DVDizzy Forum

So, this release has improved deeper, darker, more contrasting colors. And it won't be badly compressed. And it will had a more picture in the ratio. Definately an upgrade, though I am still bummed we are not getting much closer to the VHS I loved the feel of as a kid.

If you ask me, though, the chairs they sit in for dinner...should be red, I mean, he lives in a nice castle, I would have red chairs over brown! And it's a romantic scene! And it's dinner!

As for the Belle's reflection...they should have done a much better job or not done it at all. IN THE REFLECTION BELLE HAS TWO ARMS ON THE SIDE WITH HER HAIR! That better only be in the Special Edition version! Did the original directors and Dahn Hahn even want or approve of that new reflection?

Matt wrote:

Prince Edward wrote: Here's *to* hoping

Hehe, oooh, I forgot a word. But considering English is not my first language, I don't think it's that bad. I would have liked to see you write in French/German/Spanish or something like that (or perhaps Norwegian, hehe) without making some mistakes along the way;)

Prince Edward wrote:

Matt wrote:

Hehe, oooh, I forgot a word. But considering English is not my first language, I don't think it's that bad. I would have liked to see you write in French/German/Spanish or something like that (or perhaps Norwegian, hehe) without making some mistakes along the way;)

You didn't forget the word, I added it lol. That's why I put that.

Kyle wrote:Also, DisneyChris, I believe what might be throwing you of is if you have VLC doing a hardware color overlay. Ive had similar issues with my screencaps giving me inaccurate colors. I now have that feature tuned off. Make sure that any color adjustments you do are from your display only. When you get multiple color adjustments and overlays its bound to be a little off.

Could you tell me how to see whether I've turned off that feature? I just set everything to default in the video settings.

funloops wrote:Also keep in mind that these are still from a mpeg2 source, and will suffer from the standard chroma issues (reds in particular won't be faithfully reproduced). The Blu-ray should really shine since this movie has a wine tint to it. (kind of like the Godfather films)

I totally agree. I feel frustrated that I can't capture the picture of the DVD from Mac OS X DVD Player. The VLC screencaps I posted are much redder than that. Plus, it looks much better on Blu-ray; shame I couldn't provide some proper screencaps of that too. Therefore, everyone (especially jpanimation) please don't get too unhappy about those VLC screencaps of the DVD before you see the real product with your own eyes. Gosh, I feel guilty to have posted them in the first place.

Update: Here's a direct photograph of the Blu-ray picture on my TV screen, and as you can see it's much less red. Please note that the photographed image still doesn't accurately represent the colors I see with my own eyes, but hope this makes some of you less worried. Make your final judgment when you've seen the disc yourself.

zackisthewalrus wrote:

DisneyChris wrote: Disc 1
- Sneak Peeks: Tangled, Bambi: Diamond Edition, Toy Story 3, The Lion King: Diamond Edition, Alice in Wonderland: Special 60th Anniversary Edition, Dumbo: 70th Anniversary Edition, A Christmas Carol

Looks like it's confirmed that Dumbo is still somewhere on the schedule. Does it say a specific month on the preview, DisneyChris?

I'm afraid no release date is given on the trailer, and there's no ad of it in the inserts as well. Lucky I already have the Hong Kong Blu-ray (in complete English packaging, no less!).

For people questioning about the included sneak peeks, please refer to the above quote.

Lastly, some screencaps of the DVD menus:

Screenshots do not necessarily provide an accurate reproduction of the image that they are intended to represent (which fact has been referenced in this thread). Moreover, the limitations inherent in the VHS & laserdisc media, the TVs to which they were connected, and the connections themselves---be they S-video or (especially) composite--make it *highly* improbable that any such viewing experience is likely to have replicated the original *theatrical* experience. When we start introducing variables like various compression schemes, display calibration (or lack thereof), the fact that color perception is individually subjective *and* subject to environment and context (a single image viewed in a darkened room may appear very differently than in well-lit environs, or when comparing a computer's LCD monitor to a 15-20-year-old SD tube TV)...this discussion of the color scheme for <i>BatB</i> borders on silliness. And the film was released 19 years ago: I sincerely doubt that anyone is capable of making an objective and accurate judgment regarding any home media release's authenticity to *that* experience.

Good to know that Dumbo is back on the schedule and that this Blu includes a Bambi trailer. I can't wait for this!

someone makes sense!!!

Mr. Yagoobian wrote:Screenshots do not necessarily provide an accurate reproduction of the image that they are intended to represent (which fact has been referenced in this thread). Moreover, the limitations inherent in the VHS & laserdisc media, the TVs to which they were connected, and the connections themselves---be they S-video or (especially) composite--make it *highly* improbable that any such viewing experience is likely to have replicated the original *theatrical* experience. When we start introducing variables like various compression schemes, display calibration (or lack thereof), the fact that color perception is individually subjective *and* subject to environment and context (a single image viewed in a darkened room may appear very differently than in well-lit environs, or when comparing a computer's LCD monitor to a 15-20-year-old SD tube TV)...this discussion of the color scheme for <i>BatB</i> borders on silliness. And the film was released 19 years ago: I sincerely doubt that anyone is capable of making an objective and accurate judgment regarding any home media release's authenticity to *that* experience.

Excellent point!

Mr. Yagoobian wrote:Screenshots do not necessarily provide an accurate reproduction of the image that they are intended to represent (which fact has been referenced in this thread). Moreover, the limitations inherent in the VHS & laserdisc media, the TVs to which they were connected, and the connections themselves---be they S-video or (especially) composite--make it *highly* improbable that any such viewing experience is likely to have replicated the original *theatrical* experience. When we start introducing variables like various compression schemes, display calibration (or lack thereof), the fact that color perception is individually subjective *and* subject to environment and context (a single image viewed in a darkened room may appear very differently than in well-lit environs, or when comparing a computer's LCD monitor to a 15-20-year-old SD tube TV)...this discussion of the color scheme for <i>BatB</i> borders on silliness. And the film was released 19 years ago: I sincerely doubt that anyone is capable of making an objective and accurate judgment regarding any home media release's authenticity to *that* experience.

Very well said! I think we shouldn't be so upset about the picture as long as it looks natural and pleasing. I'm very satisfied with how this new edition looks!

Mr. Yagoobian wrote:Screenshots do not necessarily provide an accurate reproduction of the image that they are intended to represent (which fact has been referenced in this thread). Moreover, the limitations inherent in the VHS & laserdisc media, the TVs to which they were connected, and the connections themselves---be they S-video or (especially) composite--make it *highly* improbable that any such viewing experience is likely to have replicated the original *theatrical* experience. When we start introducing variables like various compression schemes, display calibration (or lack thereof), the fact that color perception is individually subjective *and* subject to environment and context (a single image viewed in a darkened room may appear very differently than in well-lit environs, or when comparing a computer's LCD monitor to a 15-20-year-old SD tube TV)...this discussion of the color scheme for <i>BatB</i> borders on silliness. And the film was released 19 years ago: I sincerely doubt that anyone is capable of making an objective and accurate judgment regarding any home media release's authenticity to *that* experience.

Thank you. I've said many times that people can't claim which colors are 'original', but somehow some still refuse to listen. I'll wait for some actual reviews.

Mr. Yagoobian wrote:Screenshots do not necessarily provide an accurate reproduction of the image that they are intended to represent (which fact has been referenced in this thread). Moreover, the limitations inherent in the VHS & laserdisc media, the TVs to which they were connected, and the connections themselves---be they S-video or (especially) composite--make it *highly* improbable that any such viewing experience is likely to have replicated the original *theatrical* experience. When we start introducing variables like various compression schemes, display calibration (or lack thereof), the fact that color perception is individually subjective *and* subject to environment and context (a single image viewed in a darkened room may appear very differently than in well-lit environs, or when comparing a computer's LCD monitor to a 15-20-year-old SD tube TV)...this discussion of the color scheme for <i>BatB</i> borders on silliness. And the film was released 19 years ago: I sincerely doubt that anyone is capable of making an objective and accurate judgment regarding any home media release's authenticity to *that* experience.

Can you explain why there are complaints about the colors ONLY for THIS film and not any other??
I have all the VHS for the Disney films and all the DVDs. such radical change of colors appears ONLY in Beauty and the Beast.
It's not the environment's fault, etc.. so, I don't think the discussion is silly.
Also, I watched Beauty and the Beast at the cinema when it came out, and when i bought the VHS I was completely fine with it, and no problem at all.
Only when i saw the Dvd i shouted: WHAT IS THIS?????

Here is the original documentary that i also watched at that time of release. ANYONE can see the differenece and the radical changes that this film has been subject to!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fYHTvJ6xG10

NOONE who actually saw the film in the cinema can say that Belle's hair were actually red, and that you could see the Beast before it stepped to the light, because actually they weren't!!

I'm starting to believe that all these disagreements of people who say that the color discussion is silly, is from people who actually never saw the film in the cinema, and maybe only saw it for the first time in the DVD, so that's the image they stack to.

Wait, am I the only one who noticed that the menu screenshot DisneyChris just posted of Belle [walking out of her house] is in the colors of the VHS???

The irony...

Menu designs look very nice. Thank you for all your info DisneyChris!!!!

I am really excited for this release!!! Only 15 days!

filmmusic wrote:

Mr. Yagoobian wrote:Screenshots do not necessarily provide an accurate reproduction of the image that they are intended to represent (which fact has been referenced in this thread). Moreover, the limitations inherent in the VHS & laserdisc media, the TVs to which they were connected, and the connections themselves---be they S-video or (especially) composite--make it *highly* improbable that any such viewing experience is likely to have replicated the original *theatrical* experience. When we start introducing variables like various compression schemes, display calibration (or lack thereof), the fact that color perception is individually subjective *and* subject to environment and context (a single image viewed in a darkened room may appear very differently than in well-lit environs, or when comparing a computer's LCD monitor to a 15-20-year-old SD tube TV)...this discussion of the color scheme for <i>BatB</i> borders on silliness. And the film was released 19 years ago: I sincerely doubt that anyone is capable of making an objective and accurate judgment regarding any home media release's authenticity to *that* experience.

Can you explain why there are complaints about the colors ONLY for THIS film and not any other??
I have all the VHS for the Disney films and all the DVDs. such radical change of colors appears ONLY in Beauty and the Beast.
It's not the environment's fault, etc.. so, I don't think the discussion is silly.
Also, I watched Beauty and the Beast at the cinema when it came out, and when i bought the VHS I was completely fine with it, and no problem at all.
Only when i saw the Dvd i shouted: WHAT IS THIS?????

Here is the original documentary that i also watched at that time of release. ANYONE can see the differenece and the radical changes that this film has been subject to!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fYHTvJ6xG10

NOONE who actually saw the film in the cinema can say that Belle's hair were actually red, and that you could see the Beast before it stepped to the light, because actually they weren't!!

I'm starting to believe that all these disagreements of people who say that the color discussion is silly, is from people who actually never saw the film in the cinema, and maybe only saw it for the first time in the DVD, so that's the image they stack to.

If you think the only color complaints are with Beauty and the Beast, you're looking in the wrong place. LOL I've read complaints about Sleeping Beauty, Snow White, and Pinnochio not looking "film like" or having colors look too bright or artificial. This is just the latest complaint!

jsz1002 wrote:

filmmusic wrote: Can you explain why there are complaints about the colors ONLY for THIS film and not any other??
I have all the VHS for the Disney films and all the DVDs. such radical change of colors appears ONLY in Beauty and the Beast.
It's not the environment's fault, etc.. so, I don't think the discussion is silly.
Also, I watched Beauty and the Beast at the cinema when it came out, and when i bought the VHS I was completely fine with it, and no problem at all.
Only when i saw the Dvd i shouted: WHAT IS THIS?????

Here is the original documentary that i also watched at that time of release. ANYONE can see the differenece and the radical changes that this film has been subject to!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fYHTvJ6xG10

NOONE who actually saw the film in the cinema can say that Belle's hair were actually red, and that you could see the Beast before it stepped to the light, because actually they weren't!!

I'm starting to believe that all these disagreements of people who say that the color discussion is silly, is from people who actually never saw the film in the cinema, and maybe only saw it for the first time in the DVD, so that's the image they stack to.

If you think the only color complaints are with Beauty and the Beast, you're looking in the wrong place. LOL I've read complaints about Sleeping Beauty, Snow White, and Pinnochio not looking "film like" or having colors look too bright or artificial. This is just the latest complaint!

Don't forget Cinderella.

filmmusic wrote: I'm starting to believe that all these disagreements of people who say that the color discussion is silly, is from people who actually never saw the film in the cinema, and maybe only saw it for the first time in the DVD, so that's the image they stack to.

That could also be said for those who only saw the VHS, and to those who didn't see Cinderella, Sleeping Beauty, Pinocchio, and Snow White when they came out in theaters. Still doesn't change the fact that so many years have passed since they originally came out that who can honestly say they remember so much about what the colors looked like in the cinema? I know I can't.

Ok, here's a weird, random question about the movie.
When Belle and Beast are in their fancy formal wear at the dinner table (right before going off to dance in the ballroom), what's that painting on the wall? I feel like I should know this.

Disney Duster wrote:If you ask me, though, the chairs they sit in for dinner...should be red, I mean, he lives in a nice castle, I would have red chairs over brown! And it's a romantic scene! And it's dinner!

Whenever I take a girl out to dinner, the restaurant usually has something called 'atmospheric lighting'. This isn't where they replace all the light-bulbs with pink ones and give everyone red chairs, it's where they dim the lights to resemble a candle-lit room (to setup a romantic atmosphere). This [atmospheric lighting] was heavily incorporated in the original version of this movie during the dinner and ballroom sequence. Also, I've never seen a red chair like that, it just looks unnatural.




The bottom is of a picture I took of an antique chair we own. The colors very closely resemble those in the original theatrical version. Considering how Disney likes to research architecture and environments before they make movies, I'm sure they were basing the chair off of something real.

Mr. Yagoobian wrote:Screenshots do not necessarily provide an accurate reproduction of the image that they are intended to represent (which fact has been referenced in this thread). Moreover, the limitations inherent in the VHS & laserdisc media, the TVs to which they were connected, and the connections themselves---be they S-video or (especially) composite--make it *highly* improbable that any such viewing experience is likely to have replicated the original *theatrical* experience. When we start introducing variables like various compression schemes, display calibration (or lack thereof), the fact that color perception is individually subjective *and* subject to environment and context (a single image viewed in a darkened room may appear very differently than in well-lit environs, or when comparing a computer's LCD monitor to a 15-20-year-old SD tube TV)...this discussion of the color scheme for <i>BatB</i> borders on silliness. And the film was released 19 years ago: I sincerely doubt that anyone is capable of making an objective and accurate judgment regarding any home media release's authenticity to *that* experience.

All of my captures are made with the same device and everyone who views them are viewing the different images on the same screen (whatever that may be). That's a fair comparison and if people can still tell the difference between the images, then the discussion is not silly but valid.

filmmusic wrote:Can you explain why there are complaints about the colors ONLY for THIS film and not any other??
I have all the VHS for the Disney films and all the DVDs. such radical change of colors appears ONLY in Beauty and the Beast.
It's not the environment's fault, etc.. so, I don't think the discussion is silly.
Also, I watched Beauty and the Beast at the cinema when it came out, and when i bought the VHS I was completely fine with it, and no problem at all.
Only when i saw the Dvd i shouted: WHAT IS THIS?????

Here is the original documentary that i also watched at that time of release. ANYONE can see the differenece and the radical changes that this film has been subject to!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fYHTvJ6xG10

NOONE who actually saw the film in the cinema can say that Belle's hair were actually red, and that you could see the Beast before it stepped to the light, because actually they weren't!!

I'm starting to believe that all these disagreements of people who say that the color discussion is silly, is from people who actually never saw the film in the cinema, and maybe only saw it for the first time in the DVD, so that's the image they stack to.

This.

Why is it that this is the only CAPS film to have different colors every time it's released? This is not the format's fault, as none of the other CAPS films have such drastic changes between releases. I understand it when the colors change on the older films that need restorations and color correction but these all-digital films shouldn't even be touched. I just wish people would quite blaming the format.

Also, I 100% agree with you on your last observation. Most of the people defending this release have probably never seen the original as it was intended to be. I keep forgetting that there are whole generations that have now grown up with the Platinum Edition colors. That's like if they changed Cinderella to a definite blonde on it's DVD (like in most of the clip art), there would be a whole generation that never saw the theatrical showing/television re-runs/VHS/LaserDisc and wouldn't care in the slightest.

Most people that had the VHS or had seen it in theaters notice immediately that there is something wrong with the DVD, equating it to a DTV sequel, but they usually assume it was always that way and they just have bad memory. You don't hear more people complaining because they are unsure of what they just saw and default to blaming themselves for thinking there is something different. I know because I was just like them. I knew there was something very off about the DVD but I just blamed it on me not remembering the movie right. Then I found this site and had my suspicions confirmed (my VHS was at a different house, so I couldn't us that). If information on the color changes was as abundant as what you can find on the supposed subtle racism and hidden sex messages, with all of those sites posting comparisons, there would be a much larger outcry. As long as people can't confirm their suspicions, they'll just continue to blame themselves and accept the colors.

rodis wrote:Wait, am I the only one who noticed that the menu screenshot DisneyChris just posted of Belle [walking out of her house] is in the colors of the VHS???

The irony...

Kind of, but I think as the title fades, the sky gets oranger during the opening to the Belle sequence.



DisneyChris would have to snag us some exact frame captures to properly compare (and since they're both being captured by the same device, Mr. Yagoobian, it's a fair comparison). Also, it's not really irony since the vast majority of the supplements on the Platinum Edition DVD featured the original theatrical colors.

while my early childhood is filled with memories of the vhs, i think that particular scene looks more romantic in the platinum colors.

jpanimation wrote: Also, I 100% agree with you on your last observation. Most of the people defending this release have probably never seen the original as it was intended to be. I keep forgetting that there are whole generations that have now grown up with the Platinum Edition colors. That's like if they changed Cinderella to a definite blonde on it's DVD (like in most of the clip art), there would be a whole generation that never saw the theatrical showing/television re-runs/VHS/LaserDisc and wouldn't care in the slightest.

You're still assuming that the VHS and Laserdisc are the ones that are correct, and that anyone can remember how the theatrical version would look like, nineteen years ago.