The Sword in the Stone Discussion

MickeyMouseboy · Post by **MickeyMouseboy** » Tue Sep 02, 2003 12:30 am

What makes the world go round?

Matty-Mouse · Post by **Matty-Mouse** » Tue Sep 02, 2003 11:48 am

When you spin around and sround really really fast. That makes the world go round for me anyway.

Thanks for answering my question Luke. As much as I love it (and I do like it quite a bit) I just don't get the appeal of "The Jungle Book". People complain about the lack of plot in "Alice In Wonderland" but theres absolutely NO plot in Jungle Book either. I do love the bits with the Vultures though. As for 101 Dalmatians, I see nothing wrong with it and its quite funny so that ones fine with me.

2099net · Post by **2099net** » Tue Sep 02, 2003 12:09 pm

Well, your comment Matty basically sums up my thoughts. Out of the films of the 60's (I'll include The Aristocats in this too being as it was released in 1970 - obviously created in the 60's) all of them fail for me storywise, apart from 101 Dalmatians.

I don't think The Jungle Book is as great as it's reputation but my wife adores it, so I can accept that is has a following. But as you say, the story is somewhat lax, and the final confrontation with Shere Kahn is somewhat an anti-climax (but not to Alice's level) and that more than anything else harms the film in my eyes. Especially when Shere Kahn is presented as being such a wonderful villain throughout the film. (Yes, I know you could argue that it just shows how a bully does react when the tables are turned, but it still doesn't really wash with me. Compare Shere Kahn's behaviour and ending to that of Hopper in A Bug's Life. I know which ending is more dramatically satisfying.)

As for the Sword In The Stone it seems, via the use of Merlin's magic, to be rather episodic - while people complain about DTV productions like Cinderella II and Tarzan and Jane, they seem to forget how fragmented some of the Classic Disney's films are. The Sword In The Stone doesn't have a series of neat, self contained 'episodes' like the DTVs I mentioned, but it still suffers from having no clear thrust throughout the story, it seems to lurch from set-piece to set-piece.

As for The Aristocats, this is quite a fun little film, and I would argue more underrated than The Rescuers or The Fox And The Hound. Not necessarily because it deserves more credit than the other two, but it certainly deserves more credit than it gets. However, in many respects it's trying too hard to be 101 Dalmatians.

101 Dalmatians is one of Disney's masterpieces, and for exactly the same reasons Pixar's films today are so highly praised.

Firstly, it's a proper story with a clear beginning, middle and end. Every one has clear motivation, sequences and event happen naturally over the course of the story and nothing feels like filler.

Secondly, it has well defined, likable characters. Even the villain, Cruella is likable in her own way.

Thirdly, it's not just a film for children. There's a lot of jokes and comments in there more suited for the adults watching.

Compare this to the other films of the 60's (yes, including The Jungle Book - in my opinion, I should add) and 101 Dalmatians is the clear winner, and easily one of Disney's 10 best animated films. In fact, with very little rewriting and modernisation it could easily be one of Pixar's next films.

Shame that the live-action 101 Dalmatians films were so poor, and a shadow of the original.

Prince Phillip · Post by **Prince Phillip** » Tue Sep 02, 2003 1:22 pm

Hum... sounds like the next DIScussion topic.

As for me, 101 Dalmations is my least favorite of the 60's productions, and I don't understand why it is so loved

, similar to the Lion King, which is a good film, but in my mind not GREAT, and even though this will be a purchase that I make the day it comes out, it will not be because I highly anticipate it, but rather because I want to save via the first day sale...(many stores put a movie on sale around here the first day it is released, sometimes, the whole first week)... anyway that's getting a bit off topic, but just one last thought on 101 D, I'm not sure if it was because of the horrible live action movie, and then it's sequel, but I really really no longer like 101 Dalmations, I think as a kid I found it cute, but even then it was never one of my favorites, and when it comes to the dog stories, I think Lady and the Tramp is by far the best... besides Dalmations are really neither friendly or intelligent dogs in real life, on the contrary they are quite vicious, and don't even make the cut on the list of 100-150 smartest dogs... enough said.

Anyway to get more ontopic... eh nevermind, can't think of anything that hasn't been said already...

rdwalt · Post by **rdwalt** » Mon Sep 22, 2003 1:44 pm

disneyfella wrote:i know we talked about this earlier, but the gold collection dvd of sword and the stone....is that the original aspect ratio? it says fullscreen and "modified from its original version", but i don't ever recall hearing that one as a wide screen. have we really lost a lot of picture on this release? i checked imdb.com and no ratio specs could be found. any luck with anyone else?

"The Sword in the Stone" was not a widescreen motion picture... at least not originally. Apparently, like "101 Dalmations" and other films of the late 1950s and early 1960s, "The Sword in the Stone" was made to be projected in one of two formats: either widescreen or full-frame, depending on the theater where it was shown. It seems that the Disney animators designed the film with a bit of 'extra picture' at the top and bottom of each frame; that way this 'extra' could be cut off without ruining the image in theaters playing it in widescreen. In other theaters, and on television, the film could be shown in a standard full-frame (1.33:1) format. So, according to Disney, the current full-frame DVD of "TSITS" is indeed the film in it's "original format'. Admittedly, it may not be the way that most of us remember this great little movie, but it is the way the folks at Disney made it.

Prince Eric · Post by **Prince Eric** » Tue Sep 23, 2003 11:56 am

I think my opinion falls between Luke's and Prince Phillip's. I really enjoyed it as a kid and I still do. However, it is by no means in the same category as The Jungle Book or 101 Dalmatians. Those two movies were definately groundbreaking in terms of animation and story telling. I would like to think it's better than the Aristocrats, a film a thought cute, but never really liked. I'm partial to my canine friends.

However, I wouldn't call it one of the 5 worst Disney films. It's good, but the episodic method of story telling is best reserved for Live-action films.

Chernobog · Post by **Chernobog** » Tue Sep 23, 2003 2:01 pm

I thinh that TSITS is one the worse films Disney ever made. The story is boring and artisticly is few interesting. However, the animation is good, I point Kay and the wolf in the forest.

schuylervj · Post by **schuylervj** » Thu Sep 25, 2003 12:46 pm

I totally agree; SITS is an overlooked and underappreciated classic, which should now, hopefully, get the recognition it deserves on DVD. It has never looked better, and the message is timeless....hopefully people will judge for themselves the inherent value of this wonderful Disney animated feature, and those who are discerning enough to enjoy it will be the ones who appreicate it, and will pass their enthusiasm along to friends and family. I saw it when it first acme out and was enthralled, and now I can enjoy the same quality in my DVD. A must for every Disney library.

Tangela · Post by **Tangela** » Sat Sep 27, 2003 9:25 pm

I just wanted to say I love 'The Sword in the Stone' I had never paid too much attention to itbefore, the same as with 'The Black Cauldron', Merlin is really funny, he always cracks me up.

As for 101 Dalmatians and Jungle Book, I find them both really boring, they don't really follow a good story speciall 101 D., its the same story, nothing new happens.

Post by **Luke** » Sun Sep 28, 2003 7:55 am

Yeah, all the folks in '61 were talking about "how many times are we gonna see the whole 'dalmatians have 101 puppies, puppies get kidnapped by a sadistic woman with a craving for fur, puppies must be rescued' plot?!"

rodis · Post by **rodis** » Sun Sep 28, 2003 8:57 am

It's a nice film. Since buying it 3 and a half years ago, I've watched it maybe three times. What bothers me the most is the rough animation, similiar to that of The Aristocats. But I DO like the animation in The Jungle Book and part of 101 Dalmatians, so...

"Jungle" & "101" are among my favorite Disney films.

2099net · Post by **2099net** » Thu Oct 02, 2003 2:24 am

Looking through Amazon.co.uk I was amazed to find this, a Sword in the Stone toy!

http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASI ... edisne-21/

So, not everyone ignores or has forgotten this movie.

Prince Phillip · Post by **Prince Phillip** » Thu Oct 02, 2003 9:12 am

2099net wrote:Looking through Amazon.co.uk I was amazed to find this, a Sword in the Stone toy!

http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASI ... edisne-21/

So, not everyone ignores or has forgotten this movie.

Cool

an assult tower

IggieKuzco · Post by **IggieKuzco** » Fri Oct 03, 2003 6:06 am

this is somthing i wrote on this thread about a month ago and i never got an answer.... i dont think ppl saw it and i want to know what u guys think:

I wrote:Oh... and by the way... did anyone notice besides me that in the sword in the stone, (in the point where they turn into fish), that Merlin turns into a big blue fish and Wart turns into a small orange fish! just like in Finding Nemo!!!! (Dori- big blue, Marlin- small orange!)
And another thing I noticed.... Merlin in the sword in the stone turns into a fish, and Marlin in finding Nemo is a fish!

Though they aren't the same type... i still insist that somthing very fishy is going on here!

reply!

Prince Phillip · Post by **Prince Phillip** » Fri Oct 03, 2003 9:07 am

IggieKuzco wrote:this is somthing i wrote on this thread about a month ago and i never got an answer.... i dont think ppl saw it and i want to know what u guys think:

I wrote:Oh... and by the way... did anyone notice besides me that in the sword in the stone, (in the point where they turn into fish), that Merlin turns into a big blue fish and Wart turns into a small orange fish! just like in Finding Nemo!!!! (Dori- big blue, Marlin- small orange!)
And another thing I noticed.... Merlin in the sword in the stone turns into a fish, and Marlin in finding Nemo is a fish!

Though they aren't the same type... i still insist that somthing very fishy is going on here!

reply!

I saw it, way back when

I guess in response I would have to say NO CONNECTION!!!!!!!

Actually who knows, maybe there is one, it is interesting...

AwallaceUNC · Post by **AwallaceUNC** » Wed Sep 01, 2004 10:54 pm

Sadly, The Sword In The Stone is right up there with Alice In Wonderland and Treasure Planet in being vastly underrated. It's by no means one of Disney's best movies, but it's not one of their weakest, either. As a child, it was always one of my favorites, and remains a favorite to this day- not only for the nostalgia factor (which is large here), but for the film itself.

(Hmm... have we ever ranked animated classics before? I know we've rated and had contests, but I can't remember if we did the ranking thing or not).

The animation isn't Disney's best- but it's by no means its worst. At times, it gets awkward (like Arthur's face in many scenes), and on the whole, I'd say it's under-done. The imagery is good, though, and is reminiscent of Sleeping Beauty (only not presented with the beauty and perfection that SB boasts).

There's a lot of Walt in this film (though many of its critics are probably reluctant to admit that). There are also many similarities with other Disney films that came both before and after it. In particular, I see a lot of Bedknobs & Broomsticks in it. There are also a few reminders of Cinderella, Alice in Wonderland, Sleeping Beauty, The Jungle Book, 101 Dalmatians, Winnie the Pooh, The Rescuers, Aladdin, and Beauty and the Beast, even if they are only small reminders here and there. I'll address a few of those that stuck out for me a little further down.

Maybe the story is what makes me like it so much. I've always been fascinated by the stories of King Arthur (but then, I think that fascination actually began with this movie). This movie really focuses on Arthur the boy- after the opening sequence (one that really reminded me of SB), we don't really hear much of the legend that is the source of the film's title until the end. I think a little more build up to that would have been nice, but it still works as it is. The Sword in the Stone is part history & legend, part fantasy, and part coming-of-age. It's also very funny. Throw in the occasional (though not abundant) emotional element, and you've got a fairly well-rounded and enchanting story.

It's disappointing that of the 3 '60s Disney movies, TSITS is the only one to not receive an animated sequel, but the only one that really begs for one at the film's close. I'd love to see a theatrically released follow-up to the adventures of Arthur, Merlin, and Excalibur.

The characters are wonderful. My favorite is either Merlin or Achimedes (tough call). I think Christopher Lloyd would be great as Merlin if they ever adapted this into a live-action flick (which they should, recent efforts notwithstanding

). Arcihimedes is a hoot (pun unintended), and really reminds me of Merryweather, where as Merlin sort of reminds me of Flora and the genie from Aladdin at the same time. Arthur is part Penny (The Rescuers) and part Christopher Robbins (Pooh). He isn't quite as endearing as the first two I mentioned, but he successfully brings a little sympathy to the table. Madam Mim is great. The wizard's duel scene is really pure genius. She's evil but lovable, and earns her spot on the display shelf in Disney's library of villains.

None of the film's songs are among my all-time favorite Disney songs, but I still really enjoy all of them. I'm not sure which I'd finger as my favorite- that'll take a little thought. I love that you can really see the handiwork of the Sherman Brothers in the lyrics and score. I wish they would work with Disney again.

Finally, I've gotta point out that the film really captures the spirit of the legend in the key parts of the story, and relies on the spirit of fun for the rest.

As for the DVD, it's a surprisingly good one, though I haven't yet tackled all the features. I wonder why Disney went with 1.33:1 for this in the '60s?

-Aaron

Sekaino Jasmine · Post by **Sekaino Jasmine** » Thu Sep 02, 2004 6:56 am

I'm not a really big fan of this movie. I remember when I was little that I would start watching it and get bored after the squirrel part. I should probably watch it now the whole way through...Well, anyway, I think that the animation wasn't that great and that it was kind of, well, boring.

Well, that's all I have to say about this film.

snowbot · Post by **snowbot** » Thu Sep 02, 2004 7:20 am

this used to be one of my favorites as a kid also. i dig the song "that's what makes the world go round". what i want to know is, how come none of the songs are commercially available on cd? the only one that i've seen is "higitus figitus" on a couple of compilations. granted, there aren't all that many songs in the film, but maybe disney could combine some film soundtracks onto single discs. for example:

"saludos amigos/the three caballeros"
"make mine music/fun and fancy free"
"melody time/the adventures of ichabod and mr toad"
"the sword in the stone/robin hood"

none of these soundtracks are available now. i would buy them!

MickeyMousePal · Post by **MickeyMousePal** » Thu Sep 02, 2004 7:50 am

The Sword in the Stone isn't one of my favorite Disney film but I watch it once in a while since it's traditional at home.
Many would say it underrated and I believe them because it's not that bad I like it very much.

PatrickvD · Post by **PatrickvD** » Thu Sep 02, 2004 10:13 am

This film was one of the few Walt-movies I could watch anytime as a kid. I can see why some people consider it weaker than other movies from the sixties like 101 Dalmatians, Jungle Book or Mary Poppins, but I just love the characters, songs and the artwork in particular. My favourite part of the movie is when Merlin tries to prove man will fly one day, and when the little plain he tries to send into the air crashes like a rock, Archimedes cracks up and laughs for like 3 minutes. That part is so contagiously funny. "That's What Makes the World go Round" is in my opinion one of the most underrated Disney songs.... heck, the entire movie is underrated! A great Disney classic, of wich I hope a 2-disc dvd will one day be available

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