Why did Disney support laserdisc so much?

[2099net]

Blu-ray will never get DVD levels of success. I'd be surprised if it gets 50% of the penetration DVD had at its peak to be honest. That's not down to any particular failing on Blu-ray's part, but down to lots of issues and circumstances such as alternative delivery methods, the fact that most people own DVDs of movies which are backwardly compatible with Blu-ray players, that DVD saw a huge boom in "movies to own" sales which VHS never really had etc.

But it is and will remain a premium format, just as LD did. LD lasted for 2 decades. BD will last just as long, if not longer. Even if as I predict the special features do decline in volumne and quality as it becomes more mainstream, it will always have premium visuals and sound over DVD and (I would assume) over downloads for many years to come. Personally, I think its a mistake to ignore it. Even if you can't afford it at this time - which is a perfectly reasonable reason - reconsider when it does become cheaper.

[BK]

I don't get the price argument because it's cheaper to buy a combo pack than either release separately in the US at least.

enigmawing got Dumbo or PATF for $2.88 or something. That says something.

Having said that, I don't think your assessment of BR special features is correct. BR has not once yet matched LD in terms of special features and on a lot of releases the bonuses are pathetic, worse than the DVD. If it gets worse, there will be even less incentive to buy into the format.

[David S.]

David your point about Disney masking the reason it's releases are lacking by using the soccer mum excuse is plausible but by adding that part about BR it kind of fails because maybe you haven't noticed but even keeping an art gallery off the SD release doesn't make the BR release any better without a commentary (Bolt).

It does if you prefer art galleries to commentaries!

Even Up, Cars and Ratatouille have almost barebones releases compared to older Pixar releases.

I agree and aknowledged somewhere in my long reply to Netty that if I were a BD collector, I'd feel like they were being skimpy, too. But that just makes the even skimpier DVD releases even more unpleasant to swallow, when you know those BD-exclusive featurettes could have fit...

It's not like they don't have anything because the UK release for Ratatouille (2 disc DVD edition a year later) had some exclusive features not on either DVD or BR before. I mean, if they have all of these backed up features why not release them? Holding out is corporate Disney and the company as a whole deserve to be burnt at the stake.

I do agree, although I personally wouldn't say the company as a whole. I'm happy with the parks I do agree with you with regards to the Home Video division, and will feel that way even more if the Treasures are truly over. Also, someone at the company needs to realize that if Walt's classic live-action film and tv material is no longer shown on TV, the demand for it on home video will decrease with each passing generation until it disappears forever. Someone at the company needs to do something about this before it's too late. With Roy gone, I fear the worst. Maybe Lassiter can do something?

Still, even if you're against BR, Disney are making incredibly valuable combo packs and sure you don't want to buy them because you won't use them but if it's cheaper to buy the combo pack than the DVD it's pretty stupid not to buy it. Before you complain, think about it, Disney are making less money selling a combo pack because they are packing two separate releases (BR, DVD) into one and selling it at a cheaper price than either. So, underhand it may be, but it's still a very good deal with you, the consumer in mind.

At Amazon, the single disc DVD is $15.99, and the combo pack is $26.99. The DVD-only carries a cheaper list-price, as well. So no, I'm not going to pay more for something I can't use (the BD) and I have absolutely ZERO use for digital copies. And it isn't nice to call people stupid!

Besides, even if there is someone out there offering a better deal on the combo, I can go in person to a used DVD/CD shop, buy a used single disc copy in mint condition, and get a better deal on that than I would on buying the combo pack new. And Disney won't get my money that way!

[yamiiguy]

I seen a blu-ray player for £50 the other week, no one has an excuse not to buy in now. (Even if you don't have an HDTV the extra disc space is worth it)

[2099net]

No, really, they were going downhill long before Blu-ray (although I accept you could argue that that was because HD in the form of Blu-ray or even HD-DVD was on the horizon, but I don't really accept that either.

But it hadn't gotten as bad as things are now, DVD-wise. I don't think it's a coincidence that the first Pixar film to not get a packed 2-disc DVD edition was the first to also be released on BD (Cars). Ironically, WALL-E did get a two disc, but that's my least favorite Pixar! Cars, Ratatouille and Up, which I LOVE, all got the shaft. Also, there's no way Princess and the Frog would have had the Making Of AND Art Gallery witheld from the DVD if those features were finished and ready to go for a new DAC DVD in the pre-BD days, even when they started getting cheap about the 2-disc sets. After all, those could have been included now and the release kept to one disc.

But don't forget, Cars also had "retailer exclusive" DVDs. So by the same argument, Disney's Marketing department stopped the DVD of Cars from being all it could be because they were chasing retailer exclusives. You could complain just as strongly at all the Disney DVDs which are released with extra content if you just happen to purchase them from a certain store. In a way, Blu-ray is just another retailer exclusive - I'm sure internally that's how Disney as a business sees them.

To be fair to Disney, they did perfectly well with the Sleeping Beauty and Pinocchio Platinums - I'm actually very surprised that Sleeping Beauty PE got as much content ported over as it did (on both the DVD and the Blu-ray).

Snow White was when things went to pot and I'm not really sure why. Even the Blu-ray is disappointing with noticable omissions from the PE which I'm confident could easily have been ported across in SD as "Classic DVD" features. [sigh] Notice how the Blu-ray managed to port the Dopey's Mine Cart Ride set-top game? Even with Blu-ray it seems Disney has more inclination to appeal to children than adult collectors.

Secondly, Disney's still with-holding content from Blu-ray releases now. They're rarely the all-singing, all-dancing cornucopia of extras that they could be. When they did the new Nightmare Before Christmas all they could add was a 30 second introduction? Hardly something to get everyone dropping DVD and moving to Blu-ray.

But that was what, a year or more ago? Things have gotten much worse since then as to what's being left off the DVD versions. I'll admit, if I was a BD fan, I'd feel like the releases could be more packed than they are. But that wouldn't frustrate me as much as KNOWING stuff could have fit that ALREADY exists, such as leaving things off the DVD that are on the BD and could have fit on the DVD.

Yes, but sadly that to a certain extent always will be the case. We've long suspected that they're left stuff off DVDs for future double-dips (What did happen to the Christmas Show for Peter Pan? Why have none of the LD supplements for the Latin American Package films been seen on DVD? What happened to the LD content initially promised for Hunchback of Notre Dame? Why does the US still not have an anamorphic, widescreen Honey, I Shrunk the Kids? They managed it in other regions. It's absolutely ludicrous that the biggest single market for the film doesn't have one. And of course, there's the retailer exclusives I mentioned before.) The difference now is its more blatant - so more offensive.

As for Blu-rays and DVDs, I think we have to accept that generally DVD or Blu-ray, we're unlikey to get such treats the the Atlantis: The Lost Empire or the woefully under-promoted Lilo and Stitch documentary on the 2 disc release. The market place had just changed.

In an ideal world, DVDs would have just as many video supplements as the Blu-ray releases, with Blu-ray "exclusives" being left to supplements best suited to the format (Picture in Picture, Interactive Internet tools such as Sony's MovieIQ, multi-streaming, BD-Java overlays etc). The problem is (and I'll admit this comes down to money) it no doubt costs more money to do all these, and the market place isn't big enough to support the investments at this time.

Well, the DVD market is still big enough. Despite the hype of DVD sales REVENUE going down, more UNITS were actually sold on DVD in 2009 than 2008! And inspite of all the underhanded tactics to prop up BD at DVDs expense - leaving off features, the delayed release of Snow White, misleading packaging, etc. BD sales are still hovering around the 7 to 8 percent of the market range.

Yes the markets big enough - more than. While sales may be going down, there's more people who own DVD players than ever before. I suspect though that the average price of each sale is going down though. Which may or may not result in lower profits (after all, creating/manufacturing a DVD must be dirt cheap these days - most studios give one away free digital copies. As far as I'm aware, only Disney charge extra for the privilege). But if you have documented "proof" that 80%+ of that market doesn't care for supplements beyond Disney Channel Star Pop Songs and point-and-clicky set-top games, are you going to try and keep that 20% or so happy or expect them to at some point "upgrade" to the next format where (currently) you are actively courting that audience?

Personally, I'll repeat what I said before. I truely think Disney and others would be better off getting their "all-singing, all-dancing" special editions out now while the DVD market is buoyant, and waiting 5-10 years before doing the same on Blu-ray. I personally expect most films released on Blu-ray between 2006 and 2010 to be double-dipped in the same time-frame, so I don't really see how doing so would harm future Blu-ray sales drastically for the long-term and surely striking at the maximum audience for such sales now would benefit them in the short-term?

That's what's most frustration about Disney's DVD only re-issues - they're not a step forwards for people who own the film on DVD, or an incentive for people who have dipped their toe into the Blu-ray market to consider purchasing. How can they be logical, viable alternatives to simply repressing and re-releasing the existing DVDs? I really don't understand Disney's mindset when it comes to such releases at all.

Not really. Because like I said, I wasn't interested in getting BD before Disney's tactics soured me on it, anyway. I would have been more open-minded about it, but most likely stuck with DVD just as I stuck with regular CD over SACD. As for the leaving the features off, trust me, I'll find a way to get those BD-exclusive extras in my collection, down-converted to DVD (not including Cine-Explore and things DVD can't support) without crawling to Disney and their pet new format! If Disney wants to make money from me on those features, release a quality DVD, fellas.

Well I agree. Doing so would increase DVD sales and help to innovate BD supplements. It's odd, because Universal was an avid supporter of HD-DVD, but currently they really are pushing the envelope when it comes to BD supplements - especially BD-Live. They're the only company really showing what BD-Live can do (you know my Funny People BD loads up different, up-to date previews each time I play it before showing the menu. They're even skippable too!)

Likewise, I have a copy of the Silent Hill movie released in France only by what I assume is a small publisher (Metropolitan) and it has two Picture-in-Picture streams, each of which can be set to full-screen at the touch of a menu button. How has a small, non-international publisher achieved this, and yet none of the large multi-nationals have? Why does having the PiP Work-In-Progress on The Princess and the Frog stop you from listening to the commentary? Silent Hill lets me switch in an instant between the movie, two commentary tracks, two picture-in-picture windows or a full-screen expanded picture-in-picture track with no disruption to the playback of the film at all.

I think its fair to say lazily withholding content from DVD and simply putting them on Blu-ray releases in HD is contributing to many studios not really exploring the full potential of the format. Why bother if you can entice people over with a 20 minute making of and a few web movies?

Its a shame, because the Princess and the Frog could have been an excellent BD - a full screen or PiP Work-in-Progress, perhaps multiple PiP tracks of animation in various stages of completion from design to the final finished product, etc. Instead they cynically decided to plump up the package with content which I agree 100% should have been on the DVD release. Even the WiP which should have been on a second disc. Personally I think the WiP as a Picture-in-Picture track which constantly blots out 1/6 or more of the frame is pretty pointless anyway. It would be much more logical for Disney to have encoded it as a second title on the Blu-ray, even if only is SD!

They'll even make less off of me on the DVDs I do buy, because when I do get around to getting Up and Princess on DVD, I'll buy used from a chain that carries used, and won't feel like Disney is ripping me off so much on those titles, since I'll be paying less and more importantly, Disney won't be getting my money! Also, since Disney has gotten too cheap to include chapter inserts in the discs, buying used is now a lot easier because now you just need to make sure the disc isn't scratched and don't have to worry about whether the insert is missing.

If you do that, more power to you. But I would suggest you should tell them you did it and why. Or else why would they change? They'd just see it as another sale lost to the decline in DVD sales. To their minds, that will validate their BD support strategy, not crucify it).

[David S.]

I seen a blu-ray player for £50 the other week, no one has an excuse not to buy in now. (Even if you don't have an HDTV the extra disc space is worth it)

I have an "excuse". I'm not interested in the format!

To be honest, I wouldn't be interested in buying another DVD player right now either though, even if it was dirt cheap, because I already have 3 and 2 of those are brand new (I ended up having to replace a VCR and got a really good deal on a VCR/DVD combo, and bought an extra since they are getting so hard to find)

I'm not a "hardware" person. I tend to only buy hardware when something breaks. I'd much rather spend the 50 on new DVDs and CDs for my collection. I'm into content, more than the equipment needed to play the content.

Also, there's my theme park addiction habit that takes priority as well.

Lastly, even if I wanted the BD player for 50 pounds, I wouldn't buy it until I got a HD widescreen tv, or else none of the fullscreen films like Snow White or Pinocchio would fill my screen properly, if watched on my standard television. So BD, for me, would require much more of an investment than just the player.

[yamiiguy]

The fact is that Blu-Ray is the official successor to DVD and is vastly superior to it, whether you upgrade now or later you will upgrade and the sooner the better as the more DVD titles you buy the more you will have to spend to upgrade them.

[The_Iceflash]

The fact is that Blu-Ray is the official successor to DVD and is vastly superior to it, whether you upgrade now or later you will upgrade and the sooner the better as the more DVD titles you buy the more you will have to spend to upgrade them.

I must remind you and everyone else about the upcoming Great Mouse Detective DVD that's boasting a new Digital Restoration. For those that already have the Great Mouse Detective DVD is one thing. What about those like me who have yet to own it on DVD? Should I wait 8+ years for a BD release? It's a hard decision.

On the combo front, I have been catching up on the Pixars, I'll get the 2 Toy Storys and Monsters, Inc. next week and I already have the Cars Combo. As far as combos go that leaves me with Up. (From what I read about Wall-e they throw a Digital Copy in there instead of a DVD which really annoys me.) As far as Sleeping Beauty and Pinocchio are concerned, I already have the Platinum DVD's and I'm happy enough with those to hold me over until their Diamond releases comes out. I could find them relatively cheap used but then I'd be getting rid of a new DVD for a used combo. Something about that doesn't sit well with me. I for once would like to sit back and enjoy getting their releases as they come out instead of hunting down out of print copies.

[2099net]

David S's opinion is perfectly valid. It would be considerable expense to do right, even with lower BD player prices and he'd personally rather have more discs. I have Blu-ray via my PS3 and a HD TV (720 only though, not 1080) and no amplifier or speakers. It doesn't seem to make much sense, as I can't get full HD benefit from the picture and especially not from the lossless 7.1 soundtracks Blu-ray offers. But I'm happy with what I have for various reasons (expense and I live in a flat so somewhat-expensive, loud sound systems don't make much sense). And personally, like David, I'm at a stage where I would rather spend my money on more discs than upgrading my TV or sound. My main reason for getting a HD television was for videogaming, and my main reason for buying Blu-ray discs is for extras (but I will still buy barebones BDs of new films if I'm interested in the film - I see no point in buying DVDs anymore if a BD is available).

However, I think David has to tell Disney why he is not buying their cut-down DVDs or else nothing is likely to change. To be honest, nothing is likely to change regardless, but without Disney being given information nothing is definitely going to change!

[2099net]

The fact is that Blu-Ray is the official successor to DVD and is vastly superior to it, whether you upgrade now or later you will upgrade and the sooner the better as the more DVD titles you buy the more you will have to spend to upgrade them.

I must remind you and everyone else about the upcoming Great Mouse Detective DVD that's boasting a new Digital Restoration. For those that already have the Great Mouse Detective DVD is one thing. What about those like me who have yet two own it on DVD? Should I wait 8+ years for a BD release? It's a hard decision.

I would buy it now. Really, your whole opinion of Disney films could totally change in 8 years. I know the appeal of most Disney films to me has decreased considerably in 8 years! Even films I once enjoyed thoroughly. In 8 years, your whole life could have changed!

[The_Iceflash]

I must remind you and everyone else about the upcoming Great Mouse Detective DVD that's boasting a new Digital Restoration. For those that already have the Great Mouse Detective DVD is one thing. What about those like me who have yet two own it on DVD? Should I wait 8+ years for a BD release? It's a hard decision.

On the combo front, I have been catching up on the Pixars, I'll get the 2 Toy Storys and Monsters, Inc. next week and I already have the Cars Combo. As far as combos go that leaves me with Up. (From what I read about Wall-e they throw a Digital Copy in there instead of a DVD which really annoys me.) As far as Sleeping Beauty and Pinocchio are concerned, I already have the Platinum DVD's and I'm happy enough with those to hold me over until their Diamond releases comes out. I could find them relatively cheap used but then I'd be getting rid of a new DVD for a used combo. Something about that doesn't sit well with me. I for once would like to sit back and enjoy getting their releases as they come out instead of hunting down out of print copies.

I would buy it now. Really, your whole opinion of Disney films could totally change in 8 years. I know the appeal of most Disney films to me has decreased considerably in 8 years! Even films I once enjoyed thoroughly. In 8 years, your whole life could have changed!

Good point. And seeing that it's The Great Mouse Detective I doubt there is going to be some big epic release of it down the road. Unfortunately I'm come to accept Disney's favoritism and inconsistent releases with how they treat their animated classics.

[David S.]

But don't forget, Cars also had "retailer exclusive" DVDs. So by the same argument, Disney's Marketing department stopped the DVD of Cars from being all it could be because they were chasing retailer exclusives. You could complain just as strongly at all the Disney DVDs which are released with extra content if you just happen to purchase them from a certain store. In a way, Blu-ray is just another retailer exclusive - I'm sure internally that's how Disney as a business sees them.

Good point. The retailer DVD exclusives don't bother me nearly as much though, because if I want what's on them, I can make sure I buy from that retailer and at least I know those "exclusives" will work on my player.

To be fair to Disney, they did perfectly well with the Sleeping Beauty and Pinocchio Platinums - I'm actually very surprised that Sleeping Beauty PE got as much content ported over as it did (on both the DVD and the Blu-ray).

I agree completely. And I loyally rewarded them for those stellar releases by buying them, brand new from a store, on release day!

Snow White was when things went to pot and I'm not really sure why. Even the Blu-ray is disappointing with noticable omissions from the PE which I'm confident could easily have been ported across in SD as "Classic DVD" features. [sigh] Notice how the Blu-ray managed to port the Dopey's Mine Cart Ride set-top game? Even with Blu-ray it seems Disney has more inclination to appeal to children than adult collectors.

I agree again. That's a really shoddy DVD release and even the BD has less than the Platinum.

Yes, but sadly that to a certain extent always will be the case. We've long suspected that they're left stuff off DVDs for future double-dips (What did happen to the Christmas Show for Peter Pan? Why have none of the LD supplements for the Latin American Package films been seen on DVD? What happened to the LD content initially promised for Hunchback of Notre Dame? Why does the US still not have an anamorphic, widescreen Honey, I Shrunk the Kids? They managed it in other regions. It's absolutely ludicrous that the biggest single market for the film doesn't have one. And of course, there's the retailer exclusives I mentioned before.) The difference now is its more blatant - so more offensive.

I agree again. It's a travesty for films like Hunchback that have yet to get the DVD they deserve, when the content is already out there!

Personally, I'll repeat what I said before. I truely think Disney and others would be better off getting their "all-singing, all-dancing" special editions out now while the DVD market is buoyant

Total agreement there. That's part of the frustration is that they seem unwilling to do this, like you say here:

That's what's most frustration about Disney's DVD only re-issues - they're not a step forwards for people who own the film on DVD, or an incentive for people who have dipped their toe into the Blu-ray market to consider purchasing. How can they be logical, viable alternatives to simply repressing and re-releasing the existing DVDs? I really don't understand Disney's mindset when it comes to such releases at all.

Total agreement!

I think its fair to say lazily withholding content from DVD and simply putting them on Blu-ray releases in HD is contributing to many studios not really exploring the full potential of the format. Why bother if you can entice people over with a 20 minute making of and a few web movies?

Its a shame, because the Princess and the Frog could have been an excellent BD - a full screen or PiP Work-in-Progress, perhaps multiple PiP tracks of animation in various stages of completion from design to the final finished product, etc. Instead they cynically decided to plump up the package with content which I agree 100% should have been on the DVD release. Even the WiP which should have been on a second disc. Personally I think the WiP as a Picture-in-Picture track which constantly blots out 1/6 or more of the frame is pretty pointless anyway. It would be much more logical for Disney to have encoded it as a second title on the Blu-ray, even if only is SD!

All great points. I'm glad you agree that those missing features should have been on the PatF DVD, and that BD exclusives should be things that explore the potential of the BD format's capabilities beyond what DVD can do. If they did that, maybe more people like me could get more interested in the format.

If you do that, more power to you. But I would suggest you should tell them you did it and why. Or else why would they change? They'd just see it as another sale lost to the decline in DVD sales. To their minds, that will validate their BD support strategy, not crucify it).

Good point. I do plan on writing a letter on behalf of a DVD fan's point of view to try to make my voice heard.

We actually agree on quite a bit, even though we're on different formats.

[David S.]

The fact is that Blu-Ray is the official successor to DVD and is vastly superior to it, whether you upgrade now or later you will upgrade and the sooner the better as the more DVD titles you buy the more you will have to spend to upgrade them.

How do you know what I'll do? It remains to be seen if I'll "have" to upgrade to BD or not, as far as buying new releases. That all depends on if BD succeeds in eliminating DVD the way DVD eliminated VHS. If it doesn't, there may well be plenty of people who never upgrade to BD. 2099net predicted in this thread that BD might not ever get the amount of market penatration DVD had, and I think he's right.

And it's been pointed out that BD is backwards compatible, so even if I ever did get a BD player, I won't have to upgrade all my DVDs to BDs, as you are suggesting.

[yamiiguy]

The fact is that Blu-Ray is the official successor to DVD and is vastly superior to it, whether you upgrade now or later you will upgrade and the sooner the better as the more DVD titles you buy the more you will have to spend to upgrade them.

How do you know what I'll do? It remains to be seen if I'll "have" to upgrade to BD or not, as far as buying new releases. That all depends on if BD succeeds in eliminating DVD the way DVD eliminated VHS. If it doesn't, there may well be plenty of people who never upgrade to BD. 2099net predicted in this thread that BD might not ever get the amount of market penatration DVD had, and I think he's right.

And it's been pointed out that BD is backwards compatible, so even if I ever did get a BD player, I won't have to upgrade all my DVDs to BDs, as you are suggesting.

No you wouldn't have to but they would be subpar. I think they will have the same market penetration, when there are titles that are BD only then DVD will slowly falter out. As Buddhism teaches everything changes, BD is the official successor after HD-DVD failed. Already over 53% of US households have an HDTV, Blu-Ray will follow.

[David S.]

BD is the official successor after HD-DVD failed

And Anakin was the "Chosen One", and we know how that turned out

The Atari 5200 was unveiled as the "official successor" to the widely successful 2600, and it flopped.

And of course, Super Audio CD, the "official successor" to CD, has still not surpassed the sales of CD or replaced it.

My point being, nothing's a "sure thing" until it happens.

The fact is no one knows for sure what will happen, so let us agree to disagree. You think BD will probably eliminate DVD at some point, and I think there's a good chance it won't.

[littlefuzzy]

I just wanted to throw a few laserdisc facts out there...

• CDs are actually descended from Laserdiscs, not the other way around!
• There were about 2 million players in the US at the height of popularity (I thought I had heard 4 million at one point.)
• VHS had 240 lines of resolution, LD had 425 (almost double), and DVD only had 500 (not as huge a jump)
• LD had Analog video, so no compression artifacts like on DVD. Also, error correction was a lot better.
• LD had at least 3 audio tracks - Analog Left, Analog Right, Digital, and maybe a DTS track. Mono supplements could be stored on the left and right tracks, leaving the Digital track for the main film.
• There are STILL supplements missing from DVD and Blu-Ray that were on LD, like some of the Snow White audio tracks and some of the still images from the marketing section.
• There are quite a few movies on Laserdisc that still haven't made it to DVD.

I personally got into Laserdisc in 1990, I pretty much skipped the VHS era. I was becoming a movie fan back then, and when I found out that TV broadcasts and VHS used pan & scan formats, as well as editing (for TV), I decided Laserdiscs were the better way to go.

I got a pretty good anime collection on Laserdisc, with the added benefit of dual language audio: Analog was Japanese, and Digital was English (or vice versa.) Of course, some discs used closed captioning for the subtitles, and my TV was too old for that so I had to use the English version.

Box sets were beautiful, The Toy Story set came with as much or more supplemental material as is included in the Ultimate Toy Box DVD, as well as a hardback book, a lithograph, etc. Plus, I have the "large-breasted" version of Knick Knack!

[Aqua]

The LDs also have Aladdin, The Little Mermaid and The Lion King's "subliminal messages" that where removedf rom the DVDs.

I think that's another plus knowing Disney gave in and changed it for the DVD.

[jpanimation]

It's odd, because Universal was an avid supporter of HD-DVD, but currently they really are pushing the envelope when it comes to BD supplements - especially BD-Live. They're the only company really showing what BD-Live can do (you know my Funny People BD loads up different, up-to date previews each time I play it before showing the menu. They're even skippable too!)

You know, when BDLive was originally announced, updatable previews was the first thing I thought of (just seemed like a no-brainer). I don't own any Universal Blus, only rented Coraline once and saw their generic menu, but I'm really glad to hear someone is taking advantage of the hardware. Sounds like an awesome feature.

Now if only Universal would step up their catalog titles. They have some of my favorites: Universal Monsters (The Phantom of the Opera, Dracula, Frankenstein, The Mummy, The Invisible Man, The Wolf Man, and The Creature from the Black Lagoon), the Hitchcock's (The Birds, Psycho, Rear Window, Vertigo, etc.), the Back to the Future trilogy, and some of Spielberg's best (Jaws, E.T., Jurassic Park, etc.) but have failed to release them (heck, I would've picked up King Kong if it wasn't barebones).

Besides Disney, I own a Fox (The Day the Earth Stood Still) and 2 Warners (The Searchers, Casablanca) and I have to say that Warner is the absolute worst. They do fantastic restorations and transfers, sometimes with a wealth of extras but they don't do a single thing to take advantage of the hardware besides using the capacity of the discs. Their menus are terrible, even more plain then the DVDs, and none of them use BDLive. Quite frankly, Disney makes the nicest Blus (at least of the ones I own).

[merlinjones]

Well, I was around back then, and this is my memory of it:

Disney really didn't support LaserDisc so much - - Pioneer and Image did.

In the early days of laser, Disney licensed a few TV titles to initial LD distributor Discovision - - later Walt Disney Home Video added a line of their own of about 20-25 titles (this was in the VHS clamshell era, when tapes were still at rental prices). These titles were not letterboxed nor did they have extras of any kind. After the initial releases, additions to the line were sparse, as Laser had proved to be a niche market - - and Disney was not yet accustomed to "sell through" video - - they preferred to sell or rent high priced tapes to rental stores rather than directly to the consumer.

Though LaserDisc failed to catch on with the general public, it became the format of choice (much like Blu-Ray today) for movie collectors, film buffs, tech early adopters and Hollywood insiders, due to its superior picture and (though quite expensive by today's standards) lower price point than VHS. Because of its acceptance by this crowd, laser proved to be the place where proper aspect ratios (letterboxing) and archival extras, commentary tracks and box sets first became prized (led by The Criterion Collection's scholarly supplements and presentation standards).

Disney tired of serving a niche market early on and cancelled its own distribution of laser discs entirely, making the titles that went out of print hard to find -- and new titles imported from Japan became the only way to get Disney titles of any kind on LD for about 2-3 years.

Eventually Pioneer became the main proprietor and manufacturer of LaserDisc hardware and software (Image was another major LD software distributor) and went about making licensing agreements with the studios that had stopped making lasers. When Pioneer (or was it Image?) struck a deal with Walt Disney Home Video to distribute discs -- that's when the titles offered began to be tailored to the film collectors who made up the bulk of the laser market, resulting in those great Walt Disney Archive Collection laser disc sets, remastered titles and older live action films, etc. WDHV still had knowledgable Walt Disney folks on the payroll in those days that provided insider insight on what the fans wanted to see and the lawyers didn't seem to get too involved in the choices of extras (as some of those things have not been seen since).

If it weren't for the fact that filmmakers and video execs of the day collected LD themselves and Disney insiders as well as consumers/fans hadn't nagged to get this stuff available, it never would have happened - - and it really came about because Pioneer/Image picked up the ball to partner from the outside with Disney to make and market these things to the correct consumer.

[2099net]

It's odd, because Universal was an avid supporter of HD-DVD, but currently they really are pushing the envelope when it comes to BD supplements - especially BD-Live. They're the only company really showing what BD-Live can do (you know my Funny People BD loads up different, up-to date previews each time I play it before showing the menu. They're even skippable too!)

You know, when BDLive was originally announced, updatable previews was the first thing I thought of (just seemed like a no-brainer). I don't own any Universal Blus, only rented Coraline once and saw their generic menu, but I'm really glad to hear someone is taking advantage of the hardware. Sounds like an awesome feature.

Their BD-Live portal on the newer discs is superb too - a vast improvement on their first discs and leaps and bounds ahead of anybody elses. Very iTunesy.

Now if only Universal would step up their catalog titles. They have some of my favorites: Universal Monsters (The Phantom of the Opera, Dracula, Frankenstein, The Mummy, The Invisible Man, The Wolf Man, and The Creature from the Black Lagoon), the Hitchcock's (The Birds, Psycho, Rear Window, Vertigo, etc.), the Back to the Future trilogy, and some of Spielberg's best (Jaws, E.T., Jurassic Park, etc.) but have failed to release them (heck, I would've picked up King Kong if it wasn't barebones).

RE: King Kong. It's not barebones - it has both edits, a commentary and PiP features (some production diaries and concept art). Yes, I too can't understand why they didn't just throw in a second disc for the DVD content. I would say future double-dipping, but then why bother with the seamless branching of both edits?

RE: Spielberg's titles. You won't see these gems until Spielberg decides the format big enough.

RE: Hitchcock - A new supplement for Psycho was classified by the BBFC recently. Its possible we may see Hitchcock's films on BD sooner than you think - I can't imagine the DVD getting another re-release over here.

As for the generic menu, I'll get to that later.

Besides Disney, I own a Fox (The Day the Earth Stood Still) and 2 Warners (The Searchers, Casablanca) and I have to say that Warner is the absolute worst. They do fantastic restorations and transfers, sometimes with a wealth of extras but they don't do a single thing to take advantage of the hardware besides using the capacity of the discs. Their menus are terrible, even more plain then the DVDs, and none of them use BDLive. Quite frankly, Disney makes the nicest Blus (at least of the ones I own).

Warners do use BD-Live - its on a number of their titles - mainly current box office hits - just not all of them. Being as they generally don't have anything of use on the titles which do support it, its not great loss.

As for Warners Menus, I actually prefer them. I like Universal's menu the best - simple to use, always the same - you know where everything is, how it works and even how the advanced features (such as bookmarking and time-lines) work without messing about looking for instructions or straining your eyes looking for menu options, deciding when an option is selected or when an option is unselected etc. Warners too, while each having different backdrops and fonts also have a consistent design and function.

Disney's menus are the same with the three column layout most of their titles use, but for some reason they sometimes completely abandon the format. I don't know for example why Snow White didn't use this format - while it may only take moments, I resent having to "learn" how to use a different menu. And as for BD-Live, Disney can't even be bothered to turn it on for countries outside the US! Even Warners do more!

I personally rate Universal's Blus ahead of Disney's. Lots of Universal releases come with multiple edits, U-Control has evolved (mainly through their earlier HD-DVD releases) into something easy to use and understand while offering advanced features (especially the newer Take Control discs), BD-Live is available worldwide and genuinely seems to be advancing what can and cannot be done using the system. As for the discs, Universal discs feature high-bit rate transfers, plenty of extras (often porting most/all of the DVDs) and often enhanced by U-Control.

And Universal were the last major studio to sign with Blu-ray - but IMO have done the most.