DVDizzy Forum

... which is getting to see the story reel for the first version of "Pomp & Circumstances" that Disney animators proposed for "Fantasia 2000." Which supposedly features the too-cute-to-be-believed concept of every Disney princesses & prince marching in (to Sir Edward Elgar's music, of course) into this grand cathedral. Where they then presented their sons & daughters to an audience full of Disney characters.

Has anyone out there actually seen this footage? I'm told that Dave Bossert recently showed this work-in-progress version of "Pomp & Circumstances" to an audience full of animation fans on the Disney Cruise Line. If you saw this piece of animation, what was it like? What do you remember from the piece?

jpanimation wrote:To me, this is the weakest segment in Fantasia 2000 (easily eclipsed by The Sorcerer's Apprentice). I know using this music for a segment was all Eisner's idea and to me it was a terrible one. I just didn't care for it, same with the crappy whale and butterfly segments.

jpanimation wrote:I think this princess version would've not only been distracting, but equally awful. I though the images they present with the music were artistic expression, not advertising.

Wonderlicious wrote:it would have implied that all those sweet virgins had been corrupted.

Goliath wrote: Not only that, but I always hate it when random Disney characters are featured in the same scene. Unless it's something like Who Framed Roger Rabbit or Bonkers, in which they are depicted as merely actors, I don't like the fact that characters from totally different time periods interact with each other.

Disney Duster wrote:

Wonderlicious wrote:it would have implied that all those sweet virgins had been corrupted.

The King wanted Cinderella and the Prince to make grandchildren as soon as possible!.

Super Aurora wrote:

Goliath wrote: Not only that, but I always hate it when random Disney characters are featured in the same scene. Unless it's something like Who Framed Roger Rabbit or Bonkers, in which they are depicted as merely actors, I don't like the fact that characters from totally different time periods interact with each other.

So does that mean you dislike Disney's House of Mouse as well?

"You have to understand that every other sequence that we were considering for 'Fantasia Continued' at that time was art for art's sake. We were always looking to marry a great piece of music with stunning visuals to then create this memorable movie-going experience," David Bossert explained. "And what Michael was asking us to do with 'Pomp and Circumstance' was kind of out of step with the rest of this film. His Disney Princess procession idea was almost nakedly commercial."

But - again -- because it was their then-Boss who suggested this idea, the "Fantasia Continued" production team gave it the old college try. George Scribner (best known as the director of Disney's 1988 animated feature, "Oliver and Company") was assigned to develop a story of the Disney Princess version of "Pomp and Circumstance." And from what David tells me, George did the very best that he could with this concept. Creating a pretty entertaining storyreel.

"As I recall, this sequence was set outside. And the Disney Princesses that were supposed to appear in 'Pomp and Circumstance' started with Snow White and then went all the way up to Princess Jasmine in 'Aladdin (Disney Special Platinum Edition) ,' " Bossert continued. "And as they all marched along with their princes and their children, you'd then get these quick cameo appearances by other famous Disney characters."

Which brings us to the other gimmick that was supposed to have been associated with this Disney Princess-based version of "Pomp and Circumstance." In that this proposed sequence was going to be the part of "Fantasia Continued" which would have featured scenes that were animated by genuine Disney Legends.

To be specific, Disney wanted to recruit the surviving members of the Nine Old Men (which - at that time - were Marc Davis, Ollie Johnston, Ward Kimball and Frank Thomas) to come work on "Pomp and Circumstance." With the idea that each of these legendary animators would animate one short scene which starred their signature Disney character.

"As I recall, Marc was going to animate a scene featuring Tinker Bell. Ward was supposed to animate a scene with Jiminy Cricket. They wanted Frank to do something with the Fairies from 'Sleeping Beauty. And I don't remember what Ollie was supposed to have done," Dave continued.

Now these scenes that were to be animated by the surviving Nine Old Men were then supposed to be folded in with footage that had been created by the modern masters of Disney hand-drawn animation. We're talking about super-talented people like Glen Keane and Andreas Deja, who'd create cameos for the most famous Disney characters that they'd ever worked on, like Ariel from "The Little Mermaid" and Scar from "The Lion King."

"A lot of the comedy in this version of 'Pomp and Circumstance' was to have come from Donald Duck. Who was wreaking havoc behind-the-scenes because he was attempting to get his hands on that magic hat that Mickey wears in 'The Sorcerer's Apprentice,' " Bossert said. "But if I'm remembering this storyreel correctly, there was a quick scene where you got to see the Fab Five all standing together. And another one where you saw a number of the Villains observing this Disney Princess processional from a distance."

Now you have to admit that the idea of a musical number -- which was supposed to be animated by the very best animators, past and present -- that featured every animated Disney character ever created does sound kind of cool. So why didn't this version of "Pomp and Circumstance" actually go into production?

To answer that part of the question ... I must now launch into a somewhat adult story. Which I want to stress that I DID NOT hear from David Bossert. But - rather - from someone who was actually in the room when the Disney Princess version of 'Pomp and Circumstance' hit the skids.

To explain: When the folks at Walt Disney Animation Studios decided that they seriously wanted to pursue this idea of having the surviving Nine Old Men come in & work on "Fantasia Continued," they then staged this elaborate pitch meeting. Where Marc, Ollie, Ward and Frank were all limoed onto the Disney Lot and then taken into this room that was loaded with concept art for the "Fantasia" follow-up.

And given that Michael Eisner had come up with the original Disney Princess / "Pomp and Circumstance" concept ... Well, he made a point of sitting in on this particular pitch meeting as well.

Anyway ... After everyone was served a light lunch, the formal pitch for this proposed "Fantasia Continued" sequence began. And at some point, the lights were turned down and the Disney Princess "Pomp and Circumstance" storyreel was shown. Afterwards, the room was deadly silent. Marc, Frank and Ollie shot each other sidelong glances, wondering what they should say.

But leave it to the always bombastic Ward Kimball to break the silence. Who reportedly said to the entire room: "That's the stupidest f*cking idea I've ever heard."

Needless to say, the idea of bringing the surviving Nine Old Men back on the Lot to work on this project died that afternoon. And shortly after this infamous story pitch, the "Fantasia Continued" production team began casting around for an entirely new story concept for this film's "Pomp and Circumstance" sequence.

"But you have to understand that this is how the development process at Disney Animation works. Not every idea that we come up with works. But we keep refining things, trying different ideas, different combinations of characters until we eventually do come up with something that works," Bossert stated. "I honestly don't know if we would have come up with the idea of making Donald Duck Noah's assistant - which is the concept that we eventually used for 'Pomp and Circumstance" in the final version of 'Fantasia 2000' - if we hadn't first explored that idea of Donald being the character who was causing all of those problems behind-the-scenes during the Disney Princess processional version of this sequence."

The other thing that's great about Disney is that - while an idea may not always work out for feature animation - it can eventually find new life in another part of the Company. Do you recall that Donald-trying-to-get-his-hands-on-the-magic-hat-from-the-Sorcerer's-Apprentice story thread? Does that concept sound familiar? It should. WDI took that idea and ran with it while it was developing "Mickey's PhilharMagic" for the Parks in the early 2000s.

And - yes - just in case you're wondering. It was George Scribner who not only developed the storyreel for "Mickey's PhilharMagic," but he also wound up directing this 3D Theme Park Productions film.

as part of a "Fantasia" - themed presentation that Bossert gave on the Disney Cruise Line back in 2009, he screened this version of the "Pomp and Circumstance" storyreel. And the results were ... Well, mixed.

"Some people in the audience laughed because they were really enjoying what they were watching. But then there were these laughs that came in very weird places. Which meant that there were people out in the audience who were laughing AT the movie. Rather than laughing with it," David said.

But leave it to the always bombastic Ward Kimball to break the silence. Who reportedly said to the entire room: "That's the stupidest f*cking idea I've ever heard."

Wonderlicious wrote:I'm not too sure about whether I would have wanted to see the princesses presenting their children; it does seem a bit too sweet, and of course, it would have implied that all those sweet virgins had been corrupted.

DisneyAnimation88 wrote:Roy Disney vetoed it as it would suggest that the Disney characters had had sex

disneyprincess11 wrote:AHHHHHHHHHHHHHH! WHY DIDN'T THEY KEEP THIS VERSION?!?! THAT WOULD BE SOOOOO CUTE!

I hope they eventually do it. I want to see all of their children (well, we know Ariel's kid), esepecially Aurora's amd Tiana's!

@Super Aurora: Don't forget, Tiana's mom. In the beginning of Almost There, she tells her, "I want some grandchildren".

DisneyAnimation88 wrote:Roy Disney vetoed it as it would suggest that the Disney characters had had sex

Oh wow!!! Does this mean Melody was adopted because you know Disney princesses don't sex!!!!

bradhig wrote:

disneyprincess11 wrote:AHHHHHHHHHHHHHH! WHY DIDN'T THEY KEEP THIS VERSION?!?! THAT WOULD BE SOOOOO CUTE!

I hope they eventually do it. I want to see all of their children (well, we know Ariel's kid), esepecially Aurora's amd Tiana's!

@Super Aurora: Don't forget, Tiana's mom. In the beginning of Almost There, she tells her, "I want some grandchildren".
Oh wow!!! Does this mean Melody was adopted because you know Disney princesses don't sex!!!!

It's natural for them to do that after getting married. There is already some nasty drawings of the princess around just look and they are worried about people reacting to them having sex to have kids

But leave it to the always bombastic Ward Kimball to break the silence. Who reportedly said to the entire room: "That's the stupidest f*cking idea I've ever heard."

According to the book "DisneyWar", this is the reason the sequence was abandoned; when Eisner told the production crew about the sequence, none of the principal animators liked the idea at all and Roy Disney vetoed it as it would suggest that the Disney characters had had sex, something he was against. Eisner was apparently upset by this and said that either way, "Pomp and Circumstance" had to be included, despite Roy and other members of the feeling that the piece was unsuitable for the film.

PrincePhillipFan wrote:I love this quote. Probably now tied with my favorite Walt quote of "Nobody gives a shit about Luxembourg!"