Passion of the Christ

[Prince Adam]

Has anyone seen this movie? What does everyone think?

I personally, although a Christian, don't plan to see it for two reasons:

1. I'm a wimp. I get very emotional during movies, and also have a very weak stomach. A ten-minute torture scene may make me have a heart attack like that woman in the US.

2. I don't know how to take Mel Gibson. Yes, he's a devout Catholic and I'm Protestant, but it's not that.
Last week during an interview he was quoted as saying he believed all Protestants were going to Hell. Yes, he's entitled to his opinion, but what really got me was that he said "it's too bad my wife's going to Hell, because she's a much better person than I am." (his wife's a Protestant)
I can't imagine anyone saying that about the person they're supposed to love.

So what about all of you? How do you feel about this movie?

[Luke]

Last week during an interview he was quoted as saying he believed all Protestants were going to Hell. Yes, he's entitled to his opinion, but what really got me was that he said "it's too bad my wife's going to Hell, because she's a much better person than I am." (his wife's a Protestant)
I can't imagine anyone saying that about the person they're supposed to love.

Did you actually hear him say that? I tend not to believe a number of things that Mel Gibson is attributed with 'saying', but I suppose it is possible. There's just some stuff that it doesn't seem anyone would say, and it's not like the media hasn't tried to stick him in the crosshairs and take him down.

I do hope to see "The Passion of The Christ" at some point soon, but I haven't seen it yet.

[indianajdp]

To address the point ... YES I do plan on seing this.

Secondly, regarding Gibson and the suposed comments. I'm inclined to believe that if he DID say something like this we would have heard all about it in the media -- since so many folks right now would like nothing more than to beat him down.

However, if he did say something like this I cannot say I'm all that surprised. I was born-and-raised Catholic but moved away from the Catholic Church for a number of philosophical reasons. I marries a Protestant and converted to the Methodist Faith. Anyway, my sister-in-law is a devout (read "phanatical") Catholic. She firmly believes and professes the following:

1. All non-Catholics are going to Hell. Period. There is no hope unless they become Catholic, even if they believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God and died for our Sins on the Cross.

2. In the history of mankind, only 188,000 (I hope that number is right, if not it's close -- I believe it represents the seven tribes that had to flee Egypt) will ever make it to Heaven...and guess what...she and her family are a part of that number.

I love my sis-in-law and she is a very loving person, but some of her extreme views are a perfect example of why I moved away from the Catholic Church.

[karlsen]

I know that number wery well. In my oppinion there are only one "problem" with the bible, and that is all the numberst that it gives out.

People does not see that many of those are symbolic for something and not intended to take seriously on the point.

I am so sorry to hear that someone in your family does belive this, but it only proves that there are misguided people in all belives. There are people like that wich are protestants and catholics so we should not judge the faith after some of the followers. The faith should be judged after what their books teach.

[Disneykid]

Hopefully I'll see this tomorrow as I've been looking forward to it for a looong time. As for the comments Gibson made about non-Catholics (including his wife) going to hell, I doubt he said that simply because it's not all over the news, and why on earth would he say something like that about his wife when she could easily hear and find out about it? It seems like another case of the press twisting what he says. Even if he does believe that, I'm not letting his personal life get in the way of my movie going experience. Heck, The Gospel According to St. Matthew is considered to be one of the greatest Jesus films of all time, but its director was an Atheist Communist.

[wwwjim]

This link seems to support that he did make those comments:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4224452/

Like you, Luke, I plan to see the film. I can't say I support his views on hell for Protestants though since I'm an Episcopalean like his wife.

Did you actually hear him say that? I tend not to believe a number of things that Mel Gibson is attributed with 'saying', but I suppose it is possible. There's just some stuff that it doesn't seem anyone would say, and it's not like the media hasn't tried to stick him in the crosshairs and take him down.

I do hope to see "The Passion of The Christ" at some point soon, but I haven't seen it yet.

[Rebel]

I went to the theater last night at 6:30 and all of the Friday night showings were sold out.

Regarding Mel Gibson's comments :

Gibson was interviewed by the Herald Sun in Australia, and the reporter asked the star if Protestants are denied eternal salvation. “There is no salvation for those outside the Church,” Gibson replied. “I believe it.”

He elaborated: “Put it this way. My wife is a saint. She’s a much better person than I am. Honestly. She’s, like, Episcopalian, Church of England. She prays, she believes in God, she knows Jesus, she believes in that stuff. And it’s just not fair if she doesn’t make it, she’s better than I am. But that is a pronouncement from the chair. I go with it.”

Although I am one of many Protestants who would disagree with him, he is only being honest about his beliefs and I can understand where he is coming from. He believes that only Catholics will make it to heaven; it would wrong for him to think that an exception would be made for his wife just because he loves her and wants her to go to heaven. I have a cousin who currently says that she is not sure whether or not God exists but she does not believe that Jesus was anything more than just a charismatic man who pulled off the biggest scam in history. I love my cousin dearly, but I would have to admit that unless something changes, I do not believe that she will make it to heaven. To deny that would be to deny my faith.

As for Mel Gibson's wife hearing about it, I expect that she is already fully aware of Mel's view. My cousin knows what I believe and how I feel about her beliefs; we have talked about it all in depth on various occassions. I would be surprised if Mel and his wife have not done likewise.

Anyway, you may disagree with Mel Gibson's beliefs, but I do not see that as a reason to avoid going to see the movie. There are a lot of movies produced/directed by Jews, scientologists, and atheists, but I am not going to prejudge the movie just because I disagree with the religious beliefs of the people who made it. I do not know the religious beliefs of hardly any of the people responsible for making the many Disney animated features that I love, but I really do not think that knowing would in any way change my opinion of the films.

[Ludwig Von Drake]

I would very much like to see the film but I think that I won't be able to due to the controversy.

[Just Myself]

To address the point ... YES I do plan on seing this.

Secondly, regarding Gibson and the suposed comments. I'm inclined to believe that if he DID say something like this we would have heard all about it in the media -- since so many folks right now would like nothing more than to beat him down.

However, if he did say something like this I cannot say I'm all that surprised. I was born-and-raised Catholic but moved away from the Catholic Church for a number of philosophical reasons. I marries a Protestant and converted to the Methodist Faith. Anyway, my sister-in-law is a devout (read "phanatical") Catholic. She firmly believes and professes the following:

1. All non-Catholics are going to Hell. Period. There is no hope unless they become Catholic, even if they believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God and died for our Sins on the Cross.

2. In the history of mankind, only 188,000 (I hope that number is right, if not it's close -- I believe it represents the seven tribes that had to flee Egypt) will ever make it to Heaven...and guess what...she and her family are a part of that number.

I love my sis-in-law and she is a very loving person, but some of her extreme views are a perfect example of why I moved away from the Catholic Church.

Well, we believe a little different at the LDS church. First off, we don't believe anyone on earth goes to "hell", or as we call it eternal darkness. Only those who didn't go with god in the pre-mortal excistence would go to eternal darkness. We also believe he didn't die for our sins, he BLED for our sins in the Garden of Gesemite(spelling?). He died on the cross so he could be ressurrected to fulfil the Plan of Salvation. If you'd like to learn more about the LDS chruch, go to http://lds.org/. If there are some things different from what I just told you, please don't grill me. I'm only 14.

[Lady]

i'll be watching this film next weekend when it is less crowded at the theatres. the movie has been doing very well and is projected to make around $100+ million at the box office over the 5 day period (Wednesday to Sunday).

[Loomis]

2. I don't know how to take Mel Gibson. Yes, he's a devout Catholic and I'm Protestant, but it's not that.
Last week during an interview he was quoted as saying he believed all Protestants were going to Hell. Yes, he's entitled to his opinion, but what really got me was that he said "it's too bad my wife's going to Hell, because she's a much better person than I am." (his wife's a Protestant)
I can't imagine anyone saying that about the person they're supposed to love.

So what about all of you? How do you feel about this movie?

Having seen many a Gibson interview (he is one of Australia's favourite adopted sons after all), I can safely assume his tongue was firmly in cheek when he said that.

However, he seems to have become a complete wanker over this movie, talking about god working through him etc etc. It is like people thanking god in their acceptance speeches at the Oscars - if god really has the time to be concerned about your career, no wonder this world is so screwed up...

Anyhoo, the film.

Initially I was really enthusiastic about seeing it. I found the concept really interesting (filimg in a dead langauge, without subtitles). Then he added the subtitles, and started going on about hellfire and brimstone. From other interviews, he seems to be taking a heavy handed approach to this. More concerned with preaching than storytelling. A local paper had this to say:

Dramatically, the film is limited, largely because it's so literal and violent. It evokes strong emotions - particularly pity - but few moments of revelation, and fewer still of poetic wonder. Gibson directs everything with a dull hand, awed and stymied by the importance of the story he's telling.

I have to say I'm not really sure I want to fund Mel's religious crusade. While every film is a filmmakers beliefs and opinions (with the possible exception of Police Academy), this one appears to be something I disagree with. I have never liked the violent, depressing side of Christianity and Catholicism in particular (although, as a kid, I was raised as one, btu have since rejected).

In essence, I guess the violence does turn me off. By focusing on the Passion alone, Gibson is not really offering us anything new BEYOND the violence, and that is troubling. I know much talk has been made on the anti-Semitism of the film, and havign not seen it, I cannot comment on this aspect. But to me, the focus has shifted away from the violence, which is just as troubling to me.

Of couse, I am yet to see the film, but these are the reasons I am hesitant to.

[IggieKuzco]

im planning to see this film as soon as i can (i live in israel, and apparently it's been banned from theaters- what an impact this movie is having on the world..!!) and being jewish, i will probably take it differently then most of you, but i plan to look at it from a critical standpoint more then a religous standpoint. basically, going into the movie with a clear mind, and see how i feel by the end of it... if im ever able to see it that is.
But i assure you, when i see i'll give you a thorough review of my opinins on it.

But until then.... Be Patient with the Passion!

[STASHONE]

NEW YORK (AP) — Days before the release of Mel Gibson's film about the death of Jesus, which some critics say could fuel anti-Semitism, his father has told an interviewer that the Holocaust was mostly "fiction."

In the latest interview, Mel Gibson's father said Jews want to take over the world.

By Corrado Giambalvo, AP

Steve Feuerstein — host of Speak Your Piece!— said he interviewed Hutton Gibson for a segment of his show to be broadcast Monday by the small Talkline Communications Network.

According to a transcript released by the network, Hutton Gibson said, "It's all — maybe not all fiction — but most of it is," when asked about his views on the Holocaust.

He added: "They claimed that there were 6.2 million (Jews) in Poland before the war and after the war there were 200,000, therefore he (Hitler) must have killed 6 million of them. They simply got up and left. They were all over the Bronx and Brooklyn and Sydney and Los Angeles."

The interview comes at a sensitive time for Mel Gibson, whose epic The Passion of the Christ is due to open Wednesday.

Some Jewish leaders say the movie could fuel anti-Semitism for its portrayal of Jews' role in the crucifixion, while conservative Christians have praised it as a moving depiction of Christ's death.

Gibson, who produced, directed and co-wrote the film, has said repeatedly that he is not anti-Semitic and that the project was a deeply personal expression of his own faith.

Hutton Gibson has an unpublished phone number at his home outside Houston and could not be reached for comment. Alan Nierob, a spokesman for Mel Gibson, declined to comment on the interview.

Hutton Gibson follows a tiny wing of traditionalist Catholicism that views the modernizing reforms of the Second Vatican Council as a conspiracy between Jews and Masons to take over the church.

The elder Gibson has stirred controversy in previous interviews with remarks on the Holocaust and Judaism, but had kept quiet in the months leading up to the release of The Passion.

In this latest interview, Gibson said Jews want to take over the world. He did not know why Jews would want to achieve that, but said "it's all about control. They're after one world religion and one world government."

Asked in media interviews whether he shares his father's views, Mel Gibson has said that he loves his father and will not speak against him.

Zev Brenner, owner of Talkline, which he calls a Jewish network, has been calling for a boycott of all of Mel Gibson's movies. - USA Today.


Regardless of the above transcript, I can't express how little interest I have in seeing this film eitherway. I hear it's a bloodbath though, a 2 hour long murder with continual 45 minute torture scenes of Christ getting flogged. Should churches really be bussing children off to see this? Suffice to say, I won't be supporting. I can understand the fear that these graphic images and sadistic actions of the jews portrayed in this movie can ignite anti-semitism though. I know the ADL is a bit sensitive at times. I myself am of jewish faith and proud to be, though I do not hold any divine belief. Through Catholic friends however, my understanding of the teachings, is that Jesus died for our individual sins and that we are responsible for his death, not any one race.

Anyway, here's a great review of the actual movie from The New Yorker: http://www.newyorker.com/critics/cinema ... rci_cinema


Btw, is it not ironic that for a film director with such a strong passion and desire to portray a factual account of what he considers to be his 'magnum opus' epic... that Jesus is cast by a pasty white dude that looks like he's been living on a modern western diet his entire life?

Religious figures turned hollywood... sheesh. I think Jesus should've been played by Steven Segal.

[Sulley]

I saw the film Thursday night with my youth group. Having shed a few tears at The Return of the King, and being a Christian, I expected to be crying very hard by the end of the film, but I did not shed a tear. I did, however, flinch, get goosebumps, and a rapid pulse rate at some of the more intense moments. I respect all beliefs and religions, but I am very happy with this movie and hope it will help those not familiar with or out of touch with the Christian religion. It really doesn't matter what one's denomination is, the entire doctrine of Christianity is based upon the events portrayed beautifully in this movie, and so it is very religiously educational and moving. As for the film itself, I must agree with Roger Ebert's "Two Thumbs Up". It was extremely well done, and although it was possibly the most intense violence I've ever seen, I will probably see it again. The acting, particularly by Caviezel, is wonderful, as is the cinematography and outstanding directing. I encourage everyone who can to see it. Bravo, Mel Gibson.

[Disneykid]

Btw, is it not ironic that for a film director with such a strong passion and desire to portray a factual account of what he considers to be his 'magnum opus' epic... that Jesus is cast by a pasty white dude that looks like he's been living on a modern western diet his entire life?

Well, I'll tell you one thing: Jim Caviezel as Jesus looks FAR more convincing than any other Jesus I've seen on film (which is a lot), and Mel put a prosthetic nose on Jim plus CGI coloring of his baby blue eyes, making him look very Christ-like, IMO.

The only real criticism I keep hearing about the film is that it provides virtually no backstory as to why these things are happening, meaning if you're not already familiar with the life of Christ, you'll be sitting there wondering why everyone's so hateful towards Him. Perhaps Mel should've extended the film by 20 minutes or so by adding flashbacks of Christ telling the pharisees off publicly, and other events (Christ performing miracles on the sabbath which ticked the high priests off) that'd give the passion better context.

[STASHONE]

I guess you missed the sarcasm DK.

Jesus was middle eastern and a carpenter before the invention of power tools, not likely a skinny blue-eyed white guy. Most respectable theologians would acknowledge that the common image portrayed is highly inaccurate and based solely on tradition. I guess Gibson decided to overlooked this minor fact though.

Btw, is it not ironic that for a film director with such a strong passion and desire to portray a factual account of what he considers to be his 'magnum opus' epic... that Jesus is cast by a pasty white dude that looks like he's been living on a modern western diet his entire life?

Well, I'll tell you one thing: Jim Caviezel as Jesus looks FAR more convincing than any other Jesus I've seen on film (which is a lot), and Mel put a prosthetic nose on Jim plus CGI coloring of his baby blue eyes, making him look very Christ-like, IMO.

The only real criticism I keep hearing about the film is that it provides virtually no backstory as to why these things are happening, meaning if you're not already familiar with the life of Christ, you'll be sitting there wondering why everyone's so hateful towards Him. Perhaps Mel should've extended the film by 20 minutes or so by adding flashbacks of Christ telling the pharisees off publicly, and other events (Christ performing miracles on the sabbath which ticked the high priests off) that'd give the passion better context.

[Disneykid]

I guess you missed the sarcasm DK.

Jesus was middle eastern and a carpenter before the invention of power tools, not likely a skinny blue-eyed white guy. Most respectable theologians would acknowledge that the common image portrayed is highly inaccurate and based solely on tradition. I guess Gibson decided to overlooked this minor fact though.

Forgive my stupidity, I've been out of it lately, but I'm still not quite getting your sarcasm (it still sounds very sincere to me). Jesus in this movie is not very traditional looking (such as, say, Jeffrey Hunter in King of Kings). He has dark eyes and hair, a thicker beard, and is a bit more built than the usual scrawny Jesus. The only flaw I see in Jesus' physical appearance in this film is that his skin is white rather than tan. That's all.

[STASHONE]

Oh my bad than, I havent seen the film. Given that the strong basis of this movie is supposed to be its actual depiction though, Id say skin color should be a primary consideration.

[Disneykid]

Ah, now things are cleared up. Here's a pic of what Christ looks like in this film (for some reason img tags wouldn't work on this image):

http://www.imdb.com/gallery/ss/0335345/ ... ey=0335345

[STASHONE]

DK, a while back there was a program on Discovery that tried to reveal the face of the "true Christ" using scripture and historical infomration as opposed to the common Western Wolrd Renaisaance/Baroque image.

Here is what they revealed at the end of the program:



Jesus is 1970s Keith Moon!