DVDizzy Forum

SpringHeelJack wrote:And then it turned out the wicked queen was really old man Higgins in disguise!

And he would have gotten away with it too, if it weren't for those meddling dwarfs.

One question; It's been said that the "Disney through the decades" feature is on the new edition, and includes a new segment that details Disney starting from 2001 and ends today with The Princess and the Frog. Is this true or not?

Also, how much of the old material has been ported over to the new edition?

I love early sneak peeks! Thank you, brownpuppy.

In the Blu screenshot of Love's First Kiss, the Prince is such a dark pink like he's flushed with embarassment/fever/sunburn.

enigmawing wrote:

SpringHeelJack wrote:And then it turned out the wicked queen was really old man Higgins in disguise!

And he would have gotten away with it too, if it weren't for those meddling dwarfs.

I have a feeling they'll be meeting Old Man Higgins again soon in the upcoming "Snow White and the Harlem Globetrotters 2", so I wouldn't worry about him.

KubrickFan wrote:

Marky_198 wrote: I know that, and I'm starting to realize that HD ruins an animated film, because it makes it look like Hanna Barbera.

You do realize both Blu-rays and dvds are lower resolution copies from 35mm elements? So either you just have to get used to the fact that an animated film simply looks different from the way you were used to, or moviegoers in the thirties would complain about the fact that animated movies would look awful on a big screen. And I never heard anything like the second.

Exactly. If he's complaining about HD exposing film faults than his head would explode seeing the original 35mm print with the full resolution. Complaining because it looks closer to it's original theatrical counterpart is crazy as I thought thats what everyone wanted.

Also, thanks goofystitch for the comparisons. Looks like the the color has been toned down or altered on the new one in comparison to the 2001 restoration. I prefer some of the changes but then I like some of the 2001 colors. Is the Huntsman supposed to be a little pinkish and is the sky not supposed to be as blue? Who knows which is correct as their isn't many around who've seen it theatrically. Either way, I'm convinced that the people handling the restoration have resources that probably justified the changes. It does show how great their original restoration was as the differences in clarity are tiny, if any.

I'm really excited to see this after so many years (haven't seen it since my VHS).

jpanimation wrote:Exactly. If he's complaining about HD exposing film faults than his head would explode seeing the original 35mm print with the full resolution. Complaining because it looks closer to it's original theatrical counterpart is crazy as I thought thats what everyone wanted.

jpanimation, you have the honour of being the person to bring back my WIST series!!!



albert

jpanimation wrote:Also, thanks goofystitch for the comparisons. Looks like the the color has been toned down or altered on the new one in comparison to the 2001 restoration. I prefer some of the changes but then I like some of the 2001 colors. Is the Huntsman supposed to be a little pinkish and is the sky not supposed to be as blue? Who knows which is correct as their isn't many around who've seen it theatrically. Either way, I'm convinced that the people handling the restoration have resources that probably justified the changes. It does show how great their original restoration was as the differences in clarity are tiny, if any.

I always thought the 2001 restoration was well done and was wondering how much they could really improve upon it. The differences seem to be slight, with the exception of some color changes. Reportedly, when Frank Thomas saw the 2001 restoration he said something to the tune of "I like the colors. They aren't the ones we used, but they look good." According to several sources, Walt decided that Snow White should have a soft color palette because he was worried that audiences eyes would hurt by the end if the colors were too bright. While this isn't true of all the colors (many were intentionally bright for effect, such as the apple), the new restoration does seem more in league with reports of the film having softer colors.

And you are correct that they have multiple references when doing these digital restorations. I met Les Perkins over the summer, who makes bonus features for Disney and also is brought in sometimes as a consultant on restorations. He mentioned that their most reliable source is to take the cels and backgrounds that still exist and photograph them using the same techniques originally used. Based on what that film shows, they attempt to get the colors as close as possible to the original intentions. Judging by the first 30 minutes of the film that I saw at the D23 Expo, I have to say they did a fantastic job with this one.

The_Iceflash wrote:

Marky_198 wrote: I know that, and I'm starting to realize that HD ruins an animated film, because it makes it look like Hanna Barbera.

To be fair, I wouldn't make a final judgment based on screenshots. My Pinocchio and Sleeping Beauty DVDs look much better than the screenshots made it appear to be. The screenshots made the colors look darker and the image less sharp than they appeared on my TV. You have to consider the imperfections screenshots have.

Sigh. And this is directed at Marky, not you Iceflash

We don't know how the screen were taken - were they on Full RGB or Not, or have then been taken on reduced RGB and adjusted for a monitor. I know I keep going on about this, but it really does effect the image. Computer monitors show colours using the range 0-255, most (older) displays cannot and only display 16-239 (where 16, 16, 16 is pure black for example rather 0, 0, 0 on a computer) than and thus some output devices only deliver these colours. Meaning they look different when displayed on a computer monitor. Most DVD players are incapable of outputting Full RGB so the discs are encoded using the limited palette, where as most (all?) hi-def players can output in full mode, so most are encoded to take advantage of the full range of colours. If you don't like it, set your player to the limited palette. See how the limited setting makes the CGI image below look "older" and in Marky's eyes probably more "classy" and "dimentional".

Check this out:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthre ... st11672095

The same image captured with different RGB output settings from a PS3 game (Limited on the Left, Full on the right).

All this microscopic analysis of the colours on various screenshots is a complete waste of time, because they can only be a guide. Even if the colours are the the colour/contrast/brightness settings on our hi-def displays are likely to be set differently from each others anyway. Only comment on the quality of the release when you actually see it.

Marky I've posted this before, but you have ignored them, so for the last time I will attempt to educate you about film:

http://www.ultimatedisney.com/forum/vie ... 723#454723
About the old Technicolor tie-dye process, and how it looked. Now none of us here can say for certain how it looked because none of us were there. Short of inventing a time machine, the only way we can tell is to recreate the process today.

Which surprise, surprise is what happened here.

For more on Technicolor's tie-dye processing read this article here about the process when it was revived in the late 1990s.

http://www.mkpe.com/publications/d-cine ... icolor.php

Quote:
I have never seen video pictures like this displayed on any type of display. The most costly studio monitor cannot show images like this. And Digital Cinema comes no where close. The lack of film grain is amazing in this dye transfer print. This film is obviously shot with a lot of high speed negative (probably pushed) and many practical lights (flaming torches) and there is little to no grain in the projected image.

There are many reasons why grain is formed, but the main reasons are the quality of the film stock and underexposure (that's why dark scenes tend to be more grainy). By all accounts the Technicolor process used expensive stock and the images were taken under highly controlled lighting conditions for live action. I can only assume the lighting was even more controlled being basically animation frames taken from mainly fixed cameras (multi-plane shots excluded).

So yes, I believe at the time Snow White was mostly grain free, as will the Blu-ray and DVD. Because everything I read from people in the know tells me that is likely to be the case.

Secondly, I want to ad a bit about film resolution, detail and sharpness.

Film resolution is very high. It is higher than Blu-ray - even 16mm film has a higher resolution then Blu-ray and that's about a quarter of the resolution of 35mm film. Try it, by doubling the size, you quadruple the resolution (2x2 = 4, 4x4 = 16). To say Snow White never looked this sharp or was never intended to look this sharp is frankly laughable.

In fact, 16mm film (Snow White was 35mm) is so sharp that b/w film recordings of colour video taken off a studio monitor contain enough information to show how the dots make up the B/W image and from that the colour information can be recovered.

See here http://colour-recovery.wikispaces.com/A ... e+material

If 16mm film can do that, contain information most people's eyes cannot see unless literally right next to the screen, how can you doubt the resolution of Snow White's 35mm film, shot under highly controlled conditions, with a static camera, with static uniform lighting, at a carefully set focus calibrated to an object at a static depth, wouldn't show the detail of the Prince's eyelashes?

Colour Recovery is a ground breaking new technology in use today, but still being improved to restore several BBC programmes which only exist as B/W film recordings to colour. It is however, also an example of how technology for processing images is constantly changing and innovating. Which is another example of why this latest restoration is likely to be the best, most faithful restoration of Snow White - the tools keep changing and improving.

Does the DVD have all the bonus features on Disc one of the Blu-ray? Remember Disney wasn't really advertising it that much on the Blu-ray only the DVD Combo Pack. If it's the same, I rather have the Blu-ray pack! Even though the DVD Combo Pack has the best cover.

I just out of my chair when I saw BATB before Fantasia lol. I hope they don't push the release back though, do to the 3D version may not be out by 2011.

Please brownpuppy post more pictures and more details if possible. You have me on my edge of my seat waiting for you almighty updates!
Thanks so much...

Just.A.Friend wrote:Please brownpuppy post more pictures and more details if possible.

He won't. On page 2 he said this:

• Now...I don't do SPOILERS so here's a heads up on what to expect.
  
  HEADS UP!
  - Go into the magic Mirror, Mirror on the Wall game to see which Princess you are.
  - There will be a sneak peek of the new Disney film for 2009, "The Pirncess and the Frog" and its a rough cut of the film from the beginning it takes about only 6 minutes for the preview. And all I have to say is, this will be the new classic Disney film for the 2010's because I see a resemblance to "The Little Mermaid" and "Aladdin". And most of all I love hand drawn animations period (no 3D).
  - Take a look at the documentary of Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs on how it started it all.
  - And this Blu-Ray also includes the DVD inside for only the film.
  
  And that's all I'll give you. Bye-bye...

So what he already posted is all that he'll post.

I'm waiting for lighthousemike to post (if he got an advance copy). He usually has lots of screencaps, is quick to answer questions, and doesn't mind giving spoilers.

albert

Escapay wrote:

Just.A.Friend wrote:Please brownpuppy post more pictures and more details if possible.

He won't. On page 2 he said this:

• Now...I don't do SPOILERS so here's a heads up on what to expect.
  
  HEADS UP!
  - Go into the magic Mirror, Mirror on the Wall game to see which Princess you are.
  - There will be a sneak peek of the new Disney film for 2009, "The Pirncess and the Frog" and its a rough cut of the film from the beginning it takes about only 6 minutes for the preview. And all I have to say is, this will be the new classic Disney film for the 2010's because I see a resemblance to "The Little Mermaid" and "Aladdin". And most of all I love hand drawn animations period (no 3D).
  - Take a look at the documentary of Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs on how it started it all.
  - And this Blu-Ray also includes the DVD inside for only the film.
  
  And that's all I'll give you. Bye-bye...

So what he already posted is all that he'll post.

I'm waiting for lighthousemike to post (if he got an advance copy). He usually has lots of screencaps, is quick to answer questions, and doesn't mind giving spoilers.

albert

Unless lighthousemike decides not to get it for some reason.....then we have to wait 2 more weeks.....that would be so terrible....apoclypse will surely soon follow if we have to wait 2 more weeks...

Matt wrote:Does the DVD have all the bonus features on Disc one of the Blu-ray? Remember Disney wasn't really advertising it that much on the Blu-ray only the DVD Combo Pack. If it's the same, I rather have the Blu-ray pack! Even though the DVD Combo Pack has the best cover.

I just out of my chair when I saw BATB before Fantasia lol. I hope they don't push the release back though, do to the 3D version may not be out by 2011.

The only bonus features on disc 1 of the DVD set (what is included with the Blu-Ray combo pack) are the new music video by Tiffany Thorton and the audio commentary pieced together from interviews with Walt Disney.

As I've said before, I got confirmation from a Disney Store executive that Beauty and the Beast is the Fall 2010 release. WDSHE has to give Disney Store an advance warning with big releases so that they can prepare merchandise tie-ins for them. So we all have every reason to expect Fantasia/Fantasia 2000 sometime next Spring and Beauty and the Beast next Fall.

Another reason to expect BatB in the Fall? Princess related films are usually Disney's top sellers and they would be releasing it dangerously close to the home entertainment debut of The Princess and the Frog, causing some consumers to have to choose between the two and also not spreading their income out like they should.

I am furious that Disney have left the deleted Witch At The Cauldron sequence out of the new forthcoming Blu Ray - why on earth this has been left out of this "most complete" Snow White and The Seven Dwarfs version God knows because it was included in both the Laserdisc version and previous Platinum Edition DVD in 2001 !!

It's only 30 seconds long but was a terrific sequence adding extra ooomph to the dark edge of the Witch/Wicked Queen's character - why oh why they chose to dispense with it I'll never know!!

So that they can release the super slick edition down the line

No, seriously, Disney could have done the same way Warner is doing for Wizard of Oz i.e. add a ton of bonus features (I mean hours and hours!!)
But it is clear that they don't care to cater to the movie buffs out there but to the moms and dads who want their children to just shut up

Deco King wrote:I am furious that Disney have left the deleted Witch At The Cauldron sequence out of the new forthcoming Blu Ray - why on earth this has been left out of this "most complete" Snow White and The Seven Dwarfs version God knows because it was included in both the Laserdisc version and previous Platinum Edition DVD in 2001 !!

It's only 30 seconds long but was a terrific sequence adding extra ooomph to the dark edge of the Witch/Wicked Queen's character - why oh why they chose to dispense with it I'll never know!!

It's there. Relax.

Escapay wrote:

Just.A.Friend wrote:Please brownpuppy post more pictures and more details if possible.

He won't. On page 2 he said this:

• Now...I don't do SPOILERS so here's a heads up on what to expect.
  
  HEADS UP!
  - Go into the magic Mirror, Mirror on the Wall game to see which Princess you are.
  - There will be a sneak peek of the new Disney film for 2009, "The Pirncess and the Frog" and its a rough cut of the film from the beginning it takes about only 6 minutes for the preview. And all I have to say is, this will be the new classic Disney film for the 2010's because I see a resemblance to "The Little Mermaid" and "Aladdin". And most of all I love hand drawn animations period (no 3D).
  
  - Take a look at the documentary of Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs on how it started it all.
  - And this Blu-Ray also includes the DVD inside for only the film.
  
  And that's all I'll give you. Bye-bye...

So what he already posted is all that he'll post.
I'm waiting for lighthousemike to post (if he got an advance copy). He usually has lots of screencaps, is quick to answer questions, and doesn't mind giving spoilers.
albert

I usually lurk, but i do see lighthouse mouse having to give a lot more info, i dont understand why brownpuppy comes on here to "show off" his copy says some things nd decides thats it, that's not really helping, he knows people will ask things Nd refuses to answer for that don't even post his copy, he said he doesn't do spoilers but he just did, ok sorry rant finish, it just erks me

Want2beBelle wrote:I usually lurk, but i do see lighthouse mouse having to give a lot more info, i dont understand why brownpuppy comes on here to "show off" his copy says some things nd decides thats it, that's not really helping, he knows people will ask things Nd refuses to answer for that don't even post his copy, he said he doesn't do spoilers but he just did, ok sorry rant finish, it just erks me

Don't worry about ranting, I agree with pretty much everything you said. I'm sure brownpuppy had good intentions in posting that he has it early, but really, because he is so annoyingly cryptic about it and because it's just "Look, I have it early!" it really does come off as showing off and really is a spoiler though he doesn't intend it to be.

That's why I prefer lighthousemike's previews. He knows people want to know about things so he posts about them rather than come in once in awhile to say, "Here's a picture of me with such-and-such that hasn't come out yet! I don't like spoilers, so this is all you'll get! Okay, bye until the next Platinum!"

Lighthousemike, where are you?!?

albert

I agree with Scaps. No offense to brownpuppy, but to me it looks like he just wants to brag and show off his early copy, then disappear without contributing any significant information or opinion to the forums. No one can dictate how to act or what to post on a forum, but you can annoy people if you do the same thing over and over.