Will Don Bluth's animated movies ever become SE?

Discussion of non-Disney DVD and Blu-ray.
User avatar
numba1lostboy
Anniversary Edition
Posts: 1461
Joined: Wed Mar 01, 2006 10:10 am
Location: Joining the Resistance.

Post by numba1lostboy »

PixarFan2006 wrote:Rock-A-Doodle
I remember that one!! Wow...it's been a long time. I really liked that film, though. Didn't it start out in live action and progress to animation (ala Pagemaster)?

While the animation on these films were never as up to par with the Disney films of the same time, I think the Bluth films were much better at soliciting emotion in their films.
:pan: Love It.
User avatar
disneyboy20022
Signature Collection
Posts: 6868
Joined: Tue Aug 23, 2005 2:17 pm

Post by disneyboy20022 »

numba1lostboy wrote:
PixarFan2006 wrote:Rock-A-Doodle
I remember that one!! Wow...it's been a long time. I really liked that film, though. Didn't it start out in live action and progress to animation (ala Pagemaster)?

While the animation on these films were never as up to par with the Disney films of the same time, I think the Bluth films were much better at soliciting emotion in their films.

Rock a doooooooodle I loved that movie when i was little. I remember watching on The Disney Channel all the time (Even though it wasn't truly disney). I think I still have the original DVD Release of it. In Fact I think that WAS My first DVD I ever owned. I remember I had a friend buy it online off of amazon before my family got the internet and then I payed them back the shipping and the cost of the Rock-a Doodle DVD.
Want to Hear How I met Roy E. Disney in 2003? Click the link Below

http://fromscreentotheme.com/ThursdayTr ... isney.aspx
User avatar
Siren
Platinum Edition
Posts: 3749
Joined: Sun Feb 13, 2005 6:45 pm
Location: Florida
Contact:

Post by Siren »

I find it funny when people make the point about how Rasputin was not really based on the real person. And complain about Thumbalina.

Pocohontas was "based on a true story" too. And yet, they made Pocohontas 10 years older, gave John Smith a clean-shaven face. And made Radcliffe into a villian.
Little Mermaid, was based on Hans Christian Anderson's story, and yet, very little of the movie turned out to really be based on it. While Thumbalina was much closer to the original story.

And I don't understand why every single animated movie HAS to be compared to Disney. MGM was one of the first movie makers ever. Do we compare every movie to one of the first MGM movies? How is it fair that every single animated movie has to be compared to Disney, and thus, everything is below average to Disney then? Don Bluth does what Disney won't. He pushes limits. Look at the violence in Secret of NIMH and All Dogs Go To Heaven. Disney would never allowed to make him make those movies under the Disney name. Does Don Bluth always make the BEST animated movies? No, but neither does Disney for that matter.

I am just sick and tired of hearing how the every animated movie HAS to be compared to Disney. Don Bluth isn't Disney, nor does he try to be. He is his own entity. He does it his own way. Imagine how good Disney could be, if Disney didn't shoot down every story idea that would push those limits that Don Bluth doesn't have.
User avatar
reyquila
Anniversary Edition
Posts: 1689
Joined: Thu Apr 01, 2004 10:03 am
Location: San Juan, Puerto Rico
Contact:

Post by reyquila »

I own almost every Bluth movie!! He's great and I'll love to see his work restored!!!
WDW Trips: 1992,1997,2005,2006, 2007, 2008, 2009-10 (Disney's Port Orleans-Riverside), 2010, 2012, 2013, 2014, 2015, 2018 and 2022.
Disneyland Trips: 2008 (Disneyland Hotel) and 2016
Disney Cruises: 2007, 2010 (Wonder) and 2012 (Dream).
My Disney Movies http://connect.collectorz.com/users/peluche/movies/view
Dottie
Collector's Edition
Posts: 2576
Joined: Wed Aug 23, 2006 1:51 pm
Location: The Pie-Hole
Contact:

Post by Dottie »

I'll have to agree with Siren.
NOT everything Disney has made is super-awesome-fantastic.
I simply love NIMH, although it's quite differernt from the novel, but I never was a big fan of Dumbo and Pinocchio. I never considered them to be wonderful movies that I watched all the time. I've maybe seen Pinocchio 2 times and Dumbo 3.
But I remember that I used to watch NIMH like every week. I absolutely loved that movie(still do), though it ws kinda violent, but it never felt like it was. It was/is a magical movie and I likt that Don Bluth never thought: " We can't do that, we need a G-rating" like Disney does. Bluth always did what he felt was right. Not all of his work is great ( I hate ADGTH and the Land-before-times series), but NIMH ad Anastasia are much better movies than some stuff Disney has produced. Take the package movies for example, what's so great about those? I wouldn't buy one of those, but I'd rush out to a store right away to buy a restored, 2-Disc of NIMH. But it shouldn't be like the 2-Disc of Anastasia. That was too much fluff!!!! The commentary was great, though.

Another great movie that someone else has already mentioned is The Swan Princess. The characters are very nice and the music is good too.
Its sequels are kinda crappy though.
Image
Finchx0rz
Gold Classic Collection
Posts: 448
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 4:43 pm
Location: USA

Post by Finchx0rz »

Dottie wrote:Not all of his work is great ( I hate ADGTH and the Land-before-times series)
Don't blame Bluth for TLBT's sequels; those are Universal's fault. I wish I could blink them out of existence.
Dottie
Collector's Edition
Posts: 2576
Joined: Wed Aug 23, 2006 1:51 pm
Location: The Pie-Hole
Contact:

Post by Dottie »

I didn't like the first one either :lol: . I don't like dinosaurs anyway. :D
Image
User avatar
Caballero Girl
Gold Classic Collection
Posts: 190
Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2006 10:19 am
Location: the Twilight Zone

Post by Caballero Girl »

I agree that not every single animated film needs to be compared to Disney. There are many that stand out as perfectly distinguished and ground-breaking enough on their own. However, I do think that comparing Don Bluth's films to Disney's is more than reasonable. Logical, even.

After all, he WAS a former Disney animator. And he left Disney because he wasn't content with their declining animation standards throughout the 70s. He felt that he could do things better, and create animated movies which were closer to the kind of films Disney used to make in his heyday (personally I'm of the opinion that he failed rather dismally for the most part, particularly once Disney's own critical revival got started, but that's just me). Throughout the 80s, the films which Bluth and Disney produced were in pretty much head-to-head combat at the box office. They were released at similar times, in the case of the Land before Time/Oliver and Company, the very same day. And, I mean, look at his films. A lot of the time, they just invite comparison to Disney. There are plenty of other animated films, such as Yellow Submarine, Watership Down and When the Wind Blows, which I wouldn't even consider comparing to Disney, because besides being animated in the first place, they have scarcely anything in common at all. Bluth's films, however, strike me as being desperately determined to replicate the Disney format. His animation style, for a start, is blatantly modelled upon Disney's (although from All Dogs Go to Heaven onwards, this style did appear to start wandering into Saturday Morning cartoon territory - Anastasia proved a disruption to this slide). Then there are the upbeat musical numbers (NIMH and Land Before Time excepted), the dim-witted comical sidekicks (in Bluth's case, all voiced by Dom DeLouise :p), the full-blown menacing villain, and the list goes on. Rather than pushing the boundaries, he strikes me as someone who's always determined to play things safe and include all the basic elements which have seemingly made Disney's films so endearing. Consider that the original NIMH novel, "Mrs. Frisby and the Rats of NIMH", didn't have any really distinctive villains. Plenty of threats, but no one single figure who deserves to have the "pure evil" label slapped upon them (there is, maybe, Dragon, but he's only ever portrayed as acting purely on instinct, so he doesn't count). I mean, why else would they have given Jenner's characterisation a significant tailor-job other than to fill what the "Disney formula" would have dictated as a void? Given that the original story was engaging and dramatic enough as it was, I just can't think of any other reason.

And the historical inaccuracy isn't really what bothered me about Anastasia, hence why I didn't really dwell on that point. I just didn't feel, when I saw it, that the story, ripe with potential, was as well-told as it could have been. Rasputin has certainly been a figure of much historical controversy over the decades, but what turned me off about his portrayal in that film was that he felt like more of a plot device than a respectable character who had any reason to be involved in the story. The two romantic leads, Anastasia and Dimitri (sp?) had a lot of charm going for them...more focus upon their relationship and less upon Rasputin's perfunctory revenge scheme would have been more than welcome. But hey, as I said, I kinda liked that particular film, even if it was uneven.

And I growled about Thumbelina simply because I personally found that film unendurable. All respect to anyone who can actually find enjoyment in it (you're a braver soul than me). I had to keep flicking through the channels just to escape from how grating its songs, voices and execution insisted on becoming. I kept hoping I was just experiencing some really rough spots in an otherwise okay film, and that when I returned, things would have improved. Alas, no... :o
Image
User avatar
Siren
Platinum Edition
Posts: 3749
Joined: Sun Feb 13, 2005 6:45 pm
Location: Florida
Contact:

Post by Siren »

I certainly understand SOME comparrison. Afterall, critics compare movies all the time. Spirit was said to be the similar to Lion King for instance.

It just seems that every other animation company is doomed by Disney fans. That they are instantly mocked, insulted, and degraded because they are compared to Disney.

Why not just look at the movie as a stand-alone? Judge it on its animation, style, story telling, character development/arc, music, etc. Rather then compare it to something else and feel that is enough evidence as to how good it is? That is my whole point.

I think we are all entitled to our opinion, but I think its a bit weak to base most that opinion by an unfair comparrison. Rate a movie on how well it preforms itself, and THEN compare it to the movies before it. :)
User avatar
Caballero Girl
Gold Classic Collection
Posts: 190
Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2006 10:19 am
Location: the Twilight Zone

Post by Caballero Girl »

Siren wrote:
Why not just look at the movie as a stand-alone? Judge it on its animation, style, story telling, character development/arc, music, etc. Rather then compare it to something else and feel that is enough evidence as to how good it is? That is my whole point.

I think we are all entitled to our opinion, but I think its a bit weak to base most that opinion by an unfair comparrison. Rate a movie on how well it preforms itself, and THEN compare it to the movies before it. :)
Yeah, I'm cool with that. :) Disney have made some wonderful films over the years, though obviously I'm not going to claim that everything they've done is automatically superior to every other animation studio's output. They've made their fair share of weak films too. Given the choice, I think I'd probably take Anastasia over Robin Hood and the Great Mouse Detective any day. :D
Image
User avatar
jrboy
Anniversary Edition
Posts: 1245
Joined: Sat Sep 10, 2005 7:38 pm
Location: Baton Rouge Gender: Monster
Contact:

Post by jrboy »

I know this topic is kind of old but, YEEEEEEEEEEES

Secret Of NIMH: 2-Disc Family Fun Edition in WIDESCREEN

http://www.dvdempire.com/Exec/v4_item.a ... d=28118312
User avatar
xxhplinkxx
Collector's Edition
Posts: 2769
Joined: Wed Feb 15, 2006 7:34 am
Location: Your mind.

Post by xxhplinkxx »

I was in the store yesterday and was very surprised to see a new 2 disc edition of The Pebble and the Penguin... but um... Im really not sure if it's Don Bluth's. It got me excited though!
Image

"Hip hop frightens you, doesn't it....Hmmm...Fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate. Hate leads to endlessly posting threads about stupid white people. Hmmmmm....."

I love Siren!
PapiBear

Post by PapiBear »

Recently found on Don Bluth's website:
Posted: 04/05/2007
From: Adam McDaniel
Email: cinemalad5@aol.com
Subject: NIMH retrospective
Message: I'm happy to learn that www.aintitcoolnews.com, a popular site about the entertainment industry, will soon be including a discussion of THE SECRET OF NIMH as part of their look back at 1982 as "the best genre year ever." (I'd volunteered to write about it, only to be informed that someone else was already on top of it!) Naturally, we're all very excited about the film's upcoming DVD re-release, and hope that it's given the comprehensive, deluxe, "all out" treatment that it deserves. Any news or details to share with us yet? "Making of" interviews with the animators and surviving voice cast? Is there anything you wish could have been included that wasn't? I know, I know...we'll probably just have to wait, but it's been 25 years now, so you can't accuse us of being impatient. :) I'm particularly interested in your thoughts on the film now, as well as its large cult following. As much as people love and enjoy your other films, it's fair to say that "NIMH" is the one that you guys will be known for...and will still be enjoyed another 25, even 50 years from now. Heartfelt regards, Adam McDaniel
Reply: Adam, Thank you for writing. Actually, this re-release will not be the HD Blu-Ray release, but it will have the color corrections made by Gary and the new master was digitally cleaned up and ridded of scratches and dust by the technical people hired by Fox Home Entertainment (for MGM/UA). The HD version will come out later. The folks at Fox Home Entertainment marketing have decided that this first re-release will not be the "25th Aniversary Edition" but a Fox Family Fun Edition, with a Fox Home Entertainment choice of cover art and an edited interview to service family audiences. It will also have a producer/director commentary over the film as part of the extras. We provided the Extras producer with several links and leads to materials that could be used in the extras but I do not believe that interviews were done with the likes of Dom DeLuis, or Wil Wheaton, or Shannen Doherty, or the beloved Derek Jacobi. That would have been great. There are a lot of the animators who have gone on to have great careers and some have even directed animated features. Maybe for the HD Blu-Ray version we can get the extras producer to go after these contributors and expand the backstories of many of those involved. Hopefully, you and all the other fans will enjoy the color-corrected remastered film, and the extras that have been made for this release. By the way, we haven't seen a release copy yet, only the remastered digital copy on professional equipment...but it looks great!
Reply Posted: 04/11/2007
User avatar
carter1971
Gold Classic Collection
Posts: 168
Joined: Sun Mar 11, 2007 7:42 pm
Location: Georgia

Post by carter1971 »

I love most of his work, especially his early films and Anastasia. During the 1980's, while Disney was trying to get its animation department back on track, Don Bluth was animation as far as I'm concerned. The Secret of NIMH and An American Tail are two of my favorite animated movies from any studio, and I hope they get the treatment they deserve on DVD someday. The post above from PapiBear looks promising!
ichabod
Diamond Edition
Posts: 4676
Joined: Thu Sep 25, 2003 8:29 am
Location: The place where they didn't build EuroDisney
Contact:

Post by ichabod »

Well it's nice to know that this movie is getting an SE, it definitely deserves one, being one of the greatest and most underrated animated films ever. It is however disappointing that a much better Blu-ray disc will be coming out * after* the DVD. :(
yamiiguy
Anniversary Edition
Posts: 1685
Joined: Mon Oct 09, 2006 12:52 pm
Location: United Kingdom

Post by yamiiguy »

Well I'll defenatly import The Secret of Nimh, lets hope All Dogs Go To Heaven, An American Tail and The Land Before Time get the same good treatment
User avatar
my chicken is infected
Anniversary Edition
Posts: 1048
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 6:55 pm
Contact:

Post by my chicken is infected »

xxhplinkxx wrote:a new 2 disc edition of The Pebble and the Penguin
I looked for that on Amazon, and they said it only has one disc. But it is a new reissue with some bonuses, albeit probably lame ones. And it's in widescreen, and anamorphically enhanced.

I can't see why it'd get a 2-Disc release. I've seen the movie's box office gross on IMDB. Pretty abysmal. It's not one of Don's most popular movies, and I doubt there's enough material for two discs.
Image
-Joey
User avatar
Siren
Platinum Edition
Posts: 3749
Joined: Sun Feb 13, 2005 6:45 pm
Location: Florida
Contact:

Post by Siren »

About the hate towards Bluth....Bluth was strongly involved in movies like Rescuerers and Fox and the Hound and look how good they were. As far as I'm concerned, they were as much of Bluth movies as they were Disney movies. Like Disney, he had a great eye for really making the audience feel for orphans. And he focuses on details. An American Tail's artwork is as stunning as any Disney movie out there. As is Secret of NIMH and Land Before Time. He isn't a Disney-wanna-be, he was a major hitter in Disney animation for years before he quit because he didn't like how they got so cheap. He loves details. He has no problem spending days on one scene. Look at the Great Owl scene in NIMH, that took months to complete, because like Walt Disney, he was a perfectionist. And when the heads at Disney told him, "don't bother to color in the eyes" for the movie Rescuers, because it would save Disney money, he quickly started getting sick of it. They cut corners to save money and Disney suffered, till they finally brought back the Disney tradition of detailed animation and stories with Little Mermaid. While Bluth has never wavered from his attention to detail. He struggles to make movies now. Because he rather struggle to make it so it perfect, then do it cheap and fast and sloppy.

And box officer scores mean jack. A lot of Disney classics did very poorly in the theaters too. Fantasia was a box office bomb and yet it is scene as a work of art now
User avatar
bradhig
Anniversary Edition
Posts: 1109
Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2005 10:59 pm
Location: Olathe , Kansas

Post by bradhig »

Most of his stuff doesn't interest me much. He did create animated scenes for the Dragon's Lair and Space Ace laserdisc arcade games.
User avatar
Escapay
Ultimate Collector's Edition
Posts: 12562
Joined: Tue Jan 27, 2004 5:02 pm
Location: Somewhere in Time and Space
Contact:

Post by Escapay »

bradhig wrote:Most of his stuff doesn't interest me much.
Except for the "rubbish" ending of Anastasia. :P

Escapay
WIST #60:
AwallaceUNC: Would you prefer Substi-Blu-tiary Locomotion? :p

WIST #61:
TheSequelOfDisney: Damn, did Lin-Manuel Miranda go and murder all your families?
Post Reply