Zootopia

[Farerb]

I actually haven't seen any discussion about Zootopia now, I've mosty seen discussion about The Help and the "White Savior" trope and today GwtW and SotS resurfaced again. I'm actually interested in what people have to say about Zootopia.
I thought back then that the film means well, but its allegories might be more confusing than intended. I used to think that the film won't age that well back then when it was released, but I thought it would happen later rather than sooner.

[UmbrellaFish]

There’s been discourse about it on #DisTwitter, specifically from black Disney vloggers who say the movie always made them feel uncomfortable. Shawn Rosell was the first person I saw who mentioned it if you’d like to look him up and go from there.

[Farerb]

Thank you

[Sotiris]

I actually haven't seen any discussion about Zootopia now, I've mosty seen discussion about The Help and the "White Savior" trope and today GwtW and SotS resurfaced again. I'm actually interested in what people have to say about Zootopia.

I have. They're saying the prejudice metaphor is awkward and half-baked and doesn't apply to the real world. In Zootopia, the predators are being discriminated against and are seen as dangerous. The film pretends it's irrational for the prey to fear them, but it's not. Even if they are evolved now, there's a presumed century-long history of the predator class hunting down and killing the prey. That doesn't correspond to U.S. history. Even though racial and ethnic minorities are feared and labeled as dangerous, there's never been a time where they've been the predators, systemically-speaking. White people have always been the predators while demonizing communities of color at the same time. The implication of the oppressed being at one point the oppressor is seen as offensive. Moreover, the mere association of predatory animals, which in real life are regarded as violent and threatening, with the disenfranchised is seen as offensive as well.

[JeanGreyForever]

I remember criticisms like that existed for this film back when it came out and they'll probably only get stronger as time goes on. I wonder if that's maybe why Disney was so hesitant to do anything permanent with this property like include it in the Parks or announce a sequel.

That makes me wonder how many Disney films will be regarded like Song of the South is right now way in the future. I feel like you could easily pinpoint almost every Disney film (regardless of era, including the Revival ones) as offensive or controversial to some extent, deeming it necessary to lock away because it hasn't aged well.

[Farerb]

I remember criticisms like that existed for this film back when it came out and they'll probably only get stronger as time goes on. I wonder if that's maybe why Disney was so hesitant to do anything permanent with this property like include it in the Parks or announce a sequel.

That makes me wonder how many Disney films will be regarded like Song of the South is right now way in the future. I feel like you could easily pinpoint almost every Disney film (regardless of era, including the Revival ones) as offensive or controversial to some extent, deeming it necessary to lock away because it hasn't aged well.

I think it really depends. They have never treated Dumbo, Peter Pan and Lady and the Tramp the same way they did Song of the South, so I don't think they'll remove films from existence like they did with SotS. I think the way Warner handle this is better, to put the films in a historical context so we can learn from it instead of ignore it and pretend that it never happened.

[UmbrellaFish]

I think, too, that we have to remember we live in a moment, and it doesn’t necessarily mean that we’re heading in a direction where all Disney films with problematic racial elements are treated like Song of the South. I mean, SotS has a long history of being hidden by the Disney company. On the other hand, last year with Disney+, the company chose instead not to hide their history, but to share it on their new platform with appropriate disclaimers attached. I think and I hope that this is Disney’s model going forward.

[JeanGreyForever]

I suppose Song of the South was different because it had people protesting against it even when the film came out. Although I still think What Makes the Red Man Red is the most offensive piece of content in any Disney film. At least they didn't censor Dumbo like rumors suggested.

[estefan]

I think the way Warner handle this is better, to put the films in a historical context so we can learn from it instead of ignore it and pretend that it never happened.

Disney did that with the Walt Disney Treasures DVD sets by having Leonard Maltin introduce some of the shorts (specifically the World War II propaganda films) and explain the historical context. If they ever decide to add some of that material to Disney+, they should include those intros, too.

[JeanGreyForever]

I think the way Warner handle this is better, to put the films in a historical context so we can learn from it instead of ignore it and pretend that it never happened.

Disney did that with the Walt Disney Treasures DVD sets by having Leonard Maltin introduce some of the shorts (specifically the World War II propaganda films) and explain the historical context. If they ever decide to add some of that material to Disney+, they should include those intros, too.

Agreed, although I see Disney as just pretending those shorts don't exist anymore. I can't imagine them including them on Disney+ at all.

[Disney's Divinity]

I think, too, that we have to remember we live in a moment, and it doesn’t necessarily mean that we’re heading in a direction where all Disney films with problematic racial elements are treated like Song of the South. I mean, SotS has a long history of being hidden by the Disney company. On the other hand, last year with Disney+, the company chose instead not to hide their history, but to share it on their new platform with appropriate disclaimers attached. I think and I hope that this is Disney’s model going forward.

I agree. That is the proper way to handle it rather than changing films or hiding them in a vault somewhere.

[Sotiris]

Zootopia is once again #1 at the box office. Clearly there's a demand for more. A sequel can't be far behind, right?

https://deadline.com/2020/06/weekend-bo ... 202974215/

[DisneyBluLife]

Even Moana have had more news and buzz around it than Zootopia.

[Farerb]

Even Moana have had more news and buzz around it than Zootopia.

I don't see them making a sequel without Musker and Clements, even if Moana had more longevity than Zootopia. Also Zootopia 2 will happen years after Encanto.

[Disney's Divinity]

Yeah, I think we're all still shocked that Zootopia made a billion despite being written off by most here. It made nearly 350 million more than Moana, for example. I guess Moana has the Disney Princess line to keep it "relevant" these days…? I suppose it might get a Broadway musical eventually, since Miranda was attached to it, but a sequel is very unlikely and TV series iffy.

I hope Raya ends up with Zootopia numbers, too, considering it's in that same Spring release area.

[Sotiris]

A sequel to Moana is unlikely without Musker and Clements (although I wouldn't rule it out completely), but I still think there's a good chance for an animated TV series. Moana is consistently trending on Disney+. It's still in the top 10. There's no way Disney hasn't noticed that.

[Farerb]

The problem with a TV show is that I don't think that either Johnson or the musical team would do that.
By the way I'm not surprised that Moana is trending, it found its popularity after the Blu-ray was released, it was the 5th most sold title in 2017.

[Sotiris]

The problem with a TV show is that I don't think that either Johnson or the musical team would do that.

I think they would, especially if it were a high-quality production exclusive to Disney+ like the upcoming Monsters at Work.

[Disney's Divinity]

A sequel to Moana is unlikely without Musker and Clements (although I wouldn't rule it out completely), but I still think there's a good chance for an animated TV series. Moana is consistently trending on Disney+. It's still in the top 10. There's no way Disney hasn't noticed that.

https://i.imgur.com/yDRACLf.jpg

Interesting to see Frozen, Frozen II, and The Making of Frozen all in the top 10.

[Sotiris]

Interesting to see Frozen, Frozen II, and The Making of Frozen II all in the top 10.

If Frozen Fever and Olaf's Frozen Adventure were trending too, we'd have a full (Frozen) house.