BOLT (formerly American Dog) Discussion

Balto123 · Post by **Balto123** » Sun Jun 01, 2008 3:54 pm

The teaser trailer for "Bolt" is attached to "Wall-E"-

http://pixarplanet.com/blog/up-teaser-t ... d-to-walle

Can't wait!

Jules · Post by **Jules** » Sun Jun 01, 2008 5:53 pm

About friggin' time!

Jules · Post by **Jules** » Mon Jun 02, 2008 4:32 am

This Cartoon Brew article makes it look like Pixar will be innovators and Walt Disney Animation Studios sidekicks.

Not very nice to hear.

http://www.cartoonbrew.com/disney/disne ... er#respond

PatrickvD · Post by **PatrickvD** » Mon Jun 02, 2008 10:49 am

Julian Carter wrote:This Cartoon Brew article makes it look like Pixar will be innovators and Walt Disney Animation Studios sidekicks.

Not very nice to hear.

http://www.cartoonbrew.com/disney/disne ... er#respond

I don't know who wrote that article, but he's clearly voicing his OWN opinion, and it's totally out there.

He speaks of Disney's animation division as if it's a joke that's gone on for too long. How there's too much bagage of Walt's legacy to produce anything of artistic merit. Was this guy born in 1998?? Did he not see Beauty and the Beast? The Little Mermaid? or even Lilo & Stitch? I don't think Walt was personally involved in any of these projects.

And refering to The Princess and the Frog as a a labored bid to repeat past glories is kind of insulting to two of the most talented directors in Disney's animation history. I'm amazed at the amount of people who have an opinion on this film eventhough A) nobody knows the story and B) it's not even animated yet. Now that Disney is doing 2d again, eveybody appears to have an opinion on it. Where were these people when 2d was "dieing"?

Ariel'sprince · Post by **Ariel'sprince** » Mon Jun 02, 2008 11:01 am

Yay

,finally,I much prefer seeing a teaser for this then Up.

Jules · Post by **Jules** » Mon Jun 02, 2008 1:22 pm

Patrick, the guy who wrote that article is Amid Amidi. I think he can bee a bit, erm ... extreme at times. I don't know if this is fair on him, but I admit I enjoy Jerry Beck's opinions much more than his. Firstly, I really like Jerry Beck. Secondly, I kind of feel safe that he (Jerry) knows what he's talking about (heck ... he's Jerry Beck!) even if I disagree with his views. With Amid ... there's still a lack of trust. I don't know much about him, though he must be a professional. In the end, his opinions tend to sometimes seem biased (for the sake of bias) and lacking logic, as you said. He dissed Bolt's character design as unimaginative, and um ... pretty much terrible. I think he's being rash. Although Sanders' designs were more unique, I have to admit that Bolt's current designs really seem to have a sense of fun! Look at Bolt himself. He looks just right - brave, cool, and if he were human he'd be handsome!

Some users were mocking the design for Penny saying she'd be Disney's first transvestite or transsexual (or something like that).

They claimed they could not realise she was a girl.

2099net · Post by **2099net** » Mon Jun 02, 2008 1:35 pm

PatrickvD wrote:
Julian Carter wrote:This Cartoon Brew article makes it look like Pixar will be innovators and Walt Disney Animation Studios sidekicks.

Not very nice to hear.

http://www.cartoonbrew.com/disney/disne ... er#respond
I don't know who wrote that article, but he's clearly voicing his OWN opinion, and it's totally out there.

He speaks of Disney's animation division as if it's a joke that's gone on for too long. How there's too much bagage of Walt's legacy to produce anything of artistic merit. Was this guy born in 1998?? Did he not see Beauty and the Beast? The Little Mermaid? or even Lilo & Stitch? I don't think Walt was personally involved in any of these projects.

Well, the point I think he is making is that Disney seems to be making non-radical choices for thier movies, heavily reliant on what people expect a Disney film to be. Out of all the upcoming Disney films announced all are fairytale-ish, apart from Bolt after all. (Of course, feel free to ignore the Tinker Bell movies if you wish being as they are DTVs).

Bolt
Tinker Bell*
The Princess and the Frog
Tinker Bell 2*
Rapunzel
Tinker Bell 3*
Tinker Bell 4*
The King of the Elves

It's hardly a breeding ground for innovation and fresh ideas is it? And Bolt was in production long before Lasseter's arrival and appears to have been considerably "smoothed" story and character wise to appeal to the widest possible audience. If Lasseter felt people couldn't identify with Sanders' misfit dog (remember, people identified with Stitch! In fact, the mass audience embraced Stitch!) why does he not had similar concerns about a 78 year old principle in "Up"?

Meanwhile Pixar dips its toes into Outer Space, Geriatric Heroes, Living Toys, Animals, It's own Fairytale and Cars.

To me, it's pretty clear which Studio is doing what it wants to do, and which studio is doing what people expect it to do.

And refering to The Princess and the Frog as a a labored bid to repeat past glories is kind of insulting to two of the most talented directors in Disney's animation history. I'm amazed at the amount of people who have an opinion on this film eventhough A) nobody knows the story and B) it's not even animated yet. Now that Disney is doing 2d again, eveybody appears to have an opinion on it. Where were these people when 2d was "dieing"?

But I think it is. All of the post Bolt Disney films are blatant attempts to make a "Disney film" rather than the much more creatively liberating make a "good film".

steve · Post by **steve** » Mon Jun 02, 2008 5:30 pm

2099net wrote:Out of all the upcoming Disney films announced all are fairytale-ish, apart from Bolt after all...

...The King of the Elves

Em, King of the Elves isn't that fairytale-ish - sure, there are elves in it, but it's based on a story by Phil Dick about a guy who works in a gas station in modern-day Mississippi...

2099net · Post by **2099net** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 12:42 am

well I did qualify with an "ish"

I didn't know about the story, but are you sure it stays in the modern day, or will some transport to a fairytale(ish) realm take place at some point?

Anyhow, the point is Disney does seem to be sticking to topics and titles that scream "Disney" to the average viewer, who has a somewhat stereotypical perception of a Disney film. Lasseter may or may not be behind this (he was obviously shouted down about Tinker Bell), but he doesn't seem to be doing anything to change what films WDFA are making (what happened to Joe Jump?) where as Pixar is apparently given free reign when it comes to the subjects of their films (including stepping on WDFA's toes with the Bear and the Bow)

Kyle · Post by **Kyle** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 2:00 am

Julian Carter wrote: He dissed Bolt's character design as unimaginative, and um ... pretty much terrible. I think he's being rash. Although Sanders' designs were more unique, I have to admit that Bolt's current designs really seem to have a sense of fun

eh, I agree with him, bolts new design is very bland looking. he looks like every other animated dog now. changing a movie to appeal to the broadest range possible is not in pixar's character from what I can see. they make movie they themselves would enjoy. with bolt's blander look it seems like their too worried about standing out, afraid to be a little wierd.

PatrickvD · Post by **PatrickvD** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 2:49 am

well my point was more that Disney's simply trying to get back into what it's been doing for over 70 years. And I think it's weird that that is looked down upon.

Where Pixar is known for doing new stuff (well, to an extend) Disney is known for familiarity. I think people shouldn't look down on John Lasseter or anyone at Disney for trying to get back that winning formula.

blackcauldron85 · Post by **blackcauldron85** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 9:20 am

2099net wrote: (including stepping on WDFA's toes with the Bear and the Bow)

What do you mean by that?

2099net · Post by **2099net** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 11:03 am

I mean it appears to have been decided that Fairytales are Disney's "thing", but it's not stopped Pixar from having ago themselves.

I really want to know what's happened to stuff like Joe Jump and Fraidy Cat. They may or may not have been fully realised and workable ideas (but you sort of expect them to have been somewhat along the line before leaking out). To an outsider it does indeed look like Disney has been "relegated" to fairytale films only.

And Patrick, what has Disney been doing for 70 years exactly? Under Walt, Disney did fairytales, music concerts, animal adventures, theatrical plays and comedy partworks.

Sigh. The only reason people expect certain types of films from Disney is because of Disney's stupid princess marketing obsession!

yukitora · Post by **yukitora** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 12:05 pm

*sigh* Although I'll probably like Bolt, I'm not a fan of Lassetter destroying our only chance of another Lilo & Stitch and any other Disney/Sanders movies. In addition to that he's pursuing a Disney Princess alternative with the whole Tinkerbell franchise and he stopped production of the DTVs

(You gotta admit, some of them are just superb)

In fact, I'm not a very big fan of Pixar at all right now, after announcing so many features covering the next 5 years, I'm not quite sure if they'll be able to keep their standards, but we'll just have to wait and see.

Pete Doctor on the other hand <3

REINIER · Post by **REINIER** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 12:06 pm

2099net wrote: Sigh. The only reason people expect certain types of films from Disney is because of Disney's stupid princess marketing obsession!

I'll have to agree on that, at least on a certain level.
On another note it's clear ThePandtheFr will need to be succesfull for Disney to satisfy it's shareholders
(after the commmercially dissapointing Home ontheRange)and venture off into more 2-d

Still I find it cowardly not to set a new standard and make a bold move by announcing at least one or two more 2-d related pictures, it is after all the one thing that distingueshes Disney from other ''big'' studio's

Ariel'sprince · Post by **Ariel'sprince** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 12:34 pm

2099net wrote:Sigh. The only reason people expect certain types of films from Disney is because of Disney's stupid princess marketing obsession!

What? the Princess film are perfact,the Princesses are the best.

2099net · Post by **2099net** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 12:35 pm

yukitora wrote:*sigh* Although I'll probably like Bolt, I'm not a fan of Lassetter destroying our only chance of another Lilo & Stitch and any other Disney/Sanders movies. In addition to that he's pursuing a Disney Princess alternative with the whole Tinkerbell franchise and he stopped production of the DTVs (You gotta admit, some of them are just superb)

I think Lasseter did want to stop the Tinker Bell movies, but being as Disney has big plans for the "franchise" (how I hate that word) he was basically told they were happening with or without his input. In that situation, he could either ignore them, or try to guide them and make them better.

Basically Disney want their faries to be thier next princesses, and we know how Disney's abused that "franchise".

2099net · Post by **2099net** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 12:36 pm

Ariel'sprince wrote:
2099net wrote:Sigh. The only reason people expect certain types of films from Disney is because of Disney's stupid princess marketing obsession!
What? the Princess film are perfact,the Princesses are the best.

Maybe, but Disney is, and always has been more than just Princesses.

Mooky · Post by **Mooky** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 1:37 pm

I couldn't agree more. As much as I love Princess movies and consider them all to be masterpieces, I don't think Disney should be known only for them. What about epic movies (like "Lion King" and "Tarzan"), heart-warming stories of animals ("Dumbo", "Bambi", "Aristocats"), zany comedies ("Emperor's New Groove", "Home on the Range"), heavy dramas ("Hunchback of Notre Dame"), adventures ("Atlantis: The Lost Empire", "Treasure Planet") and adaptations of literary classics ("Alice in Wonderland", "Peter Pan"). These types of films seem to be taken away from Disney and now they decided to make only fairytale/fantasy stuff. Don't get me wrong - I'm a big fan of these genres (fairytales and fantasies, that is) but even I can tell when the formula's stale. I thought Disney's step away from animated musicals after "Mulan" was a step in the right direction, and I pretty much liked/loved every movie from that new age ("Chicken Little" and "Meet the Robinsons" excluded). I'm happy they'll return to the '90s style with "Princess and the Frog" but if they continue that route, we'll be looking at another post-'90s crisis.

Ariel'sprince · Post by **Ariel'sprince** » Wed Jun 04, 2008 5:22 am

2099net wrote:
Ariel'sprince wrote: What? the Princess film are perfact,the Princesses are the best.
Maybe, but Disney is, and always has been more than just Princesses.

It is,Disney has many more things besides Princesses,they need to make more film but about something else,not Princesses (The King Of Elvs for exmaple) because they can't make only Princess film.
Thought keep in mind that if the Princess line wasn't sucessful we whould have got more films like The Wild insted of Enchanted,The Princess And The Frog and Rapunzel.
I don't think that the Fairies line will be sucessful as the Princess one,the Disney Princess franchise is about different heroines from different films while the Fairies line is about TinkerBell and her pixie friends that Disney made up for the line,this line is more like the Winnie The Pooh franchise (When I first heard about Disney Fairies I thought it should be called TinkerBell And Friends insted,it fits more),a Villains line can be the next Princess one.

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