The Forum vs. Hannah Montana

[blackcauldron85]

http://tommy2.net/content/?p=15246

Yesterday the new Miley Cyrus single, Can’t Be Tamed premiered on her official MySpace [ http://www.myspace.com/mileycyrus ]. You can’t help but wonder since it skipped Radio Disney are they going to pass on the single? One thing also worth noting is the track credits BG5’s Brooke Adams for backing vocals. Miley’s new album, Can’t Be Tamed, will released on June 22nd and will be available in CD and CD/DVD editions.

There are so many CDs coming out in June- I need to save my money!!! I like the song- it'll have to grow on me more, but I do like it! If Radio Disney is passing on the single, I wonder if it's because Miley says "hell," and the song is more risqué than her other music?

[DisneyFan09]

http://tommy2.net/content/?p=15246

Yesterday the new Miley Cyrus single, Can’t Be Tamed premiered on her official MySpace [ http://www.myspace.com/mileycyrus ]. You can’t help but wonder since it skipped Radio Disney are they going to pass on the single? One thing also worth noting is the track credits BG5’s Brooke Adams for backing vocals. Miley’s new album, Can’t Be Tamed, will released on June 22nd and will be available in CD and CD/DVD editions.

There are so many CDs coming out in June- I need to save my money!!! I like the song- it'll have to grow on me more, but I do like it! If Radio Disney is passing on the single, I wonder if it's because Miley says "hell," and the song is more risqué than her other music?

Sorry for being negative, but with the exception of "When I Look At You" and the passable "Party in the US", Miley's songs has went downhill lately. Sorry

[blackcauldron85]

http://music-mix.ew.com/2010/04/30/mile ... ed-single/
(via tommy2.net)

...will release the video for new single “Can’t Be Tamed,” from the upcoming album of the same name, on Tuesday, May 4 via E!

[blackcauldron85]

Miley Cyrus Breaks Free In 'Can't Be Tamed' Video
http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/163843 ... iley.jhtml
(via disneyreport.com)

I love it! I'm happy that she's able to transition to a more adult entertainer; I mean, she's not always going to be boxed into the good Disney girl mold, and hopefully she'll have a really long career ahead of her.

[ajmrowland]

I'll say one word: Finally!


And the comments spout the usual: think of the children, she's a slut, just like other pop stars, blah blah blah, wah, wah, wah, etc, etc.

[pap64]

Cyrus Alcohol and Sex Scandals in 3...2...1...



Just kidding. I don't care for Miley Cyrus, but I hope she doesn't fall into the same traps as previous Disney starlets have.

[Goliath]

Miley Cyrus Breaks Free In 'Can't Be Tamed' Video

I love it! I'm happy that she's able to transition to a more adult entertainer; I mean, she's not always going to be boxed into the good Disney girl mold, and hopefully she'll have a really long career ahead of her.

As a man, I think it's sad to see one woman praising another woman for being sexualized for fame and money.

Look, the only reason why girls like Miley Cyrus go the route of sexy outfits, kinky positions, and provocative lyrical/video content, is because they can't sing. It happened to Britney Spears before her, and then Lindsay Lohan and God knows how many other (formerly) teen stars: eventually they discover that the kiddies aren't going to buy their records forever, because they grow up and realize they (the teen stars) don't have any talent. So what do you do when you can't hold the attention of the audience with your music? You go 'adult' and you put out!

Female artists who can really sing and perform and who have a genuine talent, don't have to use their bodies to gain attention.

I am by no means prudish or a puritan (that's something all people on this forum can attest to), but I think it's an unhealthy message we're giving young girls nowadays: "if you want to be a grown up; if you want to be taken seriously; if you want to be treated like an adult, you have to sell your body." If Miley *really* wanted to be taken seriously and let go of her 'girly' image, she could have considered making mature music. Doing away with the childish lyrics and cheap pop tunes. *That* would have shown growth. But no, she's putting out, like all the bimbo's before her.

*Yawn* In a year or two, she'll have crashed, been burn out and been forgotten.

(Edited for typo's.)

[Sotiris]

If Miley *really* wanted to be taken seriously and let go of her 'girly' image, she could have considered making mature music. Doing away with the childish lyrics and cheap pop tunes. *That* would have shown growth.

[ajmrowland]

After Goliath's comment, I've got a few things to say:

1. he's right about the image thing, though there are much worse than Miley when it comes to talent.

2. Being optimistic, but the slutty ship hasn't sailed quite yet. There may be hope for her.

3. Dont catch me singing in the shower. I'm not great nor bad, but you'll probably say something I might be offended by.

[Duckburger]

At a certain point every Disney star tries to make it on their own without Disney's backing. All the former ones still famous to this day have... umm... a mugshot, the rest reside in obscurity.

If you look at actual amounts, few make it work afterwards. Mostly because they're talented, for as much as that can be defined. Lindsay actually *had* other talent, not the singing though - but I do believe Miley can sing, but the acting just isn't going to work after her Hannah Montana days. The singing could definitely work, a la Britney Spears, sans headshaving, rehab and K-Fed.

Two words pretty much sum my post up. Crazy. Parent(s).

[blackcauldron85]

As a man, I think it's sad to see one woman praising another woman for being sexualized for fame and money.

I knew I was going to get some flack for my thoughts. I'm more praising her for going the route that she wants to. Even a year ago, if she put out this video, I'd be like, "Wow, I can't believe her parents let her do this," but she'll be an adult soon. It's not like she was stripping or anything. I mean, she showed a little more skin, but Britney and Christina were at this age, too. I don't think that the video was trashy or anything, which it could have been (child star transitioning into adult performer). I think that the song and the video are great. I think that, especially as a product of the Disney machine (which I am a huge fan of), Miley could've had a hard time of being taken seriously when it comes to her post-Hannah career.

I think that Miley has so much talent, and I'd like her to have a career for a long time, if that's what she wants. She has said recently that this will be her last album for a while, because she wants to focus on movies. I mean, 17 is an awkward age to begin with, so maybe by the time she comes out with music as an adult, it will be more mature.

Look, the only reason why girls like Miley Cyrus go the route of sexy outfits, kinky positions, and provocative lyrical/video content, is because they can't sing. It happened to Britney Spears before her, and then Lindsay Lohan and God knows how many other (formerly) teen stars: eventually they discover that the kiddies aren't going to buy their records forever, because they grow up and realize they (the teen stars) don't have any talent. So what do you do when you can't hold the attention of the audience with your music? You go 'adult' and you put out!

1. Miley can sing. Very, very well.
2. I hope that Miley doesn't go the alcohol/drug/sleezy route that Britney and Lindsay did (and I'm a fan of them). I hope that her parents have raised her well enough, and that she has enough self-respect, to stay away from things like that. I'd hate to see her go the bad-girl route. But dressing up a little doesn't mean that she's whored herself out.

Female artists who can really sing and perform and who have a genuine talent, don't have to use their bodies to gain attention.

*cough*Christina Aguilera*cough*

I'm a Christina fan, too, but hell, that girl shows skin and is provocative, and she has the best voice of this generation.

If Miley *really* wanted to be taken seriously and let go of her 'girly' image, she could have considered making mature music. Doing away with the childish lyrics and cheap pop tunes. *That* would have shown growth. But no, she's putting out, like all the bimbo's before her.

We haven't heard any other songs from her upcoming album, so who's to say that some of the music won't be more mature? And I think that "The Climb" is a pretty mature song (when it comes to Hannah Montana music, even though in the movie Miley Stewart sings it...oh the joys of explaining Hannah Montana, haha), and it was really successful. I think that there's definitely a balance to be had, of more serious songs, and fun dance songs that aren't as serious. The world would be a lot more boring without fun dance songs.

*Yawn* In a year or two, she'll have crashed, been burn out and been forgotten.

We'll see.

2. Being optimistic, but the slutty ship hasn't sailed quite yet. There may be hope for her.

I agree. I mean, I know that so many naysayers are just dying for that ship to sail, but just wait and see. She might surprise you. Or not. We don't know yet.

All the former ones still famous to this day have... umm... a mugshot, the rest reside in obscurity.

Not all fit into those categories. I mean, going back to the Mickey Mouse Club, at least the '90s version, we have Christina Aguilera, Ryan Gosling, Justin Timberlake, JC Chasez, others who have been trying to make a name for themselves, like Tony Lucca and Matt Morris, and Keri Russell was successful on Felicity. As for newer Disney stars, Hilary Duff was successful in her music career (I'm not sure if she's been resigned since leaving Hollywood Records), and while not as successful in her acting career as of late, she's still steadily working. And then you have some of the HSM actors: Zac Efron made the teen actor-to-adult actor transition very well. Corbin Bleu has been having a successful Broadway run. Vanessa Hudgens' acting career hasn't been awesome since HSM, but with Beastly coming out, that could change. Both Drew Seeley and Lucas Grabeel have had some acting success, and Ashley Tisdale is still doing acting and music. And they don't have mugshots, and I wouldn't call them obscure.

[estefan]

At a certain point every Disney star tries to make it on their own without Disney's backing. All the former ones still famous to this day have... umm... a mugshot, the rest reside in obscurity.

If you look at actual amounts, few make it work afterwards. Mostly because they're talented, for as much as that can be defined.

Jodie Foster is probably the Disney child actor to have the best career afterwards. Critically, she is the most successful with her two Oscars and hits like Silence of the Lambs, Panic Room and Flightplan.

And despite a couple of run-ins with the law, Shia La Beouf is probably the one Disney Channel actor to make it big anywhere else. Though it helps that Spielberg is signing his paycheques, he actually is a talented actor and more people know him from Transformers and Indiana Jones rather than Even Stevens.

[Duckburger]

Well, of course "all" is not what I actually meant, and the HSM cast have forwarded their careers to post-Disney, can't argue with that. And Jodi Foster is definitely the best example there is. I was thinking more contemporary stars though, but even from those times there are a lot of child stars who didn't make it past the Disney stages. So, for every star who did exceptionally well, there's at least ten who didn't.

As for Shia LeBoeuf... mugshot. Yeah, sorry, like you said, run in with the law. I really don't like people who drive drunk. As for his groundbreaking movie career. Indie 4, Eagle Eye and the Transformers movies are hardly anything to brag about talent-wise, though I did like Disturbia. Its pretty much established that Spielberg <3's him, without that he probably would have never gotten so famous. I'm not a fan of his acting either, so not a big loss for me.

[Goliath]

Look out... long post coming through! I'm now discussing this topic in two threads; the other is in 'Movies, music and tv'. It would be better if we decided on *one* thread to continue. I leave it up to you.

2. Being optimistic, but the slutty ship hasn't sailed quite yet. There may be hope for her.

I wouldn't call her 'slutty'. Ever. No matter what she wears or how she behaves. In my opinion, 'slut' is a mysoginistic word that's being used by hypocritical males (mostly), as a means to keep women in line; to decide how a woman should or shouldn't dress or behave. If they don't obey, they'll be labeled 'sluts'. There's no male equivalent to the insult. A man can do whatever he pleases and never be called a similar thing.

So that's why I won't call her that. I was not attacking you, by the way, ajmrowland. Just some general thought I felt I should share before I continued the discussion.

I'm wondering how much of this 'new image' was really Miley's own decision. I think it's dangerous that some people on this board are applauding Miley for it, since we don't know whether it's something she wants, or if it's decided for her, by her father. She's only 17 years old and thus underage. And we've seen in the past what her father will do for money. He even exploited Miley's little sister. Go back a page or two and you'll find the horrible pictures of a 9 year old dressed up like a... Well, let's say with that outfit and those photo's made public, you wonder why they just didn't move next door to a registred sex offender and opened the windows at night...

I knew I was going to get some flack for my thoughts.

I hope you realize I wasn't attacking you personally.

I'm more praising her for going the route that she wants to. Even a year ago, if she put out this video, I'd be like, "Wow, I can't believe her parents let her do this," but she'll be an adult soon.

That's just my point: I'm not sure we can know this is her own decision. And even if it is, what does that say about her upbringing and her judgement that she thinks the only way to be 'mature' is to put out?

It's not like she was stripping or anything. I mean, she showed a little more skin, but Britney and Christina were at this age, too.

Yes, they were, but that doesn't mean that's a good thing, or an excuse. She (or her father) probably 'learned the trick' from Britney and Christina. And I would be a hypocrite if I denied that, to this day, I like the 'Baby hit me one more time'-clip. After Polizzi confessed his foot-fetish, I'm willing to confess I have a thing for the schoolgirl uniforms (*not* the schoolgirls themselves, of course!). But does that mean I think it's appropriate to dress up like that to sell your music? No. Remember, that was Britney's first hit, and after that it even got more suggestive. Like I said, I'm not a prude and I will never say to a woman how to dress or behave, but I just think it sends the wrong messages to teenage girls about 'how to be taken seriously'.

I think that, especially as a product of the Disney machine (which I am a huge fan of), Miley could've had a hard time of being taken seriously when it comes to her post-Hannah career.

But how seriously do you think she'll be taken with this new song and videoclip? Don't you think people are going to say: "oh, there's yet another former teen star who thinks she's going to make it big by posing in sexy outfits"? There have already been so many of them. Why not make a mature *song*? Mature lyrics, mature sound. I know it's hard to pull that off if you're only 17. You haven't really lived by then. Maybe she should just wait a little longer.

1. Miley can sing. Very, very well.

Everybody has different tastes, but I think we can establish what's good singing and what's not. Miley sounds good because they've run her voice through the computer a zillion times to make it sound better; at least that's how I judge it. I would put her on the same level as your average American Idol-finalist. (I wouldn't want to be caught ever watching that program, but it's on when my sister's home, unfortunately.) Oh, and just so you know, that was not a compliment.

2. I hope that Miley doesn't go the alcohol/drug/sleezy route that Britney and Lindsay did (and I'm a fan of them). I hope that her parents have raised her well enough, and that she has enough self-respect, to stay away from things like that. I'd hate to see her go the bad-girl route. But dressing up a little doesn't mean that she's whored herself out.

Do you remember her pole-dancing during a show aimed at teenagers? Including the half-dressed dancers in the background? Hvae you seen how she behaves in the 'Party in the USA' clip? (Again, I curse my sister!) Do you think that shows self-respect? Have you seen how her father dressed up his 9 year old daughter? Do you think that's good parenting?

I'm a Christina fan, too, but hell, that girl shows skin and is provocative, and she has the best voice of this generation.

Then you've never heard Alicia Keys sing.

I think that there's definitely a balance to be had, of more serious songs, and fun dance songs that aren't as serious. The world would be a lot more boring without fun dance songs.

Oh, you're certainly right about that. I just wrote it to make a suggestion about how she could show maturity in another way, instead of putting out.

Not all fit into those categories. I mean, going back to the Mickey Mouse Club, at least the '90s version, [...] And they don't have mugshots, and I wouldn't call them obscure.

Not all of them are obscure. Justin Timberlake and Christina Aguilera have been succesfull. But most of the others... would anybody who doesn't follow 'that' circle know even half of those people? I mean, I don't know half of them. The ones I do know have starred in teen-oriented tv series, movies or made teen-pop music. In the bigger picture, that's still rather obscure.

[Disney's Divinity]

Miley sounds good because they've run her voice through the computer a zillion times to make it sound better; at least that's how I judge it. I would put her on the same level as your average American Idol-finalist. (I wouldn't want to be caught ever watching that program, but it's on when my sister's home, unfortunately.)

Glad you said "your average." That way I don't have to go on a rant of "You don't know what you're talking about...," etc. (But, really, don't ever watch this current season--it's the worst they've ever had).

But I agree about the other part. I always assumed the only time she sounded decent was when it was recorded, because the recorded version is not actually her. Not that that's a bad thing to me--if it sounds good on a CD, it sounds good. But I wouldn't call her a good singer. For example, I love Taylor Swift. I think she's a great songwriter and the tone of her voice can be very beautiful. But she's a really sucky singer. That's why I'll buy the CD and skip the concert.

Btw, I'm not putting down Miley. I'm really apathetic towards her. Though I think she has more personality than past Disney clones, I--from what I've seen of her--don't like how garrish her voice sounds. Have to admit I liked "The Climb" (even if I felt a little ashamed for feeling so... ).

Then you've never heard Alicia Keys sing.

I don't know, I think Christina has a better voice (and definitely more personality). Keys is definitely a great songwriter, but her voice is a bit bland. Almost like a demo. (Leona Lewis is the same way--no surprise, since she seems a bit like an Alicia clone)

[Goliath]

Glad you said "your average." That way I don't have to go on a rant of "You don't know what you're talking about...," etc.

I did that especially for you!

But I agree about...

You WHAT?!

But I agree about he other part. I always assumed the only time she sounded decent was when it was recorded, because the recorded version is not actually her. Not that that's a bad thing to me--if it sounds good on a CD, it sounds good. But I wouldn't call her a good singer. For example, I love Taylor Swift. I think she's a great songwriter and the tone of her voice can be very beautiful. But she's a really sucky singer. That's why I'll buy the CD and skip the concert.

You don't even have to have a good voice to be a good singer. You know I'm a big Bob Dylan-fan, but have you heard his voice? I would say he has a bad voice. It's a wonder he ever got to make even one record. But he knows how to use his voice to make the songs work. He can do *anything* with his bad voice. He can handle all genres, all sorts of songs, he can convey all kinds of moods and emotions. He can create beautiful imagery not only through his lyrics, but also with his voice. Now that's real talent. (Although I would stay away from his current live performances, if I were you.)

[blackcauldron85]

I hope you realize I wasn't attacking you personally.

I know.

I'm not sure we can know this is her own decision.

That's a good point. I'd like to think that she has more control over her career now to not do something she doesn't want to do...

But how seriously do you think she'll be taken with this new song and videoclip? Don't you think people are going to say: "oh, there's yet another former teen star who thinks she's going to make it big by posing in sexy outfits"? There have already been so many of them. Why not make a mature *song*? Mature lyrics, mature sound. I know it's hard to pull that off if you're only 17. You haven't really lived by then. Maybe she should just wait a little longer.

Some people may have the opinion that she's selling out, but you can't please everyone. As I said earlier, I love the song and the video, and I'm sure lots of other people do, too, and I'm sure that lots don't like it...Miley has talent to back up how she dresses, if that's an issue; she doesn't need to use her looks to get by. (But she is, someone says. Sex does sell. If she's okay with it and her parents are okay with it, then who are we to complain...?

Miley sounds good because they've run her voice through the computer a zillion times to make it sound better; at least that's how I judge it.

I've seen Miley live in concert twice- the girl can sing.

Do you remember her pole-dancing during a show aimed at teenagers?

She wasn't pole-dancing. If you watch the whole clip, she's holding on to the pole on the ice cream truck so she doesn't fall off, and she dips once. That's not really pole dancing, now is it?

[Goliath]

If she's okay with it and her parents are okay with it, then who are we to complain...?

I will never tell her how to dress or how to behave. That's not for a man to tell a woman. But I do hold an opinion on whether or not it's a good example to her audience of (teen) girls. And I think it's a bad example. Just my opinion.

I've seen Miley live in concert twice- the girl can sing.

Or did she playback, like Britney Spears?

She wasn't pole-dancing. If you watch the whole clip, she's holding on to the pole on the ice cream truck so she doesn't fall off, and she dips once. That's not really pole dancing, now is it?

The suggestion is there; that's enough. You don't have a pole on an ice cream truck for nothing. It's deliberately there. You have to see it in the context of the way she dressed and her background dancers. And at one point, she's on her knees, holding the pole. What's that all about?

By the way, I think you're great reacting the way you do while I'm trashing your favorite singer. I don't know if I could remain that friendly if somebody trashed Bob that way.

But then again, I don't think there are many possibilities to do that.

[blackcauldron85]

Thanks. And no, she wasn't lipsynching. I could tell.

***

http://tommy2.net/content/?p=15540

As of 5pm central time yesterday when you typed in Can’t be Tamed into the YouTube search, the video was not listed. However it was available through YouTube’s partner site VEVO and had 26,000 views. Later in the evening, YouTube updated their search queries to include the song on VIVO. Her previous video, Party In The USA, debuted on Hollywood Records YouTube account and had a million views by noon. Wonder how much money was lost by that mistake? I guess no one told the execs. how the ’subscribe’ feature works on YouTube.

Miley Cyrus Says 'Can't Be Tamed' Is Unlike 'Any Other Music Video'
http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/163865 ... tory.jhtml

[bruno_wbt]

I love her new music video. And I don't think it's slutty at all.

It's a sexy video in a smart way.