DVDizzy Forum

My boyfriend claims he looks like Hitler.... Whatevah!

And we all know he's really cyberbot who eats Latino little boys under Disney World...

toonaspie wrote:The racial stereotyping and insensitivity you find in Walt's early works was standard all-throughout-Hollywood stuff in his day. Yeah we grew out of it. I dont think Disney was racist, just a bit racially stereotypical as many wouldve been in the 1930s and 1940s...not racist or anti-Semitic.

Exactly. The sad truth about Hollywood back in the day was that what we consider as racial stereotypes today, they considered acceptable caricatures that much of the general public didn't have a problem with.

I never like getting into discussions about Walt Disney as a person because honestly, it doesn't matter to me. I'll enjoy a Disney film and/or television show just as much as I enjoy movies with that crazy ole Tom Cruise. My opinion on whether or not I liked a movie/tv show hardly (if ever) relies on what I think of the actor/producer/director/etc. as a person. Because to me, all they'll ever be is a "shadow on film" (to quote from Singin' in the Rain) and whether or not Walt Disney was a racist won't change the fact that I loved Pinocchio and still don't get what all the hype is about regarding The Jungle Book. Just like how I'll always enjoy Legend or Cocktail regardless of Tom Cruise's personal religious/spiritual beliefs.

jeremy88 wrote:There is this banned Anti-Nazi cartoon Walt Disney made a while back...don't know if this has anything do with him hating Jewish people, I wouldn't think so looking at this cartoon.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASW3UCc17AI

Not so much "banned" as it is "discreetly put back on the shelf after it served its purpose". It's a propoganda short meant to turn the USA against the Nazis, and is a product of its time. You wouldn't see Disney make an Anti-Taliban cartoon today because of political correctness and family-friendliness gone mad.

Albert

It would have been very difficult for him to have hated all Jews, as the Sherman Brothers (songwriters for 'The Sword in the Stone', 'Jungle Book' etc), Joe Grant (second only to Walt in terms of creative power during the Golden Age), and a number of other significant people at the studio with whom he was also friends, were all Jewish.

I must make clear one thing: I just want to know how the rumor started.

Not saying that Disney hated the Jewish. I just want to know what caused the legend to be born.

If Disney was not like that why do people make comments about it and see it as comedy material?

Old myths die hard. The accusation against Walt Dinsey that he was a racists, anti-semite and an Nazi occur again and again on forums of imdb.com.
I think the sensational 'biography'of Walt Disney by Mark Eliot has done a lot to reinforce these myths.

Albert, I understand you point, "If I like a movie, it does not matter to me if the person who made it had/has repuslive ideas." But is this really the issue here?
I think the issue is that making a monster out of someone who was not (and for the time being I do not believe Walt Disney was the monster so many make him out to be) is a form of character assasination, and therefore wrong and harmfull.

I understand Diana Disney Miller tries to battle these ideas about her father, and who can blame her?

I remember well that she wrote an angry letter to Time Magazine after Richard Schickel painted an unsympathetic portrait of Walt Disney in that magazine. (which I indeed think was biased.)

To be honest, I think that the whole "Disney the Anti-Semite" thing is quite an urban myth, born out of exaggeration and intentional vendettas. I am guessing that Walt did say some slightly insensitive things about Jews, yet they were probably hyperbolic and not meant as anything more than mild bitchiness or traces of small-town silliness. And racial/cultural/religious stereotyping, as some have mentioned, was very common in Western popular culture up until only perhaps the civil rights movements (and traces of it still exist). However, dissenters of Walt may have used these things and took them out of context so as to help prove their dislike, and as this entered popular thought, the idea of Walt wanting to nuke Israel (and the like) probably became a commonplace idea.

And as for the comments on The Golden Touch (which Walt personally directed, believe it or not), I can't help but think that the person who said that is intentionally going out of his way to attack Walt and may even have some fresh stereotypes in his mind too. I have seen that short a few times and in neither of those viewings did I think that Midas was Jewish. I've also heard the concept that the seven dwarfs are Jewish stereotypes...

Ah I see, so you think maybe like 100 years from now it could pop back onto DVD? lol I think SOTS as a higher chance of returning then that one...

I'd be shocked if Disney did an anti-taliban cartoon...it would be interesting, but then again everyones seemed to beef up PC a lot more these days. And of course family-friendliness comes straight from our lovely soccer-moms...(maybe I shouldn't say soccer moms since I think we have a member of that name here, I'll just stick with...Over Protective/sensitive mom)

I don't think so,people always make up things like that.

jeremy88 wrote:Ah I see, so you think maybe like 100 years from now it could pop back onto DVD? lol I think SOTS as a higher chance of returning then that one...

I'd be shocked if Disney did an anti-taliban cartoon...it would be interesting, but then again everyones seemed to beef up PC a lot more these days. And of course family-friendliness comes straight from our lovely soccer-moms...(maybe I shouldn't say soccer moms since I think we have a member of that name here, I'll just stick with...Over Protective/sensitive mom)

"Education for Death" is available on the Walt Disney Treasures "On the Front Lines" DVD set, along with "Der Fuehrer's Face" and others of the time.

It is? So much for being banned lol, I think the person on youtube should change the title and description heh.

pap64 wrote:But there's one I missed: he hated Jewish people.

Sadly, anti-Semitism was very prevalent in the past. My own dad (born in 1913) used to use the phrase "Jew him down" for "bargained with." When people were stingy, it was very common for people in those days to say "Stop being such a Jew." Even Eleanor Roosevelt, so well-known for helping people of color, made disparaging remarks about Jews when she was young. Heck, stuff like this still happens today. Almost 20 years ago I used to work with a Jewish man who was very careful with his money. Behind his back, at least one of my co-workers made comments that it was typical because he was Jewish! I couldn't believe people still made stupid remarks like this.

I believe like everyone else Disney probably used those terms and that's where the rumor came from. Also, apparently "The Three Little Pigs" originally had the Wolf in the guise of a very stereotypical Jewish peddler.

BelleGirl wrote:Albert, I understand you point, "If I like a movie, it does not matter to me if the person who made it had/has repuslive ideas." But is this really the issue here?

Not really. I was just stating my reason as to why I likely won't say much about this topic (because a person's personal decisions/beliefs should not a factor in whether or not I enjoy their professional work).

As for "Education for Death", I highly recommend you watch it jeremy88. It's one of the most powerful cartoon shorts out there, in addition to being one of the most serious ones I've ever seen. And "Der Fuehrer's Face" is hilarious! Get "On the Front Lines" if you can still find it just for that!

Albert

Escapay wrote: As for "Education for Death", I highly recommend you watch it jeremy88. It's one of the most powerful cartoon shorts out there, in addition to being one of the most serious ones I've ever seen. And "Der Fuehrer's Face" is hilarious! Get "On the Front Lines" if you can still find it just for that!
Albert

That wasn't "Education for Death" in the youtube video?? Well either or, I probably will pick up that set, since I've decided to pick some Walt Disney Treasures. I think my friends would be shocked to see those cartoon shorts lol.

jeremy88 wrote:

Escapay wrote: As for "Education for Death", I highly recommend you watch it jeremy88. It's one of the most powerful cartoon shorts out there, in addition to being one of the most serious ones I've ever seen. And "Der Fuehrer's Face" is hilarious! Get "On the Front Lines" if you can still find it just for that!
Albert

That wasn't "Education for Death" in the youtube video?? Well either or, I probably will pick up that set, since I've decided to pick some Walt Disney Treasures. I think my friends would be shocked to see those cartoon shorts lol.

Oops, sorry, I misread one of your posts and thought you didn't watch it. Yeah, that is "Education for Death" on youtube. But you still MUST watch "Der Fuehrer's Face"!

Albert

Oooh it's a Donald Duck short! Donald Duck shorts are my favorites of the bunch. That's a pretty good short lol I was busting up at Donald's frustrated "hail hitler hail hitler hail hitler!" line its hilarious lol! This one is a lot less serious then "Education for Death" well actually, if you look at is as the way Donald is when he goes insane, that must how have some of the Nazi workers went after working for them... Anyways, thanks for posting it Albert!

These would be great to show in like World History classes or something.

Escapay wrote:
I'll enjoy a Disney film and/or television show just as much as I enjoy movies with that crazy ole Tom Cruise.

Crazy ole Tom Cruise eh? Craaaazy ole Tom Cruise (you know you've been watching too much BatB when...)

Anyways *puts the on-topic cap on* I have that biography Marc Eliot did on Walt Disney, I believe it's called Walt Disney: Hollywoods Dark Prince and I've never really read it just the odd page here and there and looked at all the pictures. There was a mention about him and Jewish people but at the moment I have no clue what it said, I'll take a look later and post what it said if anyone's interested.

Personally I don't think it really matters what he thought of anyone, it's like sticking my nose in my neighbors buisness and digging around to find out what they think of people/religons. Besides back then it was probably the mindset of a lot of people so why single out just Walt? Sure it's because he's a famous cartoonist but it just shows he was like the rest of us, he had his opinons and whether we agree with them or not they were his opinons to have and hold till death do him part...err you know what I mean (I hope)

Cherny wrote:you know you've been watching too much BatB when...

1. You talk to your clock, candlelabra, and teapot and expect them to talk back.
2. You throw an enemy into your wardrobe, hoping he comes out wearing a bra and skirt.
3. You suddenly find yourself in a field spreading your arms and yelling "I want adventure in the great wide somewhere..."
4. You welcome any old hag into your home because you're afraid it's the Enchantress and she'll cast a spell on you if you don't.
5. You complain when you don't get the chipped teacup.



Albert

It couln't be true, Walt was an atheist, it's not like he'd point at a Jew whenever he sees a cross. Personally, (and this is coming from a Muslim) I feel sorry for the Jews, especially the ones who lived in WW II, I just finished reading Anne Frank's diary and I'm starting to feel that the world could be a better place if there wasn't such a thing as religion or politics.

Jack Skellington wrote:It couln't be true, Walt was an atheist, it's not like he'd point at a Jew whenever he sees a cross.

Not sure whether Walt really was an atheist, but I'm quite sure that being an atheist does not rule out being an anti-semite as well.
Not that I believe Walt Disney was one.

Even though I may be criticised for bringing such a topic up, but do you think that Walt Disney was an anti-semite? Obviously Walt hired many Jews over the years (e.g. the Sherman Brothers), but hiring Jews doesn’t mean he wasn’t a little prejudiced against them.

There were many talented Jewish animators around at that time, he realised that, and hired as many as possible. That doesn’t mean he felt completely kindly towards them. It simply means he could recognise talent, and wanted talented people in his studio.

The Sherman Brothers have defended Walt on countless occasions, but animators like Bill Mendelez, Joan Scott and most notably Art Babbitt have claimed that Walt was a Nazi sympathiser. Disturbingly, Babbitt once said that he often saw Walt and his lawyer, Gunther Lessing, at the German American Bund, formed by Nazi sympathiser Fritz Kuhn in 1933.

Babbitt once said: “In the immediate years before we entered the War there was a small, but fiercely loyal, I suppose legal, following of the Nazi party...There were open meetings, anybody could attend and I wanted to see what was going on myself. On more than one occasion I observed Walt Disney and Gunther Lessing there, along with a lot of prominent Nazi-afflicted Hollywood personalities. Disney was going to meetings all the time.”

Even though the Disney Studio was filled with Jewish employees, the Jews would often be used as gags for shorts. The Big Bad Wolf disguised himself as a big-nosed Jewish Peddler in Three Little Pigs, and also Mickey Mouse dressed up and danced as a Hasidic Jew in 1929’s The Opry House. Walt would approve of every scene in every one of his shorts.

So, what do you think? Personally, I have mixed feelings, and feel that Walt wasn't completely anti-semitic, but still was a little prejudiced against them, especially when such a prejudice was common in the 30's/40's. But I want to investigate more into this interesting topic, and find out your opinions.