The Princess and the Frog Discussion - Part III

drnilescrane · Post by **drnilescrane** » Tue Nov 24, 2009 8:36 pm

Expect huge box office opening for 'The Princess and the Frog,' thanks to high ticket prices

As much as I'd hate to see another TLK record (gross vs. theatres) smashed into oblivion, PatF will destory TLK's $1,586,753 opening.

Babaloo · Post by **Babaloo** » Tue Nov 24, 2009 9:00 pm

Skippy, you're my hero

! And ignore anything I said about the soundtrack, I LOVE IT NOW! The more I hear it, the better it becomes.

I'm also loving how there's so many commercials in the US. I was worried since I live in Canada, and I haven't seen many (even on Family channel, which is our Disney channel). But it sounds like Disney is doing a good job in advertising it over there!

jpanimation · Post by **jpanimation** » Tue Nov 24, 2009 9:01 pm

Well I read all the reviews on Rotten Tomatoes and even the ones not on there (Time, SFChronicle, USAToday, LATimes and IGN 3/5). The general consensus seems to be the movie is too familiar, story never soars, the songs aren't memorable (as I thought from listening to them ahead of time), and some characters aren't very strong. From what I've gathered, this movie just seems to be average, neither ranked with the greats or the worse, just average.

I'm not as excited as before to go see it but I still want to judge it myself. Even if its just average I hope its earns enough to officially resurrect traditional animation.

pap64 · Post by **pap64** » Tue Nov 24, 2009 9:45 pm

jpanimation wrote:Well I read all the reviews on Rotten Tomatoes and even the ones not on there (Time, SFChronicle, USAToday, LATimes and IGN 3/5). The general consensus seems to be the movie is too familiar, story never soars, the songs aren't memorable (as I thought from listening to them ahead of time), and some characters aren't very strong. From what I've gathered, this movie just seems to be average, neither ranked with the greats or the worse, just average.

I'm not as excited as before to go see it but I still want to judge it myself. Even if its just average I hope its earns enough to officially resurrect traditional animation.

Um, what reviews have YOU read? All the reviews on RT have been glowing, save for one, calling the movie fresh, fun, lighthearted and more, the exact opposite of what you are saying. Care to post the exact quotes from those reviews?

Also, it seems that you have already made up your mind about the movie, so I doubt you watching it will do anything to change it.

nomad2010 · Post by **nomad2010** » Tue Nov 24, 2009 9:45 pm

jpanimation wrote:Well I read all the reviews on Rotten Tomatoes and even the ones not on there (Time, SFChronicle, USAToday, LATimes and IGN 3/5). The general consensus seems to be the movie is too familiar, story never soars, the songs aren't memorable (as I thought from listening to them ahead of time), and some characters aren't very strong. From what I've gathered, this movie just seems to be average, neither ranked with the greats or the worse, just average.

I'm not as excited as before to go see it but I still want to judge it myself. Even if its just average I hope its earns enough to officially resurrect traditional animation.

well from what i've read, it's a little better than average.

UPDATE: 3 New Reviews Added (All Positive)

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/1196003 ... _the_frog/

pap64 · Post by **pap64** » Tue Nov 24, 2009 9:47 pm

nomad2010 wrote:
jpanimation wrote:Well I read all the reviews on Rotten Tomatoes and even the ones not on there (Time, SFChronicle, USAToday, LATimes and IGN 3/5). The general consensus seems to be the movie is too familiar, story never soars, the songs aren't memorable (as I thought from listening to them ahead of time), and some characters aren't very strong. From what I've gathered, this movie just seems to be average, neither ranked with the greats or the worse, just average.

I'm not as excited as before to go see it but I still want to judge it myself. Even if its just average I hope its earns enough to officially resurrect traditional animation.
well from what i've read, it's a little better than average.

UPDATE: 3 New Reviews Added (All Positive)

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/1196003 ... _the_frog/

That's why I want jpanimation to post quotes from the missing reviews, since maybe that's where the general consensus of the film being "average" comes from

Margos · Post by **Margos** » Tue Nov 24, 2009 9:51 pm

Well, in jpanimation's defense, he did say that he read some reviews not from RT....

pap64 · Post by **pap64** » Tue Nov 24, 2009 10:03 pm

Margos wrote:Well, in jpanimation's defense, he did say that he read some reviews not from RT....

And those are the reviews I wanted posted because like I said, maybe that's where the consensus comes from.

But to be honest, I never expected the film to gather amazingly glowing reviews, especially when compared to the likes of Pixar efforts.

The film is, in a way, not meant to be a groundbreaking film that will delight with its morally deep story is intricate character development. It's a fairy tale. Though it does play with the formula a bit, creating characters that are a bit out of the Disney norm (mainly Tiana) in a setting that celebrates American culture with the sensibilities of a magical story.

So in a way, no one should be surprised if a reviewer or fan comes out and says that "the movie is average", because we are currently living in an era in which Pixar has set the standards for animated filmmaking very high, so a classic film like Princess and the Frog might appear to be a little old fashion for modern audiences.

Margos · Post by **Margos** » Tue Nov 24, 2009 10:06 pm

My sentiments exactly, Pap. I don't care what the critics say about this film, to be honest. I don't really care what the critics say about any Disney film. I love it, and that's good enough for me!

Babaloo · Post by **Babaloo** » Tue Nov 24, 2009 10:16 pm

I feel the same way to, but it would be nice to see many people like this movie as well (and so far with the reviews, it seems that many people DO like the film). I especially love the one line from Mary Williams review "The sweetest, most sincere romantic comedy to come along in ages, and a luminous love letter to a great American city."

This movie seems a lot like when Little Mermaid came out (even though I wasn't even born yet...just missed it by a year

!). But from what I've heard reviews almost sound the same, like catchy music, great characters, and a great revival. Who knows, maybe Rapunzel will be as great as Beauty and the Beast was

! (I know that has nothing much to do with PatF)

Frogger for life!

nomad2010 · Post by **nomad2010** » Tue Nov 24, 2009 10:16 pm

Margos wrote:My sentiments exactly, Pap. I don't care what the critics say about this film, to be honest. I don't really care what the critics say about any Disney film. I love it, and that's good enough for me!

I enjoy knowing that others enjoy a film also. I don't care if I'm the only one in the world who enjoys a film, but if everyone enjoys it it makes me happy knowing that this film will most likely fair well in the box office and maybe at award season for songs and such..

jpanimation · Post by **jpanimation** » Tue Nov 24, 2009 10:24 pm

Well, a positive review isn't a glowing review. 3/5 or 6/10 counts as positive and thats not something to brag about. As far as me having my mind made up, its not made up on anything but the music. All the positive reviews for Bolt had me going in thinking it would be great but I walked out disappointed while Cars was hailed as Pixar's worst and I really liked it. At this point, I've disagreed with critics enough to know not to take their views to heart.

"Princess and the Frog" isn't the second coming of "Beauty and the Beast" or "The Lion King." It's just plain pleasant, an old-fashioned little charmer that's not straining to be the next glib animated compendium of pop-culture flotsam. - San Francisco Chronicle

Part of the problem with "P&F" is that Tiana and Naveen's connection feels superficial. Plus, unlike some of his modern princess-courting brethren - the Beast, Aladdin, even John Smith in "Pocahontas" - Naveen's inner change from shallow to decent seems as perfunctory as his physical one from man to amphibian.
Which brings us back to Tiana... she's lovely and strong but achingly one-dimensional. And for all the movie's modern touches, she really has no reason to change, which keeps much of the plot earthbound. Maybe when it comes down to it, "The Princess and the Frog" could handle only so many wishes. - NY Daily News

Though it doesn’t quite rise to classic status, The Princess and the Frog does remind us that there was a lot of pleasure to be found in those pre-CGI musicals of not-so-ancient vintage. - Film Journal Internasional

Making less of an impression are Randy Newman's score and songs, which, though they encompass an impressive range of Southern musical styles, won't have kids or their parents humming on their way out of the theater. With the exception of the film's strongest tune (Mama Odie's delightfully upbeat hymn to soul-searching, "Dig a Little Deeper"), most of the numbers play like rehashes of past Disney showstoppers, in purpose if not in style: Dr. Facilier's sinister "Friends on the Other Side," for example, recalls Scar's "Be Prepared" from "The Lion King" (while the bad doctor himself resembles "Aladdin's" Jafar with a bared midriff).

That derivative quality pervades the entire production, as directors John Musker and Ron Clements -- who collaborated on such Disney new-wave masterpieces as "The Little Mermaid" and "Aladdin," but also 2002's poorly received "Treasure Planet" -- seem content to sample the company's back catalog and riff on classic conventions rather than forge an actual classic. Admittedly, Musker and Clements (who scripted with Rob Edwards) are working in a looser, more insouciant mode than the tradition of vintage Disney storytelling; for many viewers, the mere effort will be enough, even if it primes one's appetite for better things to come. - Variety

Thats a couple of quotes and they rank it pretty average but to answer your question on what reviews I've read, I think I made it clear in my initial post. Feel free to check out those sites and read the reviews, such as IGN's. I hope everyone remembers these aren't my reviews, so don't bash me as if they were. Everyone has different tastes in movies but despite that, I haven't seen anyone rank this one up with the best or down with the worst. Sounds average to me but I'm hoping average is better then the CG crap Disney has been spewing.

To repeat myself, I'm not bashing a film I haven't seen and I have no negative biased towards the film (although, I'm a sucker for anything 2D). I was just stating what I've gathered from reading reviews and how it lowed my excitement. I'm still going to see this movie and make up my own mind.

Kyle · Post by **Kyle** » Tue Nov 24, 2009 10:40 pm

Im going into this expecting to like it as much as brother bear, which I did like more than your average person, but clearly it cant really hold its own against the real classics. it''ll borrow too much from older movies. they'll think about what made them successful and try to replicate it, and that will bring the movie down just enough to keep it from being great, but still be enjoyable.

jpanimation · Post by **jpanimation** » Tue Nov 24, 2009 10:44 pm

Exactly Kyle. I liked Brother Bear a lot and ended up loving some seemingly "average" Disney movies.

ajmrowland · Post by **ajmrowland** » Tue Nov 24, 2009 10:49 pm

I really like Treasure Planet, and that's a pretty average movie.

pap64 · Post by **pap64** » Tue Nov 24, 2009 11:05 pm

Thanks for posting the quotes, jpanimation! And my apologies for making the biased claims. I confess I am not on the brightest of moods, and it doesn't help that I have this very annoying cough that refuses to leave...

But ignoring that, like I already stated I never expected the film to get fantastical reviews akin to Pixar's efforts. The film is meant to be a nostalgic throwback to classic Disney films.

And I agree that reviews don't always reflect the overall public opinion and the fans. To take a recent Disney example, many critics slammed "A Christmas Carol" for its motion capture, its lead actor, its story, and many other things. Yet, many fans loved the film, myself included. I thought that despite some weak parts it was a great and even horrific take on the classic story and one of Zemeckis' best films in the Motion Capture canon, easily beating Monster House. And the numbers don't lie, either. It's been doing well since release, and if it wasn't for Twilight and 2012 it would likely be in the top three week after week.

I am sure the same thing will happen with Princess and the Frog. Yes, some Disney fans will discredit it and dismiss its value, but it will be embraced my many, especially families.

Remember that this the first Disney 2D animated film in years, and today's generation of children have yet to experience a film of this caliber in theaters. So even if its familiar to US, it will be a whole new experience for children. And if the high sales of Princess and the Frog merchandise is any indication, a lot of people are embracing the frog.

akhenaten · Post by **akhenaten** » Wed Nov 25, 2009 12:27 am

while waiting for our new princess...here's RT list of disney's best animated features

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/guides/be ... ed_movies/

yukitora · Post by **yukitora** » Wed Nov 25, 2009 2:42 am

What Disney Animated film plot ever soared? The only ones I can think of are Chicken Little and Meet the Robinsons (the alien thing really came out of nowhere! and MtR was surreal enough to be original).

In fact, I cant think of any recent well recieved film that had a plot that soared. Most of them have just been retread material really well made. Or in come cases, poorly made + good actors.

estefan · Post by **estefan** » Wed Nov 25, 2009 7:27 am

Yeah, I'm loving the extremely positive reviews, but I'm noticing that the less-than-enthusiastic reviews are harping more on the character's skin-colour rather than, you know, the film itself.

I'm also disappointed that the New York Times didn't choose A.O. Scott to review the film (even though he likely will on At The Movies). He actually knows what he's talking about when it comes to cinema and he would have provided an intelligent and thoughtful review of The Princess and the Frog.

PatrickvD · Post by **PatrickvD** » Wed Nov 25, 2009 7:38 am

Oh my God, I looove the E!online review. Here is a small piece from it:

There is a beautiful diversity in The Princess and the Frog—Tiana is black, Charlotte is white, Naveen seems to be of South Asian descent. Some naysayers are bound to grumble that it's hyper-idealistic to see them all get along so swimmingly in the pre-Civil Rights era (these same people also no doubt eat puppies). And parents, be warned: Shadow-man voodoo king Facilier is host to many scary scenes and images, a bevy of ghosts from "the other side" that give Harry Potter's Dementors a run for their money.

Score!!

Read the rest here: http://uk.eonline.com/uberblog/movie_re ... ioned.html

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The Princess and the Frog Discussion - Part III

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