DVDizzy Forum

In a change of direction from the 'Best Disney Opening Ever' thread, ( original link here : http://www.dvdizzy.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=27339 ) I thought we could have a thread discussing the lower points of an opening to a Disney film.

I say 'worst' but there can really be no 'worst' opening, as it is all down to each individual UD member's opinion As I know from reading the other thread that there are people who don't really care for fairy tale book openings, whilst others do, so thought it would be interesting to hear what people on here DON'T like !

Well, heres mine to start off proceedings :

Lilo and Stitch : For me personally, I really just don't get along with the opening. I skip scenes straight to the opening of the movie wih Lilo swimming, feeding Pudge the fish.

Now, I LOVE Lilo and Stitch, its one of my favourite Disney movies. I just hate the whole space start to the film. I know it is the basis of introducing Stitch and how he was created, but I just plain dont 'get' it. It's dull and over long.

This sounds like a fun topic as well atlanticaunderthesea

My worst Disney opening ever are:

1* Home On The Range ( don't like the song and the stupid rabbit)

2* Pete's Dragon ( it just starts some drawings and a song, Then with pete floating and hiding in the forest, nothing before that, you never knew what happend before he ran and how he ran away!)
And last en surely least, not that it bothers me but still

3* Atlantis ( LOVE the movie, but we all know Atlantis went down in the sea and the fact that Kida's mom disappeared was just useless I think. Just a bracelet in her hand at the end and that's it.)

Pocahontas

In my honest opinion, there are no "bad" openings. Each one is different and serves their place in their own story. Some are weaker than others, yes, but not bad.

I might have to think about it, since again I can't think of anything bad or even horrible.

I still remember saying "WHAT THE H.E. double hockey sticks is THIS CRAP??" during the opening of Chicken Little. I was truly embarrassed to be sitting in that theatre with other humans. That film wasn't even worthy of a direct to video feature.

Other than that I can appreciate even the not so great movies.

stitchje1981 wrote:2* Pete's Dragon ( it just starts some drawings and a song, Then with pete floating and hiding in the forest, nothing before that, you never knew what happend before he ran and how he ran away!)

I haven't sat down to watch the movie in a while but I really, really remember loving that beginning. I can't see how anyone can think it among the worst ... Which of course means, I really need to watch it again. But I think I can say this...

Okay, you say we don't know what happened before he ran away. But- don't you think the musical number with the Gogan family saying they're going to physically beat and terrorize him in various ways tells us everything? They were mean to him. Do we need to know all the detaiils? Snow White's opening only told us she was jealous, forced Snow White to wear rags and wash the floors. That's about as much as we know at the start of Pete's Dragon: he ran away, they were nasty, he didn't want to be there, they talked about beating him (a lot). I may not remember the drawings or the music (very well), but I know I remember the lovely song about the fun side of child abuse.

pap64 wrote:In my honest opinion, there are no "bad" openings. Each one is different and serves their place in their own story. Some are weaker than others, yes, but not bad.

I might have to think about it, since again I can't think of anything bad or even horrible.

That's what I tried to explain in the first post; you can't really classify them as being 'bad' or the 'worst' but films where you watch the opening scenes and think "oh man ... will this be any good ??" then after the first 10 mins you think "hell to the YEAH it will be !"

I mean, some people hate the old school Disney choir vocals, yet they love the films that happen to start of in that style of song

The Princess and the Frog: After the prologue, while I didn't actually think it was a bad opening, it was badly executed. It went by so fast, that if you didn't already know the characters before you would be completely clueless.

Pocahontas: The beginning really annoys me, the chorus sounds so... Cheesy? It gets better when you actually see people but the first few seconds bug me.

Home on the Range: Maybe I don't like it since I'm not a huge fan of country music, but it really didn't make any impression on me. I had to actually watch the beginning again, since I forgot what happened.

atlanticaunderthesea wrote:I mean, some people hate the old school Disney choir vocals, yet they love the films that happen to start of in that style of song

As much as I really don't care about anything Disney made after Pocahontas... I can easily see how people wouldn't be as into the old-school films. I think they're really missing out. But really- if all they've been raised on is the late 80's films to today, of course they're not going to know anything about the old days.

I count the "opening" of any Disney film to be the credits with music / titles, introduction, plus the beginning of the first scene. Based on that, I could say Ichabod & Mr. Toad has a weak opening because the song is one of the weaker starters and the credits just sit there. But the library sequence that starts it is unique and pretty good.

Beauty and the Beast has a truly weak opening. Mostly because of the fairy-tale story they start with. It's not a very magical one, it's heavy handed, and lacks a lot of details. Basically, this is why Beast is such a weak character in the film and why I've taken so much ire out against it. This means we're left with Belle and she has to be twice as strong a character to make up for what he lacks. He is a void. A life-sucking, selfish jerk. And if the fairy tale in the beginning is going to be so simplistic- than there's no reason why we should like or care about him at all. He's not a sympathetic "sad Beast." He's a nasty, one-note, selfish, stuck-up Prince who (in the context of the highly manipulative circumstances of the opening prologue) got what he deserved. There's nothing about him that makes him worth giving a chance to. Then... the movie decides to soften him to make up for this with... humor. And the cutesy "will you come down to dinner?" bit. That's not the way it works.

So, Beauty and the Beast deserves a nod. Because the opening narration affects and damages the rest of the story.

The Rescuers Down Under. What a huge disappointment after the gut-wrenching opening of the original. The openings scene of the sequel actually stands for everything that's bad about the film in general: it values style over substance. It's basically one long presentation of what Disney could do with CGI at the time. It had nothing to do with the story or characters. It didn't set a mood --like the old riverboat in the middle of the swamp, amidst thunder and lightning, with a little girl coming through the old, creaky door to throw away her call for help in a bottle, in the original film.

Wow, I didnt think anyone dissed BATB on here Lazario ! Did you change your view of the Beast for worse / better after The Enchanted Christmas ? Or do you not agree that has any standing on the world of BATB, as its a DTV ?

And gotta agree with you guys on Pocahontas .... "In sixteen hundred seven, while sailing the open seas ..." its not Alan's best work by a long shot ! And as you said, by no means does it set the tone for the rest of the movie. Or indeed does the song match the heights the rest of the score acheived.

Goliath wrote:The Rescuers Down Under. What a huge disappointment after the gut-wrenching opening of the original. The openings scene of the sequel actually stands for everything that's bad about the film in general: it values style over substance. It's basically one long presentation of what Disney could do with CGI at the time. It had nothing to do with the story or characters. It didn't set a mood --like the old riverboat in the middle of the swamp, amidst thunder and lightning, with a little girl coming through the old, creaky door to throw away her call for help in a bottle, in the original film.

Well, a lot of filmmakers would agree that the purpose of a sequel is to take the original to the next level. But, not in big studio fare. Studio sequels are usually a step in another direction. As Down Under was. I think it has a fantastic opening, as a matter of fact... But, after all the heart-in-your-throat camera show-offery at the beginning, after Bernard and Bianca set off on their mission, and after McLeach starts going over-the-top (I'd say while driving around in that large vehicle, he had dialogue / banter against the kid), all we're left with are the weak characters. (Although I think Bernard's challenging his fears character gimmick was preferable to his fear of everything 13 in the first film.) It's an inferior follow-up, but the opening was made to dazzle and I think it did.

atlanticaunderthesea wrote:Wow, I didnt think anyone dissed BATB on here Lazario ! Did you change your view of the Beast for worse / better after The Enchanted Christmas ? Or do you not agree that has any standing on the world of BATB, as its a DTV ?

Ha... No, you're definitely thinking of someone else. I haven't seen the sequels. And I've always "dissed" the original Beauty and the Beast since I've been here. Ask anyone who knows me, I think it's a raging bore and a very poorly made film.

I always found the opening scenes for The Sword in the Stone and Robin Hood to be very weak. The Sword in the Stone just has a very bland song and visuals. The rest of the film can be highly imaginative at times. Robin Hood's opening song just bores me (it doesn't help that it was later sped up and used for "Hamster Dance"), I usually skip it and go right to "Oo-de-Lally". The two are certainly not the worst, but they're not a good indication of the quality of the rest of the film. Though some may say they're the perfect indication.

I'm also not fond of the opening scenes for The Boatniks. Worst Disney song ever.

albert

Escapay wrote:The Sword in the Stone just has a very bland song and visuals.

It might not have helped that the style / background animation in a lot of the opening (especially when Arthur/Wart goes into the woods) look too much like a sloppy-second from 101 Dalmatians, but I partially agree with you. That song was terrible (don't ask me how I forgot it in the Worst Disney Songs thread). But I was impressed by the opening visuals very much so. Even if they are (pre-Kay & Arthur scene) a little Sleeping Beauty Part 2. Some great purple light in the forest and a slight trace of an ominous mood... until we get to the well and meet Merlin.

Escapay wrote:Robin Hood's opening song just bores me (it doesn't help that it was later sped up and used for "Hamster Dance"), I usually skip it and go right to "Oo-de-Lally". The two are certainly not the worst, but they're not a good indication of the quality of the rest of the film.

I actually put Robin Hood among my Top 10 best Disney openings. Guess it's time to haul those Disney live-action films in my Netflix Queue up to the top.

Lazario wrote:

stitchje1981 wrote:2* Pete's Dragon ( it just starts some drawings and a song, Then with pete floating and hiding in the forest, nothing before that, you never knew what happend before he ran and how he ran away!)

I haven't sat down to watch the movie in a while but I really, really remember loving that beginning. I can't see how anyone can think it among the worst ... Which of course means, I really need to watch it again. But I think I can say this...

Okay, you say we don't know what happened before he ran away. But- don't you think the musical number with the Gogan family saying they're going to physically beat and terrorize him in various ways tells us everything? They were mean to him. Do we need to know all the detaiils? Snow White's opening only told us she was jealous, forced Snow White to wear rags and wash the floors. That's about as much as we know at the start of Pete's Dragon: he ran away, they were nasty, he didn't want to be there, they talked about beating him (a lot). I may not remember the drawings or the music (very well), but I know I remember the lovely song about the fun side of child abuse.

Hmmmmm you got point in there

Lazario wrote:
Beauty and the Beast has a truly weak opening.

So, Beauty and the Beast deserves a nod. Because the opening narration affects and damages the rest of the story.

The blasphemy

j/k

Escapay wrote:I always found the opening scenes for The Sword in the Stone and Robin Hood to be very weak. The Sword in the Stone just has a very bland song and visuals. The rest of the film can be highly imaginative at times.

I can understand your point to some extent with The Sword in the Stone (because its overall look and reasonably melancholy nature don't completely gel with the rest of the movie), but I've always had a soft spot for it. I like the song itself, and especially like when the illustration comes to life (albeit in a somewhat limited, stylised way) with the ray of light from heaven beaming down onto London.

As for what I feel is the worst opening, I'm not quite sure. Some perhaps go on a bit too long, some aren't very memorable, but nothing comes off the top of my head as really stinky. I may say Chicken Little, mainly because of The Lion King spoof and the slamming of the stereotypical book opening seeming so contrived. It's depressing that Disney themselves were trying to make themselves cool by slamming their legacy like that, and I think that the book opening they did have planned (and was on the DVD) was better. Needless to say, that opening isn't particularly bad (more mediocre) when it actually gets to the story itself (the film is still overall a stinker though). Of the book openings, I'd say Snow White, as it doesn't do much with the book other than provide a few narration screens (opposed to practically every other book opening, where the illustrations come to life some way or another)

I don't like The Fox and the Hound opening.

The mother is shot yes, but it feels so forced I can't feel any emotion for it, especially since it happens in the beginning before we have any attachment to her. Not like Bambi or The Lion King. And then the song the queenlatifa owl sings, worst song I've ever heard!

yukitora wrote:And then the song the queenlatifa owl sings, worst song I've ever heard!

HORROR! That's the best song of the film!

rodis wrote:

Lazario wrote:Beauty and the Beast has a truly weak opening.

So, Beauty and the Beast deserves a nod. Because the opening narration affects and damages the rest of the story.

The blasphemy

j/k

It surprises me everyday that very few people agree with me. I just don't get people, obviously. I'm not made out of stone or anything, I'm actually very romantic and I love romantic stories. But this one glosses over everything - literally, so many details that need to be there for the serious moments to work are thrown to the side just to be sentimental. Just for cutesiness. It's not legitimate and nothing about it feels genuine in the slightest. It doesn't earn its' drama or the quiet romance. It feels wooden. Forget character development- there's almost none here. You get a few stray motivational ideas but they're nothing but cliche; she's smart and wants to be independent, he's angry and brooding. And then there is lame confrontation, cutesy scene to lighten mood, heavy dramatic adventure scene... Nothing inbetween. That's the problem. There's nothing inbetween the cliches. No glue to hold them together. Just underwhelming orchestral music and some high-tech production effects to overflash the music numbers. And the best one of them, "Gaston," is ruined by loud sound effects (you can barely even hear the damn lyrics).

TheSequelOfDisney wrote:

yukitora wrote:And then the song the queenlatifa owl sings, worst song I've ever heard!

HORROR! That's the best song of the film!

Which one... exactly? "The Best of Friends"...?

stitchje1981 wrote:Hmmmmm you got point in there

I'm sorry- are you saying I have a point or giving me childish attitude?