Let's face it, Disney lost its magic. How to come back...

[rb_canadian181]

What Disney needs to do is go back to is animated musical roots that they discovered in 1989. Get Alan Menken back (he also did Disney's NEWSIES - Disney's first original musical for television).

If Disney revives its animated musical - I believe the company will thrive once again on the silver screen.

I couldn't agree with you more. Although, I doubt that Disney would be willing to buy the rights for something like Phantom Of the Opera (which I think would make an interesting animated film, seeing as the limits are endless for special effects). Disney should look back at the few fables and fairy tales that they didn't already adapt and they should make as many of those as possible into musicals. I even think that as long as they had Alan Menken for music, someone like Elton John could write some good lyrics.
I really hope to see the company rise again...as soon as they say they're making another musical with Alan menken, i'm buying stock! hahaha

[SuicideSeaside]

d) I never met a Disney fan who didn't like any of the animated musicals.

I visited a peculiar messageboard a few weeks ago. The people on the messageboard believed that the downfall of Disney began with the Little Mermaid. They hated all the musicals.

[Sunset Girl]

d) I never met a Disney fan who didn't like any of the animated musicals.

I visited a peculiar messageboard a few weeks ago. The people on the messageboard believed that the downfall of Disney began with the Little Mermaid. They hated all the musicals.

Y'know, I've also met several Disney fans (in person, no less) that disliked the musicals, but to say that TLM was the beginning of the downfall? I hope they're speaking artistically (which is just opinion anyway) instead of monetarily.

Still, I believe that there's no way Nemo would have done so well if it had been 2-D. As I said before, it's the mind-set of the general public. As I mentioned before, I think a lot of the general public currently thinks that animation for babies, *including the kids they're supposedly geared toward,* and for some reason they put CGI in a different category.

On the other hand, Robots wasn't the huge blockbuster it was expected to be (you can't expect a long list of celebrities to carry a feature or even heavy advertizing). Oddly enough, critical acclaim can't do that either. The audience has to make some kind of special connection with the concept if they're going to have it on their must-see list.

Let's say that Disney released another broadway-style animated musical. Would today's audience embrace it like the audience of yesterday? I'm not so sure about that.

[Raydawggie]

I don't think some good musical numbers could hurt, especially if they were written by the songwriters Disney's had the most success with. But I think the key is that Disney's got to go back to the heroic epics. If you look at the recent movies, one of the thing a lot of them were lacking was a strong villain. The movies were either lacking a true villain(Treasure Planet, Brother Bear), or had a weak, comedic villain(Yzma, Almeida Slim, Gantu). The only movie that had a real, evil villain was Atlantis, and Rourke was a rather minor part of the story. He was good, but he didn't have the same presence of some of the others. Compare these villains to the likes of Ursula, Gaston, Jafar, Scar, Frollo, Hades, and Shan-Yu! Some of these villains were the best thing about their movie, and others were irreplacable in making the movie what it was. Even the weaker villains like Clayton and Ratcliffe added something to the plot and were memorable. Clayton had a great final battle with Tarzan and an incredible death sequence, and Ratcliffe had the best song in the movie.

Plus, if you look at the 1989-1999 era, most of Disney's movies were essentially about teenagers finding their way in the world. This ensured that the audience found the lead character relatable and was rooting for them to triumph. The fact that most of the characters and their love interests were rather attractive didn't hurt either. Rather than the songs, I think that the most important element of a good Disney movie is having a likeable hero or heroine, a love interest that the audience wants our hero to wind up with, and a truly hissable villain. There is room for diverging from this formula occasionally(Lilo and Stitch was a great movie), but overall, this is a recipe for success.

[Wonderlicious]

I love the animated musicals of the 90s, but I have to admit that if Disney made another fairy tale in this style, then this would be really unoriginal. The Little Mermaid and the first few musicals, as 2099net wrote, worked as they took the formula for Snow White, Pinocchio, Sleeping Beauty etc and made it more approachable for a modern audience who don't look at things in context. In my eyes, there isn't much to add to the early-90s formula for audiences in 2005, so this would be unoriginal, which so many "true" Disney fans hate, right?

In my opinion, new formulas are a good idea. I thought that Atlantis and Treasure Planet just weren't all that great (the only Disney animated features that I can say that I hate), yet I'd rather have seen them like they were than having "Be Our Guest" and "Hakuuna Mattata" numbers chucked in to fit a formula. I found the unusual nature of Brother Bear to be a winner, and I think that it could stand alongside the great animated films.

A good idea, in my opinion, would to please the wants of musical and innovation lovers by making films that whilst classed as a musical, could also be deemed as original. Perhaps a Disney Moulin Rouge style musical with popular Disney tunes recycled in new ways to make new tunes? A Bollywood style "Kiss the Girl" or an MGM musical approach to "Zip-a-dee-doo-dah", maybe? Sounds good to me...

[MovieMusicals.net]

"No I don't think if Nemo was in 2D it would be a hit! Because the reason people went to see Nemo was because of all those adds, "From the creators that brought you Toy Story and Monster's Inc.". They knew they were all good family movies so they went and took there kids with them.

If it was in 2D and made by Disney I think it would flop since Disney was loosing the reputation."

So you're saying that if the same exact film were in 2D, it would have flopped?

HIGHLY Disagree with you there. If Toy Story, Finding Nemo, and Monsters, Inc. were all in 2D - they would still be the same great stories. The animation style had LITTLE to do with box office. Back when TOY STORY came out, people were VERY timid about an all computer-animated film. But it was such a great film - who cared if it was 3D?

Personally, I think MONSTERS, INC. is the best Pixar film. FINDING NEMO was good, but not the best. I didn't even like it the first time I saw it.

I remember in 1989 going to see LITTLE MERMAID in theatres. It was visually STUNNING to see the fantasy ocean, shining, shimmering, golden, tropical, BEAUTIFUL. Awe-inspiring.

Now there's FINDING NEMO. I thought the ocean was life-like, but nothing about the animation was shocking or inspiring. Just very detailed.

In any case, I don't think type of animation has anything to do with it. As long as the film is good, it will get an audience.

[Sunset Girl]

So you're saying that if the same exact film were in 2D, it would have flopped?

I hate to say it, but I think so. I work with a lot of kids. I see how fickle they are. I ask them specific questions and hear their opinions first-hand.

Not all great animated films find the audiences they deserve because people fail to look past the medium. What about The Iron Giant? What about Cats Don't Dance? I'm guessing that Shark Tale did much better than both of those films combined.

[Timon/Pumbaa fan]

HIGHLY Disagree with you there. If Toy Story, Finding Nemo, and Monsters, Inc. were all in 2D - they would still be the same great stories. The animation style had LITTLE to do with box office. Back when TOY STORY came out, people were VERY timid about an all computer-animated film. But it was such a great film - who cared if it was 3D?

Well the audience doesn't know when a film will be great so unlike you, I don't think Finding Nemo would've been a hit if it was in 2D! (Man I wish Shrek was in 2D!)

I think Treasure Planet is wonderful but it flopped! And like Ichabod and I have pointed out, some of Disney's "greatest classics" were originally flops! Along with other classic movies.

[MovieMusicals.net]

I LOVED IRON GIANT and CATS DON'T DANCE and especially ANASTASIA.

Nemo would have done the same in 2D.

Think about it this way: if there hadn't been a fully computer animated film yet, and Toy Story, Toy Story 2, Bug's Life, Monsters Inc, and Finding Nemo were all in 2D, it would be considered a golden age of Disney films right now...well, minus Home on the Range.

[Timon/Pumbaa fan]

I LOVED IRON GIANT and CATS DON'T DANCE and especially ANASTASIA.

Nemo would have done the same in 2D.

Think about it this way: if there hadn't been a fully computer animated film yet, and Toy Story, Toy Story 2, Bug's Life, Monsters Inc, and Finding Nemo were all in 2D, it would be considered a golden age of Disney films right now...well, minus Home on the Range.

Well if there was no fully computor animated films today things would be different. Toy Story would've probably made more money, The Emperor's New Groove would've made more money than Tarzan, Shrek would've flopped and Finding Nemo would probably make alot of money, but not as much as Nemo.

The point I bring up is don't assme that because if there was no fully computor animated film alot of things would be different.

[MovieMusicals.net]

"Well the audience doesn't know when a film will be great so unlike you, I don't think Finding Nemo would've been a hit if it was in 2D! (Man I wish Shrek was in 2D!)"

"Well if there was no fully computor animated films today things would be different. Toy Story would've probably made more money, The Emperor's New Groove would've made more money than Tarzan, Shrek would've flopped and Finding Nemo would probably make alot of money, but not as much as Nemo.

The point I bring up is don't assme that because if there was no fully computor animated film alot of things would be different."

Sorry Timon/Pumba fan, I am not understanding what you're saying. Not making sense...

[Little Red Henski]

The Iron Giant failed because of bad marketing. When I saw the Iron Giant on TV for the 1st time I was presently surprised to find that it was the best American animated film in decades. Cat Don't Dance failed because Warner Brothers hated the movie because they didn't make it. Warner Brothers inherited that movie from the merger with Turner.

Maybe Chicken Little will resurrect the "magic". I'm sure Disney is going to promote the hell out of that movie.

[Timon/Pumbaa fan]

"Well the audience doesn't know when a film will be great so unlike you, I don't think Finding Nemo would've been a hit if it was in 2D! (Man I wish Shrek was in 2D!)"

Sorry Timon/Pumba fan, I am not understanding what you're saying.

Well you said that you'd think Finding Nemo would be a hit even if it was in 2D, just because it has a "great" story. But people don't know what films have a "great" story or else nobody would've seen Sharktale or Shrek 2. Today they only go to an animated film if it's a computor animated movie.

Let's say Pixar was around and made Toy Story and Monster's Inc. but never made Finding Nemo. Let's say Disney made Finding Nemo and it was in 2D. I don't think it would have been a hit. The audience won't know whether it has a "good"story" or not, they just go if it's computor animated these days. I mean I thought the Brother Bear trailers looked way way better than the Finding Nemo trailers but hardly anybody saw Brother Bear compared to the people who saw Finding Nemo.

[Sunset Girl]

If CGI films didn't exist there would be no Toy Story, Finding Nemo, etc.. so where would the new golden age of Disney lie?

The fact is that we don't know how something like Finding Nemo would have done had it been 2-D; we can only speculate. So much factors into the success of a film you might as well use the chaos theory. How good of a film it is, critical acclaim, merchandising, exposure, advertizing, character appeal, the mood of the audience, and so on and so forth.

[dgfan2112]

If an animated film wasn't making much money, then they would get worse.

[calvin101]

When watching 'The Lion King' me and my friend commented that it was a shame that we could have reached the time when kids won't grow up with animated films like we did.

Films go in cycles, one day, no-one knows when, the animated musical will come back but it could be in 30 years, and it might not be Disney that brings it back, but I have faith that it will, there isn't one genre that hasn't had a renaissance at some point.

The problem at the moment is there seems to be a demand for cartoons to be "cool", and the music side that Disney associates with doesn't so much fit with that image. Personally I think Disney can still get it right, I thought the Emperor's New Groove was FANTASTIC with the same quality of script as the likes of Shrek, but right now the Disney tag seems to be associated with being old fashioned. I'm sure they can adapt to the new demands of kids films though.

[MovieMusicals.net]

Well you said that you'd think Finding Nemo would be a hit even if it was in 2D, just because it has a "great" story. But people don't know what films have a "great" story or else nobody would've seen Sharktale or Shrek 2. Today they only go to an animated film if it's a computor animated movie.

Oh rubbish and poppycock! People don't go to the movies to see a GOOD film. They go to be entertained. I know plenty of horrible movies that entertained me. Just today I saw BEWITCHED and although it was horrible, it was enjoyable.

People go to see movies for the hype. I went to see LORD OF THE RINGS because of the hype, and I ended up enjoying it. I would even say they were good films.

[Kenai]

Oh rubbish and poppycock! People don't go to the movies to see a GOOD film. They go to be entertained. I know plenty of horrible movies that entertained me. Just today I saw BEWITCHED and although it was horrible, it was enjoyable.

LOL, you're not the only one who thinks so. Everyone's been bashing Bewitched.

Back on topic, I'm gonna sum this all up. Disney has and never will lose the magic...............people have.

[Timon/Pumbaa fan]

Oh rubbish and poppycock! People don't go to the movies to see a GOOD film. They go to be entertained. I know plenty of horrible movies that entertained me. Just today I saw BEWITCHED and although it was horrible, it was enjoyable.

You seem to miss my point. My point is that I disagree with you that Nemo would've done well at the box office even if it was in 2D. Because look at Brother Bear, the trailers were much more interesting than Nemo's and the movie was better than Finding Nemo(IMO) but people didn't rush out to see Brother Bear now did they.

So why did people rush out to see Finding Nemo? I don't think people rushed out to see it because Finding Nemo was "amazing" like you said since nobody knows when a movie will be amazing or not. They rushed out to see it because they were expecting to see another good animated movie from the creators of Toy Story and Monster's Inc.

[Sunset Girl]

Back on topic, I'm gonna sum this all up. Disney has and never will lose the magic...............people have.

Ah yes, thank you. Exactly what I was trying to say.