Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney

[SWillie!]

Sotiris, it'd be nice if you didn't put the most negative spin on every piece of news. You've only been doing so recently. Also, while its probable that he is indeed talking about Musker and Clements film, there's no way we can know that for sure, so there's no way you can act as the authoritative voice on news like this. The studio seems to be on a very positive boost of motivation and creativity, yet you continue to spin any news negatively. Have some optimism!

[Linden]

Hi everyone, I've been reading this forum for a while and finally decided to join today.

Hi! Welcome to the forum!

When we do pitch, it's made clear to us that the stories aren't necessarily for a hand-drawn project. When we've brought it up with John Lasseter, he's shied away from committing to a hand-drawn feature.

I don't get why hand-drawn should be considered any less marketable. They should try doing a 2D film that is not aimed at girls or very young children (I hate saying that, since I absolutely love Winnie the Pooh, but that's what most people think of it). I think if there were a 2D film that's aimed at an audience similar to Wreck-it Ralph, there should be no reason for it to flop or perform sluggishly.

[DisneyJedi]

It's blatantly obvious that they just don't give a crap anymore! That's why they aren't even trying! If it weren't for hand-drawn, CG probably wouldn't even exist! They don't realize that because they (especially Lasseter and Bob Iger) have their heads stuck too far up their asses.

[Linden]

^Well, I don't know about that. What about Paperman? It was gorgeous and critically acclaimed. That's gotta count for something. I think if nothing else, they'll probably make more 2D shorts.

[Kyle]

It's blatantly obvious that they just don't give a crap anymore! That's why they aren't even trying! If it weren't for hand-drawn, CG probably wouldn't even exist!

cel phones wouldn't exist without the rotary, mp3 players wouldn't without vinyl records, so what difference does that make?

Obviously unlike these a lot of people still care about hand drawn animation, but that's a silly point to make.

[DisneyJedi]

Well, existence talk aside, if the medium were dead, would they have even made The Princess and the Frog or Winnie the Pooh (2011)?

No?

I didn't think so. I just hope we see more hand drawn films in the distant future and that those two movies I mentioned weren't a way of them tossing us a bone just to shut us up.

[Sotiris]

Obviously unlike these, a lot of people still care about hand drawn animation.

Do they? It seems to me that hand-drawn animation fans and animators are the only ones who still care. I doubt the general audience cares for the medium anymore.

Sotiris, it'd be nice if you didn't put the most negative spin on every piece of news.

It's not a negative spin; it's the truth. I'm very tired of them perpetuating the same old myth of the 'filmmaker-driven' studio. It does not correspond to reality and it sounds self-righteous. No other studio claims that besides Pixar/WDAS.

Also, while it's probable that he is indeed talking about Musker and Clements film, there's no way we can know that for sure, so there's no way you can act as the authoritative voice on news like this.

It's quite obvious that was the project he was referring to. They don't have another feature in development that utilizes the 'Paperman' technique and understandably so since they need to test how commercial it will be first.

The studio seems to be on a very positive boost of motivation and creativity.

When did I say otherwise? Just because I'm critiquing some aspects of the studio, doesn't mean I think it has gone creatively or artistically bankrupt.

[TsWade2]

Sotiris, it'd be nice if you didn't put the most negative spin on every piece of news. You've only been doing so recently. Also, while its probable that he is indeed talking about Musker and Clements film, there's no way we can know that for sure, so there's no way you can act as the authoritative voice on news like this. The studio seems to be on a very positive boost of motivation and creativity, yet you continue to spin any news negatively. Have some optimism!

SWillie's right, Sotiris! You keep giving us bad news everytime and maybe what you heard is untrue. You made us feel very sad and disappointed about what Disney is doing. That's not cool, dude! I've been obsessing of hand drawn and hoping get Mickey Mouse a new series (even though I do appreciate the clip you show me.) and I realize it's getting a bit unhealthy for all of us Disney fans, because you are a party pooper. You need to get out that stupid animation guild blog. That blog is nothing but a bunch of crappy negative nonsense. So you stop ruining our hopes this instant!

[qindarka]

Sotiris, it'd be nice if you didn't put the most negative spin on every piece of news. You've only been doing so recently. Also, while its probable that he is indeed talking about Musker and Clements film, there's no way we can know that for sure, so there's no way you can act as the authoritative voice on news like this. The studio seems to be on a very positive boost of motivation and creativity, yet you continue to spin any news negatively. Have some optimism!

SWillie's right, Sotiris! You keep giving us bad news everytime and maybe what you heard is untrue. You made us feel very sad and disappointed about what Disney is doing. That's not cool, dude! I've been obsessing of hand drawn and hoping get Mickey Mouse a new series (even though I do appreciate the clip you show me.) and I realize it's getting a bit unhealthy for all of us Disney fans, because you are a party pooper. You need to get out that stupid animation guild blog. That blog is nothing but a bunch of crappy negative nonsense. So you stop ruining our hopes this instant!

It's not his fault. The TAG blog is a reliable source of insider information. And he is probably right in that Disney does not want to commit to 2D animation at the moment.

I reckon you should relax. You seem to alternate between savaging Disney for not producing 2D animation or producing a new Mickey Mouse series to blasting Sotiris for posting the very things that you regularly complain about.

[TsWade2]

SWillie's right, Sotiris! You keep giving us bad news everytime and maybe what you heard is untrue. You made us feel very sad and disappointed about what Disney is doing. That's not cool, dude! I've been obsessing of hand drawn and hoping get Mickey Mouse a new series (even though I do appreciate the clip you show me.) and I realize it's getting a bit unhealthy for all of us Disney fans, because you are a party pooper. You need to get out that stupid animation guild blog. That blog is nothing but a bunch of crappy negative nonsense. So you stop ruining our hopes this instant!

It's not his fault. The TAG blog is a reliable source of insider information. And he is probably right in that Disney does not want to commit to 2D animation at the moment.

I reckon you should relax. You seem to alternate between savaging Disney for not producing 2D animation or producing a new Mickey Mouse series to blasting Sotiris for posting the very things that you regularly complain about.

So is he right that Hand drawn is dead to Disney?

[qindarka]

So is he right that Hand drawn is dead to Disney?

Until 2015, yes. We'll see if Clements and Musker's film does indeed use the Paperman technique and whether that will change anything.

That unless Big Hero 6 turns out to be 2D, something which I very much doubt though I don't think there has been confirmation that it will be in CG. Not enough info on that yet but don't get your hopes up.

[SWillie!]

It's not a negative spin; it's the truth. I'm very tired of them perpetuating the same old myth of the 'filmmaker-driven' studio. It does not correspond to reality and it sounds self-righteous. No other studio claims that besides Pixar/WDAS.

They're also the only studio to claim that they create "magic". They're a company built off of self-righteousness. Regardless, it isn't the truth. We've had this conversation before: just because its director driven doesn't mean they don't have to follow the rules of the road.

And you're right that it is probably Ron and John's film. But again, you can't go around actin like you are THE authoritative voice or Disney news around here. You're doing it more and more. I know you do your research but you can't possibly know what's going on at the studio as much as you seem to think you do. For instance, you say they don't have another feature in development. How can you possibly know that? Yes, they don't have any that the public has any news of, but they have a number of projects in development that we know nothing about. All I'm saying is that you shouldn't just come on here and report your ideas and interpretations of news as facts.

[TsWade2]

It's not a negative spin; it's the truth. I'm very tired of them perpetuating the same old myth of the 'filmmaker-driven' studio. It does not correspond to reality and it sounds self-righteous. No other studio claims that besides Pixar/WDAS.

They're also the only studio to claim that they create "magic". They're a company built off of self-righteousness. Regardless, it isn't the truth. We've had this conversation before: just because its director driven doesn't mean they don't have to follow the rules of the road.

And you're right that it is probably Ron and John's film. But again, you can't go around actin like you are THE authoritative voice or Disney news around here. You're doing it more and more. I know you do your research but you can't possibly know what's going on at the studio as much as you seem to think you do. For instance, you say they don't have another feature in development. How can you possibly know that? Yes, they don't have any that the public has any news of, but they have a number of projects in development that we know nothing about. All I'm saying is that you shouldn't just come on here and report your ideas and interpretations of news as facts.

I'm with SWillie on that one. Sorry Sotiris, but I'm not going to listen to you anymore.

[Sotiris]

We've had this conversation before: just because its director driven doesn't mean they don't have to follow the rules of the road.

In this case, it was something even more specific. He said that the directors are the ones who choose the medium when clearly that's not the case.

For instance, you say they don't have another feature in development. How can you possibly know that?

I said it was probably the one he was referring to. I didn't claim I know for certain.

They have a number of projects in development that we know nothing about. All I'm saying is that you shouldn't just come on here and report your ideas and interpretations of news as facts.

I don't. There are many projects in development at Disney that we know nothing about and I never claimed that I do or made assumptions about them.

[SWillie!]

Unless I'm going insane, I definitely thought you had just said flat out "the feature he is talking about is Musker and Clements..." I'm pretty sure that probably wasn't there before (I notice youve edited your post since i made these comments). Regardless, you DO present your interpretations of things as facts fairly often. You say you never made assumptions- but you said that Musker and Clements is the only film in development working with that technique. That's an assumption. You presented it as fact.

[DisneyAnimation88]

You need to get out that stupid animation guild blog. That blog is nothing but a bunch of crappy negative nonsense. So you stop ruining our hopes this instant! Mad

So you want to live in a fantasy world then? If you don't want to know the truth about certain things then avoid certain threads but the hysterical responses to certain pieces of news on this forum about WDAS are unecessary.

There are many projects in development at Disney that we know nothing about

Exactly, which makes some of the hysteria here pretty pointless. Beyond Frozen we have no real idea what will come next, we know of some films that are in development and could be announced for release but there are more that we might not hear anything about for years. If Clements and Musker's film sees the light of the day and proves a success then who knows what doors that might open for the future?

[Sotiris]

I notice you've edited your post since I made these comments.

I edited that post for spelling mistakes. It had nothing to do with your comment. I think you saw what you wanted to see.

You say you never made assumptions- but you said that Musker and Clements is the only film in development working with that technique.

It was an educated guess. I thought that was obvious. Regardless, I don't have to explain myself to you what I say or how I say it.

[SWillie!]

Fine - but my point is, you have become an authority figure here. Because you are so well researched and well organized, people take your word verbatim. And when you make snide remarks like "we know better than to believe that fairy tale anymore" and present your own opinion on the matter as news, it sends the whole damn forum on an unnecessary tizzy about the world ending. Just so you're aware.

[Sotiris]

Fine - but my point is, you have become an authority figure here.

An authority figure? Seriously?

Because you are so well researched and well organized, people take your word verbatim.

I think members can tell the difference between when I'm reporting news and when I'm expressing an opinion. Even if they can't, that's not my fault.

And when you present your own opinion on the matter as news.

I still believe that I don't do that. Even if it occurs rarely, it's certainly not intentional.

It sends the whole damn forum on an unnecessary tizzy about the world ending.

I'm not responsible for how people react. And it's not the whole forum, it's the same few members that always overreact and respond that way.

[SWillie!]

An authority figure? Seriously?

Umm... yes? Not sure why that's eye roll worthy... That was meant as a compliment? I thought it was fairly obvious that people look to you as the most reliant source of information around here...

I think members can tell the difference between when I'm reporting news and when I'm expressing an opinion. Even if they can't, that's not my fault.

Well that's the problem - many of them can't. You're right, it's not your fault, but it's because of the fact that 95% of the time you are strictly reporting news without offering your thoughts, and then on rare occasions you put your very opinionated thoughts in there, and some members don't differentiate between the two.

I still believe that I don't do that. Even if it occurs rarely, it's certainly not intentional.

I'm sure it isn't. And that's why I'm pointing it out - because you don't seem aware of it. You have a very matter-of-fact way of saying things, whether its news or opinion - so when it is opinion, it comes of as "this is simply how it is" instead of "here's my thoughts on the matter".

I'm not responsible for how people react. And it's not the whole forum, it's the same few members that always overreact and respond that way.

Right, and because they do so, it send the rest of the forum on a downward spiral of "relax!" / "okay" / new piece of news / "OMG no more goodness in the world I'm going to murder Bob Iger in his sleep!" / "oh relax..." / "okay".

And it often starts with a piece of news you've reported to which you've added a negative comment about the state of animation today, which people take verbatim.

Again, I'm simply pointing this out because you seem unaware of it. I'm not trying to attack you about it or whatever.