DVDizzy Forum

TM2-Megatron wrote:

bmadigan wrote:I don't have an HD television yet, so I'm in no hurry. Once I do, I will concentrate at first on the Pixar films which I've been holding off buying in anticipation that they will see the biggest upgrade in picture quality from the blu-ray. Then I will wait and see if the HD picture is that much better than the old DVDs. So far when looking at HD screens in the department stores, I have not been impressed by the increase in picture quality over the old standard. Initial reports had been that the HD picture was so good it was practically 3-D. I just don't see it.

You should also take into account that most department stores use splitting to get the image onto all those displays; which can potentially cause signal degradation. It's much easier for them to do that than to have seperate HD tuners running for every TV.

Well, then they are probably losing sales for themselves if they aren't preseting the best possible HD images.

They are.

All Displays i've ever seen on a store are so out of wack and with the wrong signal and "stretch" mode and settings wrong that they all look like total crap.
My DVDs look better on my display that ANY store. Jafar has concluded the same thing, just ask him about his HDTV he bought. He loves it.

IF the display don't look like <a href="http://www.kinoweb.de/film2001/Shrek/pi ... g">this</a>, it not showing tru Blu-ray Hi Res

bmadigan wrote:

TM2-Megatron wrote: You should also take into account that most department stores use splitting to get the image onto all those displays; which can potentially cause signal degradation. It's much easier for them to do that than to have seperate HD tuners running for every TV.

Well, then they are probably losing sales for themselves if they aren't preseting the best possible HD images.

Quite true. I'd imagine most department stores (not exactly the best retailer to use for high-end electronics) don't give the majority of their customers alot of credit for being much more than people who "have to have the best things" with egos the size of Russia; and they're probably right, for the most part. I'd imagine most of their customers don't really examine the equipment, or its quality in-store with a fine-tooth comb. Nor would most of them even be the type of people who'd really appreciate the increased quality.

Department stores are fine for some things, but I wouldn't buy a TV, or any kind of electronics from one. Hell, none of the ones around me even carry stereo component systems anymore (not that the Sony, Panasonic and stuff they carried was ever very good, anyway). You either need to get an integrated stereo (bad), or a multichannel receiver for use with your TV and as a sound system.

deathie mouse wrote:IF the display don't look like <a href="http://www.kinoweb.de/film2001/Shrek/pi ... g">this</a>, it not showing tru Blu-ray Hi Res

That's.... just amazing.

to me, upgrading shouldnt be about the quality of the picture but rather the quality of the dvd material that comes along with the movie. I usually wait around for the super-est edition of the movies I really want. The only single-disc Disney film I own is Bambi II but all my other Disney films are strictly the 2-disc special editions.

I don't think I would upgrade until DVD became the minority format and harder-to-find than hi-def discs.

With the VHS-to-DVD shift, the appeal for me at least was not in the picture or sound quality, but rather in portability (smaller media to carry around), versatility (I can watch movies on my TV or on my laptop at 35,000 feet), and durability (several of my old VHS tapes are beginning to deteriorate from use). Plus, the selection on digital media is getting better and better than it was with tapes, especially with regards to TV shows.

Someone, please inform me! What the heck is Blu-ray???????? I am completely lost!

TheSequelofDisney wrote:Someone, please inform me! What the heck is Blu-ray???????? I am completely lost!

Okay, after reading up on the various formats myself, I'm gonna take a stab at this using my limited knowledge of physics:

Blu-Ray is one of several high-definition DVD formats being proposed. What sets apart Blu-Ray from formats such as HD-DVD is that the Blu-Ray system uses a blue laser to read the discs as opposed to red. If I understand correctly (enter Bill Nye the Science Guy mode here), because blue wavelengths are shorter than red, more information can be stored on a disc that is read with blue light as opposed to red light. More space equals more capacity for whiz-bang picture and sound, which high-definition requires. HD-DVD discs, using red laser technology, would require frequent disc swapping to watch hi-def material, I think.

However, beyond technology, each format is supported by several different movie/home entertainment companies, and probably the format with the most support will end up being the dominant one when the dust clears. Each company has to decide whether the cost associated with switching over to a particular format is worth the potential profits from media once that format goes on sale.

I think that's about right...did I miss/goof up anything?

Thanks a lot!!!!!!!!

Has anyone heard of the dual format players yet? LG is planning to make a player that will play both HD-DVD and Blu-Ray. If this is successful I would imagine others doing the same. This might be a good ideal because of the two formats.

HD-DVD/Blu-Ray may become like DVD+R and DVD-R. Even though +R/-R each have their advantages/disadvantages they are able to be used by almost 100% of all new DVD Burners and drives.

So much technical developments and possibilities for media to make use of or not...I think i'll wait me a while...to see which format survives or becomes mainstream..............who owns the Laser Disc?....

Also as finally mentioned in the later parts of this thread is that you gotto have a HDTV to even appreciate the improved quality.
The HDTV's are on the rise in holland but still way to expensive to just replace my still working current widescreen.

You can now buy dvd players and home cinema sets from as low as €30,- to several hundreds. If a blue-ray player will be like in the region's from €500 to a €1000,- euro's i think many people will wait till the price drops.
The big DVD surge and extinction of the VHS didn't happen here till some years ago when new and newer DVD's started to fall into the pricerange of €15 to €25 as opposed to €25 to €45 before.

Also for CGI movies i can easily understand the benefits of a better 3d picture. But with hand-drawn animation i have yet to be convinced of the difference between an excellent quality picture like Brother Bear as opposed to a Blue-Ray version of this.
Seeying is believing i guess. If future players continue to play DVD's (which are sufficient for a good viewing experience) i'll be keeping my current discs for a looong time.

Karushifa wrote:

TheSequelofDisney wrote:Someone, please inform me! What the heck is Blu-ray???????? I am completely lost!

Okay, after reading up on the various formats myself, I'm gonna take a stab at this using my limited knowledge of physics:
............................t with the most support will end up being the dominant one when the dust clears. Each company has to decide whether the cost associated with switching over to a particular format is worth the potential profits from media once that format goes on sale.

I think that's about right...did I miss/goof up anything?

Okay, a few things are incorrect there, sorry.

Both Blu-ray and HD-DVD have violet blue lasers that measure 405 nanometres (nm). The difference is Blu-ray's data layer is only .1 mm from the surface and HD-DVD is .6 mm, which is the same as DVD.

Blu-ray can hold more data, because the pores on the disc are smaller than DVD and therefore can be closer, which also gives it a bigger bandwidth (72 mb/sec). Blu-ray will be used for High Definition content (movies et cetera) at a maximum resolution of 1080 x 1920 (1080p). Dual layer discs are 50 GB (54 GB max), single layer 25 GB (27 GB max). Don't be fooled though, Lord of the Rings: Return of the King (Extended Edition), may only just fit on a single disc and only because it would be encoded in MPEG 4 (example).

The format was first designed as a rewritable disc, then they designed the Read Only Memory (ROM) disc, then the Recordable version. Development first started in the early 1990s, with Sony developing the first constant violet blue laser (1995).

Hogi Bear wrote:

Karushifa wrote: Okay, after reading up on the various formats myself, I'm gonna take a stab at this using my limited knowledge of physics:
............................t with the most support will end up being the dominant one when the dust clears. Each company has to decide whether the cost associated with switching over to a particular format is worth the potential profits from media once that format goes on sale.

I think that's about right...did I miss/goof up anything?

Okay, a few things are incorrect there, sorry.

Both Blu-ray and HD-DVD have violet blue lasers that measure 405 nanometres (nm). The difference is Blu-ray's data layer is only .1 mm from the surface and HD-DVD is .6 mm, which is the same as DVD.

Blu-ray can hold more data, because the pores on the disc are smaller than DVD and therefore can be closer, which also gives it a bigger bandwidth (72 mb/sec). Blu-ray will be used for High Definition content (movies et cetera) at a maximum resolution of 1080 x 1920 (1080p). Dual layer discs are 50 GB (54 GB max), single layer 25 GB (27 GB max). Don't be fooled though, Lord of the Rings: Return of the King (Extended Edition), may only just fit on a single disc and only because it would be encoded in MPEG 4 (example).

The format was first designed as a rewritable disc, then they designed the Read Only Memory (ROM) disc, then the Recordable version. Development first started in the early 1990s, with Sony developing the first constant violet blue laser (1995).

The website I saw listed HD-DVD under the formats where the old style red laser would be used, but perhaps this is a different HD-DVD entirely? Here's the site: http://www.hddvd.org/hddvd/difformatsblueray.php
In the case of whatever "HD-DVD 9" is listed as on the page, it sounds as if it would use current DVD read technology.

The physics thing I brought up sounds about right, though, in that it seems as if more discrete parcels of data, as there would be on a Blu-Ray disc, would require a laser of a shorter wavelength to read. Conversely, shorter wavelength laser = more data can be stored on a disc, except in smaller pieces than before. Otherwise, what would be the point of using a laser at the other end of the (visible) spectrum than what is used now?

Karushifa wrote:The website I saw listed HD-DVD under the formats where the old style red laser would be used, but perhaps this is a different HD-DVD entirely? Here's the site: http://www.hddvd.org/hddvd/difformatsblueray.php
In the case of whatever "HD-DVD 9" is listed as on the page, it sounds as if it would use current DVD read technology.

The physics thing I brought up sounds about right, though, in that it seems as if more discrete parcels of data, as there would be on a Blu-Ray disc, would require a laser of a shorter wavelength to read. Conversely, shorter wavelength laser = more data can be stored on a disc, except in smaller pieces than before. Otherwise, what would be the point of using a laser at the other end of the (visible) spectrum than what is used now?

That website is talking about using a normal DVD, with new compression standards to display High Definition video (from what I understand). I think that that page had more to do with the development of HD-DVD and how data should be stored and read et cetera. This was one of the options, acording to a link on the page, that they could use for HD-DVD, before they confirmed on the violet blue laser.

That website (hddvd.org) is also privately owned, so it may not have everything correct.

Hope this helps.

Edit: The stuff you mentioned about the laser wavelength size sounds right, I just went over storage size just for the general explanation.

Hogi Bear wrote:That website is talking about using a normal DVD, with new compression standards to display High Definition video (from what I understand). I think that that page had more to do with the development of HD-DVD and how data should be stored and read et cetera. This was one of the options, acording to a link on the page, that they could use for HD-DVD, before they confirmed on the violet blue laser.

So perhaps at this point it's all about which format gets the most support from DVD manufacturers and entertainment companies. This would make the issue more analogous to the Betamax vs. VHS debate than videotape vs. DVD (which I've heard some compare it to, especially since the videotape market is slowly dying and new investment on anything related to it is seen as unwise at this point), although the idea of a backwards-compatible player (which can play normal as well as hi-def DVDs) is encouraging for those who aren't techno junkies who invest in all the latest home entertainment gizmos.

I have a feeling I'll have to dissuade my father from sinking money on a hi-def DVD player plus DVDs if he isn't going to upgrade his big screen (but relatively old) TV at the same time; he likes buying the latest toys, but he doesn't always buy them for the right reason