Prince John

[Disney's Divinity]

I know Jay used to post these discussion topics about the Disney Villains, but I don't know if he's coming back any time soon or not. Either way, I enjoyed these discussions and felt we didn't really get to some good ones later in Disney's history. I searched, and it appears the last one he did was about Edgar from The Aristocats. I'll try to post these every week or so (depending on how much people want to talk about the character) so there isn't an overload of character topics.

Anyway, I can't say I have very many memories of Robin Hood, but Prince John was certainly comedic. There's no denying his villainy though--particularly at the end when the castle is burning and RH hasn't re-surfaced from the pond. For most of the movie, you can't take him seriously, so his actual desire to see RH dead was kind of disturbing and gives him a little redemption as a villain. To be honest, though, I think this movie might've been more fun for me if the characters had been human (though I guess Lady Cluck just makes this interpretation worth it. ).

I know Prince John isn't exactly the most popular villain, but any other thoughts on the character (or any other villains from Robin Hood)?

[Lazario]

When it comes to memories of Disney films, it's all about how you felt watching the films and how they came alive for you.

I like Prince John. Quite a bit. On an artistic level, he looks funny. He is a cute, cuddly looking lion character wearing a robe... It's adorable. Like a kid playing dress-up. And then with the jewels and crown. It fits the character in a way, the way he looks like he doesn't deserve to be King. Then, with his childlike psychological thumb-sucking... Completes the characterization perfectly.

He's a villain of circumstances. He's not that scary or intimidating. But he doesn't have to be. It's political. And as we've all learned, anyone can get to the top in game of politics. It's all about who you know / who you're related to. So I find that aspect of it very true to life.

Perhaps the really nasty villain of the movie is the Sheriff. But he also has to talk more to the people in the village than John. So, you could figure it goes either way. That maybe he's been put in a bad position and is "just doin' his job" like he says. Unlike the Prince, I don't find anything cute about the Sheriff. However, if you had to be stuck in a room with one of these characters in real life- wouldn't most people pick the Sheriff? In human form, I fear the Prince would annoy the hell out of anyone.

[Goliath]

Prince John reminds me of certain dictators and other political leaders in the world: villainous, evil, terrible people, who can act very childish and petty. That's why I think Prince John is a good Disney villain: in acertain way, in all his comedic exaggeration, he's still very life-like.

[Lazario]

Agreed. Of course he's still, as I gather, based on a classic tale. So it's proof, in the world of nepotistic horrors, History Repeats Itself in the realm of reality. But then, it's always been bizarre how many works of fiction went on to telegraph real life events.

I wonder if the Disney team had any special reasons for choosing that animal.

[2099net]

I wonder if the Disney team had any special reasons for choosing that animal.

Well his brother, King Richard, was known as Richard the Lionheart. So I guess that explains that.

However, I would love to know why Disney chose Rhinos as guardsmen. Lions work at a pinch because of the historical title of King Richard (although not native to the UK). But Rhinos? Why?

Bears would be more logical, but I guess they didn't want to confuse people with Little John - perhaps wolves? Or would they be a little too fox like and again cause confusion?

[BelleGirl]

Though Robin Hood is not among my favourite Disney movies, I must say that Peter Ustinov did excellent voicework in bringing the character of prince John to life. I also like his accomplice sir Hiss, though he reminds me very much of Kaa from The Jungle Book.
in design, Robin Hood borrows much from other Disney movies, especially Jungle Book and this give the movie a somewhat cheap copy/paste look.

[Lazario]

Though Robin Hood is not among my favourite Disney movies, I must say that Peter Ustinov did excellent voicework in bringing the character of prince John to life. I also like his accomplice sir Hiss, though he reminds me very much of Kaa from The Jungle Book.
in design, Robin Hood borrows much from other Disney movies, especially Jungle Book and this give the movie a somewhat cheap copy/paste look.

I like both films, but I enjoy Robin Hood more. I'd have to say it's because children as characters are hard to make as interesting as their adult counterparts. That's a blanket rule, seems to be true every single time. So the Rabbit child character isn't as central a character as Mo(w)gli. Hence, I get into it more.

But I agree about Ustinov. Without him, the character wouldn't have that slightly dignified quality that you can tell comes from the breeding. We know he's cut from the proper cloth, he just lacks the moral and character strength we assume his brother had, since he's so well-liked.

[2099net]

This is getting totally off-topic (and because it relies on school history lessons from 20+ years ago may be slightly inaccurate) but...

While various Robin Hood legends (and the Disney film of course) show Prince John to be cowardly, greedy and dictorial, he was anything but. The same legends show King Richard as being well liked and worshipped. But in reality King Richard was never in the country (he spent most of his time in France if I remember correctly when not crusading), had contempt for his English subjects (it was King Richard who demanded the taxes Robin Hood fought against in order to fund his army in the Crusades). However, I think generally he did have a good reputation in England because he was fighting "a just and holy war" (whatever).

Prince John actually signed the Magna Carta, which is sort of like the English Declaration in Independence. It was the signing of the Magna Carta which took some power away from the crown and gave it to the people, and is the basic foundation of democracy in Britain. So while legends see Prince John as evil, in real life was pretty much the opposite.

All this is from old school lessons I may have half forgot or muddled. If you're interested I would check out wikipedia or other online reference sites.

[Chernabog_Rocks]

Prince John....I like him but I don't. He's sort of like the anthro-version of Captain Hook, he has his good moments then there's parts where he can be just a tad too silly. But all arond he's pretty good villain wise.

[Lazario]

You know - before you mentioned it, I never saw PJ and CH as similar. But the second you brought it up, I see lots of similar qualities.