Lizzy McGuire was a much better show than anything they air now. I don't recall exactly, but wasn't it far less hysterical and over-the-top than HM, HSM etc.? I don't recall LMcG being used to push Hilary Duff's singing career, like they did with Miley Cyrus. I always thought HM was about the merchandise, whereas LMcG was about actually making a good show.

Oh, and the one I hate with passion is that godawful show with the two blonde bratty boys and the black manager! That dreck is the lowest!

[Linden]

@ The_Iceflash: less quote, please.

Of course I never followed these shows for more than a few episodes I came across during channel-flipping, but I believe Lizzy McGuire was a much better show than anything they air now. I don't recall exactly, but wasn't it far less hysterical and over-the-top than HM, HSM etc.? I don't recall LMcG being used to push Hilary Duff's singing career, like they did with Miley Cyrus. I always thought HM was about the merchandise, whereas LMcG was about actually making a good show.

I agree. It may be for nostalgic reasons (Lizzie McGuire was pretty much my idol when it was airing), but I can still enjoy episodes of Lizzie, while I can't get through even five minutes of Hannah Montana without wanting to throw up. They did start pushing Hillary Duff as a star toward the end of the show, but that wasn't the reason behind the show. It was probably the reason behind the movie, but that's another matter.

That's So Raven was a show I disliked almost as much as Hannah Montana. I could bear to watch whole episodes (mostly because of Chelsea, who I still think is awesome), but not without feeling dumber at the end. But That's So Raven could occasionally manage funny jokes.

[Avaitor]

I honestly never got the love for Lizzie McGuire. I always thought it was as shallow and banal as anything Disney has made since. I think most of the people that find it to be a better show just grew up watching it.

I also don't understand the love for Phineas & Ferb. To me, it's nothing more but an Ed, Edd, n' Eddy rip-off without any of the qualities that made that series so great.

[The_Iceflash]

@ The_Iceflash: less quote, please.

Of course I never followed these shows for more than a few episodes I came across during channel-flipping, but I believe Lizzy McGuire was a much better show than anything they air now. I don't recall exactly, but wasn't it far less hysterical and over-the-top than HM, HSM etc.? I don't recall LMcG being used to push Hilary Duff's singing career, like they did with Miley Cyrus. I always thought HM was about the merchandise, whereas LMcG was about actually making a good show.

Oh, and the one I hate with passion is that godawful show with the two blonde bratty boys and the black manager! That dreck is the lowest!

I shortened the quote. I didn't want to misquote you.

Lizzie McGuire did have the animated Lizzie which I found to be extremely over the top. I'll always have a resentment toward that show as it was the actual reason why the Vault Disney block ceased to exist. They took it off to air more re-runs of it. (I read a press article years ago when this happened explaining it.) I found Lizzie Mcguire in particular to be a precursor to the Disney Channel of today. It's popularilty opened the door to more shows toward that demographic. The main difference between that show and the ones that came later was the filming style. Few Disney Channel shows afterwards would have that style. (Phil of the future being one of them and I really enjoyed that show. No Disney Channel show right now is filmed that way. (Sitcom style)

[Kyle]

I don't watch too many newer kids shows, but from what I can tell, Nickelodeon's stuff is better. I would much sooner watch Victorious and icarly before anything on Disney right now. Probably helps that Dan Schneider is still at Nick, the same guy responsible for my childhood shows (Kenan & Kel, All That, etc.