DVDizzy Forum

toonaspie wrote: Fraid to ask but what's The Cogsworth Incident? I must admit I never noticed the difference between the two versions seeing I didnt watch the original as much.

The directors never liked a piece of animation of Cogsworth when the villagers want to siege the castle and Beast doesn't see a point in defending anymore. Anyway, they asked if it could be changed for the dvd/Imax version. Disney said yes, but let a different animator do it under severe time constraints. So it's still not what the directors want.

Not necessarily, but you have to agree, in a situation like this, Cogsworth is not going to flail his arms about for no reason and make a facial expression like, "OMG, HOLY CRAP!"(Old Version)
No. He's not really the type. A more simplistic gesture, and a face like "But... why has he done that?" is much better. There's a reason why they changed it, not just "well, let's put something new in here to screw with our fans' heads."

I disagree. Losing your chance for humanity is just cause for flailing. Besides, Cogsworth's character is wound up, but he cracks under pressure. Not to say I don't agree with the directors that it could've used re-animating, just that it fits in line with the film as it is regardless and seems an unnecessary change.

Also, that you enjoyed the changes to B&tB doesn't bother me. That you liked "Morning Report," on the other hand...

Cogsworth always came off exhausted, annoyed, and rhetorical to me in the original version. In the second it feels like he's actually asking a valid, "Why [did you do that]?"

KubrickFan wrote:

toonaspie wrote: Fraid to ask but what's The Cogsworth Incident? I must admit I never noticed the difference between the two versions seeing I didnt watch the original as much.

The directors never liked a piece of animation of Cogsworth when the villagers want to siege the castle and Beast doesn't see a point in defending anymore. Anyway, they asked if it could be changed for the dvd/Imax version. Disney said yes, but let a different animator do it under severe time constraints. So it's still not what the directors want.

caps?

Better yet.....

I can't find that video.

Here it is:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bZzxxBZUD-o

I admit I prefer the animation of the second one, but prefer the shading of the first one. Still, either way, the original should be given as a viable option on the BD. Let's see what happens.

I always preferred the second one. It's less of a tizzy little fit and more of a broken, defeated look, which to me felt all the more apropos at that point in the film.

SpringHeelJack wrote:I always preferred the second one. It's less of a tizzy little fit and more of a broken, defeated look, which to me felt all the more apropos at that point in the film.

My thoughts exactly.

And yeah, Disney's Divinity, I know, it's shameful! I can't help it though! I think it's a catchy tune, and the puns make me smile.... The original version was slightly less amusing. I do, however, find the voices fairly wretched, but at least they're better than that guy they got to dub David Tomlinson's lines in "Bedknobs."

Just in case anyone hasn't seen this and is interested, here's what animator Will Finn himself had to say about the Cogsworth Incident:

http://willfinn.blogspot.com/2008/07/clockwork.html

Miss Jo wrote:Just in case anyone hasn't seen this and is interested, here's what animator Will Finn himself had to say about the Cogsworth Incident:

http://willfinn.blogspot.com/2008/07/clockwork.html

Since he didn't get that chance to re-animated the scene, it should have been left alone, point blank! I cannot stand when Disney goes and touches up a film for no reason. Do you think I fell in love with the movie because Cogsworth srugged his arms that way? NO, it was the movie itself!

I don't know, it definitely looks better now. It's a shame Will Finn didn't get to oversee the change himself (because he would have, willingly!), but he wasn't at Disney at the time, therefore relinquishing his opportunity to do anything with the company. At least they did comply with his wish that the animation be changed, even if he wasn't the one to do it.

Matt wrote:

Miss Jo wrote:Just in case anyone hasn't seen this and is interested, here's what animator Will Finn himself had to say about the Cogsworth Incident:

http://willfinn.blogspot.com/2008/07/clockwork.html

Since he didn't get that chance to re-animated the scene, it should have been left alone, point blank! I cannot stand when Disney goes and touches up a film for no reason. Do you think I fell in love with the movie because Cogsworth srugged his arms that way? NO, it was the movie itself!

But has seeing it changed made you fall out of love with the movie?

Personally, I think it shouldn't have been changed, because we all know Beauty and the Beast was rushed and I dare say there's other sequences of animation the animators and/or directors would want to change. It's no secret Belle goes off-model often for example.

But I have no problem with anything being changed when the film is clearly labelled as a "Special Edition" and has "an all new animated-song" included. Of course, that's talking about it theatrically and not on home video where (probably down to the need to make such a high-profile release compatible with the highest number of players at the time) the branching was crude and inefficient meaning we didn't get the original "theatrical" version of the film. Hopefully with the next release (on DVD and on Blu-ray) will use better, proper seamless branching.

It seems a bit off they would change that for the "special edition" when, for example, we know an animated prologue was first planned but dropped due to time constraints. I know it all comes down to money (everything ultimately comes down to money) but I would have thought, if going for a new edit of the film and calling it a special edition, why not go all the way and restore as much of the original vision as possible?

After looking at the clip I dont see why Will Finn was so desperate to have it change. It really didnt look like a big deal to me. Disney films have ton of brief animation quirks like that all the time.

No previews on the UP Blu-ray, hmmmm. I hope this wasn't pushed back for 2011!

Matt wrote:No previews on the UP Blu-ray, hmmmm. I hope this wasn't pushed back for 2011!

I'm guessing that the lack of a preview has more to do with the fact that the release is still a year away. It was already featured on Snow White and Tinker Bell ATLT. If they put it on every release between now and October 2010, it will be overkill and people might even get sick of seeing it and become less inclined to buy it (law of diminishing marginal utility).

I'm just glad that a preview for Dumbo automatically plays for it. It would be great if that sold really well to encourage more Blu-Ray releases of DACs.

yeah, its too soon to put it on up. I'd expect it on the Frog blu ray though.

Ahhh, so I guess we were just getting a teaser? lol

Matt wrote:Here is the Official Diamond Edition Trailer!!!

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the colors make me sick!

I believe that this is a UK version of the trailer, but here is the US trailer, but it was taken from the Diamond Edition of "Snow White" which I don't have it in my collection. Enjoy!

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/tH8-wC-ab18&hl ... ram><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/tH8-wC-ab18&hl=en&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

Well, the DVD that came with Snow White's Blu-Ray had the preview. Oh my goodness, I'm so unhappy about all of this. I hope they don't push the DVD back or I'll lose my mind.