DVDizzy Forum

Disney's Divinity wrote:

Warm Regards wrote:Really curious what interesting ideas we missed out on because of technical limitations.

But they haven't found the "right" movie for hand-drawn animation, don'tchaknow. (Not directed at you, but the company.)

Even if Enchanted 2 does feature minimal hand-drawn animation, it has no bearing on this conversation. No way will it be done in-studio and it will not revive fully hand-drawn animated films.

Well sure, it will take more than one effort from an indnie animation studio to do that.

But to say Enchanted 2 won't do anything... I don't think that's altogether true. If it DOES do something it'll show that audiences still have somewhat of an interest. I'm not saying it will revive handdrawn animation, but to say it'll do nothing... I don't buy that.

I'm just saying, another Roger Rabbit film could reawake hand-drawn animation at Disney too.

Warm Regards wrote:Really curious what interesting ideas we missed out on because of technical limitations.

Well, for starters we would have more transformations from Maui.

John Musker wrote:In hand-drawn animation, with the shape shifter Maui, you could just draw him different, bang bang bang. But in CG, we were told, "Wait, wait, wait a minute. This is CG. We have to have a limit on how many times he can transform." We learned you've got to build that new version, you've got to rig it. You can do certain transformations, but he can't move when he transforms. We had to work those limitations in. We pushed the boundaries as much as we could, but it wasn't quite as pliable as hand-drawn in that sense.

Source: http://www.awn.com/animationworld/irasc ... talk-moana

Q: Oceania is your first computer animated film. Was it difficult for you to switch from traditional animation to CGI?

Ron Clements: It was definitely complicated. We used the CGI in the past here and there in our movies, for example in Treasure Planet, but never to this point. For us it was like starting from scratch, in a sense we went back to school. The production of a movie on the computer is completely different, there are many more steps and has its pros and cons as all things. For example, when working with paper and pencil, just draw a line on the sheet and the character is created quite quickly, while with the computer you have to build everything from scratch, characters and environments.

Source: https://imperodisney.com/2016/11/30/oce ... lm-disney/

poor Ron and Jon must have been sighing throughout that whole damn production.

unprincess wrote:poor Ron and Jon must have been sighing throughout that whole damn production.

lol true.

This is especially annoying because the average amount of transformations is quite high in Disney animation compared to Pixar...

You can seriously tell from the usage of 2D in the Prologue, You're Welcome, and Mini Maui that they really wanted this to be 2D.

can you imagine trying to do the Genie with CGI?

disneyprincess11 wrote:You can seriously tell from the usage of 2D in the Prologue, You're Welcome, and Mini Maui that they really wanted this to be 2D.

Wait, what? There's other 2d animation in the movie besides Maui's tattoos?

JTurner wrote:I don't think his quote implies that it was 2D or handdrawn that doomed The Princess and the Frog. As likable as that film was, it wasn't really anything "new". It felt like "more of the same". I think if the studio had done something like Lilo and Stitch which didn't delve into the time tested well of princess formula, then it would have been seen as something new.

I'm not dismissing your statement, but I don't think something in the vein of Lilo & Stitch would've been the salvation for hand drawn. Remember that despite that it was a hit, it was still released in the demise of hand drawn animation and never managed to save it entirely. But that's my opinion, though.

Disney has posted the whole You're Welcome scene! So, you can just tell how much John and Ron wanted this to be 2D.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=79DijItQXMM[/youtube]

Oh yeah, that sequence looks quite lovely, mostly the 2D stuff.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XrN9QZLmJ0E[/youtube]
Mary and the Witch's Flower PV, Summer 2017
Official site: http://www.maryflower.jp/
Original work: The Little Broomstick by Mary Stewart
Director: Yonebayashi Hiromasa (Arietty, Marnie)
Studio: Ghibli's Zombie Ponoc

Saw this comment on Randy Haycock's tumblr, and his reply:

Q: I was wondering if it's even worth it doing 2D animation anymore. I hear some people say don't even bother with doing a 2D reel. Do you know of any suggestions for someone who wants to do 2D animation?

RH: Although it’s true that there are limited opportunities in traditional animation, I hope and pray that there will always be new talented animators coming into the industry with a desire to keep the art form alive. There are several independent traditionally animated films that have come out in Europe in recent years that have been innovative and compelling films. I recently saw “The Red Turtle” and really enjoyed the art and allegory of the film. Sergio Pablos is making “Klaus” which looks very exciting to me.

Even if you get a job doing CG, but you love traditional animation, if you can find the ways and means to do it, I hope you do so. The future of traditional animation is in your generation’s hands.

http://randyhaycock.tumblr.com/post/155 ... t-doing-2d

if CGI animation is ever going to get out of the stagnant hyper-real rut its stuck in, its going to need CGI animators with an understanding of the principals of hand-drawn movement and its aesthetic sensibilities.
I saw alot of 2d influence in Moana and Im not just talking about the actual hand-drawn sequences like Mini-Maui. The CGI character's movements had alot of the bounciness and smoothness of 2d, something that Ive been noticing in Disney's CGI films since WIR. As opposed to stuff Ive seen in say Dreamworks where alot of human movement will often look mo-capped. And I think that's b/c they have hand-drawn animators there to guide them during production. Im really worried about whats going to happen the day they finally dismiss the few 2-d animators left and the CGI animators are left on their own. Hopefully they will have learned enough by then to be able to incorporate these traits on their own.

this gif set in the link is an example of what I mean(I love this whole sequence!) The expressions on both their faces, the timing b/w their interactions and especially Moana's eye/hand movements when Maui picks her up, great stuff!
http://senprime.tumblr.com/post/1556271 ... -a-monster

Back in 2003, SPA Studios (then called Animagic) was working on a feature called Giacomo's Secret. Unfortunately, they weren't able to secure the funds and the project was dropped. Today, they uploaded the proof-of-concept trailer in HD and it looks amazing. It's such a shame it never made it on screen. You can find some background and location design art from the period of the project's development online.

Art by Borja Montoro.


Source: http://thespastudios.com/blog/?p=705


Source: http://thespastudios.com/blog/?p=708


Source: http://thespastudios.com/blog/?p=1010


Source: http://thespastudios.com/blog/?p=977


Source: http://thespastudios.com/blog/?p=989


Source: http://thespastudios.com/blog/?p=1057


Source: http://thespastudios.com/blog/?p=941


Source: http://thespastudios.com/blog/?p=886


Source: http://thespastudios.com/blog/?p=712


Art by Sergio Pablos.


Source: http://sergio-pablos-interview.blogspot.com


Source: http://2dtraditionalanimation.tumblr.co ... gio-pablos


Source: http://thespastudios.com/blog/?p=859

Here's what the last three 2D animators at Disney have been doing post-Moana.

'Happily Ever After' Nighttime Spectacular Coming to Magic Kingdom
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQoKBqzM2C8

The Making of ‘Happily Ever After’
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pnf9VI134JU

Creators Ready ‘Happily Ever After’ for Debut at Magic Kingdom Park
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ursrmqBciWc

Animators Give a Sneak Peek at ‘Happily Ever After’
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fFzs1qs5lr8

Walt Disney World Happily Ever After Animator Interview
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rFtx8CEJ7HE

this video is from 2013, but I found it only now

https://youtu.be/mer6X7nOY_o

^that's from the commercial for a British department store(forgot the name.) Still amazing that was all made for an ad. There are some real hand drawn gems to be found among commercials.

nice that a few traditional animators can still find some work at Disney. Tts still kinda sad though.

I wish Sergio could have finished Giacomo's Secret. I love the setting and time period. The artwork and animation are wonderful and it looks like it would have been a cute slice of life style film.

dilaon wrote:this video is from 2013, but I found it only now; https://youtu.be/mer6X7nOY_o

The bear in the short has a obvious Brother Bear design. Not a blatant copy, but still reminiscent enough.

Anyway, it struck me the other day that due to Enchanted not being entirely a Walt Disney Animation Studios production (and not being under the supervision of Lasseter), perhaps it's no wonder why the hand drawn animation scenes turned out to be such a delight. Due to how the Revival era is labeled by the naysayers to as inferior to former Disney, perhaps the absence of Lasseter provided the hand drawn sequences to have such old-school charm and delight. And yeah, I know I'm adding fuel to the fire, but forgive me

The bear in the short has a obvious Brother Bear design. Not a blatant copy, but still reminiscent enough.

I think Aaron Blaise worked on the ad. He also worked on animation and designs for Brother Bear, Lion King and Rajah in Aladdin. He's like the hand drawn expert when it comes to large carnivores. Id love to see him do a movie about wolves.

regarding Enchanted I agree and I also think the fact the film isn't tied to WDFA is why we are still getting hand drawn segments in the sequel. If it had been under WDFA they would have probably forced CGI segments instead.