If you ask me to move this to the rotoscoping thread to discuss it, I will. But if I may, I would like to finish the conversation with the same people who started it in here.
Thanks
Divinity,
Julian,
UmbrellaFish, and
enigmawing.
First I apologize to you
sotiris, if I hurt you. I do not think I was attacking you, I was attacking your information, but I do admit to mocking. But...I also wanted to express emotion in my post. Yes, I wanted to express my anger at people believing in something negative and untrue about others.
sotiris2006 wrote:You have said "The artist could, in fact, have simply traced the figures from the photostats, but this was seldom done because the characters had to be adapted in order to be consistent with the remainder of the animation. Instead, a kind of gentle caricature was employed, so that gestures and poses became slightly exaggerated. This system served the animators well, and they continued to use it in later movies."
That's what I mean when referring to disney rotoscoping. No one suggested that it's the same type of rotoscoping (but is still a type) with the Fleischer films or the contemporary "A Scanner Darkly" or "Waking Life".
But you
did suggest Disney used that rotoscoping. You said:
sotiris2006 wrote:Disney from the beginning of animated features films has used extensive rotoscoping and i don't just mean live-action reference footage.
Right there, you say they didn't just use live-action footage. But that really is all they did. I know more about Cinderella than Snow White, and so maybe I don't know if some artists did tracing into the animation paper for Snow White, or Pinocchio, but I know they did not for Cinderella. The DVD explained it. And as so many sources say all of Disney never traced the live action into the animation paper, or never mention it, we can be quite sure they didn't do it.
Max Fleischer, as I know, just traced the live Gulliver actor into the animation.
Disney only looked at and referenced the pencil lines they drew on live-action photostats while they were animating. They did not trace the live-action into the animation paper.
I need to admit that what
Flanger-Hanger wrote was kind of confusing.
But Disney did not just do the same thing Anastasia or other Bon Bluth films did. Everyone, like
pap64, notices that. They probably tried to trace the live-action into the animation paper, while Disney only referenced.
I think a really big thing here is what the term rotoscoping really means.
As
enigmawing said, it used to mean directly tracing the live-action into the paper, then designing it a little or whatever.
That's not what Disney did. They looked at live-action film footage, and traced over it, but did not trace it into the
final animation paper.
Now, maybe we'll hear some news, like one animator tells us he did trace when the other Disney animators didn't know about it or something, but right now we know they didn't rotoscope in that tracing way.
Basically, what Disney actually did should probably not be called rotoscoping. They studied life in slow motion, in 24 second frames, drew over some key poses from those frames, and looked at them back and forth as they drew. I think some Disney artists may actually have called that rotoscoping, but we now know the word rotoscoping has two different meanings. But I think people just don't know what rotoscoping really is.
Enigmawing, I thought you said Disney only live-action reference footaged, doing some tracings on paper, but not tracing it into the final animation paper. So, why did you say Cinderella used rotoscoping? Or did you mean it in the loose, "live-action reference" sense of the word?
Chernabog_Rocks, we can see Naveen likes to dance. He's just not funny. At least there.
blackcauldron85 wrote:And, you can see Naveen "cutting a rug" when he's with the boy, so maybe he loves to dance!
I know he does. But every time I watch it, I know it's supposed to be funny that he says that he used to dance 'cause he liked it...for some reason that's supposed to be funny...and it's not.
I can offer something I think would be better. He should say he used to do something more that a prince would be expected to do. Not waltzing, but maybe doing a lot of bowing or kneeling or swash-buckling. It would make fun of the prince stereotype.
Also, it is not animated well. Actually, none of him is very flowy or nicely animated, but whatever.
The scene where Naveen gets of the boat and the camera flashes...is really direct-to-video sequelish. But uh...they'll get better...I hope.
