Streaming and Physical Media

Any topic that doesn't fit elsewhere.
Post Reply
User avatar
Big Disney Fan
Platinum Edition
Posts: 3098
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2006 11:28 pm
Location: Any Disney park you choose

Streaming and Physical Media

Post by Big Disney Fan »

I've heard many things about the virtues of physical media (such as DVDs or Blu-Rays) vs. streaming. For example, I know that content on streaming will often be pulled, usually because of licensing issues. But don't they also pull physical media from the store shelves, too, after a certain amount of time? And isn't it possible that after you buy and thereby own the physical media, that can be taken away from your collection as well?

One reason I ask is because I remember one time years ago (long before streaming was even a thing and we were still using VHS tapes), when we were living in San Jose, we went out for a while, and when we came back, our house was broken into, and many things were taken away! Among the items taken was my Super Nintendo (which actually didn't belong to me, but to my grandmother who was letting me borrow it for a while) and all the games that came with it! Those were all physical copies, but they still got pulled!
User avatar
blackcauldron85
Ultimate Collector's Edition
Posts: 16286
Joined: Sat Jun 17, 2006 7:54 am
Gender: Female
Contact:

Re: Streaming and Physical Media

Post by blackcauldron85 »

:( I'm sorry you got robbed - that's awful.

I think if it's a streaming-only movie or show (a Disney+, Hulu, Apple+, Netflix, etc. original), then it being removed from the service might mean it becomes lost media unless it gets on a service again. So that is different than getting robbed and losing physical VHS/laserdisc/DVD/Blu, because you can't rebuy the streaming shows that get taken away that never were put on home media.

Some streaming originals (Netflix's "Vivo," HBO/HBO Max's "The Last of Us") do get physical releases. But most don't (think all the Disney+ originals).

Especially in the days of the Disney Vault, it was lot harder to purchase the films when they were no longer on store shelves. (I know with the Disney Vault, the films usually? always? were at the store until they sold out, so if July 1st Disney says the film goes in the Vault, as long as the store didn't sell out yet, you could buy them there after that date until they sold out). Online shopping wasn't a thing, I'm sure the amount of thrift stores was a lot smaller. Without people replacing VHS with upgraded versions, I bet less videos were in thrift stores (except for people who didn't watch them anymore). Maybe pawn shops had Disney VHS.

But most studios (except probably for a major film like "E.T.") I don't think had a vault system. Even if a store was out, a video rental store probably had the film you were looking for, not to mention checking the TV listings.

I think there's a difference between streaming originals and other films. If "Disenchanted" were pulled from Disney+ and they didn't sell it to Pluto TV, Tubi, Freevee, Roku Channel, or any of the other free streaming channels, and they never put it on Blu, then that would become lost media until it resurfaces again. (I guess there are pirates out there who managed to create a copy?). But if "Enchanted" were pulled from Disney+, then people could just watch their DVD or Blu or purchase it on DVD or Blu.

So in the case of being robbed, money not taken into consideration, the person could still (except for cases like the Disney Vault) purchase the movies again, rent them, catch them on TV possibly.

So it's mostly the streaming originals that become the problem. Most everything else would have been released at least on VHS or DVD or Blu so if it gets removed, they could just go online and purchase it in most cases, again money notwithstanding.

Usually it's cheaper to stream movies or shows with one or two subscriptions then purchasing every movie or show you want to watch, so that's part of the outcry when a film/show available on physical media is removed from streaming.
Image
User avatar
Big Disney Fan
Platinum Edition
Posts: 3098
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2006 11:28 pm
Location: Any Disney park you choose

Re: Streaming and Physical Media

Post by Big Disney Fan »

blackcauldron85 wrote: Mon Mar 27, 2023 4:20 am :( I'm sorry you got robbed - that's awful.

I think if it's a streaming-only movie or show (a Disney+, Hulu, Apple+, Netflix, etc. original), then it being removed from the service might mean it becomes lost media unless it gets on a service again. So that is different than getting robbed and losing physical VHS/laserdisc/DVD/Blu, because you can't rebuy the streaming shows that get taken away that never were put on home media.
You can't really rebuy physical media either without having to pay a ton of money, especially if those items are out of print. I was under the impression that physical media is actually cheaper than streaming, but not if you're looking for something out of print, which can cost upwards of $50-$100 or more.
Especially in the days of the Disney Vault, it was lot harder to purchase the films when they were no longer on store shelves. (I know with the Disney Vault, the films usually? always? were at the store until they sold out, so if July 1st Disney says the film goes in the Vault, as long as the store didn't sell out yet, you could buy them there after that date until they sold out). Online shopping wasn't a thing, I'm sure the amount of thrift stores was a lot smaller. Without people replacing VHS with upgraded versions, I bet less videos were in thrift stores (except for people who didn't watch them anymore). Maybe pawn shops had Disney VHS.
I was under the impression that once the "back in the vault" date rolled around, then they would take all the physical media away, that they would completely remove them from the shelves.
But most studios (except probably for a major film like "E.T.") I don't think had a vault system. Even if a store was out, a video rental store probably had the film you were looking for, not to mention checking the TV listings.

I think there's a difference between streaming originals and other films. If "Disenchanted" were pulled from Disney+ and they didn't sell it to Pluto TV, Tubi, Freevee, Roku Channel, or any of the other free streaming channels, and they never put it on Blu, then that would become lost media until it resurfaces again. (I guess there are pirates out there who managed to create a copy?). But if "Enchanted" were pulled from Disney+, then people could just watch their DVD or Blu or purchase it on DVD or Blu.

So in the case of being robbed, money not taken into consideration, the person could still (except for cases like the Disney Vault) purchase the movies again, rent them, catch them on TV possibly.
Except, most people do take money into consideration, and rightfully so, especially if it's out of print, which can be very expensive.
User avatar
UmbrellaFish
Diamond Edition
Posts: 4937
Joined: Sun Jan 28, 2007 3:09 pm
Gender: Male (He/Him)

Re: Streaming and Physical Media

Post by UmbrellaFish »

I collect physical media (DVDs, Blu-rays, 4K BDs) because I enjoy it. I’ve done it since I was a kid. I still have my first DVD which I received when I was 6. It’s Cinderella II: Dreams Come True. I pulled it out the other day and was amazed that it was in remarkable condition— I had to replace the original case years ago because the press spindle inside disintegrated, but the cover art, the chapter insert (remember those?) and the disc itself were in remarkable condition. That implies that I cared for and valued my DVDs deeply, even at the age of 6! Collecting movies and tv shows on DVD/Blu-ray/4K is just my thing!

I love having a library of titles to look at on the shelves. Some of the titles were gifts or recommendations, or amazing deals, or I bought them during a particular time or place in my life so they carry special memories. Also I know that I have them— y’know, barring something awful like a robbery, or a natural disaster, or my discs developing disc rot… but those are the risks you take owning any physical possession (well not disc rot, but clothes get worn out, paperbacks fall apart, etc etc etc) whereas Disney+ can decide tomorrow to yank Mary Poppins off the app or to censor the Step in Time scene. I actually had a digital copy of Chicago that vanished from my collection— I think it probably had something to do with all the Weinstein/Miramax stuff— but I paid for that digital copy alongside the Blu-ray and one day it was just gone. Well, the digital copy is gone, the Blu ray is still on my shelves.

It costs money but it’s not the most expensive hobby in the world. I go to used bookstores and see slews of old Disney DVDs for cheap (in fact, in my experience they won’t take your used Disney DVDs because they have too many and too many people subscribe to Disney+). I missed out on the Snow White and Lion King Platinums— I’ve looked at buying them second hand to complete that collection, and you can absolutely buy decent copies for $1. I remember when Snow White was OOP and the Platinum went for $60– and now you can buy a real, genuine copy for $1!!! And I’m enmeshed in the “physical media community” so I know when the sales are for new stuff— you won’t catch me buying a Criterion outside of July or a flash sale.

As for OOPs, I’ve been seriously collecting since I was a teenager so I own a number of OOP titles. There are things that I missed like 9 to 5 on Blu ray which go for $100+ on eBay that I kick myself for not buying when they were in print— but I just cut my losses and bought the DVD from the Disney Movie Club for less than $5. (But actually Disney, if you’re listening, reissue all those old Fox releases from Twilight Time on Blu-ray again! I want Hush Hush Sweet Charlotte, too!). But the flip side is that these are also an investment, I needed money at one point in college and sold a few Walt Disney Treasures for $100 each and that paid my outstanding balance which allowed me to select my classes for my senior year.

There’s also something to be said for ritual. It’s too easy to go to Disney+ and click on a thumbnail and start a movie. When I was a kid, movies were a big deal. Buying a movie was a big deal, watching a movie was a big deal. And now you can do it with the same ease as you would finding a video on YouTube. I like scanning my collection, selecting a movie, admiring the cover art, the disc art, the menus. I like watching the film and then perusing the special features. It’s an event. Maybe a small event, in the comfort of my home, but movies mean something to me. They’re not disposable, mindless entertainment. They’re of value, of worth. I love my collection.
User avatar
blackcauldron85
Ultimate Collector's Edition
Posts: 16286
Joined: Sat Jun 17, 2006 7:54 am
Gender: Female
Contact:

Re: Streaming and Physical Media

Post by blackcauldron85 »

Big Disney Fan wrote:You can't really rebuy physical media either without having to pay a ton of money, especially if those items are out of print. I was under the impression that physical media is actually cheaper than streaming, but not if you're looking for something out of print, which can cost upwards of $50-$100 or more.

...

Except, most people do take money into consideration, and rightfully so, especially if it's out of print, which can be very expensive.
Yes, I completely agree. I more meant if you don't own a movie physically and it's removed from streaming and it has/had a physical release, in theory, you *can* purchase it physically to watch it. But yes, the average person isn't going to have all the money to do so!
Big Disney Fan wrote:I was under the impression that once the "back in the vault" date rolled around, then they would take all the physical media away, that they would completely remove them from the shelves.
I read a lot of old articles, and just recently (can't remember where) it mentioned something about the Vault and the stores selling their copies until they're sold out.
UmbrellaFish wrote:That implies that I cared for and valued my DVDs deeply, even at the age of 6!
That's really sweet!!! I took care of my VHS and DVDs too - the few times I loaned some out to friends, I kind of gave a spiel about scratches and fingerprints and keeping the discs in cases. So I understand!
UmbrellaFish wrote:Also I know that I have them— y’know, barring something awful like a robbery, or a natural disaster, or my discs developing disc rot…

whereas Disney+ can decide tomorrow to yank Mary Poppins off the app or to censor the Step in Time scene.
I have a fairly large DVD/Blu collection, too, and I worry about those things. I'm in Florida, so I worry about my movies (and my book collection) getting water damage. And disc rot scares me too so much. And robbery is awful. All awful things for the collector.

And yes, streaming services removing and censoring is another good reason to have physical copies, where we own the copy vs digital copies being taken from us.

I wonder how Disney's physical copies have fared, sales wise, since Disney+ started.
UmbrellaFish wrote:now you can buy a real, genuine copy for $1!!!
I wonder how many bootlegs are out there. Remember a couple decades ago, that being a huge concern?!

I was a late transitioner to Blu and I did sell a bunch of DVDs to afford to upgrade to Blu. Some Disney DVDs I kept based on bonus features but I sold a lot and then repurchased on Blu. But a lot of films, live action, whether Disney or not, I did not rebuy due to $$$ so that was a sacrifice I made. I had been sick of Disney not caring about putting bonus features of substance on their DVDs + wanted the digital copies.
Image
User avatar
Big Disney Fan
Platinum Edition
Posts: 3098
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2006 11:28 pm
Location: Any Disney park you choose

Re: Streaming and Physical Media

Post by Big Disney Fan »

Another thing about physical media vs. streaming, at least as far as Disney is concerned, is how streaming can involve censorship, which is supposedly not an issue with physical releases.

That is clearly not the case. Case in point: smoking scenes that were cut from physical media releases from "Saludos Amigos" and "Melody Time" (not just the DVD release, but the 1998 50th anniversary VHS release as well), and not very well, either, with cigarettes simply being digitally removed, resulting in some odd motions from Goofy and Pecos Bill. These scenes were miraculously restored for Disney Plus streaming.

Also, there's the controversy surrounding a scene from "Clock Cleaners". Many years ago, Disney ran afoul of notorious protestor and founder of the American Family Association Donald Wildmon, who claimed that Donald, in arguing with the mainspring, had dropped the F bomb, when in reality, he said, "Says you!" (to which the mainspring impertinently answered, "Says !"). Wildmon had succeeded in getting Walmart to pull any and all copies of videos containing this short.

Presumably in response, on the Walt Disney Treasures release of this short (indeed, almost all subsequent releases of this short, including on an airing of the Treasures From the Disney Vault event on TCM (though not as part of "One Hour In Wonderland" (a bonus on all releases of "Alice In Wonderland") and "Have a Laugh"), the scene was censored, and very poorly at that, as Donald now exclaims, "Aw, nuts!", which is taken from another short, given the sound of a dog (probably Pluto) barking in the background, leaving the still-intact "Says I!" totally nonsensical. For good measure, they also censored Donald following up by calling the mainspring a "snake in the grass", which was also misheard as "son of a b****", now replaced with squawking gibberish. I can only assume that such censorship was more likely the result of carelessness rather than an executive decision.

In any case, the dialogue was restored for Disney Plus, albeit partially. Donald once again exclaims, "Says you!", but he still squawks gibberish instead of calling the mainspring a "snake in the grass".

And then there's the issue of digital destruction. Case in point: the 2005 Platinum Edition release of "Cinderella", compared with a restored version which can only be found at the Disney Movie Club:
Image

I'm also told that "The Sword In the Stone" looks better on Disney Plus than on Blu-Ray, too.

So the notion that physical media is totally uncensored or unaltered, compared to streaming, is not entirely honest, because it's not entirely true. Sure, they may have done censorship to Disney Plus, but that's nothing compared to what physical media had done to these releases back in the day.
User avatar
Elladorine
Diamond Edition
Posts: 4354
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2006 1:02 pm
Location: SouthernCaliforniaLiscious SunnyWingadocious
Contact:

Re: Streaming and Physical Media

Post by Elladorine »

Honestly, I’ve always loved collecting animated films, especially Disney, even back in the good ol’ VHS days. Was more than happy to upgrade most titles to DVD, and got sucked into Blu when they first started offering the insanely irresistible coupons for the combo packs (remember those?). I figured microchips would be the next format, but that was before the power of streaming was realized.

And as streaming has become … well, mainstream, I know there’s been a lot of pushback from some collectors. Which I totally get! But I’m not one of them. I crossed over to buying digital versions without the accompanying physical media around the home video release of Finding Dori. And ever since Disney+ added Frozen II so quickly after its theatrical release, I’ve mostly stopped buying digital versions altogether (with rare exceptions of non-Disney films that have a longer waiting period for streaming as well as a more uncertain future of streaming availability).

I’ve not regretted it. I’ve actually been selling off some of my discs, many that I’ll likely never watch again, even some I never got around to unsealing! I still have hundreds and hundreds and haven’t decided what I’ll eventually do with all of them. I have upcycled a few of their inserts into book covers though, lol.

I also realize that media will often get edited in various form over the years depending on current politics or the audience’s changes in taste. And of course, there’s always media that eventually becomes “lost.” But the way I figure it, nobody is taking, say, the original Lady and the Tramp from us, nor the original Pinocchio. Even if Disney falls to ruins one day, even if Disney+ is ever taken down or only ever shows heavily edited versions, you can always find a way to access the original films again in some form.

Remember when it went viral that the old Disney VHS tapes were supposedly worth a fortune? Hundreds and even thousands of dollars? I wonder how many people still buy into that, lol. You can find nearly all the old DAC VHS tapes at virtually any thrift store, with rare exceptions like the DMC-only release of Cars on VHS (and that one actually is worth some money).

Same goes for DVDs and even Blu-rays. There were literally millions and millions of copies of these movies produced, and even if you find eBay resellers asking for a mint, you can find virtually any of them at the thrift stores for $4 or far less quite often. In fact, a lot of stores can’t even give them away anymore since they’re so common and considered dated; a Habitat for Humanity once let me take a full brown grocery bag full of Disney VHSs absolutely free! I wanted them for the inserts, lol.

And once again, absolutely nothing against those who love their physical media collections and even adding to them, but I’m a borderline hoarder struggling to whittle down my material possessions … when considering my current priorities and the needs of my family, I simply don’t have the space anymore. And that’s ok! I still have access to the films that I love, or could easily find them again if needed. That leaves me space for other things to collect or even create, things that spark joy in ways that are often connected to these films I’ve loved all my life.
Image
User avatar
Sotiris
Ultimate Collector's Edition
Posts: 19417
Joined: Sat Sep 23, 2006 3:06 am
Gender: Male
Location: Fantasyland

Re: Streaming and Physical Media

Post by Sotiris »

Disney stops selling Blu-Ray and DVD discs to Australia and New Zealand as streaming eats physical media
https://cordcuttersnews.com/disney-stop ... cal-media/
ImageImageImageImageImageImage
User avatar
Disney's Divinity
Ultimate Collector's Edition
Posts: 15652
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2005 9:26 am
Gender: Male

Re: Streaming and Physical Media

Post by Disney's Divinity »

Seems like Iger's claim to be more committed to physical was a(nother) lie, between this and DMC closing in Canada. At least the U.S. has a little longer anyway. :headshake: But I never trusted Iger farther than you could throw him anyway, just was hoping they were losing enough money to slow it down regardless of what he might want.
Image
Listening to most often lately:
Johnny Mathis ~ "Wonderful, Wonderful"
Idina Menzel ~ "Into the Unknown"
Vanessa Williams ~ "Save the Best for Last"
User avatar
UmbrellaFish
Diamond Edition
Posts: 4937
Joined: Sun Jan 28, 2007 3:09 pm
Gender: Male (He/Him)

Re: Streaming and Physical Media

Post by UmbrellaFish »

Elladorine wrote: Fri Jul 28, 2023 2:42 pmRemember when it went viral that the old Disney VHS tapes were supposedly worth a fortune? Hundreds and even thousands of dollars? I wonder how many people still buy into that, lol. You can find nearly all the old DAC VHS tapes at virtually any thrift store, with rare exceptions like the DMC-only release of Cars on VHS (and that one actually is worth some money).
I was so giddy when I realized I could buy “Sing Me a Story with Belle” on VHS for cheap on eBay! I actually haven’t bit the bullet yet since I don’t have a VHS player anymore, but soon!
Post Reply