I think we may need to save the Treasures series

[The_Iceflash]

So I wonder when we'll hear something about their continuation or ending.

[kaijueguy]

I've just finished reading these posts and I'm struck by the large amount of misinformation. First, if there any official word that the treasures line is dead? Absolutely not. Leonard Maltin says the future is uncertain. He said the same thing last year and has been repeating this mantra since 2007.

Then we get the news about a Swiss Family Robinson DVD TIN with links to pictures that you need to join the site to see and a vague reference to an 800 number without supplying anyone with the full number so that we can check it out for ourselves. I'd like more information on this if anybody has it instead of

The fan based history of Disney information is so filled with people making things up and repeating it as fact that I'm getting weary of it all. I used to come here for fact-based information, not a lot of things made up on the spot.

Before we repeat things, can't we take a moment to make sure we get the facts straight and when we have information about hard to obtain releases. Let's get all the information out there. I'm sure others might be interested in obtaining a copy of the Swiss Family Tin and providing all the information could result in greater sales which would reinforce to Disney that this product is still marketable.

[merlinjones]

You know, the rights holders are so close to releasing the vast majority of Walt Disney's work on DVD that you'd think the Treasures and exclusives would continue apace until the job was completed and the boomer consumers found total fulfillment.

I'm sort of holding on to the dream/hope that we still might get nice DVD copies of the rest of the MIA Walt era work that I find meaningful and inspiring (including "Song of the South")... If it were all available tomorrow, some of us nagging old goats would likely be happy to pack up the fangear and move to an island to watch it all.

[merlinjones]

>>Let's get all the information out there. I'm sure others might be interested in obtaining a copy of the Swiss Family Tin and providing all the information could result in greater sales which would reinforce to Disney that this product is still marketable.<<

Walt Disney's "Swiss Family Robinson" is one of my very favorite films. Since the 1980s, I will have purchased the movie twice on VHS, twice on laserdisc, once on DVD and likely will again on Blu-Ray - - along with several additional copies over the years as gifts for family and friends. All of these purchases were made with the goal of an enhanced viewing experience over the previous edition or exposing others to the film, not for the sake of "collecting" per se.

That said, if I didn't get the "tin" version (with the same content as the earlier DVD), would that be an insufficient show of consumer support for this material? I'm glad "Swiss Family" is being remarketed in a fresh way to new consumers, but is that the same niche that these Walt Disney Treasures fill -- making more of the library accessible to viewers?

"Song of the South," the majority of "Walt Disney's Wonderful World of Color" (etc.) have never even been made available...

[Flanger-Hanger]

Watching a video on Horizons made me think of Magic Highway U.S.A. I wonder why this wasn't included on the Tomorrowland set? Seems like good Treasures material to me!

[kaijueguy]

>>That said, if I didn't get the "tin" version (with the same content as the earlier DVD), would that be an insufficient show of consumer support for this material? I'm glad "Swiss Family" is being remarketed in a fresh way to new consumers, but is that the same niche that these Walt Disney Treasures fill -- making more of the library accessible to viewers?

"Song of the South," the majority of "Walt Disney's Wonderful World of Color" (etc.) have never even been made available...

My point was to state that the person who posted the previous info about this set, left out a lot of information. Stating it's available only through an 800 number without providing the rest of the number is fruitless. Providing the entire number, which they must have had access to since they purchased it, would give access to information that otherwise is not available.

Like you, I have purchased virtually every version of the film since it became available in the home market, including the super 8 condensation. I would consider making this purchase and I'm sure other who might have missed the Vault Edition would as well. Any purchase of vintage material only solidifies the argument that there is still a market for the vintage material and belittles the shelf space argument from Disney execs.

I am not debating the need for the unreleased material. I agree the material should be made available. I'm just tired of people repeating rumors as facts and providing misinformation about the material.

If Disney decided to release a version of this film while at the same time doing what they can to keep that release from the general public and then others continue that process but not providing full information on how to obtain that product all we are doing is enabling the Disney execs to keep telling us that there really isn't a market for this material.

Disney isn't looking at the marketing profits from the laserdisc releases or the older VHS releases, they are going to be looking at current market trends. They are virtually hiding and not promoting releases of vintage material. It's no mistake that their general promos on their DVD releases make no use of material pre-Little Mermaid. It's no mistake that pre-Little Mermaid programming is gone from Disney Channel and Toon Disney. It's going to be up to us when a release like that is made to make everyone else aware of it and provide full information on how to obtain it.

I'm also frustrated at re-buying vintage material simply to show support of said material especially when the vintage bonus material on the previous discs are replaced with pop remakes of songs, games and unrelated newly made mini documentaries At the same time I know they are just looking for arguments against making this material available.

There are arguments here about complaining about spending $50 for the Zorro sets which contained 6 discs or less than 10 dollars a disc as a reason for the slow sale of the Zorro Treasures. Yet we argue for more $30 releases of 2 disc sets. The truth is that the sales are slow because we didn't support the release. We keep saying we want the material, but when it's released, a lot of us aren't buying them.

They are no sooner released and they turn up in the newsgroups and in private forums where they are very popular as free downloads but if we don't buy them we don't give Disney a reason to release more of them.

[merlinjones]

>>I am not debating the need for the unreleased material. I agree the material should be made available. I'm just tired of people repeating rumors as facts and providing misinformation about the material.<<

>>There are arguments here about complaining about spending $50 for the Zorro sets which contained 6 discs or less than 10 dollars a disc as a reason for the slow sale of the Zorro Treasures. Yet we argue for more $30 releases of 2 disc sets. The truth is that the sales are slow because we didn't support the release. We keep saying we want the material, but when it's released, a lot of us aren't buying them.<<

Ironically, it seems this is misinformation about "Zorro".

Amazon and Best Buy are completely sold out of Vol. 1 already after a mere three months, unable to reorder -- and prices are soaring on the secondary market proving there is still unsatisfied demand. For my part, I bought both the first day out!

Viva Senor Zorro! Viva Walt Disney!

See for yourself:

http://www.amazon.com/Walt-Disney-Treasures-Complete-Season/dp/B0029R81BC/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=dvd&qid=1267237265&sr=1-1

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Walt+Disney ... lp=11&cp=1

[disneyrecordfan]

My point was to state that the person who posted the previous info about this set, left out a lot of information. Stating it's available only through an 800 number without providing the rest of the number is fruitless. Providing the entire number, which they must have had access to since they purchased it, would give access to information that otherwise is not available.

Kaijueguy, you're referencing one of my earlier posts in this thread. I did not list the 800 number in this thread's discussion because there is another thread specifically about this new line of Disney DVDs and I didn't want to be accused of being a Disney shill (I'm not) by plugging it in a thread outside the one specifically about this new line. For this Treasures discussion thread, I only wondered if this new DVD line could be an evolution or a morphing/blending with the Treasures because of the same tin-style release with booklets just like the Treasures. Sorry if you were confused by not providing more details in this Treasures discussion; here's the URL, and it's currently living on page 3 of the forum's threads:

http://www.ultimatedisney.com/forum/vie ... hp?t=26173

If you'll read the discussion there, you'll see that the commercials for this new line were seen by others, as well as me, and it appears that I'm the only person who signed up for this new line, or the only one who has posted about it. Like you I tend to like all the versions of the films I love. I also have shared your frustration at liking these films after buying new versions to encourage more releases, but Disney doesn't seem to promote them more for who knows what reason. In fact, this discussion is one of the few times I've ever posted to this forum just because I couldn't believe that this new line was being launched in such an inauspicious way.

I encourage you to look at the Disney Signature Edition thread to see more, including the toll-free # I listed there because it was germane to the discussion for THAT thread. I only linked to scanned images of my "Swiss Family" set because I had errors when I tried to upload the images directly to the thread. If you will private message me and give me your contact info, I'll be glad to email you the scans if you would like to see the images of the new "Swiss Family" tin that I now own.

I can assure you that this release is not a rumor or misinformation. This is a new line that has only been advertised in a few states, from what I can put together, and who knows why Disney hasn't promoted it more. I can understand, though, why you might think someone's making it up, because you'd have to see it to believe it and then wonder why Disney's not promoting this more, UNLESS, as it has been theorized to me by a few friends on the Disney inside (not employees of the home video division), perhaps Disney is testing a soft launch to gauge public reaction in new venues previously untried, i.e., like Time-Warner releases.

As a matter of fact, the second title came today, "The Apple Dumpling Gang," and I'll be posting more information about this second release in this new tin set on the other thread.

[disneyrecordfan]

One more comment about this quote from Kaijueguy:

"If Disney decided to release a version of this film while at the same time doing what they can to keep that release from the general public and then others continue that process but not providing full information on how to obtain that product all we are doing is enabling the Disney execs to keep telling us that there really isn't a market for this material."


Candidly, I was surprised by the relatively few comments or interest regarding any of the discussion about the new Wonderful World of Disney Signature Edition on these message boards. You'll see 87 pages about "The Princess and the Frog," granted, a contemporary film, or a lot of comments about "how many DVDs you own," or "the best character from Mulan," etc., so I wasn't sure if folks just weren't interested in "Swiss Family Robinson," not sure what to think since Disney is only advertising this series on reruns of "Jack Benny" or on TVLand at 3 am, or if at age 38, I'm just "too old" for this forum, since it does seem as though there are a lot of 15 and 19-year-olds posting, not that there's anything wrong with that.

I've read many other threads on these forums, and I wish there were 100 more Merlin Joneses posting than those who are excited about Hannah Montana! (He even got attacked recently here by a Hannah Montana fan who couldn't see his point of the need to support Walt-era films!)

Merlin Jones, in this forum, and elsewhere on the web, has posted so many things I've thought or talked about with my Disney friends, most of whom are older than 40 and remember Disney theatrical rereleases or the anthology series. He has observed that current Disney management seems to have given up on keeping the older material relevant. Not keeping it introduced to new generations risks making it irrelevant.

There's a reason why 12-year-olds today probably do know the 50-year-old "Andy Griffith Show" or the 60-year-old "I Love Lucy" but do not know "Our Miss Brooks" or "Car 54, Where Are You." The first two shows live on via reruns and syndication. The others don't, meaning they're most definitely forgotten.

As a kid in the 1970s, I usually wasn't aware that "Swiss Family Robinson" or "The Parent Trap" were released a decade before I was born. I didn't care; they were accessible and I loved them. Circa 1985-1988, I discovered many more Disney films I had never seen when they were released to the white clamshell videos: ""Thomasina," "Summer Magic," etc.

Merlin Jones, you, me and at least a few are others are very, very saddened that movies that Walt worked on can be dismissed by 30-something marketing guys who are commanded to focus more on promoting "Hannah Montana" or who just don't care about the older stuff.

If there's been one positive development, though, for the last two years, I have been delighted that Disney consented to allow its older films to be shown on TCM. I had encountered many younger folks who had concluded in the absence of any other information that only MGM or Warners had made any "classic" live-action films because they had never encountered ANY of them other than "Mary Poppins." When TCM or Hallmark show "Moon Pilot" or "Son of Flubber," at least they're represented where someone young MAY discover them for the first time and then be compelled to buy them on DVD.

So, there are some of us who share your frustration. Just not enough of us, unfortunately, to make a sales dent, or not enough of us in positions at Disney to advocate mass marketing awareness of older titles if they do get released. In the 1990s, Disney did run commercials for the VHS releases of "Old Yeller" and the "Hayley Mills" collections; maybe a few for the "Vault Disney" DVD releases in 2001, but it's fairly safe to conclude that they must not have sold enough of them per some sales formula to warrant any kind of marketing campaign in the future.

As I noted in a previous post in the Signature DVD thread, I've had friends see "Big Red" on my shelf and wonder why they didn't know that was on DVD. They wanted to get a copy because they remembered loving it as a child. Very sad that Disney doesn't get that.

Kudos to WB and Universal for their on-demand DVD releases so fans can at least own some of those studios' classic titles!

Last, if you learn more about this new Wonderful World of Disney Signature DVD series and think it should be promoted more, I encourage you to talk it up to the Disney bloggers who care or are in a position to influence others. I think Disney's odd marketing strategy on this one is at least worth attention outside this forum, regardless of the general consensus about the releases themselves. It has been very strange to see these beautifully produced TV commercials with Walt and then to get the first two releases and know that I'm probably one of about 15 in the whole country who has even responded to the few ads that have been shown. I hope it's not to prove some marketing guru's point of, "See, we advertised these a direct order on TV and they didn't even sell!"

[merlinjones]

From what you are saying (I've not seen any of the commercials myself), this new tin collection seems to be about the remarketing of existing, already accessible popular feature titles in the direct-market -- a very good idea, but not the same thing as the Treasures.

The only thing these lines seem to have in common is that they both come in a can.

Walt Disney Treasures is about material from the Walt era titles that hasn't yet been made available - - and it's a line that appears to sell itself to 30,000 film and Disney buffs even if the public is unaware of it. Consequently, I'd hope this line would continue or be licensed out to a third party like Anchor Bay, MPI or Shout Factory as long as viable collections remain unreleased.

I certainly agree Warner and Universal seem ahead of the game with their classic "on demand" archive DVDs - - I hope Walt's heirs try to make something like that work as well, especially with the types of exclusive titles they have been releasing through the Movie Club.

[Mouseketodd]

...Merlin Jones, in this forum, and elsewhere on the web, has posted so many things I've thought or talked about with my Disney friends, most of whom are older than 40 and remember Disney theatrical rereleases or the anthology series. He has observed that current Disney management seems to have given up on keeping the older material relevant. Not keeping it introduced to new generations risks making it irrelevant.

There's a reason why 12-year-olds today probably do know the 50-year-old "Andy Griffith Show" or the 60-year-old "I Love Lucy" but do not know "Our Miss Brooks" or "Car 54, Where Are You." The first two shows live on via reruns and syndication. The others don't, meaning they're most definitely forgotten.

As a kid in the 1970s, I usually wasn't aware that "Swiss Family Robinson" or "The Parent Trap" were released a decade before I was born. I didn't care; they were accessible and I loved them. Circa 1985-1988, I discovered many more Disney films I had never seen when they were released to the white clamshell videos: ""Thomasina," "Summer Magic," etc....

If there's been one positive development, though, for the last two years, I have been delighted that Disney consented to allow its older films to be shown on TCM. I had encountered many younger folks who had concluded in the absence of any other information that only MGM or Warners had made any "classic" live-action films because they had never encountered ANY of them other than "Mary Poppins." When TCM or Hallmark show "Moon Pilot" or "Son of Flubber," at least they're represented where someone young MAY discover them for the first time and then be compelled to buy them on DVD....

disneyrecordfan, I applaud your comments!! For a long time, I've thought the same as you and merlinjones that as Disney fails to expose the current TV generation to vintage movies and programs, consumer knowledge and appreciation of these titles will eventually dry up.

I plan to call the toll-free number for the WWOD Vintage Movie Collection for more details regarding commitment: I hope I can return an unwanted title without having to cancel my membership. I would hope for extra content on DVD titles like Follow Me, Boys! and Big Red, but I have no interest in -- actually, I have no disposable cash for -- double-dipping movies that have already been released with outstanding bonus features.

[kaijueguy]

Thanks for all the clarification!

I checked the other forum link and I'll be making a phone call.

I agree this isn't the same as the Treasures set but I still think if enough interest is generated in this type of thing it helps secure future Treasures releases.

[merlinjones]

>>I agree this isn't the same as the Treasures set but I still think if enough interest is generated in this type of thing it helps secure future Treasures releases.<<

One aspect of the Walt Disney library that there is always interest in is classic animation - - that said, potential Treasures sets such as Ludwig VonDrake, Ranger Woodlore/Humphrey, Jiminy Cricket, Chip an Dale, Donald Duck on TV or the Magic Mirror really have no down side.

[gardener14]

Candidly, I was surprised by the relatively few comments or interest regarding any of the discussion about the new Wonderful World of Disney Signature Edition on these message boards.

I'm extremely interested in classic Disney live-action films, but I have no interest in double dipping just for a tin. I'm sure many fans are in the same situation...they already own these titles. That's why I (and I assume others) haven't commented much on this new marketing campaign for pre-existing titles.

[disneyrecordfan]

I don't disagree - I'm not a fan of the double-dipping, either. What I'm surprised about is Disney's marketing approach. The fact that they're running TV commercials with Walt - is this going to last, is it a "test," a new approach? I'd like to have seen "Vault Disney" or some of the other classic live-action titles promoted in a better way.

The other surprising aspect is that very few people seem to have heard of the new line at all. So I'm curious if that means Disney is burying the commercials or just showing them in limited markets, etc.

In terms of the release, well, I'm a big "Swiss Family" fan, and I can say that even though I did double-dip - from curiosity to see what this line was about - I would have rather had the movie come in a tin, with its booklet, with a movie poster reproduction, and the two pins - than the way the film was first released. It's just a nicer way of showcasing the titles. But it is double-dipping, to be sure.

[Flanger-Hanger]

I have not heard of or seen the commercials, although if they are out there than that is a good thing. Are they posted online somewhere?

[merlinjones]

In case anyone has forgotten, here's what should go in the Walt Disney Treasures: Ludwig Von Drake DVD set:

Walt Disney's Wonderful World of Color (one hour TV shows):

An Adventure in Color/Mathmagic Land (24 September 1961)
The Hunting Instinct (22 October 1961)  
Inside Donald Duck (5 November 1961)  
Kids Is Kids (10 December 1961)  
Carnival Time (4 March 1962)
Von Drake in Spain (8 April 1962)  
Man Is His Own Worst Enemy (21 October 1962)  
Three Tall Tales (6 January 1963)
Inside Outer Space (2 February 1963)
A Square Peg in a Round Hole (3 March 1963)  
Fly with Von Drake (13 October 1963)  
The Truth About Mother Goose (17 November 1963)  
In Shape with Von Drake (22 March 1964)  
A Rag, a Bone, a Box of Junk (11 October 1964)  
Music for Everybody (30 January 1966)
A Salute to Alaska (2 April 1967)

Theatrical Featurette:

A Symposium on Popular Songs (1962)

Records:

Professor Ludwig Von Drake (Disneyland LP)

Twistin' With Professor Ludwig Von Drake (The Von Drake Quake) (BV Single)

What would you prefer for the Ludwig VonDrake "Walt Disney's Wonderful World of Color" set - - variant blue, red and green (the colors of the TV cathode ray tube) tins - - or one tin with all three bands of color?

[Flanger-Hanger]

What would you prefer for the Ludwig VonDrake "Walt Disney's Wonderful World of Color" set - - variant blue, red and green (the colors of the TV cathode ray tube) tins - - or one tin with all three bands of color?

I think I'll be boring and go for silver for the outside, but wouldn't mind a tastefully done blue/red/green mix for the inside of the tin.

[merlinjones]

Personally, I care specifically about the DVD content rather than the tin, but maybe the marketers would get more excited if there were multiple color tins to "collect."

[Flanger-Hanger]

Personally, I care specifically about the DVD content rather than the tin, but maybe the marketers would get more excited if there were multiple color tins to "collect."

Possibly, especially if there was more to the packaging that made the sets different. However I would still buy only one.