A new Toontown at WDW (open brainstorming)

[David S.]

Where in DHS would it go? I can't think of anywhere in the park where it would fit.

In this case, I agree with Disney Duster. The only place I can see it being is where it was, a replica anywhere else simply wouldn't be the same for me. I actually also hoped that they would put in more character's houses, like Donald's and Goofy's, while I also hoped that rumours that Pete, Clarabelle Cow and Horace Horsecollar would feature more prominently in the area would be true.

Unfortunately, there is no room for a Toontown in the Magic Kingdom anymore.

Take a look at this overhead shot of the Magic Kingdom:



Fantasyland/Storybook Circus is going to eat up all the remains of Toontown Fair. For the meet-n-greet of Mickey, he's going to be shoehorned into the Town Square Theater on Main Street, right up at the front of the park. The only areas I can think of are:

1. That grassy-area behind the railroad tracks and next to Space Mountain. The problem with this is there's a little river thing going through it and a street that seems to be really close by.

2. I'm pretty sure the area behind the former 20,000 Leagues area is being used. Maybe a bit further back, but it'd be very hard to access.

So what can we do?

There appears to be a big chunk of land WITHIN the railroad tracks partially cut off in the picture. (is that what you are referring to in number 2?) It's behind the CM access road leading to the utilidor entrance, in back of what they are currently building, but within the railroad tracks. This space is larger than the previous Toontown Fair and is large enough to hold a Disneyland-sized Toontown. Surely they could build a bridge either for a midway or for the access road to allow this space to be used (for a new Toontown or anything) if they really wanted to, which would not take up any space currently being used for Cast Members.

When it comes to the idea of space supposedly being an issue at MK, I just don't buy it. Considering they tore down Toad for Pooh in '98 and pretended they had no room THEN to expand Fantasyland, and suddenly POOF - they have all this land they are expanding onto now!

And think of how Disneyland's Fantasyland has far fewer acres than MKs, and still has more attractions than the MKs will have when this "expansion" is finished!

And how Walt built the Disneyland Alice dark ride mostly on TOP of the Toad show building in 1958, squeezing in an extra attraction into Fantasyland rather than closing one.

Magic Kingdom - "The park with a lot more acres than Disneyland, but a lot fewer attractions!"

As for the Studios, there is always space, if they really want to use it. Rumors have been circulating for years of the Backlot Tour's inevitable demise, now that the park is no longer really a working studio. That would free up some land, as would the area currently taken up by Lights, Motors, Action if that ever closes (there have also been a few rumors). Of course, these rumors also indicate that the most likely candidate to use this land, were it to ever be rethemed, would be an expanded Pixar Place, featuring more Pixar attractions and a possible east coast version of Radiator Springs Racers.

Also, I'm pretty sure I read that many of the buildings backstage on the World Drive side of the park are no longer being used, as they were once part of the working studio*. So perhaps a Toontown-type area with even a Roger Rabbit ride (if the rights issues ever get resolved) could fit somewhere back there.

*There is a really good article I read somewhere about the ways Hollywood Studio could expand. I think it was on Progress City USA, but I can't recall for sure.

[Big Disney Fan]

So, again I ask: where can a Toontown in WDW go?

[dizfan]

MK is ten times bigger than DL(in addition to all the other land space own by disney within the area) so surely enough they could try that.

I was going to let this go, but it confused me too much. Did MK grow or did DL shrink all of a sudden? DL is 86 acres and MK is 107 acres.

[DisneyAnimation88]

Unfortunately, there is no room for a Toontown in the Magic Kingdom anymore.

I'm aware of that, what I meant is that there isn't really anywhere else they could put. It just doesn't fit within DHS for me.

Actually, what I really think we should do is as many of us as possible should go to Disney World and protest the removal of Toontown and have the old Toontown come back, and Dumbo's area can just be Dumbo and not the whole big unnecessary Storybook Circus that makes no sense.

It isn't unecessary for all of us and it does make sense; instead of the characters' having holiday homes, they're now part of a travelling circus. Protesting is a bit extreme, it's not like they're laying off hundreds of cast members, they're spending a lot of money to retheme an area.

The ironic thing for me is that if Disney had said to all of us to pick a land that we would be willing to lose as part of a big expansion, I think the majority of us would have said Toontown. I agree it's sad that Mickey and Minnie's houses have gone but for me, if any land had to go, I would have chosen Toontown. Ideally it would have been nice to keep it and have the expansion but personally, I like the plans for the Circus area.

Honestly, and this is going to sound very harsh, but Toontown Fair is gone. It's not coming back, and if in some strange case it were, it would not come back the way that it existed at Magic Kingdom for the past so-many-years. Disney is not going to scuttle the new plans that's already being constructed in order to rebuild a small area that they recently tore down just because a bunch of people throw a protest together. If that were the case, then Mr. Toad's Wild Ride would have been re-instated years ago.

Amen to this.

[Super Aurora]

MK is ten times bigger than DL(in addition to all the other land space own by disney within the area) so surely enough they could try that.

I was going to let this go, but it confused me too much. Did MK grow or did DL shrink all of a sudden? DL is 86 acres and MK is 107 acres.

I was making an exaggeration.

My point was that MK is bigger than DL and should be able to obtain more.

[Big Disney Fan]

Okay, but seriously, where can Toontown go at Walt Disney World now?

[singerguy04]

Why would a Toontown have to be a part of any existing park at all?

What if they built a whole new park themed around Toontown. It could be designed like a small cartoon city with a downtown, suburban area, countryside, industrial area, and so on. Disney would be able to create rides, shops, and attractions based on all of the gang (including some forgotten characters). If they made focus on all the decades the cartoons have existed, the park would appeal to any generation.

[Big Disney Fan]

Why would a Toontown have to be a part of any existing park at all?

What if they built a whole new park themed around Toontown. It could be designed like a small cartoon city with a downtown, suburban area, countryside, industrial area, and so on. Disney would be able to create rides, shops, and attractions based on all of the gang (including some forgotten characters). If they made focus on all the decades the cartoons have existed, the park would appeal to any generation.

While I do agree that WDW could get another park, I don't think that would be it.

[Disney Duster]

Homes for the characters is better and more important than them in a traveling circus because their homes are...well, their homes, where they live, where they come from, so that when we visit Disney World, we feel we are visiting their homes.

[Big Disney Fan]

Homes for the characters is better and more important than them in a traveling circus because their homes are...well, their homes, where they live, where they come from, so that when we visit Disney World, we feel we are visiting their homes.

I'm told that technically, their "real" homes are at Disneyland and that the houses at WDW are vacation homes.

Now, let's just suppose we were to put a Toontown in Hollywood Studios. Where could we house the character meet-n-greets?

[David S.]

Homes for the characters is better and more important than them in a traveling circus because their homes are...well, their homes, where they live, where they come from, so that when we visit Disney World, we feel we are visiting their homes.

I'm told that technically, their "real" homes are at Disneyland and that the houses at WDW are vacation homes.

This idea that their WDW houses were not their "real" homes has been used by some Toontown haters on WDW Magic to justify the houses' removal. Personally, I've always hated this explanation and consider it a "cop out" as a way of saying the homes in MK are less special than the ones at Disneyland. It cheapens the Magic of them. And I get a sense from your other posts that you feel the same way I do. For millions of guests who have enjoyed the homes at WDW and have never been to DL, some hairbrained backstory that only the DL homes are their "real" homes means nothing. As far as these quests are concerned, Mickey's House in Florida is/was his REAL house.

IMO, the "backstory" of one park should not be connected to that of another park at a different resort. By that logic, you could say, "The Jungle Cruise at MK isn't the REAL Jungle Cruise. The one in Disneyland is the real one, since it was first and Walt touched it. The Pirates at MK isn't the real Pirates, the one at DL is better and the original. And neither is the WDW Big Thunder, Tiki Room, Small World, Dumbo, Teacups, Peter Pan's Flight, Haunted Mansion, Railroad, Main Street, and blah blah blah blah blah. These aren't the real ones; the real ones are all at Disneyland".

By that logic, the WDW Magic Kingdom itself isn't the"real" Magic Kingdom. The real and only one is Walt's original Magic Kingdom in Anaheim.

Of course I don't believe that (although I do think DL has more to offer than MK and does a MUCH better job of managing its space than MK). I'm just taking the idea that the WDW Mickey and Minnie Houses weren't their "real homes" to it's logically absurd conclusion!

Now, let's just suppose we were to put a Toontown in Hollywood Studios. Where could we house the character meet-n-greets?

See my earlier post (posted at the exact same time of one of yours) for some ideas.

[Disney Duster]

Well said David S.!

The only thing is, I actually do see a difference between the homes and the rides. The rides are attractions, not exactly the actual homes of the characters, so the characters' houses are actually different.

But as far as I know, they look exactly like their "real" houses would look like, and weren't build with a "vacation" theme in mind.

Come to think of it, you could also say Sleeping Beauty's real home is Disneyland and Cinderella's real home is Disney World and their other castles are just "vacation" castles. Yea, that doesn't work either!

[Big Disney Fan]

Yes, I can see that the forum members at WDWMagic.com are no fans of Toontown Fair. They also keep joking that where the characters live now is on a property off limits to guests. They like the ideas of characters being spread out all over the parks instead of being confined to any one area. They obviously are yearning for the days when (probably since before the 1990s) characters roamed the parks at will. I guess those people think that, at least in terms of the Fab Six, the characters should not be restricted to any one theme.

Anyway, back on topic, I'm not sure about having Toontown in the area currently taken up by the Backlot Tour. It certainly would be able to provide space for it once that area has been removed to clear the way, but what of Lights Motors Action? If you were to look at any map of the park, you would probably see that that area almost touches the tour route. In fact, I seem to recall that LMA area was once the Residential Street area of the tour. Especially if we went with the squash-and-stretch architecture so widespread in any Toontown, it would be quite jarring to go straight from the cartoon area directly to the realistic views of LMA.

Now, in terms of attractions, where can we house meet-n-greets for Mickey and the gang? Here's the thing: I don't want just plain, simple meet-n-greets, where the characters simply stand in front of a wall (Epcot's Character Spots, anyone?). I want something really fancy, something equivalent to Mickey's house or even the Town Square Theater, where Mickey is now being shoehorned into now that Toontown Fair is gone. So what can we do here?

[Disney Duster]

They like the ideas of characters being spread out all over the parks instead of being confined to any one area. They obviously are yearning for the days when (probably since before the 1990s) characters roamed the parks at will. I guess those people think that, at least in terms of the Fab Six, the characters should not be restricted to any one theme.

But you should tell them that they can have the characters all over the parks and also have their houses! Cinderella and Sleeping Beauty go all over the place but they still have their castle homes!

[DisneyAnimation88]

They like the ideas of characters being spread out all over the parks instead of being confined to any one area. They obviously are yearning for the days when (probably since before the 1990s) characters roamed the parks at will. I guess those people think that, at least in terms of the Fab Six, the characters should not be restricted to any one theme.

This is something I agree with. It's not a huge deal to me but I fondly remember when I was younger and spent my first visits to WDW avidly collecting character autographs. I vividly remember seeing Stromboli for the first time at the exit to the Backlot Tour and meeting Robin Hood outside the Haunted Mansion. Now you're unlikely to meet those characters at all, let alone in such random places. I agree that it makes more sense to place characters in areas with a relevent theme but as a child, it was very exciting to know that you could meet a character anywhere at any time. I admit I'm blinded by nostalgia here but I would settle simply for more characters in the parks.

But you should tell them that they can have the characters all over the parks and also have their houses! Cinderella and Sleeping Beauty go all over the place but they still have their castle homes!

That's true. Going slightly off topic, I've always been surprised that Jaq and Gus from Cinderella and Flora, Fauna and Merryweather aren't available for meet-and-greets in the parks.

Anyway, back on topic, I'm not sure about having Toontown in the area currently taken up by the Backlot Tour. It certainly would be able to provide space for it once that area has been removed to clear the way, but what of Lights Motors Action? If you were to look at any map of the park, you would probably see that that area almost touches the tour route. In fact, I seem to recall that LMA area was once the Residential Street area of the tour. Especially if we went with the squash-and-stretch architecture so widespread in any Toontown, it would be quite jarring to go straight from the cartoon area directly to the realistic views of LMA.

For me, I would rather see an expansion of Pixar Place replace the Backlot Tour. If Pixar Place were expanded, they could then remove the Al's Toy Barn meet-and-greet areaand the Backlot Theatre and place something there, though I don't think that land would be large enough for Toontown.

[toonaspie]

Now, in terms of attractions, where can we house meet-n-greets for Mickey and the gang? Here's the thing: I don't want just plain, simple meet-n-greets, where the characters simply stand in front of a wall (Epcot's Character Spots, anyone?). I want something really fancy, something equivalent to Mickey's house or even the Town Square Theater, where Mickey is now being shoehorned into now that Toontown Fair is gone. So what can we do here?

For now the Mickey n Friends meet n greets are being moved to Exposition Hall but I still would be interested in Mickey and Mickey Victorian style homes along Main Street somewhere. That would be nice.

My second choice would be at DHS maybe some cartoonish looking on-the-set actor trailers for Mickey n Friends. I do like the idea of a Toon Studios area at DHS. The park could really use that kind of expansion.

I don't like getting into the semantics of which resort is Mickey's true home. Besides they have a Toontown in Tokyo DL and I doubt it really bothers the Japanese whether or not Mickey Mouse really does live in Tokyo.

EDIT: Whoops. Scratch what I said about Exposition Hall. It looks like Town Square Theater has been confirmed. http://disneyparks.disney.go.com/blog/2 ... gdom-park/

[Big Disney Fan]

My second choice would be at DHS maybe some cartoonish looking on-the-set actor trailers for Mickey n Friends. I do like the idea of a Toon Studios area at DHS. The park could really use that kind of expansion.

I'm not particularly fond of the idea of "Toon Studios". It sounds too plain, almost too generic. And I also don't really like the trailers idea. Again, that sounds too plain, especially when you take into consideration the physical size of trailers, and it just seems to go almost directly to the characters. I really want something much fancier than that, where you have to go through an elaborate queue before meeting up with the characters. I'm actually trying to maybe rid the park of its "studio" identity for good. So what could we do differently?

[Big Disney Fan]

Well, I've really been trying to restrain myself from answering my own question until someone could come up with something that I thought would be good. But apparently, no one has thought of anything, so I guess I might as well provide a solution for my own problem: a Toon hotel. Everyone here likes to joke about how Mickey and the gang "live" at the resort with Toontown Fair closed: that they are living in one of the hotels on property, just like regular guests (some even remark that Mickey's real home away from home is deliberately out of sight and off-limits to guests). In any case, where meet-n-greets are concerned, the only thing I could think of to equal Toontown Fair or even Town Square Theater (which I still don't think fits Mickey at all) that Mickey is being shoehorned into is a Toon-style hotel at the park. But I have a concern with that. Thematically, it makes sense, but shouldn't a hotel have to be a tall one? Maybe nowhere near as tall as the Tower of Terror, but certainly a bit tall. So what do you think of my hotel idea?