Fantasia/F2K: 2-Movie Collection Discussion: Nov. 30, 2010

[miniroll32]

What gets me is the fact that whilst most other classic Disney films get at least a nice dollop of features, Fantasia now seems almost like an after thought. Just think of the number of Platinum Editions over the years that have pages of extras... Pinocchio... Sleeping Beauty... Just hours worth of supplements. And then Fantasia, one of the most important contributions to cinema gets left in the cold.

If there was ever any doubt that the features of the product would change, Disney should never have released 'that' trailer which, after saying rather emphatically ;

"Nothing compares to [...] Fantasia and Fantasia 2000 [...] 2 Masterpieces" (which is surely enough to call for an crammed release), and then going on to state;

"The Diamond Editions" (which they are no longer)
"Plus Fantasia World" (thats been ditched)
"Featuring Never-Before-Seen Animated Shorts" (now its only Destino)

And what about Claire de Lune? That was an actual deleted scene from the movie, and it doesn't even get a word in? Even if it was only a concept-short, its beautiful enough to deserve a place in the package.

They've screwed up, its that simple. While the restoration will obviously be flawless and thats the main attraction when you're buying a classic film, the heart-brake is that its not getting anywhere near the same treatment as other 'supposed' Disney classics. You don't spend over $260,000 getting a film restored by Lowry, and then give it a lame release.

tlc38tlc38 - I do agree with you from the perspective that we should be looking forward to the film, but I think personally anyway, I'm considering how Disney are treating this release compared to their other 'classics'.

[geniuswalt]

And guess what? Its only a 2-Disc Blu-Ray pack! So we don't even get the damn DVD's... Thanks Disney. No really, way to treat loyal customers.

I just don't get why some people get so mad about the DVDs not being
included in the Blu-ray release. It's not like you would be paying the same
price you pay now so, I'm all for leaving the DVD out especially as it makes the blu-ray release less expensive than it would be if it came with the DVD.

Using this ridiculous Blu-ray DVD and digital copy packs Disney is price gouging lots of consumers and they don't even realize it! These so called combo packs allow them to ask for a much higher price than it's called for.

[TheSequelOfDisney]

But...you're UD's biggest Fantasia fan! (at least in my experience chatting with you on the forum. Remember those multi-disc Disney DVDs we'd write about once upon a time? )

albert

Yeah, well this is kind of depressing me...

[BK]

It's that shit Rich Ross no doubt.

Really though, this is Disney, and when Roy passed, I think it was almost guaranteed Iger would do him a disservice.

I don't think we should ever take their word. Tarzan, Aristocats, screwing with Pixar, screwing with live-action releases (Everything must be family friendly), everything must be marketable, the need to promote idiotic Disney channel stars, not making 2D animation movies, changing Rapunzel's name, it's just a whole list of shit.

Can't wait until someone takes down Iger and Ross. Hope a money-laundering scandal involving the duo comes to light and in the revolutionary change that happens after it a slew of BR/DVD releases with packed features gets released from the vault as well as a more diverse slate of movie releases and less reliance on the pathetic Disney channel.

[Rudy Matt]

I recall Roy introducing Fantasia 2000 on the DVD so that's probably where he said it was his favorite Disney film or something and Rudy is simply saying that because the lackluster bonus material revealed, that this film is "a disgrace to his memory", of course home video releases were getting worse when he was alive so I'm not sure he would've been THAT upset or demanding it having a better release. Of course, none of us know father time or can change the space-time continuum to truly have a definite answer.

I'll still probably buy this set as the movies are the real highlight, but I won't be in rush to get it like I could've been.

Roy Disney stated in the 1990 making-of documentrary that Fantasia was, in his opinion, the best animated film that Walt ever made. Making the follow-up or continuation was always a dream of his. The successful 1990 re-release was followed by the Christmas 1991 home video, and that was the best selling video cassette ever until Beauty and the Baest and Aladdin and Snow White and Titanic. Roy personally produced the Fantasia Anthology box set, and it is clear from his commentary tracks that he greatly admired Fantasia. If not for Roy there would not have been a Fantasia sequel.

Roy's dead, and this is what happens to his favorite film.

[CampbellzSoup]

At least we have the movies...if you really want special features look on youtube for the older ones.

[schoollover]

One thing I don't get is that if they want to be cheap, wouldn't it make more sense to just bring over all of the old extras from the old dvcd and put it on the blu-ray. Because their new features look pretty useless and this makes me worry because if they treat one of their top films like this then how will they treat other films like Aladdin, Mulan etc. when they come out on blu-ray.

[miniroll32]

if you really want special features look on youtube for the older ones.

The only documentary that was on there (from 1990) has now been removed due to the usual Copyright reasons. We shouldn't have to resort to YouTube to see how the film was made and the history of it.

if they treat one of their top films like this then how will they treat other films like Aladdin, Mulan etc. when they come out on blu-ray.

Good point - and I think it begs to ask, What are Disney's top films? Judging by the package Beauty and The Beast is getting, the best is the highest grossing. Don't get me wrong, I love Beauty and The Beast, but in terms of the quality of the animation and the originality, it doesn't even compare to Fantasia.

[DisneyJedi]

Honestly, I feel like screaming a bunch of R-rated swears over and over again until I lose my voice. Disney has been really pissing us off lately.

Oh, well. I'll still be getting the movies anyway, since I don't have them on DVD or Blu-Ray yet.

[2099net]

Roy's dead, and this is what happens to his favorite film.

Er.

His favourite film's the same. Actually, its probably better than the previous Anthology release - being as it's had a new restoration. And, Roy being alive didn't stop PAL territories getting the shortened release of Fantasia for their DVDs the first time around either - so from a non-US perspective it appears Fantasia (the film) is getting undisputedly better treatment - new restoration, enhanced sound and the "full length" cut.

As for the supplements - we don't know what the Blu-ray consists of exactly. To be honest, the best bits of the previous Anthology release were the art galleries, and it looks like we'll still be getting them in some form or other (presumably in HD!) as well as several new supplements. I wouldn't take retailer lists or BVHE Press Release information as gospel - they have a common habit of missing out or downplaying supplemental materials.

[miniroll32]

The only hope we have with these special features is that one of them, such as the Disney Family archive turns out to be an actual 'mode' in the extras section. By this I mean its merely the title for a collection of different featurettes/images/etc... This was the case with Snow White - on paper it only had a handful of features, one of them being the 'Hyperion Studios' tour. But that 'tour' happened to be the basis for all the extra features, so it may at a very long shot happen with Fantasia... I don't know. Judging from whats listed, I think we'd have to be very lucky

Even my Dumbo Blu-Ray has more features. Just looking at the slipcase now, it has;

Bonus Shorts: The Flying Mouse, Elmer Elephant
Intro with James Coleman
Cine-Explore
The World of Baby Einstein
Two Family Play Games
Taking Flight: The Making of Dumbo
The Magic of Dumbo: A Ride of Passage
Deleted scene
Deleted song

...

...and Dumbo is what, an hour long? Nice one Disney.

[2099net]

Well, according to the BBFC the Disney Family Museum is around 4 minutes wrong (but that could be just an introduction?)

BUT...

The fact is, I'd rather wait until I have the release in my own hands before voicing a knee-jerk (over?) reaction. As far as I can see, no US site is reporting the the Roy Disney tribute listed on the Play.Com website makes me believe the full bonus features have not been revealed. Presumably this means its wasn't mentioned on the US press release, which also makes me think other features haven't been mentioned on the Press Release either. Just like the Toy Story 1 and 2 Press release didn't mention the "classic DVD extras" - so Fantasia could easily include some of the classic DVD extras on the disc, in addition to having some streamed via BD-Live. The fact the Press Release for Fantasia seems to mention commentaries for both films indicates we'll get both old and new. Until we know what's on the discs, why bother to get so worked up?

[Coolmanio]

Well, according to the BBFC the Disney Family Museum is around 4 minutes wrong (but that could be just an introduction?)

BUT...

The fact is, I'd rather wait until I have the release in my own hands before voicing a knee-jerk (over?) reaction. As far as I can see, no US site is reporting the the Roy Disney tribute listed on the Play.Com website makes me believe the full bonus features have not been revealed. Presumably this means its wasn't mentioned on the US press release, which also makes me think other features haven't been mentioned on the Press Release either. Just like the Toy Story 1 and 2 Press release didn't mention the "classic DVD extras" - so Fantasia could easily include some of the classic DVD extras on the disc, in addition to having some streamed via BD-Live. The fact the Press Release for Fantasia seems to mention commentaries for both films indicates we'll get both old and new. Until we know what's on the discs, why bother to get so worked up?

This is quite true. We were all quite surprised by the amount of extras on the Beauty and the Beast blu-ray, so hopefully we will just wait it out, and maybe the BBFC will pass a few more bonus features than what we thought we are getting.

[Rudy Matt]

if you really want special features look on youtube for the older ones.

The only documentary that was on there (from 1990) has now been removed due to the usual Copyright reasons. We shouldn't have to resort to YouTube to see how the film was made and the history of it.

if they treat one of their top films like this then how will they treat other films like Aladdin, Mulan etc. when they come out on blu-ray.

Good point - and I think it begs to ask, What are Disney's top films? Judging by the package Beauty and The Beast is getting, the best is the highest grossing. Don't get me wrong, I love Beauty and The Beast, but in terms of the quality of the animation and the originality, it doesn't even compare to Fantasia.

Beauty and the Beast *isn't* their highest grossing. Snow White is. And adjusted for inflation, Fantasia is in their top 5.

[yamiiguy]

And guess what? Its only a 2-Disc Blu-Ray pack! So we don't even get the damn DVD's... Thanks Disney. No really, way to treat loyal customers.

I just don't get why some people get so mad about the DVDs not being
included in the Blu-ray release. It's not like you would be paying the same
price you pay now so, I'm all for leaving the DVD out especially as it makes the blu-ray release less expensive than it would be if it came with the DVD.

Using this ridiculous Blu-ray DVD and digital copy packs Disney is price gouging lots of consumers and they don't even realize it! These so called combo packs allow them to ask for a much higher price than it's called for.

Thank you

And I have to say that this is probably logical. Sure they could have bumped up the price and made it a 2-disc Blu-Ray but this way there is maximum space on the disc for the highest quality presentation of the feature, which is what is really important. And who knows what's going to be on BD-Live

[akhenaten]

i dont blame the grunts we hold towards this release. its disney im disappointed with. as a company of high brand and quality trusted by art lovers and families worldwide. they repeatedly fool and disrespect our trust. this happened again and again with every new format coming in. when dvd first started...they put out IMMERSIVE dvd sets to woo ppl into jumping on the dvd bandwagon. they keep getting heaps of praises for their care of quality and generous treatment.once the accolades are enough, they resort back to the cheapskate way. disney is like an unfaithful lover that vow wondrously on the altar only to break it in the end. now its gotten me getitng upgraded to blu ray with the promises of 'extra space means more extra bonuses to enjoy!' what extra bonuses? and talk about picture quality.we say it everytime a new format is released.for all we know the hi def quality of blu ray will soon be obsolete.


...........

[yamiiguy]

i dont blame the grunts we hold towards this release. its disney im disappointed with. as a company of high brand and quality trusted by art lovers and families worldwide. they repeatedly fool and disrespect our trust. this happened again and again with every new format coming in. when dvd first started...they put out IMMERSIVE dvd sets to woo ppl into jumping on the dvd bandwagon. they keep getting heaps of praises for their care of quality and generous treatment.once the accolades are enough, they resort back to the cheapskate way. disney is like an unfaithful lover that vow wondrously on the altar only to break it in the end. now its gotten me getitng upgraded to blu ray with the promises of 'extra space means more extra bonuses to enjoy!' what extra bonuses? and talk about picture quality.we say it everytime a new format is released.for all we know the hi def quality of blu ray will soon be obsolete.


...........

Sure, there are TVs out now capable of 3840x2160 resolution. But I don't see them becoming standard for a while yet, and Blu-Ray isn't exactly restricted by space. New BDXL discs (none released yet) are capable of 100GB and 128GB. Some players can already support them, yet some players will be obsolete.

[akhenaten]

the bigger storage capacity the lesser contents to fill in.what gives....

[yamiiguy]

Personally I'd rather have a good picture and sound with a high bitrate than special features, but each to their own.

[miniroll32]

Its all very well saying that the technology will improve and the resolutions will go into the thousands, blah blah, but how many common home owners are going to be buying 40"+ TV sets? Not everyone has the living space or even need for it. And even then, Blu-Ray is perfectly adequate for now.