Tangled (Live-Action)

[Lavendergolden]

In my opinion Lilly was amazing as Cinderella. She's very elegant and graceful

She played the part well but was not pretty enough. She was able to embody the character though.

The actresses afterwards are just as plain if not outright ugly and failed to embody their characters. Actually the ones before Lily as well because I think Elle Fanning was the most hideous and wretched Aurora of all time.

[Lavendergolden]

Alright, fair enough. But still it wasn`t a outright flop either.

Ignore that user. They are spreading a heinous agenda and since my time here, I've noticed that user posts the same garbage rhetoric in just about every thread. Not even letting poor Winnie the Pooh go free from his race rhetoric and pollution. He is absolutely lying and giving you false information so do not give in to such deviousness. Tangled was a hit and Disney's biggest hit since Tarzan. That trash film that "individual" keeps promoting was not a hit and never will be and he will go to his grave fighting this truth but will never succeed. I know you are a sensible person and will not believe that nonsense but it was my duty to inform you not to fall for the propaganda.

After already culturally appropriating German culture for the evils of the swinging era and Jim Crow era, such wicked people are not content and now have to try and discount the success of a classically German tale that was true to its culture and not blackwashed.

Let me also tell you this. I checked the rankings of the Disney movie albums from the 90s onward and how they scored (Diamond, Platinum, Gold). This is the list (some changed over time like Mermaid became a much higher Platinum when the album was re-released in the 2000s but I'm only recording what it was at the time of release). Note which garbage film does not even rank because its soundtrack was not popular at all and failed to chart. Disgusting film which deserves the gutter where it lies.

1x Diamond - The Lion King
8x Platinum - Frozen
3x Platinum - Beauty and the Beast / Aladdin / Pocahontas / Moana
2x Platinum - Tarzan / Frozen II
1x Platinum - The Little Mermaid / The Hunchback of Notre Dame / Lilo & Stitch / Tangled / Encanto
1x Gold - Hercules
0.5x Gold - Mulan / Enchanted

[Lavendergolden]

I argue it wasn’t when it failed to break even at 2.5X its budget ($650M WW on a $260M budget. Hence why I argue Lilo & Stitch and The Princess and the Frog were actual hits because they broke even and/or tripled their budgets.

It's a weird argument to make. Do you think that Disney doesn't take into consideration the reason why Tangled's budget was so huge? Do you think that they don't take into consideration that Tangled still grossed the most since The Lion King (unadjusted).

They literally were giving up on Fairytales and Princess movies after The Princess and the Frog, Tangled changed that. Tangled revived The Snow Queen and turned it into Frozen and CGI.
And as much as I prefer The Princess and the Frog, I do not doubt that Tangled had greater longevity. Third after Frozen and Moana, and most Princess fans or Disney Renaissance fans would prefer it to the other two.

You can look it up here in the several Tangled threads from when the movie came up and see people's reaction back then.

Yes, you are 1000% correct. Thank you for fighting the moronic nature of jealous evildoers who try and steal Germanic culture for their warped American propaganda.

You seem to be an established member on here so you're saying what I've been saying and will not get hate for it like I have. So I support your post because it proves we are not the race-obsessed minority like those quacks and we are in the right.

I disagree with your preference of film though. I'm shocked someone as like-minded as you seem to be would prefer that garbage but at least you are honest enough to admit that Tangled had greater longevity and would be preferred by Disney fans and Disney Renaissance fans. I hope in time you will see the error of your ways and join the rest of us as your presence belongs in our company.

I will also look through old threads as per your mention, just to validate our victory, because we both know we are in the right and the moral majority. It doesn't shock me that there are historical records online of which film was more loved and successful and which one completely failed and was invisible until woke Disney's perverted agenda kept trying to push it over and over after 2020. Some people have nothing better to do than pollute threads for beautiful Disney movies with that blackwashed film so I commend you for fighting the good fight and fighting tyranny of the race-obsessed. I hope you're as enthusiastic about Tangled's live-action casting as the rest of us are (and that itself is further proof we're in the right because Tangled is getting a LA remake and considered successful enough to justify box office results. Flop frog will never get one and will languish in the pits of Tartarus forever).

[Disney's Divinity]

Wow are these posts creepy and disturbing. So much hollow vitriol and demonization, gross. I'm just wondering how far this goes. Are the mods going to let them post death threats next?

[Disney Duster]

Yes, I agree Divinity.

I am sorry, Lavendergolden, we have a lot in common and you are nice to me but you are not nice about race and stuff. Was Walt Disney's Cinderella being set in France with the American New Look-inspired gown for the title character cultural appropriation of the German Aschenputtel? Was Walt Disney's Sleeping Beauty being set in medieval France cultural appropriation of the German Dornröschen?

[Lavendergolden]

I am sorry, Lavendergolden, we have a lot in common and you are nice to me but you are not nice about race and stuff. Was Walt Disney's Cinderella being set in France with the American New Look-inspired gown for the title character cultural appropriation of the German Aschenputtel? Was Walt Disney's Sleeping Beauty being set in medieval France cultural appropriation of the German Dornröschen?

I am being honest about race. I think people blindly following this flop film are the ones who are really racist, especially as they tried to hijack the Tangled thread! Tangled is a German classic fairy tale but pests are trying to turn it into the frog thread so I must combat that. Isn't it enough they ruined a German classic fairy tale, The Frog Prince, and now they want to ruin Rapunzel as well? Not on my watch and all good Disney fans should support me on this. Many have already said they do but are afraid of recrimination here because they have been bullied in the past (no surprise who that someone is).

Charles Perrault's Cinderella was French and older than the German Grimms Brothers version. Also Walt's Cinderella even says in the title card to be based off of the Charles Perrault version. Sleeping Beauty, the Perrault version, is also older than the Grimms Brothers version. Perrault lived in the 1600s while the Grimms Brothers lived in the 1700s. Walt's Sleeping Beauty also credits the Perrault French version and uses the Russian ballet which uses the French theming and has all the Perrault characters appear at Sleeping Beauty's wedding (Cinderella, Puss in Boots, White Cat, Red Riding Hood) because they are all distinctly French tales. You also need to remember that Germany and France are right next door. They share elements of culture and stories. Just like how England and France are next door and they have shared regions, territories, and stories. King Arthur is part of French culture as well as England. The Norse gods are Germanic but also Scandinavian. Arabian Nights are shared in the Middle East, Persia, Egypt, South Asia like India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, etc. Much of Japanese culture came from China's Tang Dynasty. Some countries and cultures are inherently linked. Grimms Brothers Frog Prince was never linked to 1920s Jim Crow America.

People are upset with my posts without actually acknowledging the content which means they realize I have the truth and stats on my side but do not want to admit it so they ignore that and just make short posts about feeling upset. The truth should upset. Later I think I will post screenshots of what one of my black friends has posted about the movie so you can see what genuine black sentiment is towards how racist and oppressive this film is, created by an all white crew and directors and writers and songwriters, with no input from the black diaspora. But that does not belong in this thread which has already been hijacked. The only people who are being offended here seem to be white which tells me they are not ready to be schooled on race and understanding that the content they like is racist and outdated. That they can only tolerate black people as frogs for 80% of their movies. Very suspicious here.

[Disney Duster]

Cinderella and Sleeping Beauty both took elements from the German Grimm's version of their tales. So why can't a film set in America take elements from a German story? I mean even many Germans came to America over time.

[Disney's Divinity]

Nobody here had any control over The Frog Prince having a Black protagonist in the Disney film TP&TF, do you think this forum runs the company? I'm pretty sure that film was announced as The Frog Princess with a Black cast of characters from the jump, it wasn't like they announced The Frog Prince with a White cast and then it was changed to have a Black cast because people pushed for it. Much less are "most" here pushing for a racebent version of Tangled? I'm not sure what you could base that on. And I'm pretty sure it's the only film with a Black character that becomes a frog, it's not like there are multiple frog-transforming films out there.... Frogs are only a part of the story because of the fairy tale not because they thought Black people are only worthy of being frogs, like what are you even talking about?

[Lavendergolden]

Cinderella and Sleeping Beauty both took elements from the German Grimm's version of their tales. So why can't a film set in America take elements from a German story? I mean even many Germans came to America over time.

Such as? Please name some examples. And even so, as I said, the Cinderella and Sleeping Beauty tales are shared between France and Germany. They were in France first but they spread to Germany because both countries are neighbors.

And the problem is that a classically German tale is being transplanted not just in America but in the most virulently racist period of American history. Actually scratch that. It's the most virulently racist because America is always virulently racist. They were racist when they genocided the Native Americans before the name America even existed, they were racist during the Trail of Tears, they were racist when they brought slavery to America and kept up slavery when the rest of the world abolished it, they are still racist when one of your nurses has been accused of breaking the bones of black babies in the ICU. That is 2025 today and this nurse was not only caught but it turns out she had a past history of this. She was forgiven and allowed to come back to work and resume her activity in torturing black babies in the ICU. So really your country has always been hell for black people. I won't even go into incarceration towards Japanese during WWII, the anti-immigrant laws towards China and now towards Latinos, etc. I have digressed now. Back to what you asked me. A classically German fairy tale has been brought into America, a country that has no king or kingdom. Why should The Frog Prince, a story about a princess, a prince, and the princess' father, be transplanted to a monarchless (and cultureless) country? The story doesn't work. I won't get into the demonization of voodoo, the optics of New Orleans after Katrina, a black character being turned into a frog for 80% of her film, the lack of a black director, songwriter, writer, etc. You're a Christian right from some of the stuff you said? Would you feel happy if a movie made Christians out to be fanatical black magic villains and their worship of Jesus is really worship of the devil? How do you think voodoo practitioners, who are predominantly black feel? The ironic part is that many voodoo practitioners are also Christians and the two faiths are intermixed for them as voodoo features many Christian elements but I guess it's too ethnic and scary for mainstream Americans who see it as something savage and foreign.

[Lavendergolden]

Nobody here had any control over The Frog Prince having a Black protagonist in the Disney film TP&TF, do you think this forum runs the company? I'm pretty sure that film was announced as The Frog Princess with a Black cast of characters from the jump, it wasn't like they announced The Frog Prince with a White cast and then it was changed to have a Black cast because people pushed for it. Much less are "most" here pushing for a racebent version of Tangled? I'm not sure what you could base that on. And I'm pretty sure it's the only film with a Black character that becomes a frog, it's not like there are multiple frog-transforming films out there.... Frogs are only a part of the story because of the fairy tale not because they thought Black people are only worthy of being frogs, like what are you even talking about?

That is precisely the issue. The Frog Prince is a Germanic tale of a German king, princess, and cursed prince. It should never have been set in America or Africa or China or New Zealand. It's like setting Mulan in Cuba or Jungle Book in Japan. This was part of an agenda from the get-go. I'm surprised you defend the racial recasting because from posts I've read in this thread, it seems you aren't a fan of the recasting in Mermaid. I agree with you there 100%. So I don't get why that's bad but what was done to The Frog Prince is good. Because it's the same exact issue. The issue isn't black people turning into frogs in multiple films. It's black people turning into non-human characters over and over like Soul, Spies in Disguise, etc. These are very dangerous tropes and are literally described as dehumanizing. When white folks are saying they prefer a movie where the black lead is turned into a non-black character, you know there is a problem.



It's not just black characters. It's ethnic minorities in general like Brother Bear and The Emperor's New Groove. 3 major examples all from the 2000s era of Disney.

[Disney's Divinity]

There wasn't a racial "recasting," the film began as a cast of Black characters. None of the Disney films are exactly like the fairytale--Aladdin was not set in the Middle East, for example--so it not having a cast of White characters simply because the story is "Germanic" or whatever does not bother me. That's not the same as taking a film and changing the design in a direct remake like a racebent Rapunzel would be.

Black characters transforming is something that has become a trope since it's happened several times sonce TP&TF, but you made it about frogs themselves being offensive in particular. I don't think Brother Bear or TENG are films that exemplify that problem as much as films like Soul and that film with Will Smith as an agent who transforms into a bird that came after TP&TF.

[Lavendergolden]

There wasn't a racial "recasting," the film began as a cast of Black characters. None of the Disney films are exactly like the fairytale--Aladdin was not set in the Middle East, for example--so it not having a cast of White characters simply because the story is "Germanic" or whatever does not bother me.

Black characters transforming is something that has become a trope since it's happened several times sonce TP&TF, but you made it about frogs themselves being offensive in particular.

It is a recasting because the fairy tale is set in German with a German cast. It's not all about remakes you know. Disney has had sins before the remakes. I've already addressed the Aladdin example in a prior thread with a different user. You can seek my answer there.

Frogs are offensive because they're not beautiful, idealized creatures. European princesses get swans. They get their Snow Whites and Sleeping Beauties. The black princess got a frog with a joke about mucus as the punchline which was offensive not just to black people but also French people because frog is a slur to the French. So is it a coincidence that the setting is French inspired as New Orleans has French culture? I wouldn't be shocked if it's all linked to demean many proud peoples. I won't get into the voodoo story again because that's another can of worms I've already discussed.

[Disney's Divinity]

An adaptation of a fairy tale and a direct remake of a finished film come with different expectations, so, no, they aren't the same.

And frogs are only used as the transformed form because the fairy tale was about a human transformed into a frog, not because they deliberately chose frogs because they are unglamorous... Frogs slur the French, what?

[Pokenonbinary]

I keep wanting Avantika or Maitreyi Ramakrishnan

And also Cher as Mother Gothel (or a romani/jewish actress

Oh and a romani Flynn Rider since that was the original idea in the concept art

[Disney Duster]

Lavendergolden, did you mean examples of German people coming to America? I have an American friend who's family is German, as one example, and I cannot actually name other examples but I know others have come, I'm sure Googling about it would yield results.

If you meant what examples of the German stories were used in Walt's Cinderella and Sleeping Beauty, in Cinderella the birds, the stepmother being the main villain over the sisters, the stepmother saying Cinderella could go to the ball if she did some tasks, and the animals helping her are all from the German Grimms. In Sleeping Beauty, the name Briar Rose and the story ending right after the princess awakens is from the German Grimms.

As for the tales being French first, actually all the original fairy tales were from oral tradition first, and the Grimms were recoding the German versions of the stories passed down from before the French versions were published.

The Princess and the Frog was adapted from a book called the Frog Prince that only uses elements of the German tale of the Frog Prince. They make modern American-set versions of Cinderella all the time, are they cultural appropriation? No, they are not.

And The Frog Prince was also from oral tradition, with some possible Roman, not just German, influences!

And about the voodoo being seen as evil satanic stuff, they researched that you can use voodoo for good or bad and they never said Facilier worshipped Satan. Yes I would not like if someone said Christianity was evil but truth is people use that for good or evil every day.

[Farerb]

Now I see people claiming Demi Moore is going to be Mother Gothel. Every day there's a different rumor, all these "insiders" don't know anything.

They should just cast Idina Menzel. She looks the part and can sing (when it's not live).

Edit: No, forget about Menzel. You know who they should cast? Eden Espinosa. She's better than Menzel and it would be a nice homage to fans of the TV series.

[Thumper_93]

They should stop making this film but knowin them it won't happen. So I'm with you Indina would be great for the rol.

[Farerb]

They should stop making this film but knowin them it won't happen. So I'm with you Indina would be great for the rol.

I actually think this is the one remake that can be improved:
- Casting actors who can actually sing, and not pop singers, but ones who have Broadway training.
- Allow Menken and Slater turn it into an actual musical with more songs and maybe even improve the original music.
- Remove the outdated 2000s DreamWorks humor and make the movie more sincere with a serious tone like the original fairytale. That means downplaying the roles of Pascal and Maximus, they wouldn't work as well in live action.
- Name this movie "Rapunzel".

The Disney cruise stage version did some improvements even though the pacing was off because it's only one hour:
https://youtu.be/XFiQWzU5wSQ?si=H240AJ2CSIQ6C9wK

[Thumper_93]

They should stop making this film but knowin them it won't happen. So I'm with you Indina would be great for the rol.

I actually think this is the one remake that can be improved:
- Casting actors who can actually sing, and not pop singers, but ones who have Broadway training.
- Allow Menken and Slater turn it into an actual musical with more songs and maybe even improve the original music.
- Remove the outdated 2000s DreamWorks humor and make the movie more sincere with a serious tone like the original fairytale. That means downplaying the roles of Pascal and Maximus, they wouldn't work as well in live action.
- Name this movie "Rapunzel".

The Disney cruise stage version did some improvements even though the pacing was off because it's only one hour:
https://youtu.be/XFiQWzU5wSQ?si=H240AJ2CSIQ6C9wK

Yes they could make a great job but I don't trust them too much. I would prefeer a whole new version of the fairy tale but that's not possible.
I'm going to watch the video, thanks for the link!

[PatchofBlue]

See, for me, the "Dreamworks humor" actually serves some kind of function in this story. That becomes part of the thematic dialogue between him and Rapunzel. Flynn is smug and self-aware in contrast to Rapunzel's genuineness and vivacity. Flynn thinks he is better off for his approach, but as he gets to know Rapunzel better, he can't help but peel those layers away and reveal a more authentic version of himself as her worldview starts to reveal its strengths and resilience.

And that was kind of the state of mind of the audience in 2010. They didn't really know how to approach a classic fairy-tale straight, so they had to have Flynn act as a sort of intercessor.

Flynn's purpose in this movie in some ways reminds me of Grumpy in Snow White: he's there to represent a portion of the audience that isn't really onboard with the sentimentality at the start and create some kind of interplay between the two opposing attitudes of the audience, ultimately helping them arrive at a place of sincerity by the end.