Beauty and the Beast: Diamond Edition (October 5th!)

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jpanimation
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Post by jpanimation »

tightlacedboots wrote:So let me get this straight... in the second link, but first set of photos (ie Belle with the sheep, Belle in the grass, etc.) what is the top photo of each from? You said promotional stills... but do those stills look like any dvd/blue ray version out there? That's the coloring I prefer... but I'm worried that they are just advertising that the second of each set is what is on the blu ray Diamond disc. I may be confused...
Those were promotional images released for the Diamond Edition. The originals can be found here:

http://www.mouseinfo.com/forums/movies- ... r-5th.html
Keep in mind these are HUGE images, larger then HD.

To completely answer your question, no, those colors have never been featured on any home release thus far (VHS, LaserDisc, DVD, Blu-ray, Digital Download). I made the comparison out of pure speculation that we may receive those colors on the Diamond Edition, which we didn't. Still, the LaserDisc is the closest representation of that color scheme you will get, if that's your preference. The LaserDisc looks exactly like the top image of the Gaston's tavern comparison.

I would make more comparisons between the LaserDisc (now that I finally have it) and the Diamond Edition (when I rent it) but I'm totally worn out. Me doing the original comparisons was fueled purely by the excitement at the possibility that we may receive the original color scheme with the Diamond Edition release. Now that it's out and we didn't get it, these comparisons just depress me instead of give me hope.
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2099net
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Re: Beauty and the Beast: Diamond Edition

Post by 2099net »

Disney Duster wrote:Netty:

Alright, but there is still the people that knew the art before it was changed and loved it, and still the question of how can they feel the same way about it when it is no longer the same way it was?

If people liked the original books and paintings more, they can keep their books and prints, and shows them to and pass them onto the people they want to see the originals.
You try to get a copy of Frankenstien which only includes the text of the first printing. You'll find it just as hard (if not much, much harder) than getting BatB on VHS or LD!
But with a movie, it will be utterly wrecked after enough viewings. We cannot do the same thing.
I don't understand this. What makes a movie "wrecked" more than reading different text in a novel or viewing revised paintings?

Yes, artists have the right to alter their work. But they also should realize that they need to, it is the right thing, or the better thing, the kinder thing (as kind as they teach you should be, such as the Beast's kindness), is to also make the original available to those who want it. As an artist myself, I would do this unless the original pained me that greatly or I felt is was so wrong and bad for people, which, we do not know is the case, but if it is, they should let us know, and...c'mon, no, it's not the case with this movie.
Well, ideally both versions should be available, I don't dispute that. And I can understand people being disappointed. It is disappointing. But until somebody asks the original filmmakers, we don't know anything about the reason for the colour change. It's all just speculation, which is why, ultimately, this thread and others like it just go round and round in non-ending circles. Nobody can say definitively why the colours have been changed, so no proper conclusion can be reached.

However, unlike some people, I don't think the colours have been changed carelessly or randomly. The orange sky in one of the examples for example makes narrative sense - the scene is set in the morning, and now appears to be set at dawn. While it may not be a change that is required (because its not) it at least goes towards communicating information to the viewer. To me, it feels more like a "creative" change than an "executive" change.
And art does not need to evolve. The Mona Lisa does not need to change, and it should not be changed. Art only needs to evolve if there are people who want it to evolve, and they evolve it themselves to make it their own. Art just does evolve. But we gotta keep those old works, too.
I believe Da Vinci painted several Mona Lisas (but I could be wrong - and no, the others don't all have "This is a Fake!" written on the back in indelible ink - Dr Who joke!). The point being Da Vinci had several attempts to get his work of art "right" - the creators of Beauty and the Beast only had one.

Painters of great masterpieces had the opportunity to evolve their art "behind the scenes" (look at the successive Sunflower studies by Van Gogh). The makers of Beauty and the Beast didn't have the means to evolve their art behind the scenes (for financial/timing reasons).
Here's the thing, there's at least one right we certainly do have. And that is the right to outcry, to voice our feelings, and yes, demand the original. We have the right to demand anything, even if we don't have the right to get it. But if only we could find some way to actually get those original artists' attentions, and have them actually answer us, instead of silence behind a smiling mouse.
You may have a right to demand, but I don't think you have a right to get what you demand.
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Coolmanio
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Post by Coolmanio »

Just saw a commercial for this on TV last night. It was done really well. The only bad thing was that they used the Jordin Sparks song, but beyond that, I really enjoyed it.
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Re: Beauty and the Beast: Diamond Edition

Post by magicalwands »

2099net wrote:You try to get a copy of Frankenstien which only includes the text of the first printing. You'll find it just as hard (if not much, much harder) than getting BatB on VHS or LD!
Actually, thrift stores like Goodwill have a collection of old Disney VHS tapes. I was so surprised to find Cinderella, Lady and the Tramp, etc.

But anyhow, I can't wait for Beauty and the Beast to come out! The best thing about blu-ray is being able to differentiate the different weights in pencil strokes for the outlines of characters.
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Re: Beauty and the Beast: Diamond Edition

Post by rodis »

magicalwands wrote: The best thing about blu-ray is being able to differentiate the different weights in pencil strokes for the outlines of characters.
That's what I don't like about BD. That the characters sometimes seem out of place because the background is softer.
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Post by MICKEYMOUSE »

I just got an email, from Diseny Rewards for $10.00 off, is it the same as the other offer (where if you had the DVD or VHS before), or can I use both coupons come Oct. 5?
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Post by Lorddh »

MICKEYMOUSE wrote:I just got an email, from Diseny Rewards for $10.00 off, is it the same as the other offer (where if you had the DVD or VHS before), or can I use both coupons come Oct. 5?

no, you can't do that, it's basically the same coupon, just the first one was for the people who had the vhs or dvd to upgrade it, but they decided to give the coupon to everyone from DMR.
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toonaspie
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Post by toonaspie »

Lorddh wrote:
MICKEYMOUSE wrote:I just got an email, from Diseny Rewards for $10.00 off, is it the same as the other offer (where if you had the DVD or VHS before), or can I use both coupons come Oct. 5?

no, you can't do that, it's basically the same coupon, just the first one was for the people who had the vhs or dvd to upgrade it, but they decided to give the coupon to everyone from DMR.
Not to mention, they gave you the UPC code on the DMR site when the first coupon was available so even then you didnt need an old copy of the movie for this.

This is more of a "last call" for everyone who hasnt gotten it yet to get the coupon. I got mine printed weeks ago so I'm all set to go.
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Post by rodis »

I just came back from the theater (watched Inception) and the first commercial was for BATB :) It was awesome and... in the 1991 colors, oddly. It was nice.

My friend said "Now *this* I would have watched now if it were playing"
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Re: Beauty and the Beast: Diamond Edition

Post by Disney Duster »

2099net wrote:You try to get a copy of Frankenstien which only includes the text of the first printing. You'll find it just as hard (if not much, much harder) than getting BatB on VHS or LD!
That has nothing to do with the difference of two generations, and does nothing to disprove what I said. That the people who not only knew of, but got to experience and like the original, got to keep theirs and read it until they died and show it to others, even make copies of it if they wanted (though it would take so long...) and show other people. That is different from people today who never experienced it not getting it.

But today, the people that experienced the original Beauty and the Beast, and fell in love with it, will not be able to watch their VHS's and Laserdiscs forver, because those will break down and become unwatchable. Books and prints of paintings do not become unreadable or unseeable in the lifetimes of the people who first bought them.
2099net wrote:
But with a movie, it will be utterly wrecked after enough viewings. We cannot do the same thing.
I don't understand this. What makes a movie "wrecked" more than reading different text in a novel or viewing revised paintings?
See what I wrote above.

2099net wrote:But until somebody asks the original filmmakers, we don't know anything about the reason for the colour change. It's all just speculation, which is why, ultimately, this thread and others like it just go round and round in non-ending circles. Nobody can say definitively why the colours have been changed, so no proper conclusion can be reached.
No, what's making this go around in circles is Disney keeps not giving us the original or acknowledging the reason why (and some people's denial of the original color changes at all).

We need to find some way to actually ask Disney what is up with this. So, do you have any suggestions?

Escapay had the ability to talk to Dahn Hahn about it, but Escapay chose not to for his own reasons.
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Re: Beauty and the Beast: Diamond Edition

Post by Escapay »

Disney Duster wrote:Escapay had the ability to talk to Dahn Hahn about it, but Escapay chose not to for his own reasons.
As I said in my original review/report on Waking Sleeping Beauty...
  • After the Q&A, the event was pretty much done and people were either leaving the theater or hanging around to talk to other people. We went down to see if we could get Don Hahn to autograph some things we brought
    ...
    He was very friendly and answered our questions about the documentary as well as our general "Oh em gee, you're really you, thanks for making the films that defined our childhood!" kinds of fawnings. I got him to sign my book Screenplay by Disney, and Reuben had him sign his DVD insert for Beauty and the Beast. We were talking about the upcoming Beauty and the Beast 3-D version, which he confirmed is definite for 2011 (but that's old news). I asked him if he could tell us about some of the features for the Blu-Ray and DVD, and he said that he just received them (to look over for approval). Among some of the special features will be a new 45-minute documentary (featuring Sarah Gillespie, Howard Ashman's sister, so I'm not sure if it's about the film or about Howard Ashman, but either way it sounds like it'll be good). There will also be more material from the non-musical Purdum version, including some of the stuff seen in Waking Sleeping Beauty. I didn't ask about the changed IMAX colors or which aspect ratio will be used, simply because they're fan argument that I've grown sick of and I didn't want to have to mention them at all.
    ...
    There was so much more we wanted to ask him, but we had to catch a subway, so after we thanked him for the documentary, then took a brief picture with Pete Schneider, we left.
We were at an event for Waking Sleeping Beauty, not Beauty and the Beast, and I respected that. It was not my place, nor any other fan's, to ambush and blindside him at an event for one thing with questions about something else entirely. The fact that the conversation we were having drifted to Beauty and the Beast (him signing my brother's DVD, then segue to the 3-D release and Blu-Ray), still wouldn't have changed that. I would not ask him about a fan argument, especially one that would require a lot of detail in both the question and the answer. In addition, I was grateful enough for the opportunity to even meet him. I wasn't going to suddenly ask questions in what could potentially be seen as an accusatory tone of the why-fors on the color changes between a 1992 VHS and a 2002 DVD, and whether or not it will be different yet again on a 2010 Blu-Ray. It simply was not my place.

So yes, I did have the ability to talk to Don Hahn about it. But no, I opted not to.

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Post by Escapay »

Sorry for the double-post.

Aaron's review is now up! Just saw it on Facebook (it's not on UD Front page yet, as of this writing)

http://www.dvdizzy.com/beautyandthebeast.html

ETA:

Just read the Video & Audio section, and I agree with his assessment of the colors (and the fans' arguments about them) 115%. It still may not be enough for color warriors out there to accept, unless they get a from-the-horse's-mouth explanation from the filmmakers themselves. And even then I'm sure the fans would think they were right and the filmmakers were wrong. :roll:

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Post by yukitora »

^reading it now, so excited!

BTW I have a theory - BatB may be rereleased in 2012 in 3D blu-ray. It would also contain a 2D viewing option. The original theatrical version will be contained in that blu-ray. Why? Because the 3D version did not rely on the IMAX edit or the DE edit, they kept the stutter, no reflection in the window, and dont get me started on how wonderful the color palet was.
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Post by Matt »

I LOVE the review! Great job Aaron. :)

HOWEVER, the COLORS were killing my eyes lol! :lol:
I almost had to put on sunglasses to read the rest lol. :wink:

Nice solid review! Cannot wait to get my hands on this, just four more days! :D
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Post by AwallaceUNC »

Thanks, Escapay and Matt!
Matt wrote:I LOVE the review! Great job Aaron. :)

HOWEVER, the COLORS were killing my eyes lol! :lol:
I almost had to put on sunglasses to read the rest lol. :wink:

Nice solid review! Cannot wait to get my hands on this, just four more days! :D
Do you mean the colors of the screencaps? Or the color of the text/backdrop? If it's the latter, I can talk with Luke about possibly changing it.

-Aaron
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and The Thinking Fan's Guide to Walt Disney World: Magic Kingdom (Epcot coming soon)
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Post by Escapay »

And if it's the former, you'll have to ask Don Hahn about that. :P

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Post by Matt »

AwallaceUNC wrote:Thanks, Escapay and Matt!
Matt wrote:I LOVE the review! Great job Aaron. :)

HOWEVER, the COLORS were killing my eyes lol! :lol:
I almost had to put on sunglasses to read the rest lol. :wink:

Nice solid review! Cannot wait to get my hands on this, just four more days! :D
Do you mean the colors of the screencaps? Or the color of the text/backdrop? If it's the latter, I can talk with Luke about possibly changing it.

-Aaron
The blue background and the white text had my eyes :o lol
After reading it, I still saw it when I was looking away from my computer screen lol.

However, it might be due to me being really tired as well.
So, I will take a look at it again tomorrow. :)

Also, I thought they put the Beast's stutter back in? :?
I guess, my hopes were to high! :(
I am sure I will still love it. :)

@ Albert Don, might not approve of this lol! :lol:
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Post by pap64 »

Actually, me and Don Hahn are friends on Facebook. He owes me a favor so I'll make sure to tell him about the colors before the official release ;) .
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Post by AwallaceUNC »

Matt wrote:Also, I thought they put the Beast's stutter back in? :?
I guess, my hopes were to high! :(
I am sure I will still love it. :)
The stutter is back in. I was writing the Different Versions part before watching and then failed to go back and change that. My apologies! Thanks for catching it... I'll ask Luke to make that change.

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and The Thinking Fan's Guide to Walt Disney World: Magic Kingdom (Epcot coming soon)
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Post by James »

AwallaceUNC wrote: The stutter is back in.
Beast had a stutter?!
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