DVDizzy Forum

Escapay wrote:

GhostHost wrote:Snow White and Sleeping Beauty are cinema at its finest and are much more than good films because of their historical context. Snow White is the best animated movie ever made and maybe the best movie ever made.

Can you honestly say that with a straight face?

Snow White, while groundbreaking in that it was the first animated movie in the US, is a nice movie that deserves its merits, but hardly the best movie ever made. That honor belongs to Casablanca, IMO.

Sleeping Beauty is wonderful visually, but mediocre when it comes to story and characters.

Escapay

Well yor are entiltled to my opinion. Sleeping Beauty and Snow White have two of the best vilians in history. The Black Forest scene of Snow White is one of my all time favorite scenes, also the score is wonderful and ecspecially beautiful at the end. Great humor, score, songs, story, characters, animation, and horror, are things that make Snow White one of cinema's finest acheivements if not their finest.
Sleeping Beauty has a great score(yes I know it is adapted), awesome animation, great action, and more.

GhostHost wrote:

Escapay wrote: Can you honestly say that with a straight face?

Snow White, while groundbreaking in that it was the first animated movie in the US, is a nice movie that deserves its merits, but hardly the best movie ever made. That honor belongs to Casablanca, IMO.

Sleeping Beauty is wonderful visually, but mediocre when it comes to story and characters.

Escapay

Well yor are entiltled to my opinion. Sleeping Beauty and Snow White have two of the best vilians in history. The Black Forest scene of Snow White is one of my all time favorite scenes, also the score is wonderful and ecspecially beautiful at the end. Great humor, score, songs, story, characters, animation, and horror, are things that make Snow White one of cinema's finest acheivements if not their finest.
Sleeping Beauty has a great score(yes I know it is adapted), awesome animation, great action, and more.

But can you honestly say that out of the thousands upon thousands of movies there are, Snow White and Sleeping Beauty stand out as THE best? That if one day, movies stopped being made and you were chosen to choose one movie to represent the finest in cinema history, you'd choose one of them?

I take the phrase "best movie ever made" literally, and I personally am very selective as to which movie fits into that category. Are you positively willing to admit that Snow White and/or Sleeping Beauty truly does fit in that category? Don't be offended if I'm coming off as haughty or anything by disagreeing that SW and SB are the best movies. I'm just curious as to why you'd choose those two as THE best, of everything there is to offer. You offer good general points (great villains, great music, etc.), but if you were to seriously delve into the movie and dissect each and every frame and every facet of the movie...can you truly say it is the best movie in the history of all movies?

Escapay

Escapay wrote: I'm not The Lion King's biggest fan, even though it's revered worldwide by a lot of people. Sometimes I'd prefer watching Robin Hood over Snow White, simply because Robin Hood has more "funness" (for lack of a better word) to it. ...
Seriously, is there anyone here who really enjoys that shrilly voice of Snow White?

Escapay

I gots to agree! While I do really like the Lion King, I often feel that it is overrated. And Robin Hood is one of my favorites, I'd prefer it over many of the others (over Mulan and Pocahontas for sure, and many times over Lion King). It is totally a fun movie. Plus Not in Nottingham is one of my favorite songs from any of the movies.
And yes Snow White's singing voice can be grating, but overall I still really like that movie.

But back to Mulan, after watching it today I may consider getting it on dvd if I find it for a good price. It wasn't one my favorites but has enough in it that I would watch it again.
As for Pocahontas, I haven't seen it since it came out, liked it back then, but overtime seems to have depreciated in my mind. I will give it another look sometime. We got the new edition for sale at my work. I always check to see if they do a weird price change and put it down to $9.99 (it happened to Aladdin and something else once), if that happens I'll get it, but as it is right now, it's not high on my list.

I just saw Mulan tonight, and thought it was very well done...I NEVER see it on anyone's top list for some reason. The one thing I noticed is that the songs outside of Make a Man out of you aren't catchy...

The movie though was solid, and actually kept my interest the whole way through!

What did you guys think?

Wait, was this your first time seeing it?!

I love Mulan! I sing Reflection all the time.

I love her grandmother, she's freaking hilarious. And the scene when she leaves for war in her fathers place is intense and amazingly memorable, for me. I would have Mulan in my top 10. Not sure where, but it would be there.

I love Mulan! Been watching it since the VHS days.

Mulan is a very underrated movie. I half-wished it was not a musical but hey, it is still a very good movie. I'd put Mulan over any princess any day!

Mulan is probably one of my least favourite of the animated classics.
I do like Honour To Us All though
I think it's Eddie Murphy that ruined it for me.

I really like Mulan- I think that the music is catchy; "I'll Make A Man Out Of You" and "Reflection" are definitely the soundtrack highlights, IMO, but "Honor To Us All" and "A Girl Worth Fighting For" are also good, catchy songs. I like the balance of drama and comedy. People complain about the Gargoyles in THOND, and about Mushu in Mulan, and maybe even Timon & Pumbaa in TLK, but I think that those funny sidekicks are necessary; they lighten the mood after some huge dramatic moments (some people might think that the mood doesn't need to be lightened, but one could argue that the kids need to have fun or something...I know that I find these characters funny, and I like to laugh, so I have no problem with them!).

Yes! Mulan might be my 6th favorite Disney movie (following Aladdin, Beauty and the Beast, Lion King, Little Mermaid, and Hercules).

I love Mulan; it's one of my favorite Disney films. It has a great story and characters, good songs (with the possible exception of "A Girl Worth Fighting For"), an amazing score with "Mulan's Decision" standing out and features one of the few female protagonists in the Disney canon who is actually a feminist.

All the songs except I'll Make a Man Out of You made my ears bleed

But it's a good movie apart from the bad music, which can be overlooked since it's so good otherwise. I don't rank Disney movies, but it would probably be in my top 10 as well if I DID rank them.

Oh yes, I l really like Mulan! Disney should look to the east more often for inspiration. I especially like the opening with the Chinese watercolor painting turning into the Chinese wall.

Like drfspenter I don't want to rank Disney movies, but Mulan definitely belongs to my favourites.

I generally like "Mulan", but I think it's a fairly uneven movie. It switches from musical to a more straight-forward drama halfway through, and I wish they had picked a more consistent tone. Unlike others, I like the music fairly well... it's not my favorite, but the songs are consistently good, and the score is actually higher on my list on Disney scores. The overall visual style is pretty as well.

Most of the voice casting I also really like, save for Eddie Murphy. Every time Eddie Murphy shows up, it takes me out of the setting, because I can't figure out why the hell Eddie Murphy is in China in the 15th Century. I mean, were there no Chinese American comedians? He is just so mind-bogglingly anachronistic in every scene he is in that I begin to get annoyed every time he shows up. I can reason that the Genie can have a knowledge of future events, but I have a harder time rationalizing that a demoted guardian who is supposed to just ring a gong knows what bunny slippers are. You can be a funny sidekick without sticking out, and I think Mushu fails at that.

I disagree about Mushu. But I guess that's a personal thing. He's one of the better sidekicks from their modern films, because he's usually hilarious (the gargoyles and Timon & Pumbaa were not--Genie was only slightly entertaining, though sometimes grating). If anything bothers me about the film, as far as time-related issues, it's Mulan's behavior at points. Like how she tries to cheat and acts a lot like a teenager with her outbursts. A young Chinese woman would not act like that exactly. True, Mulan is based on a legend, but the real Mulan was most likely more reserved and did not have outbursts.

As for the music, I love the soundtrack. It's nowhere near one of their best, but I love "Honor To Us All" most. I'm surprised that so many people love "I'll Make A Man Out Of You"--that's always been my least favorite from the film. And I'm not quite sure that Mulan's voice actor (I forget her name) pulls off "Reflection." The song doesn't become interesting until the very end, but mostly because of the scene (with Mulan's multi-reflection) and not really because of the singer. I think where the soundtrack excels is in the score. I usually don't pay much attention to the score (I'm usually too interested in the story/characters/etc.), but this one really stands out, mostly in the scene where Mulan chooses to enlist.

I agree that Mulan is fairly disjointed as far as tone goes, but the film still has an excellent story and cast of characters (Grandmother Fa, Shan-Yu, the Emperor, Mulan and Fa Zhou come to mind). I rank it near third on my usual list of favorites, only below The Little Mermaid and Hercules.

Isn't Lea Salonga the singing voice of Mulan? I find the purity of her instrument more pleasing than the overwrought vocal tricks of Christina Aguilera, but that's my preference.

Honor To Us All is my favotite Mulan song.

I generally like the film but I agree with those who said Eddie Murphy's presence is the worst thing in it.

Eddie really wasn't that intrusive IMO - plus all Disney films rely on that comedic charm

Disney's Divinity wrote:If anything bothers me about the film, as far as time-related issues, it's Mulan's behavior at points. Like how she tries to cheat and acts a lot like a teenager with her outbursts. A young Chinese woman would not act like that exactly. True, Mulan is based on a legend, but the real Mulan was most likely more reserved and did not have outbursts.

True, but likewise, the real Mulan probably didn't run around with three vaguely homoerotic soldiers, a tiny dragon and a lucky cricket, so I mean... you can't be too picky here. It's still overall a story tailored for modern sensibilities.

SpringHeelJack wrote:Most of the voice casting I also really like, save for Eddie Murphy. Every time Eddie Murphy shows up, it takes me out of the setting, because I can't figure out why the hell Eddie Murphy is in China in the 15th Century. I mean, were there no Chinese American comedians? He is just so mind-bogglingly anachronistic in every scene he is in that I begin to get annoyed every time he shows up. I can reason that the Genie can have a knowledge of future events, but I have a harder time rationalizing that a demoted guardian who is supposed to just ring a gong knows what bunny slippers are. You can be a funny sidekick without sticking out, and I think Mushu fails at that.

But this is true of almost all Disney sidekicks. I just watched Pinocchio, which is set in 19th century Europe, yet Jiminy Cricket is an all-American wiseguy! In The Aristocats, which is set in Paris in 1910, two dogs turn up who have heavy rural American accents and vocabulary. What about Phil Harris voicing Baloo the bear in Junglebook, which is set in India? The list goes on and on.

Personally, I like Mulan very much. I don't get the complaints about the music, since I find it quite pleasant. Visually, the film looked great. I especially enjoyed the scene in the snow in the mountain pass, when the Chinese army is being attacked by the Huns. That's stunning!

True, but likewise, the real Mulan probably didn't run around with three vaguely homoerotic soldiers, a tiny dragon and a lucky cricket, so I mean... you can't be too picky here. It's still overall a story tailored for modern sensibilities.

I know. That was really just my response to Mushu knowing about bunny slippers fretting you. The whole movie is skewed because of its intent to entertain a modern audience, utilizing old views only when necessary (for the whole sexist story arc). I still love it though.