Beauty and the Beast: Diamond Edition (October 5th!)

[The_Iceflash]

I really don't know what you guys are talking about, the pages aren't pink on my TV when I play it. TV calibration perhaps?

That's because the whole image is grey-ish/pink, and there are no real whites in the film anymore.

If you compare it with the original image you can clearly see the difference.

Nope.

[2099net]

See, he's the Best Picture Oscar-nominated director, and we're the fanboys with the internet connections.

And it's the film with "WHITE bookpages" that got him the oscar nomination.

And people who own the Blu-ray had themselves reported the pages are WHITE on the new Blu-ray.

[Marky_198]

THIS is the version that the world loves, that got the oscar nominations and that would be perfect to have:

http://www.disney.co.uk/DisneyDVDs/DVDs ... -beast.jsp


They used the untampered version for trailers.

[yukitora]

I don't think most of 'the world' really cares.
btw, did you notice the pink/greyness of Mrs Potts and Chip in that video you posted?

[pap64]

See, he's the Best Picture Oscar-nominated director, and we're the fanboys with the internet connections.

And it's the film with "WHITE bookpages" that got him the oscar nomination.

So basically you are saying that the reason the movie got a best picture nomination was not because of its stunning music, wonderful characters and enchanting love story. It was the "correct" colors that earned the movie the honor of being the first animated movie to be nominated for a best picture award...

And yes, claiming that the whole world wants to see the original colors is an exaggeration. The whole world saw the movie the first time and loved it. The whole world bought the movie on DVD and they loved it, new colors be damned. And now the whole world will buy the Blu-Ray because they loved the film.

No matter how hard you try to convince yourself and others about how important the colors are, Beauty and the Beast is beloved because IT'S A FREAKING GREAT MOVIE! We loved it when it was in dark colors, we loved it in the red DVD colors and now we will love it with the Blu-Ray colors.

[Elladorine]

Pink pages? Well, let's not forget the green lightning.

[Marky_198]

So basically you are saying that the reason the movie got a best picture nomination was not because of its stunning music, wonderful characters and enchanting love story.
.

No, it's everything together, with the look and colors and atmosphere being a huge part of the feeling an audience gets from a film, but I'm sure I don't need to explain that to you.

Removing that is just as important as removing a song or a part of the story.

Everything that looks different from what the oscar judges saw back then, is not oscar worthy anymore.

[SpringHeelJack]

...I'll take this one.

[Escapay]

That's the wrong picture, Brends. It's too clear and sharp. You need the one that's smaller, blurrier, and faded.

albert

[Mr. Yagoobian]

Nope. No pink pages. And Belle's a brunette.

But what do I know, I'm only watching on a calibrated TV. I'm sure I could monkey with my settings and turn that book red yellow green red blue blue blue red purple green yellow orange red--red. Red yellow green red blue blue blue red purple green yellow orange red--red. Blend them up and what do you get? Cerise, chartreuse and aqua, mauve, beige and ultramarine and every color in between--color has its harmony and just like I have said: red yellow green red blue pink gray and white and red and blue green...plaid...wait wait wait whatever happened to plain old lavender blue dilly dilly dilly...dilly?

[Elladorine]

I've got the green with envy blues.

[jpanimation]

What exactly was Don Hahn's words supposed to reassure me about?

That the colors are in fact close to what the filmmakers wanted them to be on the Blu-ray? That the Laserdisc and VHS actually were wrong?

Well, I'm not arguing whether or not these are truly the colors the filmmakers currently prefer. I'm only saying that the LaserDisc and VHS were accurate depictions of the original theatrical colors and that this is their new preferred color scheme. If anything, Don Hahn just put an end to those goof balls who have been trying to tell me the LaserDisc didn't represent what I saw in theaters and that this new version does.

That no matter who comes to weigh in on the 'problem', you still believe whatever you want to believe, apparently. It would be just as easy for Mr. Hahn to say that they've tweaked the colors a bit to make it more modern (most filmmakers say that when they've tweaked them), but he didn't. He said that these are closer to the original. Why wouldn't you believe him?

He said these new colors represent their original intent, not what was shown in theaters or what was on the CAPS files. I'm only saying that since no one can actually see their intent, since it's all in their heads, that they can make the colors whatever the want them to be. I'm only repeating the facts he said in his statement (which means I believe what he's saying, since I'm using it as fact), not arguing against any of it. I'm not sure why you're so hell bent on fabricating an argument.

Because you're already convinced the new version is inferior to the Laserdisc, whatever anyone else says.

The new version is inferior, but that's all opinion. I'm not sure how an opinion can be wrong and why someone needs to convince me that I enjoy the wrong colors. Shouldn't I be allowed to have preferences without the filmmakers approving or should I only like what the filmmakers like? Why is it a bad thing I have personal preferences?

Just out of curiosity, could you quote me exactly where I stated that Don Hahn is wrong and that I am right?

[yukitora]

I used to think the shirt said

"you don't understand"
-marky.


Once again we see people relying on unreliable screenshots for the basis of their complaints.

[SpringHeelJack]

Actually, you're correct- there's two shirts. One that says that and the one as pictured above. I think "You don't understand" --Marky was the original one based on something he said, and the second shirt was the natural response.

[TacoBravo]

Why do you assume cash is the motivator?

Because otherwise Id would have to assume don hahn doesnt know what hes doing. I think he does.

Do you think people are buying Beauty and the Beast on DVD/Blu-ray because of the colours (which let's face it the average purchaser won't see until they buy the actual disc) or because of the movie? Do you think "changing" the colours will bump up sales by a significant percentage? Do you think people who previously ignored Beauty and the Beast are now queuing up to purchase the Dimond Edition?

Yes.
The new generation wouldnt like the looks of older animated movies from disney or don bluth etc. If disney was in charge of restoring the land before time or all dogs go to heaven all the colors would be Dora the explorerized aswell.

He has no reason to lie. None what-so-ever. It's only your own sense of importance to the issue that has made you consider it a big event worthy of lying over. It is no conspiracy and no catastrophe capable of bringing Disney to it's knees.

You really do live in a magical world if you dont think money could ever change anyones motivations.

Like the other directors I mentioned he could easily have admitted "yeah, we changed the colours. We prefer the new look" if that's why he did it. And it wouldn't have affected anyone except a small, minute, portion of the buyers.

Ok before we go further I need to know what the actual position of the disney apologists is.
Is it. The 'restoration' is the original intent of the movie, but is different from the theater/LD/VHS.
Or is it. The 'restoration' is what it looked like in the theater.

If its the latter then smh. You can be fed some story don han will give you but theres no way you could believe that they didnt take alot of liberties with subsequent transfers.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dft0FDfg_S0
If its the former then you'd be pretty gullible to believe that the original animators were that stupid with the equipment to somehow botch up the theater transfer sooo bad that it looks nothing like what the 'original intent' was supposed to. Apparently lighting/shadows, brown colored hair was not at all possible in 1991 lol.

[Lorddh]

wow, I can't believe people are still arguing about the dam colors...

Funny how people can act like CHILDREN!

[stitchje1981]

wow, I can't believe people are still arguing about the dam colors...

Funny how people can act like CHILDREN!

Well I saw BATB last night on blu for the first time and I didn't see anything funny about the colors: the pages were white, the sheep brown, etc...

Lol, just don't read it Lorddh
Just relax and move on
Ignore the post you think are not worth reading

[2099net]

The new generation wouldnt like the looks of older animated movies from disney or don bluth etc. If disney was in charge of restoring the land before time or all dogs go to heaven all the colors would be Dora the explorerized aswell.

Nonsense. Are you saying the Blu-ray releases of Pinocchio and Snow White and Dumbo look like Dora the Explorer?

He has no reason to lie. None what-so-ever. It's only your own sense of importance to the issue that has made you consider it a big event worthy of lying over. It is no conspiracy and no catastrophe capable of bringing Disney to it's knees.

You really do live in a magical world if you dont think money could ever change anyones motivations.

Disney don't need to do anything to make Beauty and the Beast sell more. All they need to do is take if off the market and bring it back with a big marketing hooh-hah every half-generation or so and it sells itself.

I can tell you now, most of the sales will be impulse purchases from people picking up the title from seeing it in store displays combined with competitive pricing. The fact most DACs have such competitive pricing deal when released shows how much in demand they are.

Colours have very little to do with it. Statements made by the filmmakers regarding the colours buried away and all-but inaccesible until the product is purchased must have an infinitely tiny influence on buyers. Of course he didn't have to lie (or indeed, say anything).

Like the other directors I mentioned he could easily have admitted "yeah, we changed the colours. We prefer the new look" if that's why he did it. And it wouldn't have affected anyone except a small, minute, portion of the buyers.

Ok before we go further I need to know what the actual position of the disney apologists is.
Is it. The 'restoration' is the original intent of the movie, but is different from the theater/LD/VHS.
Or is it. The 'restoration' is what it looked like in the theater.

Well, I think its important to separate marketing-speak from what words really mean. Disney marketing often misuses the word "restoration". That is part of selling the product which I agree is wrong.

However, correct me if I'm wrong, but did Mr Han actually say the word "restoration" or did he simply say the new release gave them the opportunity to present the film with the colours they thought they originally would have when making the movie?

I don't think he is saying this is a restoration - he's saying its a way for them to revisit the film. And as I said before, it their choice and their right to do so, because they made the film in the first place!

The two are two totally different issues.

If its the latter then smh. You can be fed some story don han will give you but theres no way you could believe that they didnt take alot of liberties with subsequent transfers.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dft0FDfg_S0
If its the former then you'd be pretty gullible to believe that the original animators were that stupid with the equipment to somehow botch up the theater transfer sooo bad that it looks nothing like what the 'original intent' was supposed to. Apparently lighting/shadows, brown colored hair was not at all possible in 1991 lol.

You know the DVD/Blu-ray source is the IMAX re-release, complete with some changes to the artwork.

You know, David Fincher personally oversees the transfer of all his films to DVD/Blu-ray, including colour timing. So do many other directors. It's just Fincher makes a big issue of saying so in the publicity for the home video release.

Notice how Fincher's Se7en is different on the Allience Blu-ray (unsupervised) compared to the Warner Brothers Blu-ray (supervised)

http://www.dvdbeaver.com/film2/DVDRevie ... lu-ray.htm


Now, don't you think that that means

* It's pretty common for home video transfers to get colour timing wrong - much more common than you would think

after all, if transfering a film to home format is just a case of pressing a few buttons, why would the director(s) get involved in the first place, and therefore

* The majority of home video has incorrect colour timing?

Look at comparisons on the DVDBeaver website, such as this
http://www.dvdbeaver.com/film3/dvd_revi ... nferno.htm

Who's to say which "colours" are right? There's some shots dramatically different, but would anyone know if they only saw (for example) the Anchor Bay Region 1 DVD?

Clicking around the DVD Beaver website and looking at various comparisons (especially DVD to DVD comparisons) is very eye-opening!

If transferring a finished film to home video can result in so many variations, its perfectly possible transferring the CAPS files to film on BatB's original release had similar foreseen and unforeseen issues?

[Elladorine]

Once again, does anyone know how extremely difficult it is to print out digitally-generated images onto physical media and match the colors correctly? Any experts wanna raise their hands? Most likely the difficulties behind the original colors with the film was due to the differences between RGB (additive) and CMYK (subtractive) colors.

Computer monitors emit light, while printed media absorbs and reflects light. RGB and CMYK both have their limits in the visual spectrum, but their ranges are not the same. Artwork produced on a monitor is RGB and must be converted to CMYK at the printing stage, and will most likely not match in color due to their differing limitations.

The original theatrical release of Beauty and the Beast had to be transferred to physical media on a relatively new system with little time to spare. And once it was printed on film, subsequent transfers relied on that physical media with the different set of limitations than seen on the original monitors. The current stance is that now they are able to go back to the CAPS files and recreate the colors as originally seen on their monitors, before they became filtered and compromised by a rushed film transfer.

People can argue all they like over which version they prefer, I really have no beef with that. But I think it's disrespectful to claim there's some kind of conspiracy going on. If that were the case, Disney would be finding excuses to alter all their films into the so-called Dora the Explorer colors, from Snow White to Peter Pan to The Little Mermaid. The negativity over the colors here is ruining this thread to the point that I don't even want to click on it anymore.

[Escapay]

Well said, netty and Sunny.

BTW, the thread has one good thing going for it that makes it worth clicking amidst the color warriors duking it out.

Milk Buds galore!



albert