disney losing its touch?

subzero · Post by **subzero** » Wed Jan 28, 2004 11:28 am

Is it me or is disney losing its touch on their movies, seems like things went downhill ever since Mulan or tarzan, the new ones don't seem like its the traditional disney type films.. besides their PIXAR films which seems to be going strong, I just don't see disney doing so well besides milking us on their billions of different version of the classic films. Just my 2 cents, please don't flame me

Chernabog · Post by **Chernabog** » Wed Jan 28, 2004 11:37 am

I agree to a certain point, but I think mostly it´s because there is not so amusing and fascinating with animated films anymore.
There is simply too much of them (from all studios out there), to make them so fantastic as I remember I felt for each classic when I was little.
Then there was an animated feature every three or four year, not like now - more than one every year.
Not to speak of all the sequels that they bring on top of all the rest...

Mushu2083 · Post by **Mushu2083** » Wed Jan 28, 2004 12:59 pm

I don't think Disney's losing its touch. It's just there's an overload of animated films out there right now. We get like two or three animated movies a year now. It seems like every movie studio is getting in on animated movies.

swray1024 · Post by **swray1024** » Wed Jan 28, 2004 1:22 pm

There sure is an overload of them. Seems lots of the big studios are trying to cash in on the success of the Disney ones, and trying to compete. And some are pretty good. Disney seems to put out one big one a year. I am not complaining about it though! I love this!!!

PatrickvD · Post by **PatrickvD** » Wed Jan 28, 2004 1:35 pm

no they're NOT losing their touch.. they're losing their talent... and the management is 'overdoing' their 'touch'

subzero · Post by **subzero** » Wed Jan 28, 2004 2:05 pm

disney annual summer hits which are what I use to look forward to is a thing of the past.. only thing I look forward to now are the PIXAR collections

Loomis · Post by **Loomis** » Wed Jan 28, 2004 2:42 pm

PatrickvD wrote:no they're NOT losing their touch.. they're losing their talent... and the management is 'overdoing' their 'touch'

Ha! Spot on....couldn't agree more.

Disney have made some poor creative decisions in the past few years, and the HUGE loss of talent it partly the reason for the "loss" in quality.

However, I also maintain that Disney have not necessarily loss their "touch" so much as public perception has changed. With the success and subsequent heavy marketing of films from Pixar or Dreamwork's Shrek, a great many people (Disney management included) want to see "more of that kind of stuff".

The last few films have been great: Brother Bear, Treasure Planet, Atlantis. However, none have done well at the box office. We know that with TP, at least, this was partly due to Disney having lost faith in the project and not really pushing it.

I think what Disney HAS lost it faith in consumers. If they produce a good product, coupled with clever marketing (e.g. Lilo and Stitch) Disney will continue to have hits (box office wise, I think all of them are great

).

Disney Guru · Post by **Disney Guru** » Wed Jan 28, 2004 4:01 pm

I agree with you completely Disney is loosing its touch.

Mushu2083 · Post by **Mushu2083** » Wed Jan 28, 2004 4:08 pm

I think Disney is losing its touch because of one person, EISNER. I think he's running Disney into the ground. I think if Eisner is left in charge of Disney, they'll go bankrupt or something.

Loomis · Post by **Loomis** » Wed Jan 28, 2004 4:54 pm

Mushu2083 wrote:I think Disney is losing its touch because of one person, EISNER. I think he's running Disney into the ground. I think if Eisner is left in charge of Disney, they'll go bankrupt or something.

I hardly think all the problems of Disney stem from Eisner.

Now, I am not one to defend Eisner - I certainly don't agree with all of his decisions.

But to suggest they'll go bankrupt as a result of his actions is a little premature. The company is doing quite well (financially) at the moment. Nemo and Pirates were HUGE hits this year, and DVD sales were quite high as well. And the fact that they have several films nominated for Oscars this year is indicative of them raking in more over the next 12 months (if history is a guide). Don't forget - Disney is not just "Disney" - but Miramax, Touchstone, Dimension etc. They have all been having quite a number of hits these last few years. If anything, Disney is more profitable than ever.

However, this MAY be short term.

At any rate, while I can't defend some of his actions - or Disney's generally - I think it is unfair to blame Eisner for everything.

fairuza · Post by **fairuza** » Wed Jan 28, 2004 6:50 pm

they no longer take their time to refine the stories (most important) and artwork. disney used to put out an animated movie like every 4 or 5 years.

disney also no longer spends as much money as they used to to make things right. walt bet the farm on snow white after all.

Loomis · Post by **Loomis** » Wed Jan 28, 2004 8:36 pm

fairuza wrote:they no longer take their time to refine the stories (most important) and artwork. disney used to put out an animated movie like every 4 or 5 years.

disney also no longer spends as much money as they used to to make things right. walt bet the farm on snow white after all.

If Walt had failed, we wouldn't be sitting (maybe standing?) here discussing this on the forum. And you are right - there is something absolutely stunning about a film that takes a long time to come to fruition. Sleeping Beauty and Treasure Planet were great looking films. Two of my favourite films in fact.

On the other hand, it IS a gamble. With the current state of the movie industry, big companies can't afford to bet the whole bank on one film every four years. Sleeping Beauty and Treasure Planet were not as profitable as the studio hoped. Admittedly, I've never been a fan of the whole 'churn 'em out and hope one hits' attitude of film production. But I kinda guess the DTVs serve that purpose - they can get out there quicker and cheaper, make some money for Disney so they can afford to spend more time on the big budget pictures. Disney STILL spend years on each production, they just have to do several simultaneously. And presumably with the dilution of talent due partly to management issues, Disney MIGHT be spreading themselves a little thin.

I still maintain that the "touch" Disney has lost is that of properly marketing a picture to the public. Maybe they have simply lost "touch" with what the public wants?

PatrickvD · Post by **PatrickvD** » Thu Jan 29, 2004 3:26 am

Loomis wrote:
Mushu2083 wrote:I think Disney is losing its touch because of one person, EISNER. I think he's running Disney into the ground. I think if Eisner is left in charge of Disney, they'll go bankrupt or something.
I hardly think all the problems of Disney stem from Eisner.

Now, I am not one to defend Eisner - I certainly don't agree with all of his decisions.

But to suggest they'll go bankrupt as a result of his actions is a little premature. The company is doing quite well (financially) at the moment. Nemo and Pirates were HUGE hits this year, and DVD sales were quite high as well. And the fact that they have several films nominated for Oscars this year is indicative of them raking in more over the next 12 months (if history is a guide). Don't forget - Disney is not just "Disney" - but Miramax, Touchstone, Dimension etc. They have all been having quite a number of hits these last few years. If anything, Disney is more profitable than ever.

However, this MAY be short term.

At any rate, while I can't defend some of his actions - or Disney's generally - I think it is unfair to blame Eisner for everything.

I agree, this isnt just Eisners fault, this comes from many bad decisions over the last few years and you cant blame everything on Eisner.. though now is the time he just needs to step up...his time is up

the bad part of it all, is that Disney is indeed very profitable... short term of course, the long term growth, what Roy Disney is fighting for, is definitely in danger

Kram Nebuer · Post by **Kram Nebuer** » Thu Jan 29, 2004 9:21 pm

I had just read a very good biography by Bob Thomas on Walt Disney and I learned that the reason Walt wanted a lot of profit was to keep on entertaining. He'd always even forget he was in debt and strove to make quality pictures so it is enjoyable year after year, generation after generation.

These days, Disney is making a lot of profit and I think they're not using the best of it in entertaining. Why in the world are they firing all these people: closure of Animation studio in FL, firing of a lot of cast members, closure of Paris studio, etc.? Have they got too much that they can't handle? If Walt let himself go into millions of dollars into debt for the sake of the customer, why can't Disney do that now? Have they gotten to greedy? I'm not sure what's going on, but I'm still glad that the films they are producing are still wonderful.

Mermaid Kelly · Post by **Mermaid Kelly** » Thu Jan 29, 2004 10:03 pm

Yesterday, I would have put no, but now, especially after seeing that "Chicken Little" picture, I am absolutely pissed! (sorry about the language

). Seriously though, I am very upset about the "no more 2d" idea!!!!

Kram Nebuer · Post by **Kram Nebuer** » Sat Jan 31, 2004 10:44 pm

Computer animation isn't that bad. To me, it seems like a new trend due to the success of Pixar's movies (afterall, look what happened after Snow White premiered). I don't think 2D will be gone forever. Once all the movie companies have gone into computer animation and desired to capitalize on the popularity of it, someone has to go back. Maybe Disney will and the next golden decade of Disney Feature Animated Films will come and seem new to a new generation of kids.

I mean how great will that be for the children of the future and for us? They grew up with CGI cartoons then old fashioned 2D animation makes a come back and its something they're not used to. It would also be great to us for 2D's rest to suddenly surprise us and come back?

p.s. The glass is half full.

Athena · Post by **Athena** » Sun Feb 01, 2004 11:54 am

The Disney films of late have felt more formulaic and pandering than they have in the past... possibly because we were less familiar with the Disney "formula" or possibly because these ones are simply trying to play on past successes.

I get the impression that these films are more tentative... less willing to take risks and push themselves story-wise or artistically... for instance I think "Lilo & Stitch" is the best thing from Disney in a long time, because it did dare to be a bit different... it stands out where Atlantis and even Treasure Planet just faded from mind almost as soon as I left the theatre.

That's partly due to the erosion of talent but also partly due to the fact that the corporate side of the studio is no longer willing to take risks... all they want to do is sit back on their past successes and supposedly successful formulas--and of course release nice, safe DTV sequels too... audiences might accept that to a certain degree, in the sense that "oh here's a Disney film so I can safely occupy my kids for a Saturday afternoon", but they'll never coming running... they're never going to be breaking down the theatre for the "safe" and unimaginative. I don't know about you, but that's not why I go to the movies.

Squirrel · Post by **Squirrel** » Sun Feb 01, 2004 10:08 pm

I've really loved a lot of the recent Disney films, from this decade: Fantasia 2000, The Emperor's New Groove, Lilo & Stitch, Brother Bear. And I'm waiting for Home on the Range. But the company is definitely in a state of flux. And I wish they hadn't canned the people in Orlando.

Disney Guru · Post by **Disney Guru** » Sun Feb 01, 2004 10:36 pm

subzero wrote:Is it me or is disney losing its touch on their movies, seems like things went downhill ever since Mulan or tarzan, the new ones don't seem like its the traditional disney type films.. besides their PIXAR films which seems to be going strong, I just don't see disney doing so well besides milking us on their billions of different version of the classic films. Just my 2 cents, please don't flame me

You are so right. Disney is loosing its touch.

windupgamecat · Post by **windupgamecat** » Mon Feb 02, 2004 8:10 am

I think Disney have suffered from a lack of a clear direction in recent years. Films like Tarzan, Treasure Planet and Atlantis have been pushing in one direction while films like Brother Bear, Emperor's New Groove and Lilo & Stitch have been pushing in another. Neither have been getting decent enough marketing at the same time.

If I was in charge of Disney's animation, I'd take a year off just to work out a really clear commercial strategy for traditional animation and then push it as hard as possible in the marketplace.
They really need to retreat back to old territory, I suspect: get a decent fairy tale/princess movie out there. The Frog Prince seems a possible candidate.

G.

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