DVDizzy Forum

Semaj wrote:Even though it took me almost 10 years before I ever saw it, Hunchback is actually a good movie. The embarrassment comes from the fact that it's more "adult" than what people expect from Disney animated features, which sounds like another missed opportunity.

Which is ironic since I recall Eisner love that movie so much when was CEO.

Okay, here's a project-watch pocahontas, take notes on what could be improved in which ways and how well the movie could be done with minimal drastic changes. example: the total removal of animal sidekicks or just changing them a bit and removing some of the comic moments?

What a brillaint idea. Here are my notes;

- Making a more coherent script.
- Reduce the time of the sidekicks.
- Remove Flit. In my opinion, he was unlikeable, contrived and didn't add nothing to the movie.
- Give the time to give the Natives actual personalities. I don't mind Natives at all, but they were portrayed as pretty dour and lifeless characters (especially Nakoma).

I love Pocahontas, Hunchback, Hercules and Mulan but they're not as Family friendly as Mermaid, BATB, Aladdin or TLK.

I agree that Mermaid and Aladdin were family friendly and appealing, but not exactly TLK. Although the movie was cute and appealed to kids, it was quite violent and were dealing with more serious, adult themes as well. BATB was cute, too, but I know many kids who got really scared by the Beast at first (although that was the intention of the character, haha).

Brother Bear was another Pocahontas.

How so?

DisneyFan09 wrote: I agree that Mermaid and Aladdin were family friendly and appealing, but not exactly TLK. Although the movie was cute and appealed to kids, it was quite violent and were dealing with more serious, adult themes as well. BATB was cute, too, but I know many kids who got really scared by the Beast at first (although that was the intention of the character, haha).

I know more kids who were scared of Ursula.

Honestly, the only scene from any of the fab four that I would think might cross over into "non-family friendly" territory would be Mufasa's death scene. That was a bit intense.

Honestly, the only scene from any of the fab four that I would think might cross over into "non-family friendly" territory would be Mufasa's death scene. That was a bit intense.

Agreed.

DisneyFan09 wrote:

Honestly, the only scene from any of the fab four that I would think might cross over into "non-family friendly" territory would be Mufasa's death scene. That was a bit intense.

Agreed.

I was expecting a lot more blood and gore from a character who's supposed to die in a stampede. Even the Beast had some blood showing when he got stabbed.

toonaspie wrote:

DisneyFan09 wrote: Agreed.

I was expecting a lot more blood and gore from a character who's supposed to die in a stampede. Even the Beast had some blood showing when he got stabbed.

PETA intervened.

It always bothered me that Kokoum gets shot and there's no blood.

enigmawing wrote:It always bothered me that Kokoum gets shot and there's no blood.

I know LOL.

I bet what happen was there was blood but some little shit from 4Kids, trying to carry out their censorship AmErikkkaniZion propaganda, secretly snuck in and edited it out without anyone realizing so.

either that or Thomas actually shot Kokoum in the dick/balls where you can't see the blood spewing out.

Lots of interesting comments in this thread........

I have always liked Pocahontas and it remains up there with my favorites and I would not remove Flit I always liked him reminds me sorta of how spiteful yet playful Tinkerbell was

I also have never known any children including my own to ever be scared of Beast or Ursula nor has any child I've ever known been scared of Snow White's Scary Adventures (but that's another topic) but then again every child is different lol

DisneyFan09 wrote:

Okay, here's a project-watch pocahontas, take notes on what could be improved in which ways and how well the movie could be done with minimal drastic changes. example: the total removal of animal sidekicks or just changing them a bit and removing some of the comic moments?

What a brillaint idea. Here are my notes;

- Making a more coherent script.
- Reduce the time of the sidekicks.
- Remove Flit. In my opinion, he was unlikeable, contrived and didn't add nothing to the movie.
- Give the time to give the Natives actual personalities. I don't mind Natives at all, but they were portrayed as pretty dour and lifeless characters (especially Nakoma).

Right, those are general reasons, but I was thinking on a scene-by-scene basis. Like "this should be here" or "no, that was a bad bit for this reason".

DisneyFan09 wrote:

Honestly, the only scene from any of the fab four that I would think might cross over into "non-family friendly" territory would be Mufasa's death scene. That was a bit intense.

Agreed.

a little kid loses a loved one every day, so I disagree.

As for the blood, thanks for bringing it up the first time in my life. I actually like to assume he's bleeding internally from the stampede.

ajmrowland wrote:

DisneyFan09 wrote: Agreed.

a little kid loses a loved one every day, so I disagree.

Yeah, but not most children get to watch it happen (unless hospitals have different rules for under-age children these days). Plus, I doubt murder is usually involved.

enigmawing wrote:It always bothered me that Kokoum gets shot and there's no blood.

Didn't bother me. I was too busy being caught up in the emotion of that moment to care how gory and not gory it was. It was a very important moment for that film, and I think it completely changed the story from that moment on. Now both sides had a real reason to hate each other and it caused Pocahontas to really examine her life and who she was as a person. It was very well done in my book, perfect.

Any flaw in the film is passable for me, except for the ridiculous change of heart her father suddenly has in the end. A moment earlier he was leading his people to kill Smith in "Savages" and now, less than a minute after his daughter tells him she's in love with Smith, he's suddenly open-minded and understanding. Please, they're down there wanting to kill you.

(In The Little Mermaid, it was done really well how the king finally managed to see things through his daughter's eyes.)

Having said that, Pocahontas is one of my favorite Disney films. I especially love the artwork, it's gorgeous.

rodis wrote:Any flaw in the film is passable for me, except for the ridiculous change of heart her father suddenly has in the end. A moment earlier he was leading his people to kill Smith in "Savages" and now, less than a minute after his daughter tells him she's in love with Smith, he's suddenly open-minded and understanding. Please, they're down there wanting to kill you.

It probably crossed his mind that Pocahontas would distance herself from him if he killed Smith after Pocahontas saved him.

Sky Syndrome wrote:

rodis wrote:Any flaw in the film is passable for me, except for the ridiculous change of heart her father suddenly has in the end. A moment earlier he was leading his people to kill Smith in "Savages" and now, less than a minute after his daughter tells him she's in love with Smith, he's suddenly open-minded and understanding. Please, they're down there wanting to kill you.

It probably crossed his mind that Pocahontas would distance herself from him if he killed Smith after Pocahontas saved him.

let's not forget the spirit of Pocahontas' mother was coincidentally and conveniently floating by as well

Right, those are general reasons, but I was thinking on a scene-by-scene basis. Like "this should be here" or "no, that was a bad bit for this reason".

Oh, I'm sorry. But I'll try again.

I've always had an issue with the ending. There's nothing wrong with that scene itself, cause it is a moving and touching scene. And there's nothing wrong by ending a film with a sad ending for once. But I do think the emotion of the scene is a bit contrived. It would be a better fit if the relationship between the lovebirds were more developed and more emotional. Despite some few touches, I thought they acted more like friends than lovebirds. If their relationship were more passionate and romantic, then the overwhelmingly sad ending would reasonate more to their relationship.

milojthatch wrote:

enigmawing wrote:It always bothered me that Kokoum gets shot and there's no blood.

Didn't bother me. I was too busy being caught up in the emotion of that moment to care how gory and not gory it was. It was a very important moment for that film, and I think it completely changed the story from that moment on. Now both sides had a real reason to hate each other and it caused Pocahontas to really examine her life and who she was as a person. It was very well done in my book, perfect.

Of course it's a very important moment in the film, full of emotion. I'm not into blood, guts, or gore (I can't stand horror films, for example), but showing a full-frontal shot of Kokoum falling backwards with no sign of an actual injury after the gunshot was a major distraction the very first time I watched it. I couldn't tell what happened exactly. Did the gunshot scare him? Did it barely graze him? Oh wait, never mind, he's dead . . . apparently he got shot in some vital area and the colors of the wind somehow masked it for the sake of the children.

If they were afraid to show blood (which I think is understandable) I think it was unwise to focus on his entire body falling without a wound in sight. They could have focused on just his face for example, or did the shot in a silhouette. Instead we're handed a confusing shot of a warrior falling from an invisible wound.

It's even odder when you realize on-screen blood wounds have shown up in other Disney animated movies, but not this one.