Looking back at "Home on the Range"...

[SpringHeelJack]

Well, that's a negative outlook.

[Disney's Divinity]

That's kind of a ridiculus way to look at it, considering the last few films made while Walt was still alive he had little connection to. Just because he's dead doesn't mean that people can't follow his example. And I never understand why people seem to worship Walt Disney as if he's some kind of saint. Sure, he basically founded animation in America, but that doesn't promise that his films are all good. In fact, I enjoy more modern Disney films than I do older ones (and I'm not saying the modern films are without their own faults; please don't misinterpret me).

As for HOTR itself, I enjoy the film, especially the style of animation (which is beautiful and represents the setting perfectly, imo). The only problem I have is with the three cow leads. I enjoy all the other characters in the film, but these three have a horrible dynamic and out-of-place voice actors (none of them fit together and why does a British voice have to be used for every regal and/or condescending character--there are plenty of British idiots, too). It's just strange to have a British woman (I forget her name, though I know who she is), Jennifer Tilly and Roseanne Barr all within the same film. I really miss the days when the voice actors used were relatively unknown--and much more talented. Anyway, I enjoy the rest of the cast, including the triplet dummies (hilarious). Even the villain suits the needs of the films and I enjoy his yodeling song far more than "Pink Elephants On Parade," which many people compare it to for some reason. And I suppose it goes without saying that the music is fantastic.

Overall, HOTR is a decent film. Not Disney's best, but far from its worst (I'm looking at you Brother Bear).

[Jules]

They came during the period when Disney's studio was "recovering" after the war (which drafted a good deal of young employees, some of which didn't return) ...

I always remember reading that many employees were drafted, but I've always wondered what happened to them. When you say "didn't return", do you mean "left the business" or (*sigh*) killed in battle? I figure an intelligent guess would be a mixture of both. Wonder what major talent left Disney during that period ...

I think on the internet (perhaps Cartoonbrew) I once saw a form of newsletter Disney used to send to their drafted artists to keep them in touch.

Make Mine Music can really be considered the first package film in the sense of "stringing short subjects together". IMO, it's the weakest of all the package films, though it boasts the best short to come from any of them: "Peter and the Wolf".

Strangely, my evaluation of Make Mine Music keeps shifting. On my first viewing, I too thought it the weakest package feature (especially since I had thoroughly enjoyed the others). On my second viewing ... it promptly stepped up a notch in my mental rankings and may have actually even dethroned Melody Time.

UD's reviews of the package features (especially those of the Jack Seiley/Captain Hook era) are rather harsh - at times even accusing the music with being infinitely dated and the visuals lacklustre. On the contrary, I somewhat disagree. I won't deny the music being dated. But then again ... what the hell's wrong with that!? If anything, the melodies in Make Mine Music, Melody Time, Three Caballeros are insanely catchy and bouncy and perfectly evoke to us the world of the golden 40s in our apocalyptic and dystopian (I'm exxagarating, aren't I? And why can't I ever spell "exxagarate" correctly!? There I go again ...) world.

As for the visuals ... granted you're not likely to experience any expensive multi-plane shots or any extravagant inking and colouring (a la Fantasia ... you know what I mean), but the core pencil animation is still pretty wonderful. I like to judge the quality of animation based on the original supervising animator's pencil drawings rather than on the finished film. Just because the 50s features look a bit bland in comparison to the 40s features does not logically boil down to inferior animation. Anyway ... Mary Blair's styling probably worked better that way with the more elaborate inking done in the early 40s.

As you yourself said:

What many don't realize, and what few often see, is that these films built the foundation for the style and direction of animation that would be seen in the 1950s Animated Classics. They are, in essence, the prequel of the Golden Age.

[yukitora]

lol. you guys got me all wrong.

remember, i'm the one who said I liked HOTR straight away. I think Meet the Robinsons is one of the best disney films. I grow up thinking Beauty and the Beast and The Lion King were the best films ever produced. I think "the dark ages" films in the 70s and 80s were absolutely astonishing.

I just think they don't retain the same feeling of the films released under Walt's supervision. It also doesn't mean I think their pure gold (though I do love them) and everything else is trash.

I don't know anyone who "worships Walt Disney as if he's some kind of saint". I think he's more of a hero kinda of guy...

[quiden]

I enjoyed this movie, but I'd agree with others that this isn't the greatest Disney movie ever.

I watched it recently also and really enjoyed the comedy. I'm not a big fan of burping humor, though. One part that made me really laugh was when Slim kept slipping on his disguise and his nephews would freak out because they thought he'd taken their uncle.

I think this movie would appeal most to people who really enjoy the disney shorts of the 50s. it really reminds me of those. especially the westerns.

[Escapay]

They came during the period when Disney's studio was "recovering" after the war (which drafted a good deal of young employees, some of which didn't return) ...

I always remember reading that many employees were drafted, but I've always wondered what happened to them. When you say "didn't return", do you mean "left the business" or (*sigh*) killed in battle? I figure an intelligent guess would be a mixture of both.

Likely both. I haven't read that many books about that particular period of Disney history (though I am quite fascinated by it) and I always remember the similar line in Bob Thomas's book (where he uses the phrase "some of which never returned", I believe). I don't know of any notable animators who were lost to the war, but I do remember reading that animator Fred Moore was lost to alcoholism at an early age.

Strangely, my evaluation of Make Mine Music keeps shifting.

Mine too. Soon after I wrote that (that it's the weakest), I found an old word document where I had listed the DACs in order of favorites, and Make Mine Music was a bit higher on the list than I thought it would be (even above The Three Caballeros, which I've elevated a bit on my list). I think though that the reason I wrote that it's the weakest is because it really is hastily put together. Sure, Melody Time is just as choppy, but it seems to have better-quality shorts (though perhaps not as memorable). If I were to rank the shorts based on favorites as opposed to artistic merit, Make Mine Music would beat Melody Time, if only because of the aforementioned "Peter and the Wolf" as well as the underrated "All the Cats Join In". It don't mean a thing if it ain't got that swing, kiddo! (and I'm realizing now that that reference really doesn't fit with "All the Cats Join In" as well as I'd like. Eh, I like it, so it stays.)

And why can't I ever spell "exxagarate" correctly!? There I go again ...)

Exaggerate.

albert

[Marky_198]

I kind of like the movie.

I actually don't like the animation, story and characters that much, but there are some brilliant songs that take the whole movie to a higher level. "Little patch of heaven", "the yodeling song" and "Will the sun ever shine again". I just heard that they've put "Will the sun ever shine again" in at the last moment, just in time, because they were worries that the movie would be too happy and shallow. I think it saves the movie.
Reminds me of the time they (Katzenberg) wanted to delete "Part of your world".

Ps. Have you guys ever heard the European "jodel"?
In the American version the used some sort of country jodel.
In Europe we don't know that sound so here they used the Austrian jodel.

Hear the difference here:

country jodel:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gHWUOMiL ... re=related

austrian mountain jodel :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UxTwqglL ... re=related

[ichabod]

Strangely, my evaluation of Make Mine Music keeps shifting.

Mine too. Soon after I wrote that (that it's the weakest), I found an old word document where I had listed the DACs in order of favorites, and Make Mine Music was a bit higher on the list than I thought it would be (even above The Three Caballeros, which I've elevated a bit on my list). I think though that the reason I wrote that it's the weakest is because it really is hastily put together.

I think the issue with Make Mine Music is that the good bits are great, whereas the bad bits are awful. Which makes it difficult to place anywhere, because even when thinking about the good bits, you can't help but think of the dredge that is for example 'two silhouettes' which i am quite at ease in saying is probably one of the worst things in Disney's entire history!

Any back to HotR, I'm not naming names but I will say one thing.

If you don't like the animation style of Home on the Range, that is fair enough. But anyone who says it is badly animated really is a moron.

[Jules]

... but I do remember reading that animator Fred Moore was lost to alcoholism at an early age.

I didn't know that! What a shame. The next time I see The Nifty Nineties, it will be far more poignant - especially in the Fred and Ward comedy skit scene. Come to think of it, the "Father Dear Father" satire deals with alcoholism ...

If you don't like the animation style of Home on the Range, that is fair enough. But anyone who says it is badly animated really is a moron.

Unfortunately there are two many people who seem to confuse art direction with animation. How many times have we heard "Eeew atlantis has teh most horrible amniation i've ever seen!!!1!1!!!!11!!! It reeks!"?

Why? Just because Milo and Helga are blessed with square fingers and isoceles triangle nails? In that case, blame Mike Mignola (well I don't ... I love stylised art!). Why can't people understand that animation is the movement of characters or inanimate objects ... regardless of whether they are anatomically perfect humans or just a bunch of squiggles?

Wonder what smart judgments we'd get if certain people see Chuck Jones' The Dot and the Line.

[Elladorine]

. . . but I do remember reading that animator Fred Moore was lost to alcoholism at an early age.

As a huge fan of Fred Moore, I feel a need to address this.

While it's true that Moore had a problem with alcohol, that was not the reason he died. Somehow the events surrounding the end of his life have been clouded in rumors that have snowballed ever since his untimely death in 1952. The most accepted rumor was that he was his own victim in a drinking and driving accident, which continues to persist to this day. Some said Walt had dismissed him and he'd been unemployed for months, uninsured and unable to go to the hospital to either treat the accident injuries or alcoholism. Some said he collapsed trying to unlock the key to the front door of his house, weak because his peers had refused to help pay for a much-needed hospital visit. Unfortunately these kinds of rumors have been been published in several books over the years.

The fact of the matter was that he was still employed at the Disney studio and was indeed treated at a hospital for accident injuries. Please check out this article as well as this one, which include a link to a newspaper article that explains his death was the result of a head-on collision. It couldn't have been due to his drinking; his wife was the one driving their car.

[Escapay]

. . . but I do remember reading that animator Fred Moore was lost to alcoholism at an early age.

As a huge fan of Fred Moore, I feel a need to address this.

While it's true that Moore had a problem with alcohol, that was not the reason he died. Somehow the events surrounding the end of his life have been clouded in rumors that have snowballed ever since his untimely death in 1952. The most accepted rumor was that he was his own victim in a drinking and driving accident, which continues to persist to this day. Some said Walt had dismissed him and he'd been unemployed for months, uninsured and unable to go to the hospital to either treat the accident injuries or alcoholism. Some said he collapsed trying to unlock the key to the front door of his house, weak because his peers had refused to help pay for a much-needed hospital visit. Unfortunately these kinds of rumors have been been published in several books over the years.

The fact of the matter was that he was still employed at the Disney studio and was indeed treated at a hospital for accident injuries. Please check out this article as well as this one, which include a link to a newspaper article that explains his death was the result of a head-on collision. It couldn't have been due to his drinking; his wife was the one driving their car.

Eep, color me embarrassed.

I was vaguely remembering things from Bob Thomas's book and one of them was about a talented animator (who was nameless in the book) who died because of his alcoholism. I assumed it was Fred Moore due to his known problems with alcohol, but I wasn't aware of his car accident until now.

albert

[Elladorine]

Eep, color me embarrassed.

I was vaguely remembering things from Bob Thomas's book and one of them was about a talented animator (who was nameless in the book) who died because of his alcoholism. I assumed it was Fred Moore due to his known problems with alcohol, but I wasn't aware of his car accident until now.

albert

Well, I don't blame you for any confusion. You're not alone, it seems a lot of animation fans are totally unaware of the accident or just attribute it to drinking and driving if they do. I was under the same impression myself, which I'm sure is due to a few books I read when I was younger.

[2099net]

OK, a few notes on Home On The Range – random musings really (and sorry folks, but I haven't read any of the thread and I literally don't have time to now).

1. The Animation

There's nothing wrong with the animation. It's a shame so many professional reviewers (who should know better) compared it to Saturday Morning TV. To my eyes, the animation is much better than that on Robin Hood (for example). Yes, the designs aren't life-like. Yes, the designs are somewhat simple and angular. But get over it, they've got a little something called "style". I think the root of the problem is that TV animation has improved dramatically – just look at the Yogi Bear or Huckleberry Hound DVD sets for animation in the 60s, Classic Scooby-Doo for animation in the 70s (and compare it to the 2000's What's New Scooby-Doo?) To put it somewhat bluntly, Disney didn't really have any creditable competition on television back in the day. Now, it sort of does. No cartoon with a TV budget can (or should be able to) match a Walt Disney feature animation film, but the difference between film and TV is much smaller than the crude, limited animation of the 60's and 70's.

2. The Story

How can people who champion films like Sleeping Beauty criticise the story? Sleeping Beauty has no story. No effort is made to show deep emotion. No effort is made to give the characters motivation or personality. No real effort is made to even expand the story beyond three fairies squabbling with themselves or the king's messenger getting himself drunk.

Compare that to Home on the Range. Every character not only has a personality, but has clearly shown motivations. Every character has a reason for existing, a reason for acting and every character drives the story, rather than the story driving them. Every character (except for Pearl) is proactive. In addition, every character has their own particular voice, their own method of speaking with their own rhythm and even words. The words they speak, and how they speak them tell us much about their character, beyond their already clearly defined motivations and actions.

Now look at Sleeping Beauty. Here you get the feeling half the characters have no motivation. Maleficent is just evil because the story dictates the need for a villain. Aurora herself seems to fall in love with the prince for the same reason. Not that we can ever understand what Aurora is thinking, because she hardly ever speaks. Likewise, Aurora is spirited away as a child, but untroubled by Maleficent or her goons until the eve of the termination of the curse, simply because the story demands it. Stuff just happens with little or no reason. Characters are reactive (except for perhaps Maleficent, but even she spends 16 odd years being somewhat less than proactive as Aurora grows up while hidden).

The story may or may not be your cup of tea, but to label it as "slight" is just ignorant. Sleeping Beauty, Beauty and the Beast etc may have pretentions of deepness and high-emotion that Home on the Range lacks, but Home on the Range has an almost bullet-proof construction and script.

3. Modern vs Timeless

I have scanned through this thread before posting, and I've seen the package films coming up in conversation a few times. Good. Because there's nothing wrong with Disney films taking then-current popular culture and making it a significant part of the tale. Look at the "pop" acts in Make Mine Music – Dinah Shore, Benny Goodman, The Andrews Sisters… Look at Edgar Burgen in Fun and Fancy Free. Even look at Louis Prima and King Louie in The Jungle Book.

Had Home on the Range had been a live action film, or a Muppet based feature, nobody would bat and eyelid at its Looney Tunes like humour. Why on earth should it be different just because Home on the Range is animated. Many frequenters of this site often complain that animation doesn't get much respect in Western culture. Well, I'm afraid it will never get full acceptance or become just a way of telling a story if people insist in pigeonholing it into Disney Broadway-Style Musicals all the time.