DVDizzy Forum

The photo album idea is neat and reminds me of the historical paintings that Pocahontas starts off and ends with. But like you, I prefer the final film's opening.

In the final film, Rasputin was banished for being a traitor and there's not any more context to it. Nothing about how the Royal Family tried to murder him multiple times like in the original script.

The lecherous comrade doesn't surprise me considering we've had villains like Gaston, Jafar, Frollo, and even Hades to an extent. Scar's scene was cut from the film otherwise he'd be on that list too.

In the final film, before she sings Journey to the Past, she wants a sign from the universe about if she should go to St. Petersburg to find her family or if she should go ahead to the fish factory for a job like she was supposed to. Then Pooka appears and pulls her along by her scarf throughout the song.

In the final film, the characters also struggle to get out of the Soviet Union although it's not as prominent as in the original draft but it's still there.

I'm glad Bartok isn't a womanizer. I prefer the final version of the character and how he's kinda awkward with the girl bat at the end of the film.

I agree with you about the reliquary and how the final film version of it is better with it being tied to Rasputin's life force since he sold his soul for this power.

Anya hits Dimitri by accident in the film as well twice but in the rough draft, it happens three times I think (or maybe more). The "I hate that in a woman" line is in the final film too.

I'm not a fan of Rasputin surveying the ship through a cliff while driving a wagon either. I prefer the final film version by far, where he is trapped in Limbo and uses the reliquary to watch Anya. It reminds me of classic Disney villains such as Queen Grimhilde, Maleficent, Ursula, Jafar, and even Queen Narissa who all spy on their victims through magical means.

I agree that Anya didn't need a nightmare before her dream because that dreams end up turning into a nightmare anyway. So if Rasputin was responsible for that, it hardly makes sense with his plan to woo her into a false sense of security.

The Bartok comment about Dimitri reminds me of Genie's comment to Aladdin after saving him from using the second wish.

In the final film, what Anya remembers is how Dimitri saved her and her grandmother through the hidden door/panel in the wall. It's funny how she remembers the orange but not something more important like that in the draft. You should totally watch the film again but I'm biased lol!

Yes, in the final film, Dimitri knows that he can't be with Anya after she tells the aforementioned story of a boy who saved her and her grandmother in the palace. He realizes she's the real princess and that he can't ever be with her hence his lines in the song "Paris Holds the Key." In the draft, does Dimitri bring it up first or is Vlad the one to tell him that if she's a princess, he can't be with her? I can't remember now.

Rasputin being resigned to giving himself up to the demons is interesting as long as he gets his revenge but I prefer the final film version where revenge is still #1 on his mind, but he's not willing to give himself up to the forces of evil just like that.

I prefer the Anya and Dimitri relationship in the final film too, as well as the scene where Anya and her grandmother are reunited. I agree with you that it's better for depending more on Anya's memory than her having the key because it all comes down to her as an object then through a literal object. Lol, I like Angela Lansbury's line about "Timbuktu" as well. That woman is a legend.

I think it's interesting too that we see Rasputin interact with Anya before the climax scene in this draft but I agree that it doesn't work considering how the Empress dismisses her concerns. I don't think she would do that to Anya. I think most of the dialogue about how Dimitri didn't take the money (no mention of Vlad in the final film doing that) and how Anya may not want to be a princess ends up in the final film as well but slightly different and more condensed. It's fine in the early script and fine in the final film both imo.

I personally much prefer the final film battle over the one in the early script. It feels anticlimactic and seems to involve a lot of climbing the Eiffel Tower. It's like they just used that because it symbolizes Paris or France but the bridge is way more interesting especially because it's actually connected to Anastasia's history even if that isn't mentioned in the movie. I also don't care much for Bartok having been spelled into being able to talk. It's not a bad idea and explains why there is a talking bat but I think I prefer the final film version because I don't really need an explanation for that and the movie Bartok seems less dependent on Rasputin, at least by the end, compared to in the script.

The prologue in the script mentions Vlad and Sophie. I've heard people say that even in the final film, you can sorta see them in the background, either in the prologue scene or in the Once Upon a December scene, but I can't remember which one. It makes sense since they would be there as members of the Imperial Court. Probably the only things in the original script that I prefer is a resolution on Vlad's character. In the final film, after the ballet scene where Anya finds out that Dimitri and Vlad have been using her, we never see Anya and Vlad interact ever again. That's what I meant in my earlier comment but after re-reading it, I realized I didn't word it correctly so that's why it confused you. So in the final film, there's also nothing about if Vlad took the money or if he rejected it like Dimitri. We get a goodbye between him and Dimitri and see him in his royal clothes again so it's clear that he is becoming part of royal court again, but nothing about his relationship with Sophie and if they are getting married, let alone if Anya forgave him or not.

Sophie wasn't a real life character but based on one of the Empress' real cousins (I can't remember who but it may not have been a specific cousin). This is also why in the Musical, there is no Sophie but the Countess Lily instead who I am assuming was a real person. So Sophie having sisters was probably just something they made up.

Rasputin was eventually killed by the royal family's cousins but after multiple attempts. The incident is actually quite fascinating because they kept trying to kill him after luring him somewhere but all their attempts would fail. When they finally disposed of his body by dumping him in the river, it turns out he died from drowning and not from the various attempts they thought killed him before. However, some people say this is a tall-tale that was created to make Rasputin seem like a demonic feature in league with the devil in which case it worked, considering his treatment in this film and in popular culture in general. I don't know if he wanted to rule or not in real life but he did have undue influence on the Empress so the Russian people hated him because they felt that basically he was in charge and that the Empress was having an affair with him.

I meant that it is my favorite animated non-Disney film, not my favorite non-Disney film in general.

Thanks for reading my whole thoughts, lol. It was a lot! And I read all of yours.

In the script, Vlad is the one who tells Dimitri he can't be with Anastasia, and he realizes it.

I just liked the way the Empress told Anastasia about how the men didn't take the money the way it was in the script because she was trying to tell Anastasia it through the whole conversation and it's when Vlad showed up and Anya mentioned the boys that the topic came up for her to reveal what happened. I also like hearing how Anya foragve them since I guess I really love that in a character.

Yes Angela Lansbury is a legend!

I have to see the movie again to see how it was better. I bet it was, though.

Thanks for shedding light on how Rasputin did seem to want to rule since he was seen as possibly ruling behind the scenes. But, Rasputin had great influence on the Empress? On Marie, Anastasia's grandmother in the film?!

Oh, ok, Anastasia as your favorite non-Disney animated film makes sense. I don't know what mine is.

I will watch Anastasia sometime around the holidays!

It's my favorite non-Disney animated film, but it's also one of my favorite non-Disney films, period.

blackcauldron85 wrote:It's my favorite non-Disney animated film, but it's also one of my favorite non-Disney films, period.

Thank you for clarifying!

Disney Duster wrote:Thanks for reading my whole thoughts, lol. It was a lot! And I read all of yours.

In the script, Vlad is the one who tells Dimitri he can't be with Anastasia, and he realizes it.

I just liked the way the Empress told Anastasia about how the men didn't take the money the way it was in the script because she was trying to tell Anastasia it through the whole conversation and it's when Vlad showed up and Anya mentioned the boys that the topic came up for her to reveal what happened. I also like hearing how Anya foragve them since I guess I really love that in a character.

Yes Angela Lansbury is a legend!

I have to see the movie again to see how it was better. I bet it was, though.

Thanks for shedding light on how Rasputin did seem to want to rule since he was seen as possibly ruling behind the scenes. But, Rasputin had great influence on the Empress? On Marie, Anastasia's grandmother in the film?!

Oh, ok, Anastasia as your favorite non-Disney animated film makes sense. I don't know what mine is.

I will watch Anastasia sometime around the holidays!

I always love to read your posts! And thank you for reading mine! I know mine was a lot as well lol.

Thank you for confirming that Vlad is the one who tells Dimitri he can't be with Anya. I think I prefer how it goes in the final film where Dimitri himself realizes and accepts that and is the one to tell Vlad this rather than vice-versa.

In the final film, something similar happens. She's trying to tell Anya that Dimitri didn't take the money while they're having a conversation about if she really wants a normal life and then the Empress drops that revelation at the very end. However, this scene takes place at Anastasia's debut ball right before she's supposed to head out and present herself rather than in the original script where she is getting ready.

The first time I read this rough draft, I thought to myself that if this was the final film, I might like it but I probably wouldn't love it and it wouldn't be one of my true favorites that has stuck with me all these years. They really did improve this film from this draft to the final script and make it a masterpiece imo. I shouldn't be surprised because one of my idols Carrie Fisher was a script doctor and she was responsible for working on the script so the improvement in quality really shows in the final product.

Rasputin had great influence on Anastasia' mother the Empress, not Anastasia's grandmother (Marie), the Dowager Empress.

Anastasia is a great winter film especially the first half in the Russian setting. There was a recent list posted about the top ten best animated films for the winter holidays and Anastasia was #2 after Frozen.

Yes, thanks for sharing that, Amy! I know JeanGreyForever loves how you feel about the film!

I also love reading your posts, JeanGreyForever! Though we post about so many different things here I have to pick and choose the ones that pertain to subjects I'm interested in (though sometimes I read yours just because it's you, sometimes!).

When I watch the film again, I will see which way I prefer Dimitri figuring out he couldn't be with Anya (though that's so sad, if only it could be a Cinderella situation where she makes the royals accept her marrying a servant, unless Russia really wouldn't allow it, in which case, I would think they would love in secret. Actually, you just made me realize, part of why this Anastasia must choose not to be found is so that she can be with her true love? What do you think?)

I will also have to see how the way the Dowager Empress tells Anastasia Dimitri didn't take the money is in the film to know which way I prefer. I do however think it makes more sense for her to tell Anastasia while she is getting ready so she has time to think before she has to make her appearence, instead of having to make the choice to appear or not in only a matter of minutes!

Yes, I think the way the final film is is why it has become such a great film and favorite of yours. Shows you like quality! I had no idea Carrie Fisher was good like that! The film is a masterpiece. I am reluctant to call a lot of non-Disney animated film masterpieces but I think Anastasia deserves it.

Oh ok, Rasputin and Anastasia's mother, not her grandmother.

Oh, yes, I was thinking it would be great to watch Anastasia once upon this December! I have off next week three days in a row, I should watch it then!

I'll admit I tend to be a bit partial towards other fans of this film

Same here Duster! It helps that we have pretty similar tastes but even on things we differ on, I always find your posts so insightful and a joy to read!

Part of Anya's decision stems from not being able to be with Dimitri if she accepts public life. This is literally shown when she and Dimitri are about to kiss but Pooka interrupts them and has her crown in his mouth. That's when she knows she has to make a decision. But what I also like is that her decision is not entirely based on a man (even one she loves) because with or without Dimitri, she realized that she had outgrown the royal life and it really wasn't who she was anymore. I don't think she would have been happy with it regardless. I guess they were also inspired by this ending because in real life, when the film came out, the real Anastasia's body had not yet been uncovered so people still thought there was a possibility she could have been alive. Since she never truly resurfaced (beyond some imposters), the ending goes this way to explain how she was still alive but also why the rest of the world was not privy to this.

You do have a point about it being better to tell her when she's getting ready rather than right before. But I think it works in the final film because she can see that Anya is fidgety before she is about to make her public introduction and it's evident that she has doubts. So the grandmother wants to give her one final way out before it's too late and she knows that Dimitri will be Anya's incentive.

I'm glad to hear you think Anastasia can be called a masterpiece. It's funny because I first read your comment as saying that you are reluctant to call a lot of Disney animated films masterpieces which I thought was out of character for you and then I realized you said non-Disney animated films, not Disney animated films lol. I agree with you there, most non-Disney ones don't have the same amount of quality. Even some films I used to like a lot like The Swan Princess are more guilty pleasures and suffer from a lot of flaws even if they are enjoyable movies overall.

I'm so glad to hear that you have three days in a row off! I hope you enjoy them fully.

Oh, thanks for saying that. It means a lot because I think your posts are so smart, educated, insightful and enjoyable!

I didn't realize it till you pointed it out, but I also like that Anya decides she just doesn't want to be a princess, or at least, have a public life, for herself, too. In all honesty her grandmother probably sends her money, but I feel like Anya would try to get a job on her own as well, and Dimitri would.

I had no idea they finally did uncover the real Anastasia's body...?! Is that fact?

The Swan Princess is almost a masterpiece from how I remember it the last time I saw it. I actually really like that one. But no, it's not as good as Anastasia.

In my days off I'll be watching Anastasia, reading Peter Pan, watching Marriage Story, and hopefully putting a lot more chapters in my book!

I finally had the time to read your long posts!! I also had no idea Carrie Fisher worked on this film (I knew she was a script doctor). I think Anya might want to get a job, too (and Dimitri might want a less shady job!). I like your point; I think it makes sense that Anya chose not to "be" royal not just to be with Dimitri but for herself as well.

Disney Duster wrote:Oh, thanks for saying that. It means a lot because I think your posts are so smart, educated, insightful and enjoyable!

I didn't realize it till you pointed it out, but I also like that Anya decides she just doesn't want to be a princess, or at least, have a public life, for herself, too. In all honesty her grandmother probably sends her money, but I feel like Anya would try to get a job on her own as well, and Dimitri would.

I had no idea they finally did uncover the real Anastasia's body...?! Is that fact?

The Swan Princess is almost a masterpiece from how I remember it the last time I saw it. I actually really like that one. But no, it's not as good as Anastasia.

In my days off I'll be watching Anastasia, reading Peter Pan, watching Marriage Story, and hopefully putting a lot more chapters in my book!

Oh thank you so much for those kind words!

I'm assuming her grandmother would keep her well-funded and Anya and Dimitri seem the type to travel the world and enjoy themselves a little.

Yes, unfortunately Anastasia's body was finally found a decade or so after the movie came out. All of the Romanov family's bodies have now been uncovered proving that there wasn't a single survivor At least they are together in Heaven.

I feel like some character designs like Rothbart for ex. are pretty weak. The animation is decent but not up to Disney standards and it looks outdated for a film released in 1994 compared to BATB, Aladdin, Lion King, etc. The songs are mostly nice though and I like the characterization. However, I wish they used Tchaikovsky's original music like Sleeping Beauty did.

Marriage Story is an amazing film so I highly recommend! Very emotional and very bittersweet. I hope Adam Driver wins the Oscar for his role here.

blackcauldron85 wrote:I finally had the time to read your long posts!! I also had no idea Carrie Fisher worked on this film (I knew she was a script doctor). I think Anya might want to get a job, too (and Dimitri might want a less shady job!). I like your point; I think it makes sense that Anya chose not to "be" royal not just to be with Dimitri but for herself as well.

Lol, I don't blame you! I was amazed that Carrie worked on this film so it suddenly explained why I've always innately loved it. I think she wrote the scene when Anya is pondering on whether to go to Paris or not, right before she sings Journey to the Past.

Yes, Anya and Dimitri would like to travel the world.

Sad about the Romanov's, but I also am glad we finally know about them. And yes, they have Heaven now.

Rothbart's design suits the characterization, and especially songs, that he has. But true, he could have been a stronger and scarier protagonist. I love the magic animation, but yes, the animation isn't as good as Disney's Renaissance. But to be honest, no one's animation has ever topped that in any Disney film for me. Even some of the most impressive anime's I've seen, though that's just my personal view I think. Using Swan Lake's music would be cool, but I kind of like that they didn't so one day Disney could do it!

Can't wait to watch Marriage Story!

Tbh, I find his design bland. If you put him next to the other Disney villains he looks the most basic and just uninteresting. Even Rasputin has a very shocking appearance that grabs your attention so he can stand next to Ursula, Maleficent, Jafar, the Queen, etc. My fav animation from Swan Princess is the transformation for sure and I love how they used the music and water magic for the title of the film as well when the film starts.

Yes lol, I hope Disney makes their own Swan Lake one day with the original music! It's different enough from The Swan Princess to not be an issue.

Oh, yeah Rothbart's design isn't as good as any of those others. I still kind of like it because I think it suits the kind of film they did, but that is just me, and I totally get your view. I also agree about Odette's water transformations and the title, and I don't know how Disney would top it!

The logo for the film's 25th anniversary.


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