Disenchanted

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Disney Duster
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Re: Disenchanted

Post by Disney Duster »

Wow Marce82, you made amazing points like always. It's true if Giselle didn't sing till the wish it would have made a big impact! But actually Morgan's song in the middle of the movie, "Perfect", was an "I Want" song, as was Amy Adams' second song, "Fairytale Life". I also said how I thought the memory tree thing should have went in my post on the top of page 56 of this thread. I think the memory tree started swirling just because it's the most powerful magic of all, but it is was still dumb. I don't agree the climax was too long, I liked it, but yeah, you made so many great points. I agree with so much.

Also, good reviews lord-of-sith and singerguy04.
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Re: Disenchanted

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Another poster inspired by the movie, featurette about the songs and other promos:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7nSm4fz9BeE
https://twitter.com/enchanted/status/15 ... 3350361088
https://twitter.com/enchanted/status/15 ... 9657529344
https://twitter.com/enchanted/status/15 ... 3522485248
https://twitter.com/Essence/status/1594421068474814466

Adam Shankman has also shared some behind-the scenes stuff, including a couple of costume sketches, here: https://www.instagram.com/p/ClSS3_prVb4/

Marce82 wrote: Tue Nov 22, 2022 4:38 am The resolution to the story: that climax was way too long. And can someone explain to me why the torn memory tree sheet suddenly turned magic and started swirling around? Cause neither Giselle nor Malvina made it do that.
I actually liked that the climax was long on this occasion. I was afraid things would be solved too easily, so I was glad more stuff kept happening. As for your question, as Disney Duster said, Nancy said that the magic from that tree was the strongest in Andalasia or something like that, and the memories seemed to have like a mind of their own when they swirled around Morgan during "Love Power" and then flew towards her bedroom, so I think they were so powerful that even after being torn by Giselle, they still "survived" and carried out their mission. That's what I personally understood, but I could be wrong about it.
Marce82 wrote: Tue Nov 22, 2022 4:38 am All those thorned brambles covering the building seemed to be no impediment at all (why have them??) and the storypoint of Morgan being choked by the branches gets dropped almost immediately.
I think the vines were partly a reference to Sleeping Beauty, but I agree they could've done more with that.

UPDATE
Marce82 wrote: Tue Nov 22, 2022 4:38 am But I would say this is a pretty good sequel, and (sadly) the best live action movie I have seen from Disney in a long time, which isn't saying much. And I do think this film is one I might revisit on occasion.
I agree, despite its flaws it's better than most recent live-action films from the studio (not counting Marvel and other divisions). I watched it again and I enjoyed it even more this time.
Marce82 wrote: Tue Nov 22, 2022 4:38 am One big disappointment: at the end of the first film, Giselle takes over Nancy's studio and turns it into a children's boutique. That was great, and completely dropped in the sequel. Like others here have said: what has Giselle been doing the past 10 years, other than getting pregnant a year or so ago?? Moving on...
Well, in one of the drawings from the prologue a notebook with some fashion sketches can be seen next to her, so I guess she still had her boutique before moving to the suburbs, but it would've been nice if they had explained some of that in the movie.

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By the way, I never realized she took over Nancy's studio! I thought she just created her own. That was quite a clever idea, since Nancy leaves it to live in Andalasia and wouldn't be able to work there anymore and Giselle is very good at making clothes, so it's a perfect business for her. They not only exchanged fiancés, but also jobs. :P
Marce82 wrote: Tue Nov 22, 2022 4:38 am SADLY, like Fareb said, Giselle grew in the first film, and stopped singing as a consequence. Here she still sings, making it seem like something she has been doing for 10 years, and makes her seem a little deranged to me. Imagine how much more powerful it would have been if there had been zero singing until that first morning after she makes the wish!
To me it makes sense she sings at the beginning of the movie. She has been missing Andalasia and her previous life recently and has been thinking about that place more, plus the suburbs remind her of it. She's also happy at first because she thinks all their problems will be solved there. She even starts bursting into song when they're going to sleep, as she's so excited.

Aside from that, the fact that in the first movie she stops singing as the film progresses, doesn't necessarily mean she has completely lost that ability. I think the first movie's message is about learning to take the best of both worlds, and the shot at the end when Giselle, Robert and Morgan are playing together, I think shows just that. That she still retains some of that innocence and playfulness and infects others with it. So, to me it all makes sense. Though, to be honest, I didn't expect they would have her sing before the spell at first.
Marce82 wrote: Tue Nov 22, 2022 4:38 am Some here have said they liked the beginning and the ending, but not the middle. I felt the opposite. To me, the sweet spot was between her wish coming true until the animated segment. Watching her dynamic with the town and with Morgan was really great to me.
Personally, I liked that part too. I just noticed the pacing was a bit off. Maybe it's Robert's scenes since they weren't too good; I'm not sure. But on my second viewing I didn't have the same feeling. Perhaps, because I already knew what to expect from the film.
Marce82 wrote: Tue Nov 22, 2022 4:38 am The songs: they were ok, if not kind of unmemorable. But to me, what made the songs work so well in the original was that each song was a parody/reference to a very specific type of song in Disney movies (the wishing for a prince song, the cleaning song, the show stopper song)... the songs here had the occasional lyric reference, but the overall song itself was not a reference to specific KIND of Disney song. Unless I'm missing something... do tell!
That's true. And "Happy Working Song", for example, not only referenced songs like "Whistle While You Work", but also added a twist to it. In that case, that the animals that come to help Giselle are filthy city ones like rats, pigeons or cockroaches, which was a brilliant idea. Here, the most similar thing is "Badder", which is a parody of a Disney villain song (a type of song the original didn't have) and the twist here is that there are two villains instead of one, who fight for being the leader. "Andalasia" is also clearly an homage to "Cinderella" and other Disney opening songs from the '40s and '50s, and "Perfect" reminds of the "I Want" songs from the Renaissance. The latter, though, has some moments of parody, but for the most part is just a straightforward Disney "I Want" song. "Andalasia" at least has some humor to it, which is a bit of a twist. There are some references in the other songs, like the singing objects in "Fairytale Life", but they seem more based on Broadway musicals in general and are not that specifically Disney.

I have to say, though, that I like the new songs much more now after having listened to them more. It tends to happen to me sometimes that when I've been anticipating something very much I get a bit disappointed at first when I finally see/listen to it simply because I expected something different and I need some time to get used to what it actually is. I tried not to have too high expectations this time, but you can't help imagining things a certain way. These songs are not as good or instantly catchy as the ones from the original, but are still really good, in my opinion. As well as the score. It's a shame there's only one score track in the soundtrack.
Marce82 wrote: Tue Nov 22, 2022 4:38 am It was mainly the humans that were poorly animated, the animals were pretty ok. And as for John Pommeroy... I always thought he was an overrated animator, and that link to him drawing Edward... um... that was a pretty bad drawing.
The animals also looked better than the humans to me, but maybe it's that we aren't that demanding when it comes to animals? Or are they easier to draw? Regarding John Pomeroy's drawing, I wouldn't say it's bad, but it's not very on model. But many times when animators do these type of "how to draw" videos the characters are quite off-model. I guess it's easier to draw them with model sheets next to you, as they do when they're animating. Plus, I imagine it must be difficult to draw them perfectly by heart, especially if a lot of time has passed since they animated them.
Marce82 wrote: Tue Nov 22, 2022 4:38 am And... did any character have an arc? Did anyone change after this whole adventure?
Maybe they were more subtle than usual, but I think Giselle and Morgan, at least, definitely had arcs. Giselle learned to be more accepting of changes in life and also not to idealize her homeland and be careful what she wishes for. And Morgan I think understood her mother's point of view more and how much she loves her and not to be ashamed of her in front of others. And the relationship between them, of course, improved. Robert and Malvina also changed a bit, but at the end of the movie, Giselle and Morgan are the only ones who know this whole adventure took place; for the others it was all a dream, so they couldn't change that much.

Anyway, personally I don't mind it if some characters don't have arcs or don't learn anything in a movie. In fact, sometimes I find it refreshing, as normally everyone has to have their arc and sometimes it's too evident which I find a bit annoying. Though, of course, a character arc is an important element that contributes to make the story interesting and I like it when it's well done and feels organic.

By the way, sorry if it seems I'm trying to refute all your points, Marce82. I actually agreed with a lot of the things you said.
Last edited by D82 on Wed Nov 23, 2022 11:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Disenchanted

Post by D82 »

New featurette about the costumes and other promos:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XMgEn9KzRTc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jDSG_JN2aZ4


John Pomeroy has also shared another one of his animated scenes.

By the way, I've updated my previous post adding more replies.
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Re: Disenchanted

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James + Idina on James Corden's show:
https://youtu.be/QVTeJ4abV58
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Re: Disenchanted

Post by D82 »

Disney has released a lyric video for the end credit version of "Love Power": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1051s13-OY

Speaking of the songs, I've now noticed not only "Even More Enchanted" was shortened in the final film, but also "Andalasia" (the last two verses/stanzas are missing in the final cut), "The Magic of Andalasia" (the last verse was cut) and "Love Power" (first verse and part of the middle). I'm glad at least we got the full versions on the soundtrack.

By the way, if anyone's interested in buying the physical album from Amazon UK, it's finally available to pre-order there. Although, at double the price of the US CD. Does anyone know why it's so expensive on the UK site? I ended up pre-ordering it there, though, since doing it on Amazon.com was almost as expensive for me if we add the taxes and shipping and I really wanted to have the physical copy this time.
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Re: Disenchanted

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D82, I LOVE that poster with evil Giselle with the wand! Beautiful!

Thanks for all these featurettes!

I never realized Giselle took over Nancy's studio either! I didn't even know Nancy was a fashion designer at first! That is so cool, and also funny that they not only switched lovers but careers, like you said!

I like your explanation of the swirling memory tree! I think you must be right!

I gree, I think we as people don't notice when animals look or move wrong in animation like with humans, or they are just easier to animate.

I liked your explanation of the songs, and I never realized "Andalasia" was like the first three Walt fairy tale opening songs! Has it been mentioned we see young Edward and his parents? They were badly animated, too. :(

I like that Giselle still sings. Even Robert starts to sing a little of "So Close" towards the end of the original film. I liked so much that Giselle grew, but stayed the Giselle we love.
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Re: Disenchanted

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D82 wrote: Tue Nov 22, 2022 10:57 pm
Marce82 wrote: Tue Nov 22, 2022 4:38 am It was mainly the humans that were poorly animated, the animals were pretty ok. And as for John Pommeroy... I always thought he was an overrated animator, and that link to him drawing Edward... um... that was a pretty bad drawing.
The animals also looked better than the humans to me, but maybe it's that we aren't that demanding when it comes to animals? Or are they easier to draw? Regarding John Pomeroy's drawing, I wouldn't say it's bad, but it's not very on model. But many times when animators do these type of "how to draw" videos the characters are quite off-model. I guess it's easier to draw them with model sheets next to you, as they do when they're animating. Plus, I imagine it must be difficult to draw them perfectly by heart, especially if a lot of time has passed since they animated them.
I don't have the exact pages, but I remember reading in Don Bluth's newest memoir Somewhere Out There: My Animated Life that:

A) for the 1980s movie Xanadu, he had a short amount of time to make a musical hand drawn sequence of a man and woman being in love/flirty with each other. In his book he mentions that he makes the couple turn into fishes and birds in this song specifically so they'd be easier to animate (and faster/nicer looking).

B) for 1997's Anastasia, a lot of new animators were brought onboard. A live action version of the story was shot for reference, and lot of rotoscoping was done with the humans to get the hand drawn film produced faster without straining inexperienced animators.

So for at least Bluth and his team, animals are easier to work with versus humans.
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Re: Disenchanted

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D82 wrote: It's a shame there's only one score track in the soundtrack.
I agree. I thought the score was pretty strong and would've liked there to be more of it. I haven't bought the soundtrack yet, but I will eventually. I don't mind waiting for a good price to buy it at since the music was just okay (although maybe my opinion will evolve once I'm able to sit with it for a while and listen to it more). I'm glad it at least got a physical release. I wouldn't have expected it to what with this being a Disney+ release.
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Re: Disenchanted

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You know, I still don't think it's that good, but I have had parts of "Love Power" in my head for days now, so maybe it is, lol.
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Re: Disenchanted

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"Badder" full song clip and some new promos:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MViAAekXgbk
https://twitter.com/enchanted/status/15 ... 1675464706
https://twitter.com/enchanted/status/15 ... 6128583682
https://twitter.com/enchanted/status/15 ... 1551076354

Twitter Spaces conversation on the making of the animated sequences: https://twitter.com/TONICDNA/status/1597644509072195584

Disney Duster wrote: Thu Nov 24, 2022 10:33 pm I didn't even know Nancy was a fashion designer at first!
Me neither. And I didn't know she had her own studio, I thought she worked for someone else.
Disney Duster wrote: Thu Nov 24, 2022 10:33 pm Has it been mentioned we see young Edward and his parents? They were badly animated, too. :(
I didn't notice it the first time I watched the film. I saw someone mention it on Twitter later. It was nice seeing young Edward, but I wasn't a fan of the parents' designs either. She looked too much like Aurora's mother in Sleeping Beauty and he looked a lot like King Hubert.
Disney Duster wrote: Thu Nov 24, 2022 10:33 pm I like that Giselle still sings. Even Robert starts to sing a little of "So Close" towards the end of the original film. I liked so much that Giselle grew, but stayed the Giselle we love.
Me too.
Warm Regards wrote: Fri Nov 25, 2022 8:37 am I don't have the exact pages, but I remember reading in Don Bluth's newest memoir Somewhere Out There: My Animated Life that:

A) for the 1980s movie Xanadu, he had a short amount of time to make a musical hand drawn sequence of a man and woman being in love/flirty with each other. In his book he mentions that he makes the couple turn into fishes and birds in this song specifically so they'd be easier to animate (and faster/nicer looking).

B) for 1997's Anastasia, a lot of new animators were brought onboard. A live action version of the story was shot for reference, and lot of rotoscoping was done with the humans to get the hand drawn film produced faster without straining inexperienced animators.

So for at least Bluth and his team, animals are easier to work with versus humans.
Thanks for the info. That's interesting to know. I don't know why I was under the impression it was the opposite. I think Bambi, Marahute or the bear in The Fox and the Hound, for example, were especially difficult to animate, but maybe it's because the approach was more realistic in those cases. And I guess some animals are easier to draw than others. Regarding the ones in Disenchanted, it also occurred to me later that perhaps they also look better than the humans because they don't talk or even move too much. The humans in the animated segments also look good when they are standing still; they look bad mostly when they're talking or doing something.
Disney's Divinity wrote: Fri Nov 25, 2022 1:27 pm I agree. I thought the score was pretty strong and would've liked there to be more of it. I haven't bought the soundtrack yet, but I will eventually. I don't mind waiting for a good price to buy it at since the music was just okay (although maybe my opinion will evolve once I'm able to sit with it for a while and listen to it more). I'm glad it at least got a physical release. I wouldn't have expected it to what with this being a Disney+ release.
I'm glad about that too. I often wait for the price to drop as well, but I've noticed lately that some titles that always used to be available on physical media are starting not to be, which I guess makes sense since most people listen to digital music nowadays, so I fear they might've produced few physical copies and they could be sold out soon. I hope I'm wrong, though.
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Re: Disenchanted

Post by Disney Duster »

I enjoyed reading your comments, D82. :)
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Re: Disenchanted

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I watched the movie again, and I was so in love with the story. The songs are so brilliant, I think they are a combination between the classic Disney songs from the golden age and the renaissance. The "Love Power" reprise that Giselle sings to Morgan was kinda boring, to be honest, and I thought it was too long :lol: :lol: During the animated segments, Nancy looked kinda like a man, to be honest :lol: :lol:
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Re: Disenchanted

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I'm glad you enjoyed reading my comments, Disney Duster. :)

And I agree about the songs, Vlad Sicoe. They've only grown on me since I first listened to them. Regarding the "Love Power" reprise, I agree it's not that good on its own, but I think it works really well in the movie. I like that Giselle is half-singing, half-speaking in it. It makes the words sound more sincere.

By the way, Alan Menken talked about working on the film in the latest episode of the "For Scores" podcast. Among other things, he mentioned that he and Stephen Schwartz wrote 10 or 11 songs for the film in total, including the ones that were cut.

John Pomeroy has also shared more of his work for the film, as well as animators Tony Bancroft and Ole Christian Løken:

John Pomeroy
https://www.instagram.com/p/ClnUlb7P2NU/
https://www.johnpomeroy.com/shop

Tony Bancroft
https://www.instagram.com/p/ClfPTV-O1T4/
https://www.instagram.com/p/CliBJmCO2Bq/
https://www.instagram.com/p/ClkWi3auVqt/
https://www.instagram.com/p/ClnLEjxPniS/

Ole Christian Løken
https://twitter.com/OleLoken/status/1596612035038834688
https://twitter.com/OleLoken/status/1597204003829735424
https://twitter.com/OleLoken/status/1598261928065138689
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Re: Disenchanted

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Yes, like D82, I thought Giselle's "Love Power" surprise felt so sincere. It was beautiful and made me tear up!
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Re: Disenchanted

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For me, it kinda ruined the moment...it felt like it dragged on for too long.
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Re: Disenchanted

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New poster inspired by the movie. Disney has also released the full "Fairytale Life (The Wish)" song clip.
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Re: Disenchanted

Post by Kyle »

...sad to say I didn't like the movie at all. It felt like a hallmark movie.
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Re: Disenchanted

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Having just watched the movie, I am wondering if anyone on here can provide any explanation towards anything And everything that was cut, Including why Rachel Covey, Despite cameoing, And as such did not Reprise Her role when she still could’ve, was re-casted?

Here’s the following but I know what cut, please let me know anything else that I’m missing here:

What makes a hero musical number in the Tavern
The seven dwarves
Jodi Benson cameo

I also know that Menkin and Schwartz wrote about 11 songs for the movie so we know that the side of the one mentioned above That there were others that were cut.

It also seems like they were supposed to be A scene right after Giselle went and sat down with Malvina And her minions at the beginning, As she was supposed to meet and talk with them, and we only saw the beginning With her arriving to sit down and then It cuts to the next scene?

And of course, was anyone at the test screening that Led to them having to do re-shoots? What was different/Not included in the final move either was there? Where the dwarves and the Jodi Benson cameo there? Any information from what was changed from the test screening as well please! :-)
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Re: Disenchanted

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Patricier21 wrote: Sun Dec 11, 2022 12:24 am Having just watched the movie, I am wondering if anyone on here can provide any explanation towards anything And everything that was cut, Including why Rachel Covey, Despite cameoing, And as such did not Reprise Her role when she still could’ve, was re-casted?
I don't think an official reason for Morgan's recasting has been given, but there are some theories we've discussed here. One of them is that perhaps they wanted someone younger for the role. 15 years have passed in the real world, but only 10 in the movie, so they wanted someone who could play a teenager. I believe Gabriella Baldacchino, the actress who ended up playing the part, was 19 when she was cast. She's just four years younger than Rachel Covey, but it could still have been a consideration. Also, Rachel hasn't made a movie since Enchanted, so maybe she wasn't prepared for a role like this. Another possible reason is that, unlike last time, Morgan had to sing in the sequel. Rachel Covey is a playwright and a composer now, but I don't know if she sings or not. I've searched on Youtube and didn't find any video of her singing. Baldacchino, though, had experience in that regard. She did a good job, in my opinion, but it's a shame Rachel didn't get to play the character again.
Patricier21 wrote: Sun Dec 11, 2022 12:24 am Here’s the following but I know what cut, please let me know anything else that I’m missing here:

What makes a hero musical number in the Tavern
The seven dwarves
Jodi Benson cameo
The seven dwarfs appearing in the movie was a rumor by TheDisinsider and was never confirmed, so we don't know for sure if they were ever going to be in it or not. Jodi Benson is rumored to have a cameo in the Little Mermaid remake, but I haven't heard anything about her appearing in Disenchanted. But yes, the musical number "Hard Times for Heroes" was shot, but cut from the movie.
Patricier21 wrote: Sun Dec 11, 2022 12:24 am I also know that Menkin and Schwartz wrote about 11 songs for the movie so we know that the side of the one mentioned above That there were others that were cut.
Yes, Alan Menken said he and Stephen Schwartz wrote 10 or 11 songs for the movie in total. I'm not sure if they count the two parts of "Fairytale Life" as separate songs or not. Same with "Andalasia" and "The Magic of Andalasia", which have the same melody, but different lyrics and performers. I suspect they at least count "Faitytale Life" as one song. So, that makes 6 or 7 songs used in the movie. Two of the cut ones, "Hard Times for Heroes" and a duet by Morgan and Malvina's son titled "Something Different This Year" are included in the soundtrack. That leaves from one to three cut songs we haven't heard.

"Something Different This Year" was recorded by the actors who play the characters in the film, but we don't know if the musical number was shot or not.

Also, most of the songs that are in the movie were trimmed. We know that because they are longer on the soundtrack. The full version of "The Magic of Andalasia" was most likely filmed, because part of the cut verse was featured in one of the trailers, but we don't know if the other missing bits were cut after or before filming.
Patricier21 wrote: Sun Dec 11, 2022 12:24 am It also seems like they were supposed to be A scene right after Giselle went and sat down with Malvina And her minions at the beginning, As she was supposed to meet and talk with them, and we only saw the beginning With her arriving to sit down and then It cuts to the next scene?
She does sit down at the very end of that scene, but I also had the impression something had been cut from it when I first watched the movie, so maybe there was some shot from it shown in a trailer or TV spot that wasn't in the final film.

It's also possible some of the scenes filmed during the reshoots replaced older ones.
Patricier21 wrote: Sun Dec 11, 2022 12:24 am And of course, was anyone at the test screening that Led to them having to do re-shoots? What was different/Not included in the final move either was there? Where the dwarves and the Jodi Benson cameo there? Any information from what was changed from the test screening as well please! :-)
I don't remember anyone here mentioning they had had been at the test screening, but who knows, maybe some other member has more info regarding that.
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Re: Disenchanted

Post by Kyle »

Even the hand drawn was disappointing to me. In the credits I saw a long list of "rotoscopers". was the original as rotoscope heavy? Maybe that's part of why I didn't enjoy much of the human animation in this. Although really it comes from the blocking more than anything. It felt like a first or second pass and not something ready for the final movie.
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