Walt Disney Princess Academy (Short Fan Film Project)

[Disney's Divinity]

I'm not sure what you mean here?

I'm asking how the type of person can be most important to you when you're watching someone's film/reading their book/etc. etc. when you don't even know these people except what filters down to you via Internet conversations and clips on entertainment shows.

I don't think the people judging are the ones that should be on trial here. What I think shouldn't be excused is a person's negative personality.

Are we living in 200 BC? Do people need to be punished based on what you perceive to be negative personality traits? If you're so willing to put someone else on trial when you've never even met them, you should put yourself up for the same treatment, right?

I use "you," because technically you and I are included in the "people."

[SWillie!]

I'm asking how the type of person can be most important to you when you're watching someone's film/reading their book/etc. etc. when you don't even know these people except what filters down to you via Internet conversations and clips on entertainment shows.

I don't think you hold the internet in high enough importance. Just because it's "just the internet" doesn't mean that someone should conduct themselves any differently than they would in person.

Are we living in 200 BC? Do people need to be punished based on what you perceive to be negative personality traits? If you're so willing to put someone else on trial when you've never even met them, you should put yourself up for the same treatment, right?

That's a fair comment. I don't think he ought to be "punished", but I think he ought to know that the way he carries himself online has turned people off of him. Again, I think you're putting too much differentiation on knowing someone personally and knowing them online. They should not be separate things, in my opinion.

If someone came on this forum and was rude, arrogant, or what have you... would you want them around? I wouldn't... even though I don't know them in person. That's all I'm saying. People shouldn't carry themselves in a negative manner, no matter whether it's online, in person, publicly, privately, etc etc.

[Disney's Divinity]

Again, I think you're putting too much differentiation on knowing someone personally and knowing them online. They should not be separate things, in my opinion.

But they are, which is my entire point. What you perceive personally is not necessarily reality. Regardless, it does not have anything to do with their work.

[SWillie!]

Again, I think you're putting too much differentiation on knowing someone personally and knowing them online. They should not be separate things, in my opinion.

But they are, which is my entire point. What you perceive personally is not necessarily reality. Regardless, it does not have anything to do with their work.

They aren't separate. It's not like he plays a character online. That's him. You're right that what I perceive personally isn't necessarily reality, but what he's writing is, and the fact that it turns people away is. Your online presence is just as important as your real life presence in today's world.

And again, while objectively it has nothing to do with their work, is does have an affect on people's perception of them... and in extension, on their work.

I think you've convinced me again that you are secretly David K haha

[TsWade2]

The artwork is obviously top-notch but how are they supposed to animated this? Are they going to hire a small studio? That's very expensive. Do they even have the funding?

EDIT: I know learn that the project has been cancelled. Figures. It was very naive of them to think that Disney would even consider this project.

They should have raised funds and produced it independently if they cared for the project that much.

There is no way the Mouse would allow that! They'd be sued to infinity and beyond the minute they started looking for funding!

Sad, but true.

[Super Aurora]

Hitler had an amazing charismatic and leadership skills. Also was a very effective ruler too. Does that mean I love Hitler now because of his actual good skills and craftsmanship, even if I don't know him personally?



No.


He's still an evil asshole.













please stfu now, DD. Your arguments sucks.

[Sotiris]

I have never found Walt Disney appealing personally, but I haven't bothered to delve much into him as a person because I DON'T CARE. And there's no reason why I should. Would Pinocchio suddenly no longer be a masterpiece if the creator was a complete prick?

What a person is like has nothing to do with the quality of their work or their abilities.

Well said. People need to distinguish between one's professional achievements and their character. Sure, it would be ideal for one to have a great personality and be great at what they do but when that's not the case that certainly doesn't negate their accomplishments, skills or their talent.

Besides, this is very subjective to begin with. What some may find as a negative quality in one's character, others may find it as a positive one. It's a matter of perception.

Thankfully, I don't personally associate the films directly with Walt, as I know how much of a joint effort they were, and so any one person isn't going to affect my opinion on them as much as something done by a single artist.

I'm not certain that's entirely accurate. While filmmaking is necessarily a collaborative endeavour, the artists working for Walt were merely executing his ideas and his vision. It was always about what Walt wanted and how he wanted it.

It's not like he plays a character online. That's him.

Not necessarily. People, especially online, often put on a persona for various reasons.

Also, does anyone else feel like David Kawena is a bit conceited? I've seen some if his interactions with others on DA and facebook and overall he just comes across as rather self righteous and immodest.

I haven't looked at his page in a long time, but I also remember getting very negative vibes from him. There's a difference between knowing that's you're talented and letting everyone know that you know that.

It's really bad spreading rumors without any evidence. It can ruin reputations. So, if people want to throw accusations left and right about someone, I'm going to need some proof to believe that they're telling the truth.

[Disney's Divinity]

I think you've convinced me again that you are secretly David K haha

I'm convinced you only dislike him because of his opinions on 3D, tbh. If this had been John Lasseter's name instead, for instance, you would probably have given an entirely different response.

And again, while objectively it has nothing to do with their work, is does have an affect on people's perception of them... and in extension, on their work.

And it shouldn't. Part of being rational is being objective.

Besides, this is very subjective to begin with. What some may find as a negative quality in one's character, others may find it as a positive one. It's a matter of perception.

Exactly. Undisputed facts (like the Holocaust... Wth at that comparison) is not in any way the same as gossip on a fan forum. Even on this fan forum, some people I dislike are liked by others and vice versa.

please stfu now, DD.

Thank you for proving my point, as always. You're the last person to be the judge of whether or not someone else is an arrogant asshole.

[Super Aurora]

please stfu now, DD.

Thank you for proving my point, as always. You're the last person to be the judge of whether or not someone else is an arrogant asshole.

I didn't prove your point at all. Your point was that what someone act like, and what someone accomplish is two entire separate things and that one should never be taken into account because of another- in this case shouldn't judge D kwana's art just because of personality- correct?

While to some extant that's true and no one here is arguing that. what Willie pointing out and to lesser extent me as well, is that while that above standpoint does holds points, at the same time, if that person's personality is revealed to be a prick, it does lessen hold much you respect or give creditability to that person. You still to some extent respect or at least acknowledge that person's talent or accomplishments, but you don't hold it to the same value as you once did. no matter how much you want to deny it, the revealing of the star's personality in negative light does also change your own perception of how you view their work and accomplishments. You don't see it the same way you've seen it before.

here's an another example from a friend of mine,
He's a big batman/DC Comic guy, and was a fan of the Adam West stuff since he grew up with that. The show, while corny, did help push in the popularity and iconic status and thus to many circles have been respected show to many, Adam West including. So when he finally did get to meet him, he was shock/surprise to find that West was nasty and a arrogant snob to him and other fans. Since then he doesn't seem to look at the 60's batman show the same way he use to.

When you look up to someone( a role model/star) or at first seems to find someone great due to their well talents, only to be revealed to you, something that impact to you yourself, to be someone he's not what you originally believe him/her to be, it will change and affect how you later on perceive that person and even their work, even when you'd say or others say that you shouldn't group a person's talent/skills and their personality together.




That's what Willie was trying to say. I don't think you get that.



OH and also,

You're the last person to be the judge of whether or not someone else is an arrogant asshole.

I'm the last person? Why don't you ask some of the members like Duster, Disneyboy2022, Pap64, PrincePhillipfan etc that?

You thought I was an arrogant asshole just because is said "stfu"? no seriously. I said that because:

1.I'm blunt and straightforward to people and don't pamper with words and such to get my point out

2. you seems to have this perceive notion that what some people say about a circumstance is most definitely false that that your deductions is most definitely correct hence why despite you saying you could care less, as quoted below, you seems to feel the need to argue out against the norm. Judging from the posts here and even outside of this one, you act almost like Lazario.

Since I'll never actually meet him, I could care less what he's like--or why it's important that you like someone in order to enjoy their work.

I haven't read his interactions with fans so I can't say where you've got the impression, but I don't think knowing how talented you are/how much you've learned counts as conceited though, unless you're insecure.

you care less yet you go on on this?

Also you don't seem to know the mentality of some of em in DA who grow in ego just from some popularity they grew on a shit art site. Enigmawing knows, I know, Swillie knows. All three also are artist too. We can tell with this short of thing such as one like D. Kwanwa

Besides, this is very subjective to begin with. What some may find as a negative quality in one's character, others may find it as a positive one. It's a matter of perception.

Exactly. Undisputed facts (like the Holocaust... Wth at that comparison) is not in any way the same as gossip on a fan forum. Even on this fan forum, some people I dislike are liked by others and vice versa.

The Hitler comparison was my fault as it wasn't a strong comparison. I should of used my friend's example instead had I thought of it atm. With that being said What Sotris is true, but that's not what we're arguing about. First off, Jay brought Kwana because he was involved with this project i think and then brought up his ego. I and later SWillie can in and nodded in agreement, having experience to seeing his posts and what he says. You admitted not knowing the person yet saying what we said is fault. that's where this you started to diverse into this crap. So yes what Sotris said is true but from what we experince gives us a negative connotation on the guy, i dunno why you should give a crap and state otherwise.

So, I said it before and i'll say it again, stfu with this crap and just move on. You brought this up, now try ending it by moving on.

[Sotiris]

I'm convinced you only dislike him because of his opinions on 3D, tbh.

Hmm, it did cross my mind too especially since the only people who actually gave examples as to why they dislike him (JustOneBite87 and pap64) were both referring to this Tangled/3D incident which I personally find absurd.

[SWillie!]

I'm not certain that's entirely accurate. While filmmaking is necessarily a collaborative endeavour, the artists working for Walt were merely executing his ideas and his vision. It was always about what Walt wanted and how he wanted it.

That's true, but I still personally associate the films more with the studio as a whole, more than any individual. When we start to get more to individual level within the studio, say looking at individual shots, I then start to take into account a person's character. For example, when viewing Glen Keane's work, the fact that he's all around an incredibly genuine person, teacher, mentor, etc, adds to my love for his art. On the other hand, while there's no arguing that Milt Kahl was an incredible animator, arguably the best of the nine old men, I'd rather watch something from Ollie or Frank, because I know that Milt was kind of an asshole who felt he was too good for any of the other artists there, and he was hard to work with.

It's not like he plays a character online. That's him.

Not necessarily. People, especially online, often put on a persona for various reasons.

You're right, but in this case he isn't. He's presenting himself as "David Kawena" as opposed to something like "DisneyHeroesArt79". This is is professional online presence, and I feel he should carry himself professionally.

It's really bad spreading rumors without any evidence. It can ruin reputations. So, if people want to throw accusations left and right about someone, I'm going to need some proof to believe that they're telling the truth.

That's fair. While I honestly don't care enough to go through and find heaps of proof, one example on his Flynn Rider piece: "Yes, those lanterns took days to create!" While first off, that probably isn't true (unless he's talking about mere minutes of work per day), it just comes off to me as "you lowly followers, you have no idea how hard it is to do what I do." Or he'll sometimes mention how he's having a hard time drawing lately, and nothing is going his way. That, to me, is simply fishing for compliments. (To be fair, having just looked at his Facebook page where he is now more active than on his DA, he seems to have stopped that recently).

While I'm not siding with SA, as I don't agree with his "stfu your arguments suck" approach, he did bring up an interesting point: the fact that those of us that are pushed away by his personality are artists ourselves. I think that's worth taking into consideration. Throughout school, I've come across plenty of people just like David Kawena, who like to point out how hard they worked on something, or who constantly act insecure in their art, looking for confirmation from people - "noo, you're not going through a rough patch in your art, you're great! I don't know what you're talking about!"

That whole persona is just so annoying to me. It happens A LOT on deviantart and now tumblr. Anything that creates a big fan following. The same way that turns me off in real life, it turns me off online.

I'm convinced you only dislike him because of his opinions on 3D, tbh. If this had been John Lasseter's name instead, for instance, you would probably have given an entirely different response.

It's not his opinions on 3D that bother me, it's the way he presents them. He does so in a snobby sort of "it will just never be the same, 3d artists aren't 'real' artists" sort of way. There's nothing wrong with personally liking one medium more than another, but to put others down is just arrogant, to me. But you're right, that has formed a big part of my perception of him.

At the end of the day, it's not like I despise the guy. He's obviously got talent and it isn't like he's an asshole or anything. Just the little things that I mentioned rub me in the wrong direction, that's all.

[Super Aurora]

Looking back at what I posted, I'm going to apoligize to DD for being rude. While usually i'm upfront about what I say, I think it seems I'm attacking him rudely in what I say.

So to that, I'm sorry DD.



But yes, what Swillie said also holds true to our points.

David is kinda like .....John K. LOL yeah definitely like John K. lol

[SWillie!]

DEFINITELY like John K. Can't stand that guy or his art.

[SWillie!]

DEFINITELY like John K. Can't stand that guy or his art.

Come on, he can't be that bad.

Yeah that's too harsh a comparison. Hopefully David Kawena never becomes anything like John K. Hopefully no one ever becomes anything like John K.

[Disney Duster]

I am coming in to say Super Aurora isn't an arrogant asshole and...

I have to agree that you shouldn't dislike a person's art just because you dislike the person. I am ashamed that Walt helped blacklist people and may have been racist and sexist but I love what he created. I think John K's an ass but I love his art. However, it seems a lot of people can't help what they know about a person effecting their feelings on their work...so...what can be done? : /

[Kyle]

Come on, he can't be that bad.

Yeah that's too harsh a comparison. Hopefully David Kawena never becomes anything like John K. Hopefully no one ever becomes anything like John K.

I'll preface this by saying I know noting about this guy beyond the art posted. I have no idea how he conducts himself. But come on, Hilter comparisons are fine but John K is too harsh? John k might be stubborn and full of himself, but as far as I'm concerned he has the talent to back it up a lot of the time. Some of his art is a bit on the rude side, even for me, but generally I love his art and what he stands for and actually look up to the guy, even if some of our tastes are a bit different. Ive learned quite a bit about basic principals through his blog.

I would love to see proof of the guy (David? is that the name of the guy we're talking about?) being as bad as you guys say he is. I don't exactly doubt that a DA superstar would act like some diva, Ive seen enough of it to know it happens, I just haven't seen it with him personally yet.

[SWillie!]

Yeah that's too harsh a comparison. Hopefully David Kawena never becomes anything like John K. Hopefully no one ever becomes anything like John K.

I'll preface this by saying I know noting about this guy beyond the art posted. I have no idea how he conducts himself. But come on, Hilter comparisons are fine but John K is too harsh? John k might be stubborn and full of himself, but as far as I'm concerned he has the talent to back it up a lot of the time. Some of his art is a bit on the rude side, even for me, but generally I love his art and actually look up to the guy, even if some of our tastes are a bit different.

I would love to see proof of the guy (David? is that the name of the guy we're talking about?) being as bad as you guys say he is. I don't exactly doubt that a DA superstar would act like some diva, Ive seen enough of it to know it happens, I just haven't seen it with him personally yet.

Now, come on... I never agreed with the Hitler comparison. That's a whole different thing. I also don't think SA was meaning to compare the two individuals, just trying to make a point about the idea of a persons personality in relation to their talent or skill in something.

[Kyle]

I know it was super, not you doing the comparison, I just take issue with people using Hitler as their go to scapegoat every time someone has a minor quibble about something. Cant stop Godwin's law I suppose. Super seems to acknowledge the mistake so I'll just let that part of it go.

I just included your quote for a bit of context.

[Super Aurora]

Now, come on... I never agreed with the Hitler comparison. That's a whole different thing. I also don't think SA was meaning to compare the two individuals, just trying to make a point about the idea of a persons personality in relation to their talent or skill in something.

Exactly. Simple reading comprehension here. lol

As for John K. I love his art style and ren and stimpy, but he is still an overinflated egotistical dick and it does in someways not be as interest in his stuff as I used to.

[Sotiris]

But come on, Hilter comparisons are fine but John K is too harsh?

Who said that Hitler comparisons were fine?

John k might be stubborn and full of himself, but as far as I'm concerned he has the talent to back it up a lot of the time. Some of his art is a bit on the rude side, even for me, but generally I love his art.

Good for you. Personally, I find his work revolting. I'm not even going to bother talking about his awful personality.