DVDizzy Forum

Forgive me if this theory's been brought up before, but after seeing all the lukewarm reviews and reactions to The Lion King's PE dvd, and reading all the despairing posts proclaiming that the Platinum line is dead, etc. - it got me thinkin'. Which is a rare thing.

Anywho, I almost wonder if the fluffy extras on the current Platinum dvds are an intended move. I have a tenative theory that perhaps Disney purposely made these Platinums fluffy in preparation for their HD-DVD releases come 2007 and beyond. Maybe they figure that the most likely demographic of people to accept the hd-dvd format initially are us crazy collectors. So perhaps, when Disney re-releases all of their animated features and such to the hd-dvd format, it is then that they will include all the meaty extras, and beyond - just to tantalize the adult fans into buying a whole new dvd player, whatever other expensive adaptors it needs, and starting their collection over from scratch. A proverbial carrot, if you will.

This'd be quite a sinister move, but it also at least holds a ray of hope for the nutty collectors. Maybe we will get some more substantial extras, even if it means buying a new player. *gag*
Hopefully, they'll make the damn hd players backwards-compatible to regular dvds - or heads will roll.

I wouldn't be surprised if that were indeed the case. Especially since when you compare DVD to VHS, it's easy to see why you should upgrade. But the case isn't going to be as easy with HD-DVD (unless you have a big HDTV that is). Maybe Disney's screwing us over now so they can have "new" material for their HD-DVD Super Duper Extra Platinum Editions.

Yes this is definatley something that has been in my mind, and it makes sense, because they will have to rerelease these titles, after they come out of moratorium so they will want more and better content to attract collector's to rebuy, and get first time buyers, that didn't pick up their copies the first time around.

I think you're giving them a bit too much credit for their forethought about this. Today's economic situations make it imperative to do whatever is necessary to show profits NOW. Holding back or sandbagging on a release as an attempt to anticiapte future demand 5+ years down the road could be an extremely risky venture.

And besides, if the next best thing is HD-DVD I would imagine that they would be compatible with current DVD standards...so you would ba able to play current discs in those players. And even if that is not the case we would all certainly be purchasing the new platforms and discs all over again regardless of what they featured. Even if the discs were exactly the same we'd buy them because we had no choice -- assuming the new systems were not backward compatible with existing DVDs.

Yikes. Hope that made a bit of sense.

Interesting idea, but I really think what we call "fluffy extras" is just Disney trying to cater to all ages. The reason its seems to be exclusive to the platinums is because its a single DVD release instead of duel releases - whereas before, there was one version aimed at kids, and one aimed at film fans, we are now getting one release for both.

As said before, it would be risky to hold out for HD-DVD because nobody knows how the public is going to react to this new format.

All I can say is that unless dvd is significantly outdated and limited in terms of production over the next 6 or 7 years, I'm never starting over!

STASHONE wrote:All I can say is that unless dvd is significantly outdated and limited in terms of production over the next 6 or 7 years, I'm never starting over!

I certainly couldn't afford to start over. Hopefully, any new techology will be backwards compatible.

The conspiracy certainly makes sense, but I can't decide if it contradicts or supports the decision to speed up the Platinum releases. That decision seemed driven by a desire for more incomes...now! At the same time, it also seemed affected by getting everything out by 2007 (a year that seems to be significant to them), no doubt in part because of new technology evolving.

When the next format comes along (presumably HD-DVD), I would anticipate Disney dragging their feet in testing the waters, as they did with VHS and DVD. But 2007 is already a pretty bold estimate for them, and maybe they will jump head-first into the new format. That could explain why they're fluffy.

Another situation that comes to mind is them consciously deciding to pare back Hunchback so that people would buy it again with all the bells-and-whistles down the line. Since they've pretty much stopped with the standard theatrical re-releases the last decade, and they've always had an eye on getting old films to bring new incomes, I think it makes sense that they're going to want people to buy these films again on HD-DVD, and for the common person, that's going to mean some more incentive than X lines of resolution (essentially, their failed "Limited Issue" fall '99 plan).

We shall see. I'm just disheartened it's my favorite that seems to get the lamest Platinum treatment of them all.

I have no belive in a new system that does not take old DVD's as well.

You have to remember that a new system is mostly in need of a buyer, and not many will just trash their DVD collection and jump on another system.

That was the reason for the problems that the Beta system had when VHS won. Beta was superiour to VHS but nobody wanted it since many already had bought VHS.

Laserdisc lost because it was to expencive, and nobody will buy anything new if that makes their movie collection old and outdated.

It's been confirmed in several articles that HD-DVD players are going to be backwards compatable. This is totally logical - it'll help the general public as well as home theater fans to make the change to the new format.

Luke wrote:The conspiracy certainly makes sense, but I can't decide if it contradicts or supports the decision to speed up the Platinum releases. That decision seemed driven by a desire for more incomes...now! At the same time, it also seemed affected by getting everything out by 2007 (a year that seems to be significant to them), no doubt in part because of new technology evolving.

The problem is you won't get the benefit of HD-DVD unless you have a HD-TV - it's not going to be a format that supports hours and hours of content per disc, just the same content at a higher resolution (remember double the size = four times the resolution). So being as Disney is expecting to sell most of their animated films to children (or "families" if you prefer), it seems unlikely children will benefit from a HD-DVD. I can't see lots of children getting new players and new television sets for their bedrooms in the next few years. The speed up of the Platinum releases is motivated by nothing more than money (why add titles to the range if you're having trouble getting the existing ones out to schedule?).

Luke wrote:When the next format comes along (presumably HD-DVD), I would anticipate Disney dragging their feet in testing the waters, as they did with VHS and DVD. But 2007 is already a pretty bold estimate for them, and maybe they will jump head-first into the new format. That could explain why they're fluffy.

Every studio is only going to test the waters. It would be wrong to expect otherwise. How many studios took on HD-VHS? Again, another reason to suspect Disney won't start rolling out 'super platinum' releases come 2008.

Luke wrote:Another situation that comes to mind is them consciously deciding to pare back Hunchback so that people would buy it again with all the bells-and-whistles down the line. Since they've pretty much stopped with the standard theatrical re-releases the last decade, and they've always had an eye on getting old films to bring new incomes, I think it makes sense that they're going to want people to buy these films again on HD-DVD, and for the common person, that's going to mean some more incentive than X lines of resolution (essentially, their failed "Limited Issue" fall '99 plan).

We shall see. I'm just disheartened it's my favorite that seems to get the lamest Platinum treatment of them all.

I do genuinely think that the people in charge of the BatB disc did think that they were compiling the best version that they could. In theory the first disc is a stunning release, three versions of the movie, the WIP edition, the commentary. Shame about the compression. The second disc starts out well - the PLAY ALL option on Lumiere and Cogsworth's menu reveals a documentary about the same as the previous year's Snow White one. Sadly, after this has been viewed, the disc offers very little in addition.

The thing is marketers have taken control of the discs. And while I don't agree with what the results are (or in the Lion King's case, appear to be) I don't doubt the motivation of these people. It's just the marketers have a different opinion of who is buying these discs and what they want than we do. To a marketer set-top games are fun, new documentary footage is better than archive footage (it's new so it must be better!), short segments are better than one long documentary (as it stops people getting bored) etc. I do think that are doing their best to please the biggest audience. It's just a shame that we know most of their target audience probably won't even bother to put the second disc in their players.

As for the whole HD thing, I think it may be by 2007, a lwa is being passed that ALL TV's will be made with HD technology, and there might be something else about all or most TV's being made in widescreen! Also all TV stations are going to have to start broadcasting in HD within the next couple years, so there is no reason to think HD-DVD won't take off, they might even stop manufacturing DVD players, as well as DVD's altogether. This is what they are planning on doing to VHS!

But in 2007, people won't rush out and buy a HD-TV. Especially for 'secondary' sets in kitchens, studies or bedrooms (where most children have their sets). Even now, there's people without DVD players who are quite happy with VHS.

So HD-DVD will only fragment the potential audience further - VHS, DVD and HD-DVD. No studio will be outputting their 'big guns' onto HD-DVD until 2009-2010 (look at how long its took to get Indiana Jones!)

Of course they are holding back material. Nowhere is this more obvious than in the Peter Pan "Special Edition" dvd that came out a year ago. It was only one disc and barely had any extras on it (despite a chock full laserdisc edition that is available). Since France received an upgraded 2-disc edition of Peter Pan recently, we can expect to be getting an upgraded edition ourselves at some point.

However, I do not think that the reason Disney is withholding extras is due to some grand master conspiracy to make us buy more comprehensive versions at some later time. Disney is just trying to strike some middle ground between churning out cheap dvds that satisfy the children while still including enough extras to have their dvds comparable to other collector sets in the market (particularly Dreamworks collector animated dvds like Shrek). I read a pretty terrifying article somewhere that Disney executives were realizing that their primary target audience (parents) were still willing to buy Disney movies for their children WITHOUT the extras and fluff.

Ive decided, my DVD versions.... are my final versions.
I might even skip HD-DVD, it doesnt seem like it will be the big thing that DVD is, only a core crowd will have it.

If I DO get an HDTV, I will buy and HD-DVD player, but I wont making any rebuys of my current DVDs.



Im a big movie fan, but its not THAT important to me.

I'll be getting a HD-DVD player when they first come out. I think HD-DVD will be the format for collectors! i don't think a average joe will upgrade, that said We can expect real Collector's Edition without the fluff and stupid kiddie shit!

HD-DVD player & TV will be a must have for me. That doesn't mean I will buy it right away, but I'm definately going to own an HD setup - I'm a home theater freak and there's no way I'm passing it up.

However, I'm not going to restart my entire collection - my money could be put to better use when I'm happy with my current transfers. I'll keep the DVDs I have, but after HD-DVD hits the market, I'll just start buying new releases in that format.

And as MMB said, HD-DVD could mean a new breathe of life into stricty non-kiddie collector's editions!

MickeyMouseboy wrote:i don't think a average joe will upgrade, that said We can expect real Collector's Edition without the fluff and stupid kiddie shit!

Now see, I agree with this 100%.

It will be a format strictly for the hardcore collector's and home theatre enthusiats because of the costs involved in upgrading everything. That being the case do we all really expect that Disney wil invest millions in revamping and rereleasing all of these titles as souped up deluxe SEs for a much smaller potential market?

indianajdp wrote: That being the case do we all really expect that Disney wil invest millions in revamping and rereleasing all of these titles as souped up deluxe SEs for a much smaller potential market?

that's the thing i can't comprehend. as conservative as disney was with the onset of dvd back in '99, i have a hard time seeing them spend a ton of money on a relatively small niche of consumers. if they did do super collector's editions they would have to be outrageously priced for disney to make a large enough profit for them to even consider jumping head first into hd-dvd and revamping some of their current releases adding different features and such...

can anyone help me see the other arguments for this?

indianajdp wrote:

MickeyMouseboy wrote:i don't think a average joe will upgrade, that said We can expect real Collector's Edition without the fluff and stupid kiddie shit!

Now see, I agree with this 100%.

It will be a format strictly for the hardcore collector's and home theatre enthusiats because of the costs involved in upgrading everything. That being the case do we all really expect that Disney wil invest millions in revamping and rereleasing all of these titles as souped up deluxe SEs for a much smaller potential market?

Exactly, if they wanted to appeal to the hardcore buyers, they could now, by releasing 2 version of a disc (as they did before - a single disc 'family' version and a double disc 'collectors' version). They don't because it's cheaper to only manufacture and distribute one copy. In theory a single disc Lion King today has higher sales potential than a single disc 'Dinosaur' released in 2000, just as a proper double disc 'Lion King' has higher sales potental than a double disc 'Dinosaur' from way back.

I think many people here will be disappointed with Disney's HD-DVDs; they will make them, but anyone expecting Disney to invest millions and millions on dollars on super-dooper hardcore collectors sets - with all new supplements - will be disappointed. For the first 5-10 year's at least (or for however long it takes to get market share).

Oh, and if HD-TV and/or DVD sales don't take off as much as some people suspect (and the almost complete failure of HD-VHS indicates it could be) then expect the disc prices to creep up to LD prices (I already expect the studios will try to charge more for a HD-DVD than a normal DVD).