DVDizzy Forum

I hope someone uploads a Torrent or a YouTube sequence of the restored footage

OK surely nobody was seriously expecting this release to be unedited?

ichabod wrote:OK surely nobody was seriously expecting this release to be unedited?

I was just thinking about that. Even though this is disappointing news, I don't know that we can say that it is that unexpected. Sure, we were all hoping it would be unedited, but I think most of us expected this to be the outcome.

That being said, I hope that the person who saw the screening is correct in saying that the scene is much more seamless than it was in the previous release.

I've settled down a bit, but I'm still hoping that there is a chance to have both the edited and unedited versions on the Blu-ray. I know that the restoration will be phenomenal, but I still think it was a completely missed opportunity to finally show the unedited version. It just doesn't make sense to me. Does Disney really think that mainstream people would be so interested in this film? I know it was quite popular on VHS, but I didn't think that the DVD sold that well (but then again, now the Anthology set costs a fortune to purchase). Here's to the one last chance that Disney has to actually making their fans completely happy.


(It's still majorly infuriating, though)

Its not so much as to 'who' are 'how' many people will buy the product, but the fact that with great power comes great responsibility. Disney are today one of the largest companies in the world, and because of this they are expected to conform to specific standards. If they don't, that power would collide in on itself. Everything has to be wrapped in cotton wool and made to appeal to the modern audience on a wide scale. As such, regardless of whether 'Fantasia' was bought my a larger percentage of mature individuals than for younger ones, they must make the product acceptable for everyone.

And of course, from a cultural point of view, the scenes in question are no longer acceptable. Everyone on this forum wants to see the scenes in their original form, but we ourselves are viewing the product as something of a collectors item, because were mature enough to understand the social implications. There would be plenty, plenty more people out there whom, upon viewing the centurettes, would rightly be shocked if that is their frame of mind, and there's nothing wrong with that.

Maybe if Disney were more aware, they could have simply placed a small segment before the film explaining why the black centaurs are present. Warner Brothers did this for their recent Tom and Jerry Spotlight Collection (Whoopi Goldberg) and that was to just compensate for restoring all the footage that had for years been cut. And the best bit? Everyones happy

The only argument against the cuts is of course that society and cultural values back in 1940 were completely different to now. 'Negros' were sadly seen as dirty individuals who should absolutely serve white people, and this is reflected perfectly in the scenes in question. This is just how people thought 70 years ago, and I don't feel the need to 'hush' over it or ignore that it happened. This is now, and that was then. We should be thankful that we live in a much more equal society.

In short, lets try to not get worked up over something as small and insignificant in the structure of the film as a racial stereotype. As someone whom watched the film for the very first time in 1991, I had no idea there was Pan and Scanning involved, and once I learned, I was only mildly interested out of the historical context. It doesn't detract from the entertainment aside from the fact that as collectors, we want to see the 'original' experience. If this was so, then we'd also have to buy over 70 speakers and set up a Fantasound system.... Were never going to get the 'original' feel.

My only 'huff' with Disney is the consistency of their cuts. There are bare-brested winged creatures in the Night on Bald Mountain sequence, yet they were not cut in the last releases. Maybe this is just anatomical education??

This sucks, I was really hoping to hear Deems Taylor's voice again, with a good impersonator filling in the blanks. Instead, we have to hear Corey Burton's stereotypical 30s/40s voice that I've grown tired of hearing in everything. It's like they aren't even trying to give us something close to the original theatrical version (step backwards from my old VHS tape).

Also, I'm very disappointed to hear they're still using the zoom to edit Sunflower. It's like they don't realize that we're losing the rest of the animation on the centaurette's body in addition to Sunflower. I'm sorry but re-framing a scene is basically re-directing it. I'm not sure why they don't just re-animate the scene, replacing Sunflower with some cherubs, so we don't have the nasty zoom and the carpet that magically unrolls itself.

Sorry to change the subject guys, but...



I've found 8 short clips of the final restored footage!!

http://www.imdb.com/video/screenplay/vi2414282265/

IMDB of all places... It looks absolutely wonderful! I can't believe how much detail is revealed, especially in the Night on Bald mountain sequence as the camera zooms down to the village and the purple haze casts over... Oh boy! Remember to put it on fullscreen mode too.

Permission to fist myself? I think I at least deserve some kudo's for this little doozy... Pleasssee?

miniroll32 wrote:In short, lets try to not get worked up over something as small and insignificant in the structure of the film as a racial stereotype. As someone whom watched the film for the very first time in 1991, I had no idea there was Pan and Scanning involved, and once I learned, I was only mildly interested out of the historical context. It doesn't detract from the entertainment aside from the fact that as collectors, we want to see the 'original' experience. If this was so, then we'd also have to buy over 70 speakers and set up a Fantasound system.... Were never going to get the 'original' feel.

I disagree. It is far from "small and insignificant." I find that it completely detracts from the Pastoral Symphony. I mean, hello, there are parts of the symphony cut out because they just "had" to cut Sunflower. It's totally disturbing how we won't be able to see the entire film. From a fan/collector's stand point it doesn't make any sense at all. Just let Leonard Maltin speak in front of the film telling us about the racial issue that was ocurring in the 1940s and then just show the whole film. I'm probably one of the biggest fans of Fantasia on this forum and I think it's ludicrous that we won't be seeing a complete Disney Animated Classic. Oh, sure, we can show breasts (Night On Bald Mountain, Pastoral Symphony, The Nutcracker Suite) but we aren't allowed to see the three places that Sunflower occurs. It's just totally annoying and completely unprofessional. I guess I should have seen it coming; Disney has been spiraling for awhile now in the production of worthy collector's items (Treasures, actual Collector's Edition DVDs/Blu-rays, etc.). I'm just at a loss as to why we can't see the film the way it was intended to be seen. I've seen Sunflower online (in black and white), and the racial issue is there, but I highly doubt that children would notice. And collector's will be happy. Just get Maltin to have an intro to the film and we would be all set. Or at least (the very, very, very least) give us the Sunflower animation as a bonus feature (or just insert it into the film). I'll probably still purchase it, but every time that I get to Beethoven's 6th, I'll probably become highly enraged/saddened.

miniroll32 wrote:I've found 8 short clips of the final restored footage!!

http://www.imdb.com/video/screenplay/vi2414282265/

The ever impressive

Impressed??

Omg The Sorcerers Apprentice bit looks amazing! The colours just seem to make sense now, they're not washed out

Wow, seems like we have everything now...EXCEPT COVER ARTWORK! Everyday I come to the forum and see this topic with an update, I think "is today the day?" But alas, nothing yet!

Look on the clip where the brooms come back to life. I can't believe how much color has been revitalised when Mickey stops and looks into the camera - you can see all the cavern around him! Before, it was almost pitch black.

Wow, they look excellent! I am really very excited now! Now we just need to know the bonus features and see the cover art, and I will be ready and waiting.

TheSequelOfDisney wrote:

miniroll32 wrote:I find that it completely detracts from the Pastoral Symphony. I mean, hello, there are parts of the symphony cut out because they just "had" to cut Sunflower. It's totally disturbing how we won't be able to see the entire film.

You are completely missing the point. I stated, and stand by my argument that not everyone will be "distracted". You suggest that yes, parts where cut out, but not everyone who is going to watch this film will know this. Individuals who go looking for these facts will know, but a majority of people will be clueless, and there's nothing wrong with that. Not everyone is a Disney 'buff', and as long as they enjoy the film then great.

Besides, most 'collectors' will have various editions of the same film. If you want to see the un-edited scenes, just watch the Laserdisc copy.

miniroll32 wrote:You are completely missing the point. I stated, and stand by my argument that not everyone will be "distracted". You suggest that yes, parts where cut out, but not everyone who is going to watch this film will know this. Individuals who go looking for these facts will know, but a majority of people will be clueless, and there's nothing wrong with that. Not everyone is a Disney 'buff', and as long as they enjoy the film then great.

Besides, most 'collectors' will have various editions of the same film. If you want to see the un-edited scenes, just watch the Laserdisc copy.

But those who do know the difference will still be mad. I think we can just agree that not everyone will be happy with the release. I love the restoration that was posted on IMDb, but I'll still know (as will most of the collector's) that Sunflower was cut out (still). Maybe the majority of people should be more informed. I guess it's just because I love this film so much that I want/need to see it fully restored with Sunflower still in, but it would be nice to let everyone else know of the cuts instead of just letting everyone think that this is the actual movie. The zoom in looks totally off with the rest of the Symphony and overall looks bad. I know that it'll now be sharp/less grainy and will overall look much better, but that still doesn't warrant the belief that this was the way the film was intended to be seen (because it wasn't and isn't). Oh, and I do not have a Laserdisc player or the Laserdisc copy of the film. We shouldn't have to go back 15-20 years in time to have the correct version of the film. Technology has improved and Disney should also realize that people aren't entirely worried/upset about the racial issues that plagued most of the United States history. Our generation, though still rooted in what we've been brought up with, is much more accepting of different races, religious beliefs, etc. Simply, we've moved on from the past. I just disagree that this should be the only version shown to the whole wide world. Sure there are tons of racists out there, but that doesn't mean that those who aren't shouldn't be able to watch the original film. Disney missed a grand opportunity. I'm still hoping that there will be an option to watch the unedited version of the film.

ichabod wrote:OK surely nobody was seriously expecting this release to be unedited?

To be honest I wasn't expecting this to be unedited (even though I wanted it to) however what I find appalling is that they are once again blowing up the frame instead of using a more artistic solution...

I do honestly agree with that you're saying, but I think the problem as I said before is that Disney is now a premium brand. They're just not going to risk bad feedback by including these scene just to satisfy a narrow audience of collectors. They're too stubborn to think this way, and acknowledge that the easy way out is to just pan-and-scan.

This is the company that still tries to gloss over the whole 'Uncle Walt' image, and what a Saint he was. Disney aren't going to risk damaging that reputation, because the company thrives on being some kind of magical force, beckoned by the good egg Walt Disney.

Anyday now we could hear anything. I really hope an announcement comes soon...

So, whats your fave clip then guys?

miniroll32 wrote:just to satisfy a narrow audience of collectors.

A large portion of Fantasia's audience, to be sure

Adults who are into these art house films and collector's are the main demographic (Disney knows this and released the first DVD to cater to that audience with the supplements and extended Roadshow version). To be honest, this film bored me, as a kid, almost as much as Alice in Wonderland, The Sword in the Stone, Saludos Amigos and The Three Caballeros did (and still does). No way in hell is a soccer mom is going to pick this up to babysit little Johnny or little Suzie. It's too long, the subject matter can get pretty adult, and kids just don't like it (outside of The Sorcerer's Apprentice).